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biccat wrote:
Somewhat true. If a permit is required for events over a certain number of people, then a permit would be required.

However, if legislative bans are beyond the constitutional requirement, then compliance with the statute is not required.

edit: minor typographical error

The point is that the relevant authority (Metra Police in this case) has a compelling interest in any activity that takes place on the property in question which might violate any given statute. Whether or not such an interest is Constitutional is separate from whether or not it is the business of the authority.

I would also argue that compliance with any given law is always required until such time that the law is stricken on grounds of violating Constitutional limits. In essence, whether or not you believe a law is Unconstitutional has no bearing on whether or not the law can be enforced, and therefore require compliance.

SlaveToDorkness wrote:"detained for questioning" = "Asking what is going on" in police.

I am assuming the phrase "detained for questioning" is within the legal meaning of a police "detention." That is, stopping you and temporarily restraining your ability to leave while the police asks some questions.

Significantly different from "arrest" which would involve handcuffs, a squad car, and an interrogation room.

biccat wrote:
I should "work alongside" the authorities if I'm going to do something in a public place? Why? What business is it of theirs?

If the cops find a "suspicious package" and a bunch of weirdos prancing around wearing elf-ears and shouting "MAGIC MISSILE", maybe they should do what most people would do: ask someone what's going on. Then, once they figure out that it's a group of LARPers, and maybe one of them would show the cop that the "suspicious package" was a couple of bricks, the cops could go on to do something important. Like catching criminals.

The "disorderly conduct" charge will more than likely not stick. Simply a cop trying to validate his actions by pointing to an arrest.

It's not the 90s anymore. People have got the Fear and other people and things out of the ordinary are to be detained and/or confiscated for further state evaluation. You really shouldn't blame them though. 9/11 was Scary because Bad Things happened.

Also see: "2007 boston bomb scare" and "geocaching bomb scares". People do things in public. We either move toward welcoming concepts like facecrime or we realize that we're realistically not going to catch ever single terrorist bombing attempt that has occurred since 9/11. I mean, the terrorists can hide the bombs SO WELL THAT WE CAN'T SEEM TO FIND THEM. EVER. Cause like, we've never found any. And I mean, they've got to be out there right, otherwise we wouldn't be treating every last sack of bricks like it's full of explosives, right?

SlaveToDorkness wrote:"detained for questioning" = "Asking what is going on" in police.

When dealing with potential terrorist activity asking nicely is probably not very productive, so they go to the next step.

Exactly.

biccat wrote:Then, once they figure out that it's a group of LARPers, and maybe one of them would show the cop that the "suspicious package" was a couple of bricks, the cops could go on to do something important. Like catching criminals.

Slightly OT, but what would happen (legally speaking) if, say, the dad of that child was home and took on the police officers?

SilverMK2 wrote:

biccat wrote:Then, once they figure out that it's a group of LARPers, and maybe one of them would show the cop that the "suspicious package" was a couple of bricks, the cops could go on to do something important. Like catching criminals.

Slightly OT, but what would happen (legally speaking) if, say, the dad of that child was home and took on the police officers?

What do you mean "took on" the police officers? These are Chicago cops right? Might even be SWAT and bomb disposal units. The cops would not be joking around...as in provolone beatdown not joking around.

SilverMK2 wrote:

biccat wrote:Then, once they figure out that it's a group of LARPers, and maybe one of them would show the cop that the "suspicious package" was a couple of bricks, the cops could go on to do something important. Like catching criminals.

Slightly OT, but what would happen (legally speaking) if, say, the dad of that child was home and took on the police officers?

Well, that's what they do to people with speech impediments who turn their backs upon them. Using that as an estimate, I'd imagine anyone that brought real force would be shot with any paramedics showing up restrained until that person bled out like the 'filthy criminal' that they obviously were.

Frazzled wrote:What do you mean "took on" the police officers? These are Chicago cops right? Might even be SWAT and bomb disposal units. The cops would not be joking around...as in provolone beatdown not joking around.

I'm not saying you go Rambo on the cops, but you open the door, your kid comes in and is immediately followed in by cops who then go on to start beating the hell out of him. You ask what they are doing, they ignore you, you tell them your kid is disabled, they ignore you, you go to pull them off your kid, or get them to accept that they don't need to beat the crap out of a child and just restrain him (I don't know too many people who will be be able to go a round with two police officers, especially after being tazed twice).

I know you have been all about home defense in the past, but come on - anyone who is having the crap kicked out of them by the police should be defended. There is a very clear line between restraining someone (which I have no problem with), and police brutality.

SilverMK2 wrote:

biccat wrote:Then, once they figure out that it's a group of LARPers, and maybe one of them would show the cop that the "suspicious package" was a couple of bricks, the cops could go on to do something important. Like catching criminals.

Slightly OT, but what would happen (legally speaking) if, say, the dad of that child was home and took on the police officers?

Legally speaking, he would probably get charged with Assaulting an Officer.

Practically speaking, he'd get a free trip to the hospital.

biccat wrote:Legally speaking, he would probably get charged with Assaulting an Officer.

Thought that would probably the the case. Didn't know if there was clause for attempting to prevent the police from illegal behaviour or something like that.

See, that's why I'm sometimes glad we have 'political correctness gone mad'. Yes, it's annoying, but I'd rather be annoyed than have my head kicked in by the bobbies.

biccat wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

biccat wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:LARPers, if they're going to be leaving packages in public places, should ensure that they have conversed with law enforcement officials and park officials to ensure that these kinds of things don't happen.

Damn kids, leaving packages in public places. What is this world coming to?

Back in my day, we conversed with law enforcement officials before doing anything. Going to the corner store? Call the cops, let them know. Taking a Sunday drive? Call the cops, let them know. Playing "cops and robbers" in the backyard? Call the cops, let them know.

Want some tinfoil for your brain?

If you're going to do something like this in a public setting that you do not control, do it right and work alongside the authorities.

I should "work alongside" the authorities if I'm going to do something in a public place? Why? What business is it of theirs?

If the cops find a "suspicious package" and a bunch of weirdos prancing around wearing elf-ears and shouting "MAGIC MISSILE", maybe they should do what most people would do: ask someone what's going on. Then, once they figure out that it's a group of LARPers, and maybe one of them would show the cop that the "suspicious package" was a couple of bricks, the cops could go on to do something important. Like catching criminals.

The "disorderly conduct" charge will more than likely not stick. Simply a cop trying to validate his actions by pointing to an arrest.

Your assumption is that there was "a bunch of weirdos prancing around wearing elf-ears and shouting MAGIC MISSILE".

These 'modern' styled LARPs that have been going on don't have anything like that, from what I've seen. They usually have people wearing normal clothing(shock! awe!) acting like normal people do(gasp!shock!surprise!).

If you're going to do something like that, and leave packages around for the LARPers to find it is common sense to inform the park management or police about it so as to prevent things like this happening.

SilverMK2 wrote:

Frazzled wrote:What do you mean "took on" the police officers? These are Chicago cops right? Might even be SWAT and bomb disposal units. The cops would not be joking around...as in provolone beatdown not joking around.

I'm not saying you go Rambo on the cops, but you open the door, your kid comes in and is immediately followed in by cops who then go on to start beating the hell out of him. You ask what they are doing, they ignore you, you tell them your kid is disabled, they ignore you, you go to pull them off your kid, or get them to accept that they don't need to beat the crap out of a child and just restrain him (I don't know too many people who will be be able to go a round with two police officers, especially after being tazed twice).

I know you have been all about home defense in the past, but come on - anyone who is having the crap kicked out of them by the police should be defended. There is a very clear line between restraining someone (which I have no problem with), and police brutality.

These are Chicago police officers in pursuit of a suspect. If you go to the aid of a suspect you will be restrained from aiding the suspect.

Kanluwen wrote:
If you're going to do something like that, and leave packages around for the LARPers to find it is common sense to inform the park management or police about it so as to prevent things like this happening.

Knowing how event management works at Millennium if they would have notified the police, the police would have told them that if they went ahead with the event, this is what would happen.

Its almost the equivalent of doing the same thing on the National Mall. Millennium Park is a huge tourist attraction for the city, and they take its image pretty seriously.

Kanluwen wrote:These 'modern' styled LARPs that have been going on don't have anything like that, from what I've seen. They usually have people wearing normal clothing(shock! awe!) acting like normal people do(gasp!shock!surprise!).

Which raises the question, wtf are they "LARPing"?

Kanluwen wrote:If you're going to do something like that, and leave packages around for the LARPers to find it is common sense to inform the park management or police about it so as to prevent things like this happening.

How is it common sense? If I were planning an event in a park, I wouldn't see any reason to inform the cops. Now, if it were a few sticks of clay with wires and a clock, yeah, I'd talk to the cops. Or if I were filming a scene involving prop guns, I'd let the cops know.

There's nothing illegal or indicative of crime in a bunch of people walking around and a couple bricks lying under a piece of gakky modern art.

biccat wrote:
There's nothing illegal or indicative of crime in a bunch of people walking around and a couple bricks lying under a piece of gakky modern art.

A couple of bricks wrapped in duct tape with exposed wires. It wasn't just a couple of bricks stacked on top of each other.

biccat wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:These 'modern' styled LARPs that have been going on don't have anything like that, from what I've seen. They usually have people wearing normal clothing(shock! awe!) acting like normal people do(gasp!shock!surprise!).

Which raises the question, wtf are they "LARPing"?

It could be(ironically) a terrorist LARP, a White Wolf LARP, a conspiracy LARP(revolving around the Illuminati et al.), Call of Cthulhu modern, or any number of modern RPG situations centered around plain clothes agents/civilians/etc.

Maybe it was a brick LARP.

Platuan4th wrote:

biccat wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:These 'modern' styled LARPs that have been going on don't have anything like that, from what I've seen. They usually have people wearing normal clothing(shock! awe!) acting like normal people do(gasp!shock!surprise!).

Which raises the question, wtf are they "LARPing"?

It could be(ironically) a terrorist LARP, a White Wolf LARP, a conspiracy LARP(revolving around the Illuminati et al.), Call of Cthulhu modern, or any number of modern RPG situations centered around plain clothes agents/civilians/etc.

Clearly these people need something called a life. I suggest they be drafted and sent to West Virginia to play Coal Miner LARP.

malfred wrote:Maybe it was a brick LARP.

She's a BRICK Laaaarp... she's mightymighty just hangin' out in the park.