Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Riddick40k wrote:slowed

That word, I do not think you know what it means.

Depends, what army is currently beating me?

I hate Tau.

from a fluff standpoint, they don't deserve a Codex simply because they are so tiny in the scheme of things.

they have only 100 or so planets with most being little under populated outposts,

they have soooo much Plot Armor its scary. The damocles gulf crusade, a very tiny one by all Imperial standards, nearly carved its way into the Empire's heart. the Tau were saved from a much larger crusade by Abbaddon's timely Black Crusade which pulled support from the Tau's annhilation campaign.

Their whole 'greater good' thing is annoying. They claim to be all for unifying everyone in a perfect society. down that thrice dammned path lies Socialism which leads to Communisim which doesn't work.

the Tau were also unheard of in the fluff before release. they were invented by GW to capitalize on the Anime craze and the opening of the first GW in Japan.

Grey Templar wrote:I hate Tau.

from a fluff standpoint, they don't deserve a Codex simply because they are so tiny in the scheme of things.

they have only 100 or so planets with most being little under populated outposts,

they have soooo much Plot Armor its scary. The damocles gulf crusade, a very tiny one by all Imperial standards, nearly carved its way into the Empire's heart. the Tau were saved from a much larger crusade by Abbaddon's timely Black Crusade which pulled support from the Tau's annhilation campaign.

Their whole 'greater good' thing is annoying. They claim to be all for unifying everyone in a perfect society. down that thrice dammned path lies Socialism which leads to Communisim which doesn't work.

the Tau were also unheard of in the fluff before release. they were invented by GW to capitalize on the Anime craze and the opening of the first GW in Japan.

+1 to this.

Space Wolves, it's a love /hate relationship.

coolyo294 wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:I hate Tau.

from a fluff standpoint, they don't deserve a Codex simply because they are so tiny in the scheme of things.

they have only 100 or so planets with most being little under populated outposts,

they have soooo much Plot Armor its scary. The damocles gulf crusade, a very tiny one by all Imperial standards, nearly carved its way into the Empire's heart. the Tau were saved from a much larger crusade by Abbaddon's timely Black Crusade which pulled support from the Tau's annhilation campaign.

Their whole 'greater good' thing is annoying. They claim to be all for unifying everyone in a perfect society. down that thrice dammned path lies Socialism which leads to Communisim which doesn't work.

the Tau were also unheard of in the fluff before release. they were invented by GW to capitalize on the Anime craze and the opening of the first GW in Japan.

+1 to this.

+1+1 I think most people can agree on that.

Eldar , i cant stand Eldar and all their over powered units, they are the only army I cant find some way to beat.

coolyo294 wrote:Space Wolves. I f****** hate everything about them.

This.

Their fluff is confused and atrocious. They don't know whether or not they want to be a serious "GRIMDARK" army of space vikings, werewolves, lighthearted space tricksters, the Emperor's Executioners, or rough customers with a heart of gold, and they come off just...awful.

Their army list is just as awful. Incredibly capable and flexible troops that are at least as good, if not markedly flat out better, than their equivalents, but have a hefty price cut, especially factoring in discounts the sergeant equivalents get. Despite being an army with a deep anti-psyker background they have amongst the most fearsome and capable offensive psykers in the game also wielding some of the best psychic defense in the game at costs much less than many others. Additionally, while touted as a close range viking berzerker army, they have the best heavy weapons unit in the game with the cheapest heavy weapons per point spent that are able to be utilized far more effectively than other heavy weapons units and have more heavy weapons than just about any other HW unit in the game aside from Lootas.

They're an army that does everything well, too well, even those things they really shouldn't. I haven't seen an SW army that wasn't sporting at least 2 (usually 3) 5x ML Long Fang units in years, likewise Rune Priests, and the vast majority I see play more like IG gunlines with damn near a dozen razorbacks backed up by three heavy weapons squads.


The fluff feels like bad internet fan-fic/parody (firing artillery by smell...? really?), and the army feels like it was designed simply to be a cash cow, it's Space Marines, but more capable, and huge across the board cost cuts. They can do just about every army build the other books can, and better in many cases.




Blood Angels likewise aren't often fun games. I've yet to ever see a fully painted BA force, much less a well painted full BA force. For an army that typically is seen as a fast jump pack assault army with some berzerkers, they sure do have far more access to slow combat walkers and multitiudes of heavy battle tanks than any other SM army in the game, fielding as more *heavy* armor than the overwhelmingly vast majority of even Imperial Guard armies out there. Why it was thought the Baal belonged in FA is beyond me.


GK's are a bit silly as well, primarily the 'lol 5pt auto upgrades'. The Psychic Pilot that comes on every vehicle that makes them practically immune to shaken/stun results for 5pts is...woefully undercosted, and the cost of Psybolts on tanks was very obviously not thought about at all or very intentionally undercosted to sell more kits (lol 5pts to make two BS4 or BS5 TL'd autocannons S8...who isn't taking that every time, freeing up other points to do so if they must?). Also the ability to field *super* cheap troops in chimeras with tons of special weapons at a cost to make even IG Vets blush in an army of ultra-killy dudes was a bit silly.


Vulkan marines used to be my main gripe, but since the SW/BA books I haven't seen them much anymore, but man, I literally went 12 months without seeing a single non-Vulkan C:SM army, and it's not hard to see why.


I just noticed these all happen to also be marine books...even though I own a huge number of Space Marines of various sorts

Grey Templar wrote:
Their whole 'greater good' thing is annoying. They claim to be all for unifying everyone in a perfect society. down that thrice dammned path lies Socialism which leads to Communisim which doesn't work.

It's probably best not to project real world subjective political views/values onto 40k, especially in regards to alien races/cultures/societies that work completely different from modern 21st century human ones, it'll likely only lead to assumptions and reactions to things that just aren't what one thinks they are (in addition to the impression such political expressions leave on other players/forum posters). In case one hasn't noticed, the only faction in 40k with anything resembling a functional market system is...the Orks. It's also not like most people who play this game have a firm grasp of any of these economic concepts/systems either.

Black Templars, just the look of them damn! I want to rip their skin off!

Fluffwise - The Grater Good. No old race is following that kind of tough anymore because galaxy doesn't work like that. It's just an idea influenced into young follish race that covers much bolder plan - conquest of galaxy and all of it's races under Etherial domain.

Tabletopwise - Grey Knights. Earlier they were awesome as part of Daemonhunters army. Now they are just overpowered to the level of Supermen.

I don't really hate any armies to tell the truth. Sure am bored of fighting Space Marines though, seems they're all either heretical (when I'm using Witch Hunters) or in the way of some Eldar plot (when I'm using Eldar).

Armies I find a touch annoying are Tyranids and Orks but that's mostly due to the fact that I have trouble fighting them at times (most likely because I face horde armies so rarely). The annoyance is usually countered by the much welcomed challenge of fighting the odd horde army. More so if they happen to be painted as all horde armies look great painted, even at the lower end of table top quality.

Can't stand Space Marines in all forms -.- especially the infamous Grey Marines.

Models? Can't stand them, boring things designed to appeal to 12 year olds.

Fluff? Generally can't stand it. Some isn't too bad, but mostly see above.

Gameplay? See first comment.

Orks. All they do is charge at you and there are not as many strategies playing against them other than side shots on battlewagons and stop them.

Nob bikers? Strength 8 firepower murders them dead pretty fast. Green tide? Templates. Anything else? Free win.

I encounter them a lot and I wish there was more to that army. Sure, marines suck because so many people have them, but at least it requires some brainpower to beat them.

I wish orks are challenging to play against.

Sure there are some armies which are in a worse shape than orks, but I never encounter them.

coolyo294 wrote:Space Wolves. I f****** hate everything about them.

WIN
no one ever agrees with me about hating the space muts

Ultrasmurfs, BA and SW.

All a load of overheated nonsense. Ultrasmurfs, I mean come on. 'nuff said.

BA: we be angry space vampires, and can make any vehicle fast. We also have Mephiston (I like the model, but still...)

SW: My biggest rival plays them. Since I met him, all the SM helmets on my Eldar bases are SW. Other than that, the fluff is messy. Agreeing with all comments above.

Lord Rogukiel wrote:


BA: we be angry space vampires, and can make any vehicle fast. We also have Mephiston (I like the model, but still...)

Except the bumms cannot figure out how to make a land raider fast

I dislike any Space Marines. I won't say *hate*... I don't dislike them that much, but I definitely wouldn't collect them (don't like the models) and their fluff doesn't interest me.

I much prefer Xenos

tabletop wise i hate playing against a clever tau player "shoot, jump, shoot, jump etc"

fluff wise the space wolves are stupid, the tau are shoe horned and the nids are the most threatening thing in he galaxy
unless something else is happening

DE. Some of their stuff is unfair on my opinion. Please don't reply back saying "Oh how!" and "They most certainly are not!"

Space Wolves. I can't stand them anymore. Stupid broken codex, stupid infantile fluff.

Grey Templar wrote:Their whole 'greater good' thing is annoying. They claim to be all for unifying everyone in a perfect society. down that thrice dammned path lies Socialism which leads to Communisim which doesn't work.

Ridicolous statement IMO for several reasons.
1: Socialism =/ communism. Most western European states can be classified as socialistic countries. Free healthcare, free education, large state controlled sectors, goals of small income disparity etc. Many of these countries have better living-conditions than the US, and none of them have ever been a communist state, and I really don't believe they are on the path to communism either.
2: Imperium of man is a facist, racist and hopelessly bureaucratic empire. That doesn't work too well in reality either now, does it? It can still be kind of cool in sci-fi fluff. (although the bureaucratic part is often taken a bit too far IMO - 100+ year reaction time on invasions etc)
3: The greater good is obviously a sham, and that makes it kinda cool IMO. F.ex: In DoW, you find evidence of mass sterilization of human populations. The Tau society is also a caste society, hardly the perfect society for everyone involved. (great for those in the "valuable" castes). Besides, while communism was a horrible failure IRL, it still makes for a cool background to base a fictional ideology on.
4: The greater good opens up possibilities for idealism and for grimdark. Lots of Tau probably believe in the idea, while others know that it is all BS, opens up for being both "the good guy" and "the baddies"


For my least favorite faction: Space wolves. Agreed with what has been said, cool idea, poor execution both on the codex and on the fluff.
No-brainers are bad, mkay?

the GKs liked them before the new codex

I also really don't like Space Wolves, but I think Chaos takes the prize for me.

Ya it's probably odd to be tired of/bored with/hate, what is supposed to be one of the main 'bad guys' in the 40k universe, but I think they make for some pretty pathetic villians. Hey, good for you, you're angry Marines, and like skulls and spikes... and thats about it. The Heresy was interesting, but in 40k, Chaos is flat, boring, one-dimensional (lol) and undeserving of their role as the bad boys.

Finally someone says Chaos. I have to agree. SW and BA are up there but not to the point where I would never buy one of their models. Never will I buy anything chaos. My opinion.

Ahack13 wrote:Eldar , i cant stand Eldar and all their over powered units, they are the only army I cant find some way to beat.

And I totally agree with Illumini. Many people totally don't understand differences between systems. Plot armour is not cool but many aspects of Tau are cool. That doesn't mean I deny you the right to hate Tau anyway

For me it would be Blood Angels I guess. If I really have to. Just pain in the ass with all the speed and FNP.

I would have to say I hate the Space Wolves the most, with the Blood Angels in close second.

Creeping Dementia wrote:I also really don't like Space Wolves, but I think Chaos takes the prize for me.

Ya it's probably odd to be tired of/bored with/hate, what is supposed to be one of the main 'bad guys' in the 40k universe, but I think they make for some pretty pathetic villians. Hey, good for you, you're angry Marines, and like skulls and spikes... and thats about it. The Heresy was interesting, but in 40k, Chaos is flat, boring, one-dimensional (lol) and undeserving of their role as the bad boys.

Really? I find Chaos to be amongst the most interesting in 40k, as long as you're not looking at the current codex fluff. You've got the various cult Legions, insane and damned to madness and wilfull slavery as an extension of the will of the dark gods, and then you've got the other traitor Legions, the bitter traitors who believe it was *they* who were betrayed, who fight out of hate and spite because they have nothing else, believing their entire existence and their role in creating the Imperium to have been built on a lie to satisfy the ego of a false god, harnessing forbidden powers to gain an advantage in the long war knowing they are damned and caring not.

Illumini wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Their whole 'greater good' thing is annoying. They claim to be all for unifying everyone in a perfect society. down that thrice dammned path lies Socialism which leads to Communisim which doesn't work.

Ridicolous statement IMO for several reasons.
1: Socialism =/ communism. Most western European states can be classified as socialistic countries. Free healthcare, free education, large state controlled sectors, goals of small income disparity etc. Many of these countries have better living-conditions than the US, and none of them have ever been a communist state, and I really don't believe they are on the path to communism either.
2: Imperium of man is a facist, racist and hopelessly bureaucratic empire. That doesn't work too well in reality either now, does it? It can still be kind of cool in sci-fi fluff. (although the bureaucratic part is often taken a bit too far IMO - 100+ year reaction time on invasions etc)
3: The greater good is obviously a sham, and that makes it kinda cool IMO. F.ex: In DoW, you find evidence of mass sterilization of human populations. The Tau society is also a caste society, hardly the perfect society for everyone involved. (great for those in the "valuable" castes). Besides, while communism was a horrible failure IRL, it still makes for a cool background to base a fictional ideology on.
4: The greater good opens up possibilities for idealism and for grimdark. Lots of Tau probably believe in the idea, while others know that it is all BS, opens up for being both "the good guy" and "the baddies"

I was being a little OTT, but it isn't as rediclous as you claim.

Marx had Socilisim as the path to Communisim. while it is not a bad idea in concept, it is horrible in practice(as shown by Russia and many asian countries) because it ignores the fact that man is naturally evil(and for Socilisim on the way to Communisim to work it requires the leaders to be angelic in their nature)

Yeah, european countries have better living conditions now, but i can't expect that to last. they have high unemployment rates and several countries have collapsed economically. and due to having a common currancy they will all feel the repercussions if one of the economies has problems(like Greece is)

I just wish GW would have a little more of the Grimdarkness come through. more evidence of mass sterilizations, more planet sized death camps, more race inequality. only DoW has shown this darker side and the DoW games arn't always held to be cannon(i hold them to be. the fluff endings anyway)

Grey Templar wrote:

I was being a little OTT, but it isn't as rediclous as you claim.

Marx had Socilisim as the path to Communisim. while it is not a bad idea in concept, it is horrible in practice(as shown by Russia and many asian countries) because it ignores the fact that man is naturally evil(and for Socilisim on the way to Communisim to work it requires the leaders to be angelic in their nature)

Yeah, european countries have better living conditions now, but i can't expect that to last. they have high unemployment rates and several countries have collapsed economically. and due to having a common currancy they will all feel the repercussions if one of the economies has problems(like Greece is)

I just wish GW would have a little more of the Grimdarkness come through. more evidence of mass sterilizations, more planet sized death camps, more race inequality. only DoW has shown this darker side and the DoW games arn't always held to be cannon(i hold them to be. the fluff endings anyway)

Maybe next codex. I would actually like to see some new better done evil elements. Not just falling back on sterilization. It dosen't make sense to me.

ivangterrace wrote:Except the bumms cannot figure out how to make a land raider fast

They don't need to be fast. They can Deep Strike!