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Yeah, I envisioned humans hyped on faith and drugs (increased Ld and S/T) without actually throwing SM in the mix.

The HQ that doesn't use up ForceOrg slots appeals to me. Maybe 0-2 High Priest/High Confessors or something, toss in an optional retinue too filled with zealots and the like. On the other hand, it could be an advisor to the CCS that lets these boyos be troops.

Rico..

Perhaps imperial priest? I dunno the more I think about imperial navy marines the more I like them. Some cool space suit armor.. kaskrin model for inspiration? With options to take storm shields.... droool lol

ARBITES!!!! Arbites assault squads!!! with thunder hammer and storm shields (maybe nerfed versions... they're not Assault terminators after all) wit the option of taking a repressor ( rhino with reinforced armour and assault vehicle rules????)

I do not think the "samurai" squad will work... an effective cc unit needs a transport and being inside a chimera is not so "samuraish"... maybe these bushido fanatics could be a special version of sergeants, giving a cc boost to their squad (furious charge, fearless(...), counter attack????)

Arbites are not part of the Imperial Guard.

Ooo a sergeant upgrade like bastonne or harker ha. How about deep striking samurai that can assault? Or perhaps fleet for a counter attack?



Edit Haha well as much as I like my samurai I cat see gw goin for it... but this combiner compilation of priests and imperial navy marines with cc and storm shield variants is feesable

Imperial navy isn't part of the imperial guard either.... Arbites are likely to fight alongside the imperial guard...

What is an arbite lol?

We can say that arbites are the special forces of the imperium police... they are heavily based upon judge dredd... here some links:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Adeptus_Arbites

http://kofler.dot.at/40k/units/Arbites_Necromunda_Enforcer_Patrol_Squad.gif

Kanluwen wrote:Arbites are not part of the Imperial Guard.

Neither are Psykers or Commissars.

Whoaaaa arbite are crazy and cool and just human. Power mauls shields bolters hell yes why ar3 they not an elite choice already !?

They were a troops choice for C:WH, essentially old-style stormtroopers with shotguns.

punkow wrote:We can say that arbites are the special forces of the imperium police... they are heavily based upon judge dredd... here some links:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Adeptus_Arbites

http://kofler.dot.at/40k/units/Arbites_Necromunda_Enforcer_Patrol_Squad.gif

Yeah...no.

Arbites are the enforcement branch of Imperial Law on a planet. They're not "police" at all.

punkow wrote:Imperial navy isn't part of the imperial guard either.... Arbites are likely to fight alongside the imperial guard...

No, they're really not. Arbites are likely to be dead by the time the Imperial Guard get involved in a fighting. Arbites also don't leave the worlds for which they're responsible.

The Imperial Navy, however, is expressly intended to operate with the Guard.

Kanluwen wrote:

punkow wrote:We can say that arbites are the special forces of the imperium police... they are heavily based upon judge dredd... here some links:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Adeptus_Arbites

http://kofler.dot.at/40k/units/Arbites_Necromunda_Enforcer_Patrol_Squad.gif

Yeah...no.

Arbites are the enforcement branch of Imperial Law on a planet. They're not "police" at all.

If police are not enforcers of the law what are they? I pictured the Arbites as SWAT teams of sorts.

Granted, they're not like police we see today... But that's because the Imperium are the least of all of the universe's evils in most eyes, resembling more 15th century Spain..

Rico..

All great ideas... Now.. onto games workshop how do we tell them what to do lmao

Rico wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

punkow wrote:We can say that arbites are the special forces of the imperium police... they are heavily based upon judge dredd... here some links:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Adeptus_Arbites

http://kofler.dot.at/40k/units/Arbites_Necromunda_Enforcer_Patrol_Squad.gif

Yeah...no.

Arbites are the enforcement branch of Imperial Law on a planet. They're not "police" at all.

If police are not enforcers of the law what are they? I pictured the Arbites as SWAT teams of sorts.

Granted, they're not like police we see today... But that's because the Imperium are the least of all of the universe's evils in most eyes, resembling more 15th century Spain..
Rico..

No, they're nowhere near being police. They're essentially a paramilitary unit that is completely separate from the planet at large's authority.

The entire point of the Arbites is that if the Governor turns against the Imperium, the Arbites take him down and take over until a new Governor is installed by the Imperium. If that's not feasible, they might start a pro-Imperium insurgency to accomplish it.

Don't think of them as police, at all. Think of them like you think of Inquisitors, and you're not too far off.

Simple idea:

Skirmisher Platoon Squad 0-1 per platoon

1 sgt and 10-20 guardsmen armed with pistol/ccw, the sgt gets the same upgrades other sgts do, the squad can take a powerweapon for every 10 guys. So a full squad, plus sgt, plus comissar upgrade gives the potential for 4 hidden powerweapons. Before screeching about how broken they are, keep in mind their statline is the same; its still WS3, S3 T3, 5+ sv guys. But I think they would work well because there are several special characters that give bonuses to assault, and at least with a pistol/ccw you can dump a bunch of basic attacks plus a handfull of powerweapon (albeit strength 3) attacks.

Skirmisher squad 50 points

1 sgt, 9 guardsmen
Armament: Pistol, close combat weapon, frag grenades.

-May take an additional skirmisher guardsman (up to 20 total) for +5 points a model.
-May be lead by a Comissar for +35 points
-The squad may take krak grenades at +10 points for the squad
-The squad may take combat shotguns at +10 points for the squad
-Up to 1 in every 5 guardsmen in the squad may upgrade their laspistol to a hotshot laspistol at +1 point each
-The squad may take 1 power weapon for every 10 guardsmen in the squad at +15 points each.
-One member of the squad may take a plasma pistol at +15 points.

Now you have a lean, cc oriented element to your platoon. Think about it- the PCS is the command element (obviously), the platoon squads are the all-comers element, the heavy weapon teams are the heavy support element, special weapon squads are the econo vet squads, conscripts are the cheap tarpit, and skirmishers would be the CC unit in a platoon squad.

Note that they can't take special or heavy weapons, to keep them from getting too versatile. This also gives them a niche that is worth taking but not so great it eclipses other units in the army. They would be particularly nice in low point games. I had their powerweapons/plasma pistol cost more to represent the premium you pay to get this equipment on a basic unit. As of now, every handheld gun in the Imperial Guard Arsenal is available to the basic guardsman, provided he is in a particular squad- EXCEPT close combat weapons, which only the Sgts normally get.

You could give powerweapon upgrades to vets and stormtroopers, but they're generally too expensive (yet just as fragile) to make it worth it. At least with a basic guadsman you could compensate with numbers!

@ jerjare, hmm interesting take for a platoon that i could see people using . Keep in mind we are focusing on elite troops for this convo.

The above is an imperial guard melee unit though. There's no need for the elites when we've found a solid imperial guard melee unit. Skirmishers as part of a platoon makes sense. What other options are there without transplanting space marines into a guard army or giving a space marine statline to a guard unit...?

The old epic rules also let them have jump packs. A guardsman with a jump pack, chainsword and las pistol is about as assaulty as they could get. In other words not very, but they'll go down fighting dammit.

3 attacks on charge with a couple of power weapons in the squad and maybe a priest style reroll would be reasonably acceptable.

You can possibly justify using some of the Witch Hunters/Sister of Battle melee units.

I don't have the book nearby but from what I remember there are Sister Repentia, Sisters with Chainsaws, and Arco-Flagellants. Both humans that have some melee potential.

Also the use of Arbites wouldn't be a bad idea. Make Power Mauls Rending CCW, to represent a paralyzing shock, that also causes combat resolution to be taken on -1 in addition to what combat was lost by.

larose14 wrote:@ jerjare, hmm interesting take for a platoon that i could see people using . Keep in mind we are focusing on elite troops for this convo.

No problem, the concept could be expanded to 'veteran' skirmishers; ten man squads, 80 points but WS4, LD 8, can take 3 powerweapons a squad, sgt takes a meltabomb and the following Doctorines at 30 points each:

Close Order Doctorine: The squad has +1 Initiative and gets +1 for combat resolution in close combat
Anklebiter Doctorine: Enemy Monstrous creatures/walkers get -1 A, -1 WS in close combat
Siegebreaker Doctorine: The sgt has an eviscerator and the squad gets +1 str to attacks against armored vehicles

None of these would necessarily make an OP assault unit, but it would be a unique assault unit, more oriented toward tying up a dangerous enemy CC unit. Anklebiter and Seigebreaker are particularly specialized against walkers, something I haven't yet seen with infantry.

Yea maybe my thread title is throwing people off. I really like the skirmish unit however its pretty much a power blobwith tweaks.

My main point was the lack of incentive to takr our elite choices and am not a big fan of ogryns for my army theme in particular and theyre s a few probs with them.
But overall its mainly what kind of unit could we field as elites and what would be the incentive .

Me personally id like to see the ogryns replaced by something human.. ratings .. make em human imo

edit:vet idea is cool

I'll tell you the main point of running a skirmisher squad: Tank bubble-wrap. You could keep it naked upgrades-wise and you have something that will protect tanks from enemy assaults, and being 20-strong with a comissar will keep them busy for a while. It frees up the rest of the platoon to its various duties. Right now it seems like people seldom run shooty blobs with weapons because running 'powerblob' helps more with the inevitable assault- I say have your shooty blob squad and your skirmisher squad protecting them/tanks/something else.

The veteran skirmishers have a more specialized role but it gives the Imperial Guard playbook more options- dealing with big nasty creatures, dreadnoughts, etc. Keep in mind that in fitting with the theme of the guard (in my opinion) most of these equipment options/rulesets are defensive in nature; a chimera isn't open-topped and in the Guard's case their 'assault' troop doesn't have Tonka Bikes/jetpacks/honeybadgers to hasten them into assault range. They are there to dump attacks back at the opponent, and let the shooty guys keep shooting.

Hmm I really like the vet idea. Now just give em a fluffy background and name lol.

The bubble wrap skirmishers sounds like what conscripts should relate to more lol

I see conscripts as more of an ad-hoc bottom-of-the-barrel militia type deal, getting paid to do their duty for the emperor through the expert use of cowering, tripping the enemy assaulting infantry, keying their tanks, distracting them with whining, and occasionally scoring a hit with their gun when they remember to point the flashy end away from their own face.

The skirmishers are protecting their armor from sappers, ambushes, and xenos curb stomps.

You want a unit that's unique but still guard-y, otherwise you end up with smaller, wimpier, pink orks

Hey now I had chenkov bring in 30 fresh ones , opponents terminators had killed a company command the previous turn, a bit to close to my edge. First rank fire second rank fire.90 shots later... huzah ! For the empire and won lmao. (Non competitve) . The commander must find a use for all of his tools. Even the dull ones

A new Elite Choice for a Dug in Ig Army? The Storm troopers do fall short, however I like the versatility, so why not create a more earthy version.

Trenchers (65pts)
(stormtroopers stat line)
Equipment - Lasgun, Trenching Tool, Carapace Armor, Frag Grenades
Weapon Upgrades - same as storm troopers

Special Rules:
Trenching Tool: Grants rending in the first turn of any assault.
Earthworks: Adapt at using terrain and trenches the unit always counts as having 1 higher cover, maximum of 2+
Trenchers Initiative: Before deploying the Trenchers You must announce one Initiative for the Squad to Take.
Line Breakers: Trenchers swap their Lasguns for Shotguns. Add meltabombs to their inventory, one may carry a demo pack. The unit has the deep strike universal rule
Rear Guard: Any trencher may exchange their trenching tool and lasgun for a SS and Las Pistol. The squad counts as carrying defensive grenades.
Advance Team: The squad swaps their lasguns for las pistols. The squad counts as having infiltrate, scout and stealth universal rules.

Hmm thats some neat tweaks id rather enjoy trying

It gives all 3 variants completely different roles, something which the storm troopers don't get.

I love the idea of storm troopersso id be really happy with something along these Lines