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A Grey Knight player once called my Eldar army OP because I have Runes of Warding and because all my tanks are Fast Skimmers.

Experiment 626 wrote:

Durza wrote:I just think it's hilarious that someone's calling anything in the Chaos codex OP.

I've had local GK players scream that Chaos Daemons are 'uberfied cheese because;

a) The entire army has invulnerable saves & eternal warrior.

b) I have entire units with power weapons.

I suppose the irony of that complaint was lost on them, yes?

c) Pink Horrors are broken as feth apparently because they get too many shots per model, while Flamers are apparently beyond broken because of their alpha strike abilities.

d) Blessings of the Blood God is in their words, "r" because it unfairly nerfs their entire army and they have no way of stopping it beyond being forced to buy Dark Ex on a Libby.

e) I can turn their 'over-costed and average' HQ's like Draigo or Crowe into spawns. (I'm honestly really lucky with Gift of Chaos rolls, and I have a rather impressive tally of victims!)

I love doing that. I've done Vulkan and Crowe as well as half a squad of Salamander termies.

And it continues too... So this is why they tell me that the only way to beat Daemons is to abuse warp quake and stop me from even landing, because my army is way too over powered and needs to be nerfed or else rolled back into the Chaos marine codex.
Of corse, don't get these morons started on how the Changeling works. GK Ld is apparently too low overall to make him balanced...

Thus, whenever my Daemons show up, out come all the quake-shunting lists and other tailor-made filth fests, followed by the donkeycaves then bragging about how amazing & unbeatable they are.

That's pretty ridiculous. Though it's also ridiculous that an army even has access to such an unfair advantage in the first place, even not against daemons. Though I've had someone tell me daemon weapons are OP because I rolled a six for extra attacks after getting a one for the two turns before.

God I can't wait for Chaos to finally get some OP crap of it's own back! Then I can really make them cry!

I refuse to get my hopes up. They've been nerfing the already sub-standard CSM codex, why shouldn't they take the opportunity to just kill 'em off completely...

I'm so happy that none of the guys I play 40K with have Grey Knights, so I'll never have to deal with this.

I play Space Wolves. Yes, yes, I know it's considered a cheese army, but bear with me.

I run what I call a 60mm Shuffle List at 1500 pts. I have 4 dreads (Bjorn and 3 Venerables), 2 TWC (Two Lords), one squad of 6 GH's in a Las/plas Razorback, and one squad of five with a RP w/ LL and the 5+ cover save power.

Of course, when people see this list, they laugh. They claim you can't win without Long Fangs and lots of Grey Hunter spam. Bjorn is a waist of points, they say, and the Dreads are as well. What's the point of bringing one model, when for the same price, you can get five with missile launchers?

The they see the Shuffle in action. The lords tie up the infantry squads, the razorbacks take objectives and kill tanks, and the Dreads run up the middle, led by Bjorn. Plasma and Las weaponry is spewing from everywhere, Armor saves mean nothing. The Wolf Lord with SotWB gets a ton of attacks and proceeds to wreck face on anything it touches. Bjorn and the Dreads crush vehicles and the units inside them like a cocaine-hyped 12 year old with party crackers.

At least, that's whats supposed to happen. 50% of the time, the Dreads get the gak kicked out of them, the Wolves die, and I'm just speeding around the Razorbacks trying not to get tabled.

Chowderhead wrote:I play Space Wolves. Yes, yes, I know it's considered a cheese army, but bear with me.

I run what I call a 60mm Shuffle List at 1500 pts. I have 4 dreads (Bjorn and 3 Venerables), 2 TWC (Two Lords), one squad of 6 GH's in a Las/plas Razorback, and one squad of five with a RP w/ LL and the 5+ cover save power.

Of course, when people see this list, they laugh. They claim you can't win without Long Fangs and lots of Grey Hunter spam. Bjorn is a waist of points, they say, and the Dreads are as well. What's the point of bringing one model, when for the same price, you can get five with missile launchers?

The they see the Shuffle in action. The lords tie up the infantry squads, the razorbacks take objectives and kill tanks, and the Dreads run up the middle, led by Bjorn. Plasma and Las weaponry is spewing from everywhere, Armor saves mean nothing. The Wolf Lord with SotWB gets a ton of attacks and proceeds to wreck face on anything it touches. Bjorn and the Dreads crush vehicles and the units inside them like a cocaine-hyped 12 year old with party crackers.

At least, that's whats supposed to happen. 50% of the time, the Dreads get the gak kicked out of them, the Wolves die, and I'm just speeding around the Razorbacks trying not to get tabled.

Sir, I admire you for playing Wolves like they're meant to be played.

There is a father-son 'team' at my FLGS as well. The son plays draigowing (the usual form of it: psycannon/halberd paladin spam) and the father plays airborne IG. Both are very good players, and it's actually the Guard that are OP (belive it or not)

This just shows what kinds of kids infest the hobby.

Though in the save vein, a GK player told me my kroot force was impossible to beat. Force weapons? Ok, I don't have armor, hahahaha!

IHateNids wrote:There is a father-son 'team' at my FLGS as well. The son plays draigowing (the usual form of it: psycannon/halberd paladin spam) and the father plays airborne IG. Both are very good players, and it's actually the Guard that are OP (belive it or not)

Wound allocation abuse Pallies are a total rock/papper/scissors army. If you have insant access to plentifull supplies of S8/ap2 weaponry, you laugh at them. So Imperials, Eldar of both flavours & Chaos Marines to an extent can readily pound Draigowing.
But the likes of Orks, Tyranids & Daemons can really, really suffer since you lack easy ways to spam alot of instant killing AND armour ignoring attacks. (especially at range!)

Sure sheer volume of fire eventually works, but it's really just playing to the strengths of the wound allocation abuses Pallies can pull.


Airborn IG are a true nightmare though in good hands! (right up there with DE in good hands imho.)

The father and son both sent models airborne after losing? Really? That seems incredibly hard to believe.

Chowderhead wrote:I play Space Wolves. Yes, yes, I know it's considered a cheese army, but bear with me.

I run what I call a 60mm Shuffle List at 1500 pts. I have 4 dreads (Bjorn and 3 Venerables), 2 TWC (Two Lords), one squad of 6 GH's in a Las/plas Razorback, and one squad of five with a RP w/ LL and the 5+ cover save power.

Of course, when people see this list, they laugh. They claim you can't win without Long Fangs and lots of Grey Hunter spam. Bjorn is a waist of points, they say, and the Dreads are as well. What's the point of bringing one model, when for the same price, you can get five with missile launchers?

The they see the Shuffle in action. The lords tie up the infantry squads, the razorbacks take objectives and kill tanks, and the Dreads run up the middle, led by Bjorn. Plasma and Las weaponry is spewing from everywhere, Armor saves mean nothing. The Wolf Lord with SotWB gets a ton of attacks and proceeds to wreck face on anything it touches. Bjorn and the Dreads crush vehicles and the units inside them like a cocaine-hyped 12 year old with party crackers.

At least, that's whats supposed to happen. 50% of the time, the Dreads get the gak kicked out of them, the Wolves die, and I'm just speeding around the Razorbacks trying not to get tabled.

The only thing that should be in a Heavy Support slot in an SM army is a Land Raider or a Vindicator.

What I find funny is that people actually think I made this up........ Right, your telling me that you have never experienced a opponent freaking out over a bad roll or because there a power-gamer? I have seen a guy punch a hole in the wall over a bad dice roll and I have seen people throw there dice and models over the years playing this game. Seriously when we have people like this its not surprising.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx3ISVBifM0

I dont care if this thread is made of lies or not, I've said it before and I will say it again, Thousand Sons MURDER Grey Knights. Yes, the TS may be overpriced, but they are the Grey Knights nightmare scenario... an army as tough as the GK, that can ignore their armor saves (ignoring paladins and terminators), while still having saves available against some of the GKs most potent weaponry.

I don't know if the story is true, but I find it plausible. I've seen players demonstrating abyssmal attitudes after losing a game. I'm willing to believe a pair of spoiled brats threw temper tantrums (as well as their models) after losing with their "unbeatable" armies. Considering that they were taunting and mocking their opponents (very bad form and NEVER justified) after defeating them, it is only natural to expect them to react badly to the humiliation of losing to an army from the CSM list.

That being said, good on the OP for showing those two children (yes, I know a father was involved, but any adult who acts like that ISN'T an adult) that the Thousand Sons are the best Traitor Legion for a reason. Also, for showing them that Sun Tzu was right when he said, "Know your enemy and know yourself; find nothing to fear in a hundred battles"

If they'd known about AP3 and the TS Invulnerable save, they might've been smart enough to not play the OP at all...

Genius. +1 to OP.

You should have bottled his tears so you could refresh yourself occasionally with his sadness drops.

Granted, your story was probably a lie, but I'm sure a hypothetical GK player somewhere is raging, and that makes it worth it.

Just read this again and its still funny and entertaining btw you should enter that contest !!!

GK wrote: Even better is that there is a 1500 point tournament at the store in a bit, and I am so tempted to play in it just because those two where the first to sign up .

Kronk demands that you DO EET!

Take pictures. Post a battle report.

I agree with Kronk DO IT!!!!!!

GK wrote:What I find funny is that people actually think I made this up........ Right, your telling me that you have never experienced a opponent freaking out over a bad roll or because there a power-gamer? I have seen a guy bunch a hole in the wall over a bad dice roll and I have seen people throw there dice and models over the years playing this game. Seriously when we have people like this its not surprising.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx3ISVBifM0

I would be afraid to play anyone in that video clip. They might go postal on you.

barnowl wrote:

GK wrote:What I find funny is that people actually think I made this up........ Right, your telling me that you have never experienced a opponent freaking out over a bad roll or because there a power-gamer? I have seen a guy bunch a hole in the wall over a bad dice roll and I have seen people throw there dice and models over the years playing this game. Seriously when we have people like this its not surprising.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx3ISVBifM0

I would be afraid to play anyone in that video clip. They might go postal on you.

That's the beauty of online gaming. You can laugh at them over the mic and there's nothing they can do but go berserk, which makes you laugh more, which makes them angrier. Then when they kill you, make them angry again by not caring.

Archonate wrote:

barnowl wrote:

GK wrote:What I find funny is that people actually think I made this up........ Right, your telling me that you have never experienced a opponent freaking out over a bad roll or because there a power-gamer? I have seen a guy bunch a hole in the wall over a bad dice roll and I have seen people throw there dice and models over the years playing this game. Seriously when we have people like this its not surprising.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx3ISVBifM0

I would be afraid to play anyone in that video clip. They might go postal on you.

That's the beauty of online gaming. You can laugh at them over the mic and there's nothing they can do but go berserk, which makes you laugh more, which makes them angrier. Then when they kill you, make them angry again by not caring.

I prefer to kill them in order to make them angry again. Hitting their keyboard doesn't tend to help them win for some reason...

chaos0xomega wrote:I dont care if this thread is made of lies or not, I've said it before and I will say it again, Thousand Sons MURDER Grey Knights. Yes, the TS may be overpriced, but they are the Grey Knights nightmare scenario... an army as tough as the GK, that can ignore their armor saves (ignoring paladins and terminators), while still having saves available against some of the GKs most potent weaponry.

Okay, for those of us who have never faced TS or read their rules, can you please explain why?

Cheers

Andrew

kronk wrote:

GK wrote: Even better is that there is a 1500 point tournament at the store in a bit, and I am so tempted to play in it just because those two where the first to sign up .

Kronk demands that you DO EET!

Take pictures. Post a battle report.

Do it, but I want video of the rage!

Had a GK player wreck one my chimeras during a game. Out popped Commissar Yarrick and his 5 Ogryns that hang out with him. The GK player said that is a garbage unit. Well, Yarrick and the boyz were pissed there ride got wrecked, so, being mad, they assaulted. He was surprised at Yarricks abilities, the Ogryns toughness, so much so he demanded to see my codex. Well, at the end of combat, there were three ogryns and yarrick left and no grey knight marines left in that area. Ha Ha Ha.

I now want to play a Thousands Son army...

Henners91 wrote:This thread smells of lies.

I'm gonna have to agree.

Ha. That is funny, boy if I got upset for every model I lost I would be in anger management. (PS: I play IG)

AndrewC wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:I dont care if this thread is made of lies or not, I've said it before and I will say it again, Thousand Sons MURDER Grey Knights. Yes, the TS may be overpriced, but they are the Grey Knights nightmare scenario... an army as tough as the GK, that can ignore their armor saves (ignoring paladins and terminators), while still having saves available against some of the GKs most potent weaponry.

Okay, for those of us who have never faced TS or read their rules, can you please explain why?

Cheers

Andrew

Thousand sons are expensive with being more expensive than a plague marine (around 25-27 points, above purifier level)
Have a 4++ save, standard marine armaments (bolters and bolt pistols with CCW), no option for a special weapon.
They get AP3 bolt shells
Their sorcerer is 65 points unkitted, and MUST take a power (and most of the powers in the dex are overcosted, and the best one for a sorcerer is +25 points) This is one of the most primary reasons they alone are overcosted.
They have slow and purposeful

AndrewC wrote:Okay, for those of us who have never faced TS or read their rules, can you please explain why?

Cheers

Andrew

Your basic Thousand Sons squad comes default with AP3 bolters and 4++ invulnerable saves. If your opponent doesn't utilise cover well, those AP3 bolters can easily wipe out a whole Marine squad (or any other 3+ armour squad!), especially in rapid-fire range. And then if you do manage to get into close combat with them, those 4++ saves laugh in the face of your power weapons/force weapons/strength 8+ weapons. They still die to bad dice rolls, but they ALWAYS have a chance to save, unlike regular marines or other troops without an invulnerable save. So yeah, Grey Knight troops have most of their advantages completely negated by Thousand Sons squads.

Then the aspiring sorcerer in the Thousand Sons squad comes with a force weapon as well, and at least three melee attacks - two base plus one for CCW/pistol. That sorcerer's pistol is also AP3, and the sorcerer himself can have one psychic power, including a 24" st8 ap1 shooting attack, a flamer template that glances vehicles or wounds anything else on a 4+ with no armour or cover saves, or a chance to turn a model of his choice within 6" into a chaos spawn or gibbering pile of goo. Or he can just save his psychic power for his force weapon, and suddenly that three-wound HQ you've just charged into the Sons squad has a good chance to get insta-killed (unless he has Eternal Warrior or force weapon immunity).

Granted, a Thousand Sons squad is expensive as all hell - the aspiring sorcerer alone can be anywhere from 70-95 points. And apart from the sorcerer, they aren't much good in close combat - they tarpit like champions, but with only one base attack each, they're not too great at actually killing anything in melee. And since they're SnP, and don't have grenades, they attack at Initiative 1 on the charge, except for the sorcerer who keeps his I4.

Oh, they're also fun for killing walkers with. Give the aspiring sorcerer melta bombs, and the sheer survivability of the rest of his squad (4++ invuln saves against dreadnought weapons, muahaha!) often means he lives long enough to have a good chance of rolling that six to hit with the melta bomb. One of my aspiring sorcerers has racked up both a soul grinder kill and a deff dread kill with his melta bombs. And both times he still had at least half his squad left alive! Always hilarious.

A pure Thousand Sons force can be almost as small as a Grey Knights force. Expensive, expensive, expensive. But when you play 'em right, and the dice roll well, they are SO worth it.

To those of you who think the OP's lying... I think you're just jealous. His story's entirely possible, and I've done similar myself. Surprise AP3 can be amazingly effective, hehehe.

I can believe pretty much anything about people getting angry over losing at a game...

Hell, I've seen a grown adult hold a 9-year-old kid by the arm and berate the poor girl for not playing right at the top of her goal crease all game and allowing the other team to score 8 goals on her! (you know, the old case of the 1st place team vs the last place team)
And this is house league hockey...

holes pollute every sport/hobby. Good on the OP for putting these morons in their proper place!

Skits wrote:

AndrewC wrote:Okay, for those of us who have never faced TS or read their rules, can you please explain why?

Cheers

Andrew

Your basic Thousand Sons squad comes default with AP3 bolters and 4++ invulnerable saves. If your opponent doesn't utilise cover well, those AP3 bolters can easily wipe out a whole Marine squad (or any other 3+ armour squad!), especially in rapid-fire range. And then if you do manage to get into close combat with them, those 4++ saves laugh in the face of your power weapons/force weapons/strength 8+ weapons. They still die to bad dice rolls, but they ALWAYS have a chance to save, unlike regular marines or other troops without an invulnerable save. So yeah, Grey Knight troops have most of their advantages completely negated by Thousand Sons squads.

Then the aspiring sorcerer in the Thousand Sons squad comes with a force weapon as well, and at least three melee attacks - two base plus one for CCW/pistol. That sorcerer's pistol is also AP3, and the sorcerer himself can have one psychic power, including a 24" st8 ap1 shooting attack, a flamer template that glances vehicles or wounds anything else on a 4+ with no armour or cover saves, or a chance to turn a model of his choice within 6" into a chaos spawn or gibbering pile of goo. Or he can just save his psychic power for his force weapon, and suddenly that three-wound HQ you've just charged into the Sons squad has a good chance to get insta-killed (unless he has Eternal Warrior or force weapon immunity).

Granted, a Thousand Sons squad is expensive as all hell - the aspiring sorcerer alone can be anywhere from 70-95 points. And apart from the sorcerer, they aren't much good in close combat - they tarpit like champions, but with only one base attack each, they're not too great at actually killing anything in melee. And since they're SnP, and don't have grenades, they attack at Initiative 1 on the charge, except for the sorcerer who keeps his I4.

Oh, they're also fun for killing walkers with. Give the aspiring sorcerer melta bombs, and the sheer survivability of the rest of his squad (4++ invuln saves against dreadnought weapons, muahaha!) often means he lives long enough to have a good chance of rolling that six to hit with the melta bomb. One of my aspiring sorcerers has racked up both a soul grinder kill and a deff dread kill with his melta bombs. And both times he still had at least half his squad left alive! Always hilarious.

A pure Thousand Sons force can be almost as small as a Grey Knights force. Expensive, expensive, expensive. But when you play 'em right, and the dice roll well, they are SO worth it.

To those of you who think the OP's lying... I think you're just jealous. His story's entirely possible, and I've done similar myself. Surprise AP3 can be amazingly effective, hehehe.

Unfortunately most of the time they 1kson is just an overpriced marine. Xenos hordes don't care about AP3 bolters, and no one without a power weapon cares about a 4+ invulnerable in close combat when you already have a 3+. So yeah, in most cases 1ksons are just ridiculously overpriced tactical marines without the option for any special/heavy weapons, or power fist.