Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
No, Thor is a God while Superman is an Alien.

Thor is only a god in our world, in the Marvel Universe he is an Alien as well.

No, in the Marvel world he is a God. In the Marvel Movie world he is some kind of alien.

That is debatable. I looked online and talked to others that are far more into it and can't get a straight answer on it, which is not unusual in comics as things change over the years, then change back as writer's tinker here or there. I'm pretty sure that 'god' has a specific meaning in the Marvel Universe (comic or otherwise) different from casual use of the term; Superman would most likely be considered a god in the Marvel Universe as well. I would proffer that Asgardians are still aliens, not in the sense of being from another planet in our universe, but in that they are from a different dimension/plane of existence.

It is still something of a silly debate because, unlike a lot of others of this nature, it has actually happened in the comics, and Superman won.

What comic?

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
What comic?

JLA/Avengers miniseries. There is even panels of it on the first page of the poll. Obliviously it depends on plot and such, but we actually have an instance where the companies agreed to allow the characters to cross over and had to decide what would happen. In the case of Thor and Superman it was decided Superman would win, though it was a rough fight to be sure.

Looks like you've been doing a lot of research. It seems the truth is the match was pretty even and indecisive.

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/son_of_the_northwind/blog/superman-vs-thor-and-what-really-went-down/48635/

 Ahtman wrote:
Superman isn't 'weak' to lightning, he just isn't invulnerable to it. He has been zapped by lightning before by Black Adam (and Captain Marvel for that matter) and while it hurt, it didn't stop him.

I actually imagine Superman could lift Mjolnir, and not through strength, but through worthiness.

Agreed. He's worthy.

The DC characters have generally been more powerful than Marvel's. Pre-Crisis, Superman used to push planets around. I don't think Thor's ever been shown doing things at that level. Granted, my example is pre-Crisis, but note that his abilities seem to be on an upswing again in the New 52. Besides, the real issue for Thor would be Superman's speed anyway.

I think a more even matchup for Thor would be Wonder Woman.

Lets put this into perspective.

Superman the comic book character vs Thor the comic book character.

I dont care.

Superman the comic book character vs Thor of the Aesir as worshipped by the Norse.

Thor wins, because he is a god part of the culture of millenia and not the plagiarism of some nerdy 20th century artists. Thor of the Aesir steeped in the legends of the Norse wields Mjollnir, Thor the comic book character (TM) wields a cheap plastic copy with no more substance than himself. Superman can only be hurt by Kryptonite, within the rules of his own milieu, but those rules are trumped by ancient myth. Ancient Skalds say what Thor of the Aesir could accomplish, corporate nerds say what fake Thor and Superman can accomplish. There is no end of argument, the arguement doesnt even begin. Feed the souls of the spandex wearing fool and the fraudulent copy of Thor to Fenris

Its a bit like asking which one would win:

Aragorn, son of Arathorn vs a munchkins 30th level ranger character with ub3r stats

Aragorn wins. It doesnt come down to which has the most plusses but which has the most presence, the munchkins ranger doesn't matter, its +10 sword of uberdeath is irrelevant even if it is techically sharper than Anduril, flame of the West or does more damage and neither does any of the Marvel or DC comic characters compared to centuries old culture of Norse myth. Pissing contests between comic character especially ones plagiarised from ancient cultures are frankly an insult to the collective culture of humanity and are begging to be laughed at scornfully.

Carry on enjoying your comics, kiddies.

If you are not interested in the concept it is better to ignore the thread than to go in and make disparaging remarks.

I have shown 'interest' in the thread concept and have a different, but not invalid opinion.

If it was Superman vs the Hulk or Spiderman or Batman I would have ignored it, the comic writers made the characters, they can do what they like with them. But the thread involved Thor ans thus was a continuation of the folklore theft of Nordic and Scandinavian culture.

If anyone wants to work out the limits of a Norse god ask an anthropologist of the Nordic peoples, not corporate writers for commercial comic books, or Dakka.

Er....but since it's Thor the comic character we're talking about I don't understand why you need to bother bringing up Thor the mythical Norse God. Like you said already you don't care and while you might want to bring up the idea of the original Thor to "provide additional perspective" it doesn't make sense to bring in him because they're in a different context and time-frame as well as the fact that we already made it clear we were talking about Thor as the comic character. Also just because he's the "original idea" does not by default make him the winner just because "he was there first". What feats did mythical Thor do that would one-up the crazy feats Superman has committed over the course of his fictional history anyways? Both are fictional characters regardless so your condescending tone seems a bit out of line just because you personally think that one is superior historically in its antiquity and "originality".

Exactly, the Norse god isn't less silly or more unbelievable than the comic book one.

 Orlanth wrote:
If anyone wants to work out the limits of a Norse god ask an anthropologist of the Nordic peoples, not corporate writers for commercial comic books, or Dakka.

Says the Englishman who has, in the past, talked about an "Eastern mindset".

At any rate, the winner is Superman if for no other reason than the arbitrary expansion of his powers.

 dogma wrote:

 Orlanth wrote:
If anyone wants to work out the limits of a Norse god ask an anthropologist of the Nordic peoples, not corporate writers for commercial comic books, or Dakka.

Says the Englishman who has, in the past, talked about an "Eastern mindset".

Whats the relevance of that?

For the record there is such a thing as western and eatern mindsets. You seriously going to tell me that peoples and governments on the Pacific Rim think the same as those in the western world. History, anthropology, politics and common observation will tell you different. And no I wasn't adding relative value either. Besides it was one post of two lines, not the culmination of all 7k plus posts on dakka. You really clutch at straws to troll.
/Threadjack.

 Frazzled wrote:
I'm saying Earth. Thor's a wussy and dern ferenner. Superman is naturalized citizen, hence an American Hurr!

Is he naturalized though?

When babies land in corn fields, is there a State Department form for that?

I bet Superman is an illegal. We need to sick ICE on his ass.

Superman is an illegal immigrant. Thor works for the US Goverment....but he doesn't get paid.

 KamikazeCanuck wrote:
Superman is an illegal immigrant. Thor works for the US Goverment....but he doesn't get paid.

Pro-Bono mercenary work. I'd say that sums up what Thor does pretty well.

Superman would take this one.

He would overpower Thor and throw him into the sun.

 Orlanth wrote:
It doesnt come down to which has the most plusses but which has the most presence, the munchkins ranger doesn't matter, its +10 sword of uberdeath is irrelevant even if it is techically sharper than Anduril, flame of the West or does more damage and neither does any of the Marvel or DC comic characters compared to centuries old culture of Norse myth.

It doesn't work that way. There's no kind of 'my cultural concept is older and more refined and taken more seriously than yours, therefore it wins hahaha I'm taking my Gods and going home' rule. Doesn't exist. Not a thing.

What there is, is a God in an od religion who got co-opted into a comic book series that people enjoy reading, and talking about. Let them. You said you don't care... so don't care. Walk away.

I mean, Zoroastrianism is older than Judaism and is still practiced today (and not by neo-Zoroastrians, but people with continuous traditions of faith right through history), and yet Mazda decided to use the name of their God for their car company. When their God gets co-opted by a car company and they don't get to complain, you don't get to complain about your God getting co-opted by a comic book series that still portrays him as a kick ass hero.

I think Thor would win but that's down to personal opinion than any other reason . I think Thor should win since he is an actual hero who was granted his powers because he was worthy of them, superman to me just seems like some illegal alien who conviently crash landed on the planet that would make him basically invincible, heroes like superman just don't really interest me now if it was batman then it would be a different story .

I say we let these two sit back and enjoy with us watching their ladies fight. An all-out bikini mud wrestling competition between Jane Foster and Lois Lane. Bikinis optional.

I'm just going to leave this here...



But, honestly? Batman

Regrettably, Thor lacks the speed to keep up with Superman, assuming this is no-holds barred battle. Thor could be thrown into space with a single motion, given that his strength is vastly disproportionate to his weight.

 azazel the cat wrote:
Superman's weakness is magic, yes: but Mjolnir's magical properties are limited. As in, Mjolnir cannot enchant Superman or anything like that, so the fact that it is a magical weapon is moot. it's not as if Mjolnir can bypass Superman's armour save.

It's already been said, but it comes down entirely to the location of the fight. If Superman has access to a yellow sun, then he wins, hands down. However, if he doesn't have access to a yellow sun, then Thor wins without difficulty.

(Note: Didn't read the intervening posts between this one and mine. Don't care. ) The magic doesn't have to be able to somehow enchant Superman. It just has to be a magical object to be able to harm him. I mean, Wonder Woman frigging tore out Supes's throat with her tiara stabby-thing after killing Max Lord back in the pre-sucky New 52 DC era. Given that Thor is a god (which kinda makes him a magical being in itself) and Mjolnir is magical as well, I'm giving this to Thor.

 grayshadow87 wrote:

 azazel the cat wrote:
Superman's weakness is magic, yes: but Mjolnir's magical properties are limited. As in, Mjolnir cannot enchant Superman or anything like that, so the fact that it is a magical weapon is moot. it's not as if Mjolnir can bypass Superman's armour save.

It's already been said, but it comes down entirely to the location of the fight. If Superman has access to a yellow sun, then he wins, hands down. However, if he doesn't have access to a yellow sun, then Thor wins without difficulty.

(Note: Didn't read the intervening posts between this one and mine. Don't care. ) The magic doesn't have to be able to somehow enchant Superman. It just has to be a magical object to be able to harm him. I mean, Wonder Woman frigging tore out Supes's throat with her tiara stabby-thing after killing Max Lord back in the pre-sucky New 52 DC era. Given that Thor is a god (which kinda makes him a magical being in itself) and Mjolnir is magical as well, I'm giving this to Thor.

Wonder Woman CUT superman in the throat, after using kryptonite on him. If this fight is set on earth, then superman can fly into the sun and come back with enough speed and force to simply throw thor out of orbit before he can make a move.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
I'm just going to leave this here...



But, honestly? Batman

That was pretty cool. That a TV show or something?

Whoever wins, we all win for watching it.

 ImotekhTheStormlord wrote:

 grayshadow87 wrote:

 azazel the cat wrote:
Superman's weakness is magic, yes: but Mjolnir's magical properties are limited. As in, Mjolnir cannot enchant Superman or anything like that, so the fact that it is a magical weapon is moot. it's not as if Mjolnir can bypass Superman's armour save.

It's already been said, but it comes down entirely to the location of the fight. If Superman has access to a yellow sun, then he wins, hands down. However, if he doesn't have access to a yellow sun, then Thor wins without difficulty.

(Note: Didn't read the intervening posts between this one and mine. Don't care. ) The magic doesn't have to be able to somehow enchant Superman. It just has to be a magical object to be able to harm him. I mean, Wonder Woman frigging tore out Supes's throat with her tiara stabby-thing after killing Max Lord back in the pre-sucky New 52 DC era. Given that Thor is a god (which kinda makes him a magical being in itself) and Mjolnir is magical as well, I'm giving this to Thor.

Wonder Woman CUT superman in the throat, after using kryptonite on him. If this fight is set on earth, then superman can fly into the sun and come back with enough speed and force to simply throw thor out of orbit before he can make a move.

But throwing Thor out of orbit wouldn't accomplish anything. In recent issues of Thor, it has been demonstrated that space travel is no big deal for him. Even if this somehow killed Thor, he's literally fought his way out of being dead in recent history, so at best they're at a standstill. I'm still saying that Thor's magical nature would afford him a major advantage over Superman.

You know, now that I'm thinking on it, we should establish which versions of Superman and Thor we're talking about. I mean, depending on the continuity or version you're discussing, this fight could vary wildly.

After all, that was one point in Superman history where he was strong enough to juggle planets.

 Melissia wrote:
After all, that was one point in Superman history where he was strong enough to juggle planets.

Exactly. Hell, there was even a point when he could alter the way he looked because he had perfect control of his facial muscles and could alter the way they were shaped to the point that he looked different, and let's not forgot in Final Crisis (*shudder*) when he was somehow a super genius who could perfectly memorize how to build a miracle machine to save everything.

And let us not forget when Thor had that sweet flock of ravens....

My vote goes to Thor. He's a God, thus he's pretty strong. I also don't really feel superman is a really hero. I think a solider of any country is more heroic because he or she is risking their life, where superman does great deeds but a little to no risk to himself (unless there is Kryptonite, where he is fighting for his life).

Superman risks his life constantly, since the writers often scale the power of his foes to match his.