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 Thor665 wrote:
They are worse in my opinion, drugs got weaker and they lost an attack - that's kind of a big deal.

agree, drugs are worse and they lost an attack. sure they are cheaper, but they also lost grenades. They lost the slot manipulation that made them troops and they lost the special weapons on their champion that let you remove characters. They lost baron making them awesome. If someone finds a way to make them good, it will be surprising.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Leth wrote:

Imagine for example it is turn 4. You know that you are getting fearless next turn so no matter what is shot at you, you go to ground because you know they will auto get up at the start of your turn.

Now that is powerful.

good point.

Note that Coven lists get Fearless on turn 2, which means their entire army can GTG on turn 1(well except for those around Urien, with a haemi, or the pain engines)

 Exergy wrote:

 Thor665 wrote:
They are worse in my opinion, drugs got weaker and they lost an attack - that's kind of a big deal.

agree, drugs are worse and they lost an attack. sure they are cheaper, but they also lost grenades. They lost the slot manipulation that made them troops and they lost the special weapons on their champion that let you remove characters. They lost baron making them awesome. If someone finds a way to make them good, it will be surprising.

They're bad enough to get ignored early on?
They are decent enough late game. Fearless, feel no pain and furious charge makes them decent. Especially with hit and run.
If you get a good drug roll (strength or attack) they can kill AV10 transports early on, and really kick butt late game.
If you can catch an enemy in the open, the combination of poison shots and S4 attacks is decent.

They really should have plasma grenades though, it would give them a useful niche.

Exergy wrote:they lost the special weapons on their champion that let you remove characters.

This is a good thing though, because that special weapon was feth terrible and people would be fooled into taking it.

HawaiiMatt wrote:They're bad enough to get ignored early on?
They are decent enough late game. Fearless, feel no pain and furious charge makes them decent. Especially with hit and run.
If you get a good drug roll (strength or attack) they can kill AV10 transports early on, and really kick butt late game.
If you can catch an enemy in the open, the combination of poison shots and S4 attacks is decent.

They really should have plasma grenades though, it would give them a useful niche.

I think your definition of 'decent' and mine are different

 Thor665 wrote:

Exergy wrote:they lost the special weapons on their champion that let you remove characters.

This is a good thing though, because that special weapon was feth terrible and people would be fooled into taking it.

HawaiiMatt wrote:They're bad enough to get ignored early on?
They are decent enough late game. Fearless, feel no pain and furious charge makes them decent. Especially with hit and run.

I think your definition of 'decent' and mine are different

Yeah. The biggest problem is you're making your opponents target selection pretty easy.
For the first half of the game, hellions are over-costed shooters.
I've even been toying with the idea of running my 10 as beast masters.
You get the same guns for 10 points, instead of 13.

20 shots poison shots for 100 points isn't terrible. I'd just have to model them up without the hellglaives; which I can do thanks to the extra wyche bits.

There's enough manipulation in the codex of the PnP that you can afaik can get the 3 turn bonuses on the 2nd turn and so forth.

Shoot throw urian in a wave serpent and now you got a pretty big footprint on a durable platform for his Aura.

Really not helping me with ditching space marines and going for Dark Eldar Leth, lol. I like their premise of glass cannons on paper planes. A lot

Someone has got to be positive on the internet. Otherwise all the negativity will drain the power from the planet and we will be plunged into eternal night!!

I am just dabbling in my marines right now, I have zero problem jumping ship to dark eldar I just need to cancel that predator tank order before I need to pay for it! Though I have no idea where to start on Dark Eldar, are there any recommendations? I'd like to start building and painting something from the army to entertain myself.

 BunkerBob wrote:
I am just dabbling in my marines right now, I have zero problem jumping ship to dark eldar I just need to cancel that predator tank order before I need to pay for it! Though I have no idea where to start on Dark Eldar, are there any recommendations? I'd like to start building and painting something from the army to entertain myself.

Reavers and Scourges. Awesome models and they're some of the better units in the codex.