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I would say that no one has won the War in Heaven. It's a bit like the Corean war. In the end, it ended in a cease fire with nobody having a clear millitary win, but one faction who benefited the most from peace. The Eldar claimed the galaxy, probably purged many necron tombs worlds yet many more escaped their vigilence before forgetting them altogether as their civilisation descended into decadence.

Now only Alaitoc Craftworld has good working knowledge of the Necron World and threat has well has the Harlequins. Some individuals in various Craftworld like Eldrar, who predicted their return and had a plan to defeat them, are also aware of the issue, but their working knowledge of them can vary. Eldrad plan went wrong when they failed to steal the Talisman of Vaul from the hands of Abaddon and with it their most powerful weapons against the necron.

The Necron defeated the Old Ones, but not before they could plant the seeds of their destruction: the eldars. No matter what happenned, if the necron kept fighting the war, they would either be defeated by the eldars or would reign over the broken remains of a galaxy. It was a no win situation for them. They didn't expected the Eldar to survive so long either and having so many problem at their return.

Alaitoc are the only ones who believe the necrons represent an actual threat. Every other craftworld still know who they are, they just think the dynasties are so far gone they don't matter.

The eldar mythic cycles represent the MYTHOS of the eldar, which they tie into current events as allegorical comparisons. For the eldar to COMPARE the Necron war with the war in heaven is viable, but the mythos surrounding their creation and their gods (who did and still do exist) cannot be mistaken for said war, that would mean the old ones and necrons are their gods, and that is nonsense. He eldar are even the only ones who know the origen of the C'tan ( it's in the black library according to the harlequin codex) so definitely no mistake there either.

Don't forget that the craftworlders and dark kin took a huge amount of material with them when they left, including their knowledge.

Lythrandire Biehrellian wrote:
Alaitoc are the only ones who believe the necrons represent an actual threat. Every other craftworld still know who they are, they just think the dynasties are so far gone they don't matter.

The eldar mythic cycles represent the MYTHOS of the eldar, which they tie into current events as allegorical comparisons. For the eldar to COMPARE the Necron war with the war in heaven is viable, but the mythos surrounding their creation and their gods (who did and still do exist) cannot be mistaken for said war, that would mean the old ones and necrons are their gods, and that is nonsense. He eldar are even the only ones who know the origen of the C'tan ( it's in the black library according to the harlequin codex) so definitely no mistake there either.

Don't forget that the craftworlders and dark kin took a huge amount of material with them when they left, including their knowledge.

Just like in some stories the "machine spirits" are real and in some they aren't it's just fanatical confirmation bias. sometimes you cant think literally about abstract subjects.

The Eldar won.

Upon seeing the ininfite waves upon waves of scatter-lasers in the Eldar's employ, the Necrons said "feth this, we're not playing you guys anymore. Wake us up when you're more balanced."

 GKTiberius wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Why wouldn't the Eldar forget the names of those they fought 60-some million years ago?

The Craftworld Eldar are the hinterland hicks, Young Earthers, ChemTrail conspiracy theorists and Westboro Baptists of their previous civilization. The Eldar, as we know them in 40K, are not representative of Eldar culture throughout history! It would be like having Fred Phelps stand in as a representative for all Americans.

.

This is an amazing analogy. So not to get too off topic, and I can start a new thread about it if i need to, I would be every interested to learn about the average eldar pre-fall. Was it more like star trek (Utopian dystopia)or more like Tolkien Elves (a harmoneous society built on mutual giving, like perfect socialism that actually works)

The Eldar pre-fall were like the Dark Eldar still are in the present of 40k. Eldar society was decadent in the extreme. The Dark Eldar are those Eldar that survived the Fall just because they happened to be in the Webway at the time. They just rebuild there and continued living the same way they had previously. The Craftworlders meanwhile, are those Eldar that were fed up with their society and tried to get away from it. That is why they are not representative of Eldar culture pre-fall.

The C'tan.

 Iron_Captain wrote:

 GKTiberius wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Why wouldn't the Eldar forget the names of those they fought 60-some million years ago?

The Craftworld Eldar are the hinterland hicks, Young Earthers, ChemTrail conspiracy theorists and Westboro Baptists of their previous civilization. The Eldar, as we know them in 40K, are not representative of Eldar culture throughout history! It would be like having Fred Phelps stand in as a representative for all Americans.

.

This is an amazing analogy. So not to get too off topic, and I can start a new thread about it if i need to, I would be every interested to learn about the average eldar pre-fall. Was it more like star trek (Utopian dystopia)or more like Tolkien Elves (a harmoneous society built on mutual giving, like perfect socialism that actually works)

The Eldar pre-fall were like the Dark Eldar still are in the present of 40k. Eldar society was decadent in the extreme. The Dark Eldar are those Eldar that survived the Fall just because they happened to be in the Webway at the time. They just rebuild there and continued living the same way they had previously. The Craftworlders meanwhile, are those Eldar that were fed up with their society and tried to get away from it. That is why they are not representative of Eldar culture pre-fall.

I think that for the most part you are correct about the Dark Eldar, but remember that Vect did arrive and restructure many aspects of Dark Eldar society, mainly the Kabal system rather than Royalty. I'm sure they are actually much more extreme than they once where considering now they must do it to survive, rather than just for giggles.

I am probably horribly wrong about this, but I thought the craftworld eldar represented the original eldar before they got too messed up with the pleasure and sensationso that the dark eldar are. I was under the idea that they regressed to the dark eldar ways, Slaneesh was born, and the Craftworld Eldar reverted back to their old original ways. Like I said, I could be very wrong on this though.

2BlackJack1 wrote:
I am probably horribly wrong about this, but I thought the craftworld eldar represented the original eldar before they got too messed up with the pleasure and sensationso that the dark eldar are. I was under the idea that they regressed to the dark eldar ways, Slaneesh was born, and the Craftworld Eldar reverted back to their old original ways. Like I said, I could be very wrong on this though.

Not really. They probably believe that they do, but the CWE are the descendants of (and, in some cases, are) those who lived on the furthest fringes of the Pre-Fall Eldar Empire. I suppose one could consider them something akin to the Amish or the Quakers, who are a part of American society, but aren't really part of American society. They are groups that live radically different (and, in the case of the Amish, far "simpler") lifestyles than that of the average US citizen. The CWE are much the same. Eldar life was pretty fethed up prior to the Fall, and had been for a pretty long time.

MarsNZ wrote:

 lcmiracle wrote:

I'm assuming we are ignoring it because it's absurd to think such passages would exists.

Odd considering how much of the Necron fluff consists of absurdities just like the one you quoted.

I happen to believe the newcron is the best thing that's ever happened to the Necrons. Instead of emotionaless cardboard cut-outs of a faction we now have actual drama and character within it. It makes room for personal (necronal) ambition, inter-dynastic intrigues and the much-hated but actually makes a lot of sense BA-Necron alliance (and no, it's not battle-brothers and the Crons were just using the Space Vampires for their own ends. No bro-fist for yo.)

No, it's not absurd. It's a dramatic departure from the 3rd Edition Necron, the first actual incarnation of them as a faction. The Oldcron was an ill-conceived idea for a game that had been about "your dudes", and the Newcrons have been the better option. Good riddens that the Oldcrons are gone. Despite being made by a certain monstrosity, it's still one of the best retcons GW has made.

Lythrandire Biehrellian wrote:
Page 7 4th paragraph down on the left

"Even when the galaxy was young there were upstart races seeking to gouge out petty empires of their own, and the eldar waged war against the sprawling Necron dynasties that damaged dozens of star systems and cost trillions of lives.... Even the greatest of their wars, known in the mythic cycles as the war in heaven did not humble them."

In this passage the two are listed separately. The old ones cannot be representative of the eldar gods, because the war was between the gods and the eldar know what the Necron and old ones are.

I will also note that in the CURRENT Necron codex that the eldar are listed only as an ally to the old ones. Not some sort of purpose bred weapon for them.

That's what I have right now.

You see, it's you own interpretation. No where does it say that they are not bred by the old ones either. The so called "War in Heaven" is most likely the same as the Necron wars, because, the other War In Heaven would be the one where the Eldar Gods are dead, and Slaanesh was born. Also the new Necron dex specifically named their war with the Old Ones as the War In Heaven. This sentence would make no sense if it were to describe the post-fall eldar, since the Fall (the Slaaneshi WiH would have certainly humbled all but the most deprived sub-sect of Eldars).

If I were to second guess the intention of the author, I'd say the WiH and the Eldar-Necron war is very likely to be the exact same thing. Since a "Mythic Cycle" is exactly what it is - myth. Inspired and dramatized from actual, ancient events. I also wonder if it's just Eldars that are listed as allies, since I can see the Old Ones' got a lot of "allies", that don't mean they have not uplifted them to become allies. Maybe the Old Ones are just not into slavery? I don't know. But there is no retcon here. It's just straight up neglecting to mention old fluff.

 Psienesis wrote:

2BlackJack1 wrote:
I am probably horribly wrong about this, but I thought the craftworld eldar represented the original eldar before they got too messed up with the pleasure and sensationso that the dark eldar are. I was under the idea that they regressed to the dark eldar ways, Slaneesh was born, and the Craftworld Eldar reverted back to their old original ways. Like I said, I could be very wrong on this though.

Not really. They probably believe that they do, but the CWE are the descendants of (and, in some cases, are) those who lived on the furthest fringes of the Pre-Fall Eldar Empire. I suppose one could consider them something akin to the Amish or the Quakers, who are a part of American society, but aren't really part of American society. They are groups that live radically different (and, in the case of the Amish, far "simpler") lifestyles than that of the average US citizen. The CWE are much the same. Eldar life was pretty fethed up prior to the Fall, and had been for a pretty long time.

Actually 2BJack1 is closer to it. The Craftworld Eldar are the descendants of that segment of the pre-Fall Eldar that did not become decadent. Although the Craftworld Eldar Path system is new, the aesthetics of the old pre-Fall pre-decadent Eldar Empire is closer to that of the Craftworlds. Evidence for this is in how the large Webway gates (all pre-Fall) feature gate structures that more closely match the aesthetics of the Craftworld Eldar.

The Crafttworld Eldar are not the Amish. They do not shun technology. They want to keep all the comforts of the Eldar Empire of old, and hang on to the old culture. It is the Exodites that are like the Amish. The Exodites believe in physical work to avoid having time for decadence, and they have given up the old Eldar Empire's culture in favor of a simpler way of life.

The Eldar Empire went through phases. First there was the mythical time before the empire, a time when the Eldar still had to struggle. The Exodites look back to this era. Then the empire at its height of power before it started becoming decadent. That is the era the Craftworld Eldar are yearning for again, so their aesthetics can be viewed almost as Neo-Classical. Then the Eldar Empire started becoming decadent and taking on the aesthetics closer to the modern Dark Eldar. The Eldar that left the Empire deliberately tried to re-create idealized versions of the past.

Do we have anything to suggest that isn't the CWE claiming that it's that way? Do we have something showing us Eldar culture from, say, 2 million BC?

 Psienesis wrote:
Do we have anything to suggest that isn't the CWE claiming that it's that way? Do we have something showing us Eldar culture from, say, 2 million BC?

As I have said, the fact the pre-Fall Eldar Webway gates were made of wraithbone and match the Craftworld Eldar aesthetics more than the spiky Dark Eldar aesthetic, shows the pre-decadent Eldar Empire visually was closer to that of the Craftworlds.

The quote from the original Eldar 40K compendium:

Most Eldar live upon gigantic vessels known as craftworlds, which travel the void endlessly. Each craftworld is a self-contained environment, with no need for planetary colonies or outposts. Each operates independently from the others and craftworlds rarely have much contact with each other, except to give aid in times of conflict. During their heyday the Eldar used the craftworlds as vast trading ships. The craftworlds were self-contained communities housing hundreds of Eldar families. A typical trading mission might take the craftworld away from its home planet for centuries, travelling thousands of light years beyond Eldar space before returning home. The craftworlds developed a strong sense of independence and were largely unaffected by the degradation of Eldar society leading up to the Fall. Because a craftworld might return to its home planet only three or four times in a thousand years, the decline of their civilisation was all the more apparent to them. In the final weeks before the Fall, returning craftworlds found their worlds in ruins. They rescued those of their kin who were still sane and fled into the deeps of space through the rapidly collapsing Webway network. Many craftworlds lingered too long in attempting to rescue their kinsmen. Finding themselves in orbit at the moment of the Fall, they were either destroyed by the psychic overspill or sucked through the warp and consumed by Slaanesh.

Where the Craftworld Eldar cling to the past of their race and preserve all they can of their fallen civilisation, the Exodites have turned their backs upon ancient tradition in favour of a simpler and harder way of life. Their psychic defences are tougher and more straightforward but not as subtle and thus ultimately less powerful than those of their Craftworld cousins. They have survived, and of all the Eldar they seem the most likely to continue to do so.

p.16, 2nd edition Eldar Codex

The Craftworlds at least in original conception were trading ships (though now in later fluff some Craftworlds, such as Mymeara, seem to be custom constructed arks). Because they were isolated from the wider empire, they became specimens of the Eldar empire before it became corrupt. The decline of the Eldar empire into decadence took thousands of years as shown in the Dark Eldar Codex timeline (i.e. still generations of Eldar) and so if you were living in the empire the decline would go largely unnoticed as it occurred gradually.

The Harlequin Codex talks of how the Eldar in their hubris turned their backs on their traditional gods and traditional Eldar virtues and ideals. The previous Dark Eldar Codex talks of how they look down upon their deceased gods with contempt. In contrast, the Craftworld Eldar preserve the memory of their deceased pantheon and their culture is still rife with references to their ancient mythology. The Harlequin Codex also talks of how the Harlequins travel and retell the ancient tales to remind Eldar of their ancient shared culture, and of course these plays are full of references to the gods.

The Dark Eldar are a snapshot of the Eldar right before the birth of Slaanesh, though now with kabals instead of noble houses. The Craftworld Eldar are a re-creation of the Eldar empire at its height, with the soulstones and Path system being a new adaptation to the post-Fall danger of Slaanesh. The Exodites are trying to get back to nature, and also use soulstones, and the quote from the 2nd edition Codex shows they have turned their backs upon the ancient traditions of the Eldar empire in contrast to the Craftworlders. None are quite the same as the pre-Fall Eldar empire. All have adapted to life post-Fall.

Necrons took a long nap. In my eyes thats a Eldar victory. A pyrrhic victory though, cos daemons were released. Damnit Necrons. You always ruin everything.

Yes, it did take thousands and thousands (perhaps millions) of years for Eldar culture to degenerate before the Fall. That's still a significant portion of "Eldar Culture". Again, going back to the Amish, they live in a manner very similar to that of America of the 17th century, but that is not a reflection of American culture today. Even pre-Fall, these "boat dwellers" were probably looked down upon by the mainstream culture of the Eldar as "backwoods hillbillies" and such.

 Psienesis wrote:
Yes, it did take thousands and thousands (perhaps millions) of years for Eldar culture to degenerate before the Fall. That's still a significant portion of "Eldar Culture". Again, going back to the Amish, they live in a manner very similar to that of America of the 17th century, but that is not a reflection of American culture today. Even pre-Fall, these "boat dwellers" were probably looked down upon by the mainstream culture of the Eldar as "backwoods hillbillies" and such.

Except we know the Craftworlders are of equal technological level to the Dark Eldar. It is the Exodites that have deliberately chosen to live in a less technological fashion. That is where your Amish analogy falls apart.

Also, the Craftworlders were not solely those original trading ship inhabitants but also those that they rescued from the homeworlds in the time preceding the actual Fall. In more recent background, some of the Craftworlds, like Mymeara, were custom constructed arks built by and then populated by those from the homeworlds that disagreed with slide into decadence. For example, the background for Mymeara states they built their Craftworld with the intent of housing their entire system's population, though by the time they departed, they only housed about half as the rest of the system had fallen into anarchy and slaughter. That means still about 50% of the system had not fallen into decadence and proportionally is still a far greater portion of society than the Amish compared to mainstream American society today.

The Amish analogy is closer to that of the Exodites. Both Craftworlders and Dark Eldar look upon the Exodites as rustic cousins.

I thought they went into slumber because of the galaxy wide Enslaver epidemic that was wiping out all life. They were going to simply wait the event out and life rebooted. I don't think they expected the sentient races alive in their time, foremost the Eldar and Orks to still be alive when they awoke. The death planets didn't attract enslavers, I don't think they expected the Nids either.

The Enslaver Plague is old fluff, now somewhat ret-conned by the previous Necron Codex, which doesn't mention them at all, and simply explains the Great Sleep as the Necrons not wanting to get into yet another war with the Eldar following the recent wars with the Old Ones and the C'Tan.

Boo-urns. A part of Newcron fluff I greatly dislike

Iracundus wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Yes, it did take thousands and thousands (perhaps millions) of years for Eldar culture to degenerate before the Fall. That's still a significant portion of "Eldar Culture". Again, going back to the Amish, they live in a manner very similar to that of America of the 17th century, but that is not a reflection of American culture today. Even pre-Fall, these "boat dwellers" were probably looked down upon by the mainstream culture of the Eldar as "backwoods hillbillies" and such.

Except we know the Craftworlders are of equal technological level to the Dark Eldar. It is the Exodites that have deliberately chosen to live in a less technological fashion. That is where your Amish analogy falls apart.

That is not true. The DE are technologically more advanced than the Craftworld Eldar, as shown by their dark matter weaponry, which is much more advanced than CW Eldar weapons. The DE are on a technological level almost equal to the Necrons, having the ability to extinguish suns at will and even 'capture' them. the CW Eldar are not even near to that level of tech.
It also makes a lot of sense, as the CW Eldar, being isolated from the Eldar Empire were probably also isolated from the technological advances their kin made after they had left.

Where are people getting the idea that Necrons/Ctan killed the Old Ones?

The Old Ones rolled the biggest Gets Hot 1 in the history of the game, when they got sufficiently pissed off at the Ctan/Necrons. They were killed by their own Warp machinations. Not by Ctan or Necrons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Asking whether CW Eldar or Dark Citiers are more advanced is like asking if the heavy metal twin or the religious nut twin are more advanced. They have the same tech, as they are from the same culture, they just have different uses.

The Eldar are a couple generations *at most* removed from being one people. 10k years is a long time even for them, but not nearly as long as it had been for Mankind.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
(Uthwe actually left from closer to the center of the Empire, and left not long before the Fall itself. That's why they are in the Eye.)

Bharring wrote:



Automatically Appended Next Post:
They have the same tech, as they are from the same culture, they just have different uses.

They don't. Their technology is very different, for a large part also because the DE can no longer use psychic powers and thus have lost access to wraithbone, on which most Craftworld tech is based. On the other hand, the Craftworlds do not have access to some of the most advanced Eldar technology such as Darklight or Disintegrator weaponry, likely because this technology was developed after the launch of the Craftworlds.

Bharring wrote:
The Eldar are a couple generations *at most* removed from being one people. 10k years is a long time even for them, but not nearly as long as it had been for Mankind.

As has been argued above, they have been seperate for far longer than that. The Craftworlds were already seperate from the other Eldar long before the Fall.

Uthwe hadn't made it past the core of the Eldar Empire, at Tue time of the fall. They left very late.

The Craftworlds did leave long before the fall, but on what scale? Hundreds of years? Thousands? I keep seeing it stated, but not argued/sourced. Remember, Eldred is over 10k realspace years old.

Much of the tech is the same. Look at the Vyper/Venom chassis. Different materials, sure, but mostly the same tech.

The split is making them diverge, but that doesn't mean they don't have access to each others tech. Some individuals do transition between the two, after all. Much of the difference isn't innately technical.

CWers don't have Raiders, because why expose their precious passengers? Dark Citiers don't have Falcons, because why put a wall between them and the people they want to shoot?

Iracundus wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Yes, it did take thousands and thousands (perhaps millions) of years for Eldar culture to degenerate before the Fall. That's still a significant portion of "Eldar Culture". Again, going back to the Amish, they live in a manner very similar to that of America of the 17th century, but that is not a reflection of American culture today. Even pre-Fall, these "boat dwellers" were probably looked down upon by the mainstream culture of the Eldar as "backwoods hillbillies" and such.

Except we know the Craftworlders are of equal technological level to the Dark Eldar. It is the Exodites that have deliberately chosen to live in a less technological fashion. That is where your Amish analogy falls apart.

Also, the Craftworlders were not solely those original trading ship inhabitants but also those that they rescued from the homeworlds in the time preceding the actual Fall. In more recent background, some of the Craftworlds, like Mymeara, were custom constructed arks built by and then populated by those from the homeworlds that disagreed with slide into decadence. For example, the background for Mymeara states they built their Craftworld with the intent of housing their entire system's population, though by the time they departed, they only housed about half as the rest of the system had fallen into anarchy and slaughter. That means still about 50% of the system had not fallen into decadence and proportionally is still a far greater portion of society than the Amish compared to mainstream American society today.

The Amish analogy is closer to that of the Exodites. Both Craftworlders and Dark Eldar look upon the Exodites as rustic cousins.

Fine, then. CWE are certain Fundamentalist sects that (in the US) practice polygamy, arranged marriages and child-marriage. They believe they're living according to Biblical law, though no mainstream church supports this interpretation of the Bible, certainly not in keeping with the laws of modern society.

I think we have to look the purpose of the War.


The War in Heaven was really never about the Eldar Vs Necrons. At the time of this War, the Eldar were rather insignificant players weather you go with the Fluff they were created by the Old ones during the War, or that they were around, they were not major players at this time.. The Necrons chose to go to war with the Old ones, because they were the only possible threat that could unite the fractured Dynasties. This is right from the 5th edition dex.

As we know, the Necrons were loosing until they Got the C'tan on their side. After that, the Old ones were wiped out. Which was the complete original goal of the War in Heaven.

After that, the Necrons used probably the most powerful weapons the galaxy has ever seen, to shard the C'tan. Which was their Second Goal.

At the end of the Day, the Necrons won the War in Heaven, because they beat the Old ones, which was the entire purpose of it. The Eldar were minor players during the war, and only came to prominence after.

Now, with the Old ones Extinct, the C'tan Shattered, and the Necrons weakened, the Eldar finally have a shot to do something in the galaxy. The Necrons went into slumber at this point.

So, you're saying the Eldar beat the Necrons the same way the Necrons beat the Old Ones? Namely, that their opponents own machinations made it so they weren't around anymore, so they win by default?

Granted, that went a lot better for the Necrons than the Old Ones...

(Most of the sources I see suggest that Old Ones manipulated Eldar development, but didn't create them out of nothing)

Bharring wrote:
So, you're saying the Eldar beat the Necrons the same way the Necrons beat the Old Ones? Namely, that their opponents own machinations made it so they weren't around anymore, so they win by default?

Granted, that went a lot better for the Necrons than the Old Ones...

(Most of the sources I see suggest that Old Ones manipulated Eldar development, but didn't create them out of nothing)

Since the Newcron dex has jack diddly squat in the way of fluff about the War in Heaven, I looked back into the Wardcron book which says on page 7 under "The Old Ones Defeated":

With the C'tan and the Necrons fighting as one, the Old Ones were now doomed to defeat. Glutted on the life force of the Necrontyr, the empowered C'tan were nigh unstoppable and unleashed forces beyond comprehension. Planets were razed, suns extinguished and whole systems devoured by black holes called into being by the reality warping powers of the star gods. Necron legions finally broached the webway and assailed the Old Ones in every corner of the galaxy. They brought under siege the fortresses of the Old Ones' allies, harvesting the life force of the defenders to feed their masters. Ultimately, beset by the implacable onset of the C'tan and the calamitous Warp-spawned perils they had themselves mistakenly unleashed, the Old Ones were defeated, scattered and finally destroyed.

In this selection we do see that the warp-spawned perils played a part in the destruction of the Old Ones, BUT the very first sentence, "With the C'tan and the Necrons fighting as one, the Old Ones were now doomed to defeat", makes clear that the combined might of the Necrons and the C'tan were plenty to destroy the Old Ones.

If anything, the "Warp-spawned perils" were merely a catalyst that hastened the end for the Old Ones but were by no means the sole or even major reason for the ultimate defeat and extinction of the Old Ones.

Point that I'm getting at, The Eldar did not "defeat" the Necrons in the same manner that the Necrons defeated the Old Ones.

Bharring wrote:
So, you're saying the Eldar beat the Necrons the same way the Necrons beat the Old Ones? Namely, that their opponents own machinations made it so they weren't around anymore, so they win by default?

Granted, that went a lot better for the Necrons than the Old Ones...

(Most of the sources I see suggest that Old Ones manipulated Eldar development, but didn't create them out of nothing)

The Necrons went to war with the Old Ones directly. Twice, in fact.

In the first case, they lost, because the Old Ones had psychic powers that the Necrons had little to no defense against. Then they met the C'Tan. The C'Tan known as the Deceiver said to the Silent King, "Hey, yeah, we fought those Old Ones before, too, and lost... but, if we joined forces, I bet we could take them!"

And then Round 2 of the War in Heaven began. This time, post-Biotransference, the Necrons (and their C'Tan masters) won. Then the Necrons turned on the C'Tan and wrecked them, too. Then, after what might have been millennia, if not millions of years, of warfare, the Necrons were tired, and not really in shape to take on a surging Eldar Empire. So they began the Great Sleep.

Does the new Necron background overrule Xenology? I loved the sense of growing peril in that book, but unfortunately it sounds like the Necrons are no longer some Lovecraftian threat beyond reckoning from the primordial past.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Does the new Necron background overrule Xenology? I loved the sense of growing peril in that book, but unfortunately it sounds like the Necrons are no longer some Lovecraftian threat beyond reckoning from the primordial past.

They're a lot more like slightly benevolent Daleks now. Slightly.