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 Robbert Ambrose wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:


There are multiple sources that state a battleship or heavy cruiser can pretty much glass a continent with a couple of broadsides. BFG gives vanilla torpedoes firepower in the range of tens or hundreds of gigatons of TNT. I'd call that more than token damage.

It's simply a matter of math, spaceships, are tiny compared to most planets, Continents are at least tens of thousand square kilometers large, then we haven't even spoke of issue of athmopsheric conditions, distance, targeting, loss. of force etc. So yeah, you get the idea.

Disclaimer: I'm approaching this like it's hard sci-if. This is 40k so it doesn't translate perfectly, but the general idea applies.

Yes, it is a matter of math. The projectiles fired by spaceships are fired from space, where is no atmosphere to decelerate objects and you can attack from half the solar system away. E=MC^2, and while imperial technology may not be able to get a torpedo to the speed of light (or it could, I don't know, 'Crons can IIRC but don't need to to hurt a planet, other factions I'm unsure) they can still launch large amounts of mass at a significant fraction of the speed of light. That's a lot of energy hitting the planet, and given 40k's ballistics and explosives technology that energy can be augmented. Assuming anything near consistent if not realistic physics, the result should make the Tunguska event look like a drop in the pond.

 Robbert Ambrose wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:


There are multiple sources that state a battleship or heavy cruiser can pretty much glass a continent with a couple of broadsides. BFG gives vanilla torpedoes firepower in the range of tens or hundreds of gigatons of TNT. I'd call that more than token damage.

It's simply a matter of math, spaceships, are tiny compared to most planets, Continents are at least tens of thousand square kilometers large, then we haven't even spoke of issue of athmopsheric conditions, distance, targeting, loss. of force etc. So yeah, you get the idea.

yeah, I'm having trouble understanding how these ships weapons of that size. Shields provide no defense against torpedos. A typical cruiser with no turreted defense would still need to be hit by dozens of torpedos to be hulked. Not destoyed, just reduced to a floating hulk.

Even a ship that is 10km long is going to have trouble staying intact if hit by something in the 100mega ton range. A gigaton would vaporize most of it. 100 gigatons and the torpedo wouldnt even need to get that close.


Planets though are huge.

The blast that killed the dinosaurs was on the order of 100,000,000 mega tons of TNT. It didnt even kill all the dinosaurs right away, it just tipped the climate enough to eventually kill them off.

Even if we are to believe that a 40k torpedo has 50 gigatons of TNT force. It would take a thousand of them to create an impact like that which killed off the dinosaurs.

There have not been any actual quotes or citations of sources claiming that level of power (just claims these unnamed sources exist somewhere), whereas there have been sources cited for why spaceships in 40k are not supreme. If there is to be discussion and debate on how things are in the 40k universe, there needs to be evidence not just personal speculation or wishful thinking fanfic.

Iracundus wrote:
There have' been any actual quotes or citations of sources claiming that level of power (just claims these unnamed sources exist somewhere), whereas there have been sources cited for why spaceships in 40k are not supreme. If there is to be discussion and debate on how things are in the 40k universe, there needs to be evidence not just personal speculation or wishful thinking fanfic.

isslavan III Horus poisoned a planet then set the world on fire. Planet killed.

Also repeat for knowledge smack the moon into the planet boom. Killed the Dino's and block out the sun for God knows. Hell some planets have a few to choose from..... Looking at you Saturn.

 gnome_idea_what wrote:

Disclaimer: I'm approaching this like it's hard sci-if. This is 40k so it doesn't translate perfectly, but the general idea applies.

Yes, it is a matter of math. The projectiles fired by spaceships are fired from space, where is no atmosphere to decelerate objects and you can attack from half the solar system away. E=MC^2, and while imperial technology may not be able to get a torpedo to the speed of light (or it could, I don't know, 'Crons can IIRC but don't need to to hurt a planet, other factions I'm unsure) they can still launch large amounts of mass at a significant fraction of the speed of light. That's a lot of energy hitting the planet, and given 40k's ballistics and explosives technology that energy can be augmented. Assuming anything near consistent if not realistic physics, the result should make the Tunguska event look like a drop in the pond.

E=mc^2 cannot be applied here as that is mass energy equivilance. What you want is the kinetic energy which is equil to 1/2mv^2 + GPEmax (if we can assume that the projectiles do not partially burn up in the atmosphere and there is minimal loss of speed due to air resistance).

It still supports your point, one of these hitting a planet would have a more devistating effect than the largest nuclear weapons: HUGE blast radius and horrific damage to a planets crust in large numbers.

Specialized Exterminatus viral weapons specifically designed for the creation and then ignition of a flammable atmosphere in a firestorm do not support the claims of ridiculously high torpedo or cannon yields. The discussion in the previous posts was about the conventional weapons aboard 40k spaceships.

Since there is more tech in 40k I wonder if just smashing the sun to cause a massive solar flare to hit the planet would work.

Or hell even just create a mass emp planet wide to reduce their tech to crap.

OgreChubbs wrote:
Since there is more tech in 40k I wonder if just smashing the sun to cause a massive solar flare to hit the planet would work.

Already been done. Three Blackstone Fortresses firing together made a star to nova during the Gothic War and destroyed a planet (BFG rule book). I am getting the sense you do not really know the BFG material, which is fairly key if the topic is 40k starships.

Iracundus wrote:

OgreChubbs wrote:
Since there is more tech in 40k I wonder if just smashing the sun to cause a massive solar flare to hit the planet would work.

Already been done. Three Blackstone Fortresses firing together made a star to nova during the Gothic War and destroyed a planet (BFG rule book). I am getting the sense you do not really know the BFG material, which is fairly key if the topic is 40k starships.

I may be dating myself but I came in when I was 13 because I played (risk) and wanted some custom models for my side. Then started to follow the (story and rules ) when Horus heresy started and all the codex where 40$ and I bout them all.

BFG has no codices. There is the main rule book and Armada which is a collection of various articles released over the years since the initial BFG release.

 mrhappyface wrote:

 gnome_idea_what wrote:

Disclaimer: I'm approaching this like it's hard sci-if. This is 40k so it doesn't translate perfectly, but the general idea applies.

Yes, it is a matter of math. The projectiles fired by spaceships are fired from space, where is no atmosphere to decelerate objects and you can attack from half the solar system away. E=MC^2, and while imperial technology may not be able to get a torpedo to the speed of light (or it could, I don't know, 'Crons can IIRC but don't need to to hurt a planet, other factions I'm unsure) they can still launch large amounts of mass at a significant fraction of the speed of light. That's a lot of energy hitting the planet, and given 40k's ballistics and explosives technology that energy can be augmented. Assuming anything near consistent if not realistic physics, the result should make the Tunguska event look like a drop in the pond.

E=mc^2 cannot be applied here as that is mass energy equivilance. What you want is the kinetic energy which is equil to 1/2mv^2 + GPEmax (if we can assume that the projectiles do not partially burn up in the atmosphere and there is minimal loss of speed due to air resistance).

It still supports your point, one of these hitting a planet would have a more devistating effect than the largest nuclear weapons: HUGE blast radius and horrific damage to a planets crust in large numbers.

You can certainly divert an asteroid towards a planet fairly easily. It will fall on the planet and impact at the planets escape velocity. Certainly more powerful than any nuclear weapon we could think of.

The problem is, doing that takes a long time. It takes months, sometimes years for an asteroid on the proper path to build up that much velocity. A planet with any defense at all would be able to intercept and destroy/divert the asteroid before it impacts. Even if it did get through, it would do a lot of damage and kill all planet life, but it wouldnt kill everyone on the planet. They would die of starvation which could take years.

https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/40k-grand-firepower-quantifications.250255/page-2
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=105295&highlight=40k
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?p=2109194#2109194

Seriously guys, this stuff was settled a decade ago. Remember when the Curtis Saxton Star Wars Incredible Cross Sections books came out with their multi-gigaton firepower numbers? Remember when a BDZ was something every spacebattle fan knew about? 40k remembers. Those influenced the 40k portrayal of space firepower. There are tons and tons of examples in the fluff. This is not obscure knowledge.