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A question that has been bugging me the last few months.

8th ed is released and HEs are in the box set.
Skaven were recently released with 8th ed in mind.
It has been almost 3 years since HEs were last released.

Why did GW do a splash release of a heap of models when they could have done the whole army book as well?
All it needed was:
-The fluff is fairly stable, maybe a few new tit-bits, and new model pics would be needed.
-A new special character/return of an old one.
-Move silverhelms to core (so someone, somewhere might take them)
-Integrate all the 8th ed updates and the FAQ answers.

Maybe 1 week of work for 2-3 eavy metal painters, 1 photographer, a designer and 1 computer lackey.

Seems such an obvious move, I can't reason why they didn't?

It does seem like GW missed a trick here but I think we are perhaps a little guilty of under-estimating exactly what work is involved to produce a new army book. First thing we need to take into account is GW's own resourcing; they clearly have a finite amount of people to work on any one project at any one time. Given that the new box set and rule book is released at the same time, it may be that there simply isn't enough warm bodies spare to do extra work for an army book.

Not only that but the whole book needs to be costed, designed and sent to the printers. They probably spend a fair bit of time designing and laying out the book before printing and that all takes time and effort. Not to mention all the things that you mention such as painting and photography. Normally not too much of an overhead but more so when squeezed by other deadlines?

My reasoning is that they already have it all formatted and saved to disc, so 95% of the design work and layout is done, it would be primarily cosmetic changes in new model pics, and the changing of several rules/wordings.

I guess they would also need an artist for a new front cover.

I'm not talking wholesale changes, but it counts as a release for the year, you'll a heap of army books sold and more likely to get people buying them as a new army.

Missed a bit, definitely, though I feel like they really need to think through the army a bit more before redoing them. While the 8th edition tweaks to ASF have helped address one of the issues the elves have to deal with now that Step Up rules exist, it's a somewhat clumsy rule.

I'd much prefer a well-thought out (*slight snicker*) book with a release of new Core (Spears and Silverhelms and perhaps archers, since a lot of people seem to be not big fans of them). Couldn't hurt for them to introduce 1-2 new units either (make up a couple of new 'regional' troops or something).

I see it more as a mundane issue of time frames and resourcing rather than actually writing or designing the book.

We may all scoff, but GW do put stuff through some degree of playtesting. That takes a fair bit of time and effort. Also, there is the actual nuts and bolts of editing and proofreading the book which is another drain.

As mentioned before, I think it is simply a case of not having adequate resources (ie. warm bodies) available to carry out the work at the same time as the new WHFB release. Knowing GW the way we do, I am sure they would chew their own arms off it it meant being able to cash in on an opportunity to make more money.

Agreed.

In any event, there're other armies in greater need of a new Army Book

Jin wrote:Agreed.

In any event, there're other armies in greater need of a new Army Book

This


The HE book as you said is only 3 years old nothing wrong with that. Infact HE work sooo much better now in 8th there really is no reason for them to get a new army book. Armies like Tomb Kings, Wood elves, Brets and Ogres need new books before anyone else. even tho i'm hearing that O&G is next whihc is dumb IMO

Jin wrote:Agreed.

In any event, there're other armies in greater need of a new Army Book

*waves*

The thing is, if GW had done such a minor revision to the army book, and basically "re-branded" it for 8th edition without any major rules changes, people would have cried foul about GW trying to get more money out of them (and they'd be right, imho). When HEs are re-done eventually, I do think they could use a more drastic change...

I am really hoping that rumors are true about O&G and Tomb Kings being up to bat, as I think they are more out-of-date (and TK magic needs to be brought into this century for 8th edition! It's so odd right now...)

Waaagh_Gonads wrote:Why did GW do a splash release of a heap of models when they could have done the whole army book as well?
All it needed was:
-The fluff is fairly stable, maybe a few new tit-bits, and new model pics would be needed.
-A new special character/return of an old one.
-Move silverhelms to core (so someone, somewhere might take them)
-Integrate all the 8th ed updates and the FAQ answers.

Maybe 1 week of work for 2-3 eavy metal painters, 1 photographer, a designer and 1 computer lackey.

Seems such an obvious move, I can't reason why they didn't?

Because re-releasing a book with nothing but the most trivial changes, forcing all the current players to rebuy their army book, seems too obnoxious a move, even for GW.

If the argument is 'they wouldn't have to do much' then why do anything at all?

Yeah, I still remember the bad taste in my mouth when they issued the Dark Eldar "second Edition" codex for 40k. All they did was add a couple of White Dwarf articles (changing them just enough that you couldn't get by with just using the WD). And that was back when codex/army books were relatively cheap (and inexpensive).
I think where they missed the boat was including High Elves in the first place. They could have included Bretonnia (or even Empire or Dwarves) and had a more needed army book waiting in the wings. But I guess the minis and book weren't close enough to being ready.

Jin wrote:Agreed.

In any event, there're other armies in greater need of a new Army Book

I know that.

By similar reasoning there are armies with greaater need for new models (and a book) so why stuff aroung with the ne HE models at all?
Why not bring O&G or TKs forward a few months?

That's a great question, Gonads... I guess a lot of HE's needed models were metal, and so in pretty big need of a switch to plastic. But that's all I've got for that...

RiTides wrote:

Jin wrote:Agreed.

In any event, there're other armies in greater need of a new Army Book

*waves*

The thing is, if GW had done such a minor revision to the army book, and basically "re-branded" it for 8th edition without any major rules changes, people would have cried foul about GW trying to get more money out of them (and they'd be right, imho). When HEs are re-done eventually, I do think they could use a more drastic change...

I am really hoping that rumors are true about O&G and Tomb Kings being up to bat, as I think they are more out-of-date (and TK magic needs to be brought into this century for 8th edition! It's so odd right now...)

And even if GW had gone through and done major revisions to the High Elf army book, those same people would have cried foul that "High Elves are becoming the Space Marines of WHFB!".

Hell, with just the release of three plastic boxed sets and a metal event figure people are making that accusation.

It is hard for me to take this question seriously, esp. by a veteran.

There are 4 or 5 people writing all Codices and army books. Somehow they need maybe half a year each for writing and testingstuff. There are maybe 5 army books and 5 Codices that need an urgent update, most of them 2 editions old. High Elves have a quite new and functioning rules set in the upper half of competitive armies. TK, O&G, and Wood Elves armies are almost not playable. All this makes it clear that GW can't afford the luxury to update the High Elf army book (which is more than just copy paste one unit from Elite to Core BTW). Especially as printing new books and scrapping old unsold ones is a big investment.

On the other side, GW abandonned the "one army release per player generation" policy, which is a good thing and long overdue. It revives the interest in an army more than once every 12 years. The new starter box created new high elf and Skaven players, so a high elf and Skaven miniature release shortly after that is good for players and good for GW's profit. And miniatures updates are not from a 4 year old product like the HE army book, but of 8-12 year old products, with some non-updated minatures even older (and/or dragging the look of the complete army dorn, like HE/DE standards and Skaven Night runners).

And remember, GW is mainly a miniature company, producing army books and Codices mainly to increase miniature sales. So producing miniatures always has priority.

When you say "not playable" I'm assuming you just mean the rules are awkward, kroothawk... O&G and TK have some nasty things going for them! But as a lot of these are due to outdated rules having suprising effects now, they still need updating badly...

Simple.

Draw in more HE players with shiney new models.
When updated they have to all splash out another £15 on yet another new armies book when updated.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:Simple.

Draw in more HE players with shiney new models.
When updated they have to all splash out another £15 on yet another new armies book when updated.

If that were true, then they would have updated the infantry first.

I can't count the number of people I know(several from this forum, no less) who would jump at the chance to start a Dark or High Elf army if the stock Warriors/Archers/Spearmen were bloody updated.

It was just time to retire the plastic/metal hybrid Dragon Princes, and at the same time they knocked out the White Lions and Phoenix Guard from being metals that had no real easy way to construct them from plastics.

My problem is that I need the BRB
The BRB faq
The HE book (which is falling apart thanks to shoody construction)
The HE Faq

Integrate the last 2 and problem solved for the next 5 years (at least it will be 1 army down, rather than the current 0)

Yes, my gaming bag is full of papers now with all the FAQs :-/. But better lots of FAQs then no FAQs and murky rules after the changeover, I say!

And they're free, so there is that...

Waaagh_Gonads wrote:My problem is that I need the BRB
The BRB faq
The HE book (which is falling apart thanks to shoody construction)
The HE Faq
Integrate the last 2 and problem solved for the next 5 years (at least it will be 1 army down, rather than the current 0)

Do you really think that any new book by GW won't need a FAQ immediately? Only difference would be that GW hadn't released one yet
Experience shows that playtesting and quality control for rule sets decreases.

Waaagh_Gonads wrote:
-Move silverhelms to core (so someone, somewhere might take them)

Seems like this is the most radical suggestion you are making, and one I agree with. I think instead of even worrying about an army book, this is something they should have pulled their heads out of their asses on, and made that change in the errata pdf.