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Who thinks that the phase out rule would be more helpfull if it were:

If a unit is reduced to 25 percent of its original size (after we'll be back rolls), then the unit is removed and the opposition receives the victory points for destroying it.

therefore, the rule wouldn't effect 1 'man' squads, or monsterous creatures, or monoliths.

so.... you want to get rid of phase out? I can scarcely consider a situation where a 7-bot warrior squad would get reduced down 1 model without also being reduced to 0 models.

Getting rid of phase out as we know it would be a bad idea, given the other necron rules. For example, the only way to kill a monolith is with a certain very narrow band of anti-tank weapons due to living metal, and the only way for some armies to be able to take out monoliths AT ALL is to phase them out with the rest of the army.

Phase out could be disposed of, but not without fundamentally rebalancing the entire rest of the army.

Phase out should stay should the update ever arrive, just give us Necrons FNP and Slow and Purposeful, toughness 5. A dangerously slow death march. Necrons need a beef up if anything at this point in time. Made slow and durable, then there will be a sense of accomplishment on phasing a strong army out, it would be a huge sense of relief.

A Monolith alone does not justify keeping Phase Out, a single lucky lascannon can dispose of it, or a deepstriking Terminator squad with Power Fists or Thunder Hammers.

Necrons are currently too easy to phase out. Which is gives us quite a handicap against players who realize it.

Having it work on a squad by squad basis just leaves them far too vulnerable. It's fine as it is I feel.

I haven't faced 'Crons since 3rd. How are they easy to do in this edition? I do not know their current rules :/

M.

samrtk wrote:A Monolith alone does not justify keeping Phase Out, a single lucky lascannon can dispose of it, or a deepstriking Terminator squad with Power Fists or Thunder Hammers.

And against non-Marine armies?

DE rely on Dark Lances to take out vehicles, but Monolith is immune to that.

Eldar rely on Brightlances or Fire Dragons to take out vehicles, but Monoliths are immune to them.

Orks with Powerfists can't do much of anything against a Monolith.

Nids don't always have Str 10 attacks and the no MC means most of their anti-vehicle options can't do anything.

Even IG often times are only running Battle Cannons and Melta Weapons without much Lascannons.

A monolith is simply unkillable to many otherwise viable armies. It needs to be able to be phased out.

/\ Eldar can use a combine/lucky single fire prism shot to take out 'liths

wizard12 wrote:/\ Eldar can use a combine/lucky single fire prism shot to take out 'liths

Yes, or a Wraithlord in CC, Wraithguard shooting it, or Swooping Hawks with grenades. But, these shouldn't be required in every army to deal with the occasional Monolith.

There shouldn't be one model that's so hard to kill that every army needs to take it's 1 or 2 options to deal with it in order to stand a chance. Living Metal simply is so powerful that it becomes absurd with Phase Out removed.

With Phase Out, it's balanced; without, it's OP.

IG also have S10 ordanance all over the place. Say goodbye mr lith....

Grakmar wrote:

samrtk wrote:A Monolith alone does not justify keeping Phase Out, a single lucky lascannon can dispose of it, or a deepstriking Terminator squad with Power Fists or Thunder Hammers.

And against non-Marine armies?

DE rely on Dark Lances to take out vehicles, but Monolith is immune to that.

Eldar rely on Brightlances or Fire Dragons to take out vehicles, but Monoliths are immune to them.

Orks with Powerfists can't do much of anything against a Monolith.

Nids don't always have Str 10 attacks and the no MC means most of their anti-vehicle options can't do anything.

Even IG often times are only running Battle Cannons and Melta Weapons without much Lascannons.

Dark Eldar, granted, but that changes in the new codex when they go up to strength 10 weaponry and in combat.

Eldar, I agree with, I've took on a couple of Eldar armies and they can't touch my Monolith(s). Wraithlords normally don't make it across the table.

Orks, you said it, Power Klaws, not hard for a mobile Ork army to catch and take down Monoliths.

Nids, I normally am up against Strength 10 winged Carnifexes when I face Nids, so pretty good, depends on the build of course.

IG, usually have plenty lascannons to go around, and Manticores I think are the Strength 10 ordanace barrage tanks?

Grakmar wrote:A monolith is simply unkillable to many otherwise viable armies. It needs to be able to be phased out.

That is why I support the idea of Phase Out. But Necrons need to be beefed up so they can endure a beating, it's too easy to phase them out at the moment.

I've always wondered why we couldn't phase in...

My biggest problem with Phase Out is that it discourages players from taking non necron units like pariahs.

Also monoliths aren't really that destructive, it's the teleporting and WBB rerolls that makes them neat, which I don't think is a big enough advantage to warrant phase out as some sort of way of tempering its unkillable status.

I sort of agree, but then monoliths would be nigh unkillable and reaalllllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyy annoying.

Thats just It the monolith is simply annoying Its not a TH/SS termie squad with Libby in a LR or a 10 man fortuned seer council on bikes. Yes the plate is nice but by no means a death star unit.

That being said im in favor for keeping the phase out yet it need to be reworked. I love the flavor of my crons and would really be heart broken if they became bland and lost their defining characteristics.

asimo77 wrote:I've always wondered why we couldn't phase in... .

I too have wondered this hopefully with the reworked codex the idea of teleporting, like VoD or the lith portal, will become a main feature of the new necron army. Would help make them "quicker" without mech

I'd hope we don't end up seeing Codexes become "Deathstar 40k"