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I've seen a lot of talk about using this tactic where a GM gives a unit the scouts special rule. But the scouts special rule says a unit can make a 'normal' move using this rule.

The 30" jump is a once per game ability that a PAGK or DK can use if they take the personal teleporters. I don't see how a once per game only move that is accessed only by equipping wargear is classed as a 'normal' move. Have I misread what people mean when they say a scout shunt cause as far as I can see, the rules do not allow it.

I believe the precedents are "smoke launchers" - another 'one-shot' upgrade that can be used pre-game in the scout move and turbo boosting.

chromedog wrote:I believe the precedent is "smoke launchers" - another 'one-shot' upgrade that can be used pre-game in the scout move.

Oft used as a precedent, but those are not used 'instead' of moving.

Just saying. . . .

Editing to add:
Most read it as allowed as there seems to be no "normal" besides everything in the entire game.

Given the way the FAQs seem to lean with regard to scout movement (Turboboosting and the like), there is a definite possibility of Scout Shunting being made legal.

Of course, that's my own opinion, but I'd rather learn how to play with/against it than assume it's illegal and suddenly have opponents using it against me if it gets FAQ'd.

I read "normal" as in movement that is normally allowed by a model (Otherwise how would you move the model?). Turbo-boosting, smoke launchers are probably helpful here as well---in regards to intent.

I don't see a one-time teleport as the result of an upgrade as being "normal". A "normal" move would be the standard movement at the rate of whatever unit type the model is considered. The one time power is not the way they "normally" move.

There have been at least two threads on this subject

Here is one of the longer debates about it: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/357544.page

Both sides have valid arguments. It needs a FAQ.

One time or not is irrelevant

They can "normally" move 30" (once per) game. Thus they can do so in the scout move. Same as bikes can normally move 24" during a turn.

Needs FAQ. While I don't want to, I'm siding with the fact you can.


*points to scout bikes, deffkoptas, ... anything with scout USR actually.

nosferatu1001 wrote:One time or not is irrelevant

They can "normally" move 30" (once per) game. Thus they can do so in the scout move. Same as bikes can normally move 24" during a turn.

juraigamer wrote:*points to scout bikes, deffkoptas, ... anything with scout USR actually.

Not that I disagree necessarily with the conclusion but again, that is not done instead of moving--normally or not.

nosferatu1001 wrote:One time or not is irrelevant

They can "normally" move 30" (once per) game. Thus they can do so in the scout move. Same as bikes can normally move 24" during a turn.

If they take personal teleporters. That implies to me that their normal move is the one they would make without such an upgrade. By those kind of semantics, anything in the game is a "normal" something. A power weapon is a weapon that "normally" can ignore armor, making it a "normal" weapon?

mister robouteo wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:One time or not is irrelevant

They can "normally" move 30" (once per) game. Thus they can do so in the scout move. Same as bikes can normally move 24" during a turn.

If they take personal teleporters. That implies to me that their normal move is the one they would make without such an upgrade. By those kind of semantics, anything in the game is a "normal" something. A power weapon is a weapon that "normally" can ignore armor, making it a "normal" weapon?

For the model wielding the power weapon, yes, his 'normal' attacks ignore armor saves in close combat...

To give you a counter analogy that fits better I think, if the power weapon model is under some effect that wont let him move or shoot, but allows him to "fight normally" in close combat, would he ignore armor saves? Of course, because fighting normally for him means using a power weapon.

I believe that the Turbo Boost is a normal move.

It is an alternative to the normal rule presented in the rule-book, and so it is normal.

The Shunt Move is a special ability confered by a piece of wargear in a specific codex and as such is not "normal".


Anyway, I can see both sides of this and look forward to an FAQ (going either way).

Well, the fact that it is an upgrade makes it seem to me as if it is not the normal way it moves. Maybe the power weapon analogy is a bit wierd, but I was under the impression that the character did not normally ignore armor saves, he purchased a power weapon upgrade to ignore armor saves.

mister robouteo wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:One time or not is irrelevant

They can "normally" move 30" (once per) game. Thus they can do so in the scout move. Same as bikes can normally move 24" during a turn.

If they take personal teleporters. That implies to me that their normal move is the one they would make without such an upgrade. By those kind of semantics, anything in the game is a "normal" something. A power weapon is a weapon that "normally" can ignore armor, making it a "normal" weapon?

So you would argue that they can only scout 6", as the ability to move 12" is something conferred by an upgrade?

"Normal" moves as opposed to consolidation moves and fall back moves that ignore terrain? Oh look, I found moves in the BRB that aren't defined as "normal", no way!

mister robouteo wrote:Well, the fact that it is an upgrade makes it seem to me as if it is not the normal way it moves. Maybe the power weapon analogy is a bit wierd, but I was under the impression that the character did not normally ignore armor saves, he purchased a power weapon upgrade to ignore armor saves.

The FA slots do NOT have this as an upgrade, it is default wargear

It is NORMAL for them to move 12" a turn and, once per game, it is NORMAL for them to move 30"

Normal is relative to the model.

Well then, if that's the case I agree with you nosfer (as if it matters until a FAQ) it is nice to be thinking on the same page with all the facts before I ever have to play against it.

YMDC is the best. It's like the clinton trial all over again.

I need the word "normal" defined for me please.

Cottonjaw wrote:YMDC is the best. It's like the clinton trial all over again.

I need the word "normal" defined for me please.

Thanks for your useful contribution.

The real issue is that all the other examples are not done instead of moving, but are actually described as moving or done after moving.

And people making random assertions without rules to back them.

kirsanth wrote:

Cottonjaw wrote:YMDC is the best. It's like the clinton trial all over again.

I need the word "normal" defined for me please.

Thanks for your useful contribution.

The real issue is that all the other examples are not done instead of moving, but are actually described as moving or done after moving.

And people making random assertions without rules to back them.

Oh you know what I was trying to say. The point is, without a clear cut definition of "normal move", we are just splitting hairs.

Look, I really don't see what the problem is. You've got a rule stating you can make a normal move. The dreadknight with teleporter then has an additional rule stating that it once per game, provided that it's allowed to move, can exchange it's move for a teleport shunt move. You may move as normal and use your special rule, which is more specific than the rulebooks in this case, and thus can use your special rule to move. Ergo, dreadknights (and interceptors too for that matter) can use their shunts as their scout moves.

Editing this out as it really isn't needed.

Apologies.

Kirsanth - yet Shunt is still a move. It says so 3 times.

So it is a move the unit can do normally; ergo they can use it during Scout.