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Orkeosaurus wrote:Well, the flashgit painboy specifically loses eavy armor as the prerequisite for getting dok's tools.

The nob painboy doesn't.

So you admit that a Painboy is not a nob, because if he is, why are there painboys in Flash Git squads?

Orkeosaurus wrote:Well, the flashgit painboy specifically loses eavy armor as the prerequisite for getting dok's tools.

The nob painboy doesn't.

But both Painboyz are the same. Same name, same profile, same gear. Why would they be any different?

Doesn't a flash git have the same profile as a nob? Is a flash git a nob?

Toxxic wrote:Doesn't a flash git have the same profile as a nob? Is a flash git a nob?

So? Chaos Space Marines and Space Marines have the Same Profile. Assault Terminators and Terminators have the same profile. Different names = Different Profiles.

Toxxic wrote:Doesn't a flash git have the same profile as a nob? Is a flash git a nob?

Considering they field different weapons, i would say they are too different. It would be silly to swap their war gears around with each other ( which im sure you'll all agree to this much )

thus If the theory of pain boy is still a nob , and pain boy is a was a nob, thats saying Nob and Flash Gits can use each other's war gear.

Can they? they cant . This further enforces that pain boy is a pain boy. They are not a nob , and they are not flash gits .
Thus they all lose their heavy armor , unless you want to tell me there are 2 types of pain boys.

The painboy made from a flashgit is still a flashgit, not that it matters for anything.

The painboy made from a nob is still a nob.

This is because in neither case it is stated that they cease to be one.


Also this has nothing to do with what was being discussed, which was actually the rules concerning wargear being lost or retained during upgrades.

so an assault terminator is not a terminator???

Gwar, Ive still got my book open buddy, Ive been reading and I cant find that page you were talking about - to refresh your memory its the one that states NOB painboys [not flash gitz, we are not talking about those] lose their upgraded inventory.

Looking forward to hearing from you, thanks.

Oh, I'm of the opinion that a nob painboy is a nob that happens to be a painboy by trade. That's how we play it around here anyways...

LunaHound wrote:
Thus they all lose their heavy armor , unless you want to tell me there are 2 types of pain boys.

No, a FlashGitz painboy loses his heavy armour, please tell me where a Nob painboy does. All it says is he replaces his S&C. Maybe you can help me out because Gwar seems to be having trouble finding that passage again.

Orkeosaurus wrote:The painboy made from a flashgit is still a flashgit, not that it matters for anything.

The painboy made from a nob is still a nob.

This is because in neither case it is stated that they cease to be one.


Also this has nothing to do with what was being discussed, which was actually the rules concerning wargear being lost or retained during upgrades.

Thats what im disagreeing with. They are pain boys both inside a Nob / Flash Gits squad.

Its true its not clearly written it ceased to be one , yet why would pain boy specifically lose their heavy armor?

Night Lords wrote:

LunaHound wrote:
Thus they all lose their heavy armor , unless you want to tell me there are 2 types of pain boys.

No, a FlashGitz painboy loses his heavy armour, please tell me where a Nob painboy does. All it says is he replaces his S&C. Maybe you can help me out because Gwar seems to be having trouble finding that passage again.

Thats saying there are more than 1 type of Pain boy.

Night Lords wrote:

LunaHound wrote:
Thus they all lose their heavy armor , unless you want to tell me there are 2 types of pain boys.

No, a FlashGitz painboy loses his heavy armour, please tell me where a Nob painboy does. All it says is he replaces his S&C. Maybe you can help me out because Gwar seems to be having trouble finding that passage again.

Did it ever cross your mind the reason why it says for the flashgitz one to lose it but not the nob one is that Phil Kelly wrote it so that Nob painboys cant buy armour?

Or maybe Phil Kelley meant for painboys to take eavy armor? Way to edit the moron remark!

Toxxic wrote:Or maybe Phil Kelley meant for painboys to take eavy armor?

Then why does the Painboy from a Flash Gitz squad lose his?

Maybe that guy loses his. He IS after all a different profile.

Gwar! wrote:

Night Lords wrote:

LunaHound wrote:
Thus they all lose their heavy armor , unless you want to tell me there are 2 types of pain boys.

No, a FlashGitz painboy loses his heavy armour, please tell me where a Nob painboy does. All it says is he replaces his S&C. Maybe you can help me out because Gwar seems to be having trouble finding that passage again.

Did it ever cross your mind the reason why it says for the flashgitz one to lose it but not the nob one is that Phil Kelly wrote it so that Nob painboys cant buy armour?

What does this have to do with anything? Im asking where it says I lose my heavy armour, since the topic is "Painboy with heavy armour".

Night Lords wrote:That does this have to do with anything? Im asking where it says I lose my heavy armour, since the topic is "Painboy with heavy armour".

What we are saying, is that in the flash gitz entry, the painboy Specifically loses his Evy Armour. Why would the Flash Gitz one lose it, but the Nob one be able to take it?

Oh wow! it's because the Nob one CANNOT TAKE NOB WARGEAR!

What a shocker!

Toxxic wrote:Maybe that guy loses his. He IS after all a different profile.

Please tell me where in the Ork Codex that shows two different Painboy profiles.

Has anyone yet discounted how this is different from a Space Marine Captain upgrading to Terminator armour as the fact is if a Captain buys a combi flamer, and then upgrades to terminator armour, he'd lose the combi flamer, even though it isnt explicitely stated.


If anyone can highlight how this is sufficiently different to that scenario then I'll consider that the painboy can take Heavy Armour

Gwar! wrote:

Night Lords wrote:That does this have to do with anything? Im asking where it says I lose my heavy armour, since the topic is "Painboy with heavy armour".

What we are saying, is that in the flash gitz entry, the painboy Specifically loses his Evy Armour. Why would the Flash Gitz one lose it, but the Nob one be able to take it?

Oh wow! it's because the Nob one CANNOT TAKE NOB WARGEAR!

What a shocker!

Where does it say this? You are assuming. I also assume that if a painboy is not a Nob, then he cannot take a Bike because only Nob Bikers can, and I assume that the "whole mob" wording is there on Bikes and Nades because you cant split them within a unit. But like you said, were not assuming things, its about RAW. So I ask you again, stop beating around the bush and tell me where a rule states I cant do this. Ive still got my boyz book open waiting to see.

It doesn't. It's a different unit entry. Much like a Nob and a flashgit have the same profile, yet are two entirely different units.

Toxxic wrote:It doesn't. It's a different unit entry. Much like a Nob and a flashgit have the same profile, yet are two entirely different units.

Yet a Painboy is a Painboy no matter what squad he is in.

Also , lets look at Cybork bodies in both pain boy's paragraph. Doesnt that just scream out the 5+ inv choice is tailored just for them? rather than the 4+ normal sv?

Mad Doc Grotsnik , also cybork , no heavy armor.

That is true. But one can take 'eavy armor and one can't.

Cybork body is the better upgrade, actually. Eavy armor is sort of made obsolete by the time a painboy is actually purchased.

(Also, MDG has a 4+ armor save. Which is that of 'eavy armor.)

combo wrote:Has anyone yet discounted how this is different from a Space Marine Captain upgrading to Terminator armour as the fact is if a Captain buys a combi flamer, and then upgrades to terminator armour, he'd lose the combi flamer, even though it isnt explicitely stated.


If anyone can highlight how this is sufficiently different to that scenario then I'll consider that the painboy can take Heavy Armour

Because in order to upgrade to terminator armour, you need to:

"Replace Power Armour, Bolt Pistol, Chainsword, Frag and Krak Grenades for Terminator armour with stormbolter"

In order to get a combi flamer, you need to replace the bolt pistol. Without the bolt pistol, you cannot replace it for a stormbolter.

Night Lords wrote:
Where does it say this? You are assuming. I also assume that if a painboy is not a Nob, then he cannot take a Bike because only Nob Bikers can, and I assume that the "whole mob" wording is there on Bikes and Nades because you cant split them within a unit. But like you said, were not assuming things, its about RAW. So I ask you again, stop beating around the bush and tell me where a rule states I cant do this. Ive still got my boyz book open waiting to see.

No , bike is a unit upgrade . Just like assault marine sergent (with a whole squad of jump pack upgrade) cant use flamer.

LunaHound wrote:

Night Lords wrote:
Where does it say this? You are assuming. I also assume that if a painboy is not a Nob, then he cannot take a Bike because only Nob Bikers can, and I assume that the "whole mob" wording is there on Bikes and Nades because you cant split them within a unit. But like you said, were not assuming things, its about RAW. So I ask you again, stop beating around the bush and tell me where a rule states I cant do this. Ive still got my boyz book open waiting to see.

No , bike is a unit upgrade . Just like assault marine sergent (with a whole squad of jump pack upgrade) cant use flamer.

You see, I dont care about this argument, because if you want to argue RAW and not speculation, Painboys can take Heavy armour as I have proven. If you want to argue speculation, I would say that the upgrade only uses that wording because the entire unit has to take it or nobody does, otherwise it doesnt work with the 40k rules. Otherwise it would also say "Nobs may take a bike".

This is speculation, carrying just as much weight as the flash gitz. You either follow RaW or you follow RaI.

Well, I'm taking my eavy armor equipped painboy to the LGS for a game against one of my buds. I'll check back later. Keep it up!

Night Lords wrote:Painboys can take Heavy armour as I have proven.

Stop saying that. You have proven nothing.