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I have a few ideas regarding tau tactics. this may evolve into my army list. I haven't played much, so i would like to hear opinions from those who have played. Here are some ideas:

Hammerhead to be guarded by kroot. This protects it from close-up tank killers. Also, anything within 24 inches will be shot at. Should I include kroot hounds? How about a shaper? A krootox rider would be expensive, but i will not be infiltrating them, and it could help destroy tank busting things.

A close support crisis team, with burst cannons (I know what you're thinking) and plasma rifles to hunt infantry units, and a shas'o with bodyguard, all with plasma rifles and missile pods to clean up what the close support team can't.

Piranha with fusion blaster (maybe targeting array?) and 1 or 2 seeker missiles, to deal with tanks up-close. Also, the gun drones can support the crisis teams.

Maybe pathfinders to supply much-needed markerlights? Also, a drone controller on a fire warrior team with a marker drone or 2 to help with this.

By the way, all crisis suits will have multi trackers, and the commander will have shield drones. Should I also add a team leader to the close support team, to give him shield drones, too?

These are my ideas so far. What do you guys think?

I'm a new tau player, but i do understand 40k so some of the grizzled vets might be able to help you more but i have a few tips.

A) Pathfinders- yes, yes, and yes again. The markerlights are the keystone to the tau and if you aren't fielding them then you're handicapping yourself (on top of playing a third edition army ) I'm not sure how many should be included in a list, I'd check out AdvancedTauTactica.com

B) You need Broadsides. i dont knwo how many points you are playing at but 1 hammerhead isn't enough anti tank/anti terminator/ anti MC. if you are playing at 1500 points, i have heard a lot of good things for a railhead, and two teams of two broadsides.

C) I know that up above i said markerlights were key, but don't put them in your units on marker drones. the drones don't really work. The unit cant move and the upgrade is twice and a half as expensive as a pathfinder.

D) You are probably going to want firewarriors in a devilfish with a disruption pod

E) the crisis suits have always worked best for e as either death rains, fireknives, or sunforges? (the ones with plasma and fusion). the reason I don't think burst cannons are worth it is because we have so much strength 5 ap 5 shooting in the army that wasting special weapon slots to get more seems superfluous.

F) kroot-yes kroot hounds-double yes. But if i were you i would stop there. shapers are far too expensive for the benefit they add and krotox riders are again too expensive. besides, they're may come a time would it would be tactically feasible and prudent to infiltrate your kroot and keeping the option open is always nice.

cant say anything about piranhas but i hear they are good, but tricky to use. like i said above check out AdvancedTauTactica.com. It is extremely helpful and the people there know just about everything there is to know about the greater good.

Hope this helps!

bleedge wrote:I'm a new tau player, but i do understand 40k so some of the grizzled vets might be able to help you more but i have a few tips.

A) Pathfinders- yes, yes, and yes again. The markerlights are the keystone to the tau and if you aren't fielding them then you're handicapping yourself (on top of playing a third edition army ) I'm not sure how many should be included in a list, I'd check out AdvancedTauTactica.com
thanks. should i buy the kits, or should i just make my own from fire warriors?

B) You need Broadsides. i dont knwo how many points you are playing at but 1 hammerhead isn't enough anti tank/anti terminator/ anti MC. if you are playing at 1500 points, i have heard a lot of good things for a railhead, and two teams of two broadsides.
thanks. i have always liked the look of them. also, that would be fun to convert the extra armor

C) I know that up above i said markerlights were key, but don't put them in your units on marker drones. the drones don't really work. The unit cant move and the upgrade is twice and a half as expensive as a pathfinder.
i never thought of it that way. that makes sense, though.

D) You are probably going to want firewarriors in a devilfish with a disruption pod
cool, i like that idea, too. how many units?

E) the crisis suits have always worked best for e as either death rains, fireknives, or sunforges? (the ones with plasma and fusion). the reason I don't think burst cannons are worth it is because we have so much strength 5 ap 5 shooting in the army that wasting special weapon slots to get more seems superfluous.
well, it is not always prudent to let fire warriors alone to take out infantry, as i have heard from a veteran tau player here on dakka. he is also the one who told me this tactic.

F) kroot-yes kroot hounds-double yes. But if i were you i would stop there. shapers are far too expensive for the benefit they add and krotox riders are again too expensive. besides, they're may come a time would it would be tactically feasible and prudent to infiltrate your kroot and keeping the option open is always nice.
that sounds like a good idea. i'm wondering if i should group my broadsides with my hammerhead so that i only need one unit of kroot to protect them, or if i should spread them out with 2-3 units of kroot. when building my army list, i will try to leave points for the latter.

cant say anything about piranhas but i hear they are good, but tricky to use. like i said above check out AdvancedTauTactica.com. It is extremely helpful and the people there know just about everything there is to know about the greater good.

Hope this helps!

yes it did, thank you

Marker Lights are a must, but the discussion on Markerlight delivery splits from there -

Many people will explain Pathfinders versus other units and count the 12pt models and not the expensive Devilfish they are required to bring. They are expensive, sometimes difficult to place and die faster than you can sneeze!

I do agree that Markerlights in infantry is bad as the Marker drones cannot move, but they do very well on Stealth suits. Stealth suits at 37" cannot be shot at period. Jump forward and shoot Markers, then jump back out of 36" range for protection. Adding a 2pt Fusion Blaster is always smart for late game kills or things that come after you, (I killed/disabled two Baal Predators with 1.....I said 1 Fusion Blaster Stealth suit who melted and punched them into submission.......show me a Pathfinder doing that).

Markerlights are always best delivered by pathfinders, of which you should have at least 1 squad at 1500pts of around 6; the 'dying faster than you can sneeze' is true about any model in the game that's out cover, as it stands cover is abundant in 40k, and your pathfinders should be holed up in a ruin from the word go; their expensive devilfish can then be used by your fire warriors that probably would've bought one anyway.

Stealth suits are a very hit and miss unit, made undesriable by the fact that you can have 1 FB per 3 suits, forcing you to get within 12" of something only 1/3 of your models will be able to reliably harm. There are far easier and less expensive ways of delivering fusion blasters than expensive stealth teams.

A Piranha is probably the best (you'll want to save your elite slots for crisis teams, whereas you should have at least 1 Fast Attack slot free (if ever have all 3 free at 1.5k points or more, you're doing something wrong, there should always be a pathfinder team occupying one of the slots) for Piranhas), give it a fusion blaster, targetting array and a disruption pod and you have something that skims flat out into your opponent's deployment zone, using the cover save for doing so for protection, pops the tank in question next turns using the disruption pod against enemy fire and then goes hunting the next tank.

You can find info on crisis suit loadouts here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/360480.page (the burst cannon/plasma rifle loadout is called a 'Bladestorm')

Stealth suits are not about Fusion Blasters and I don't understand why every poster reacts to Stealth Suits with that story line. Stealth suits are really only great at one thing and that is Markerlights.

They are mobile, hard to hit and can "WHEN" needed, kill things. Yes they are more expensive - (5 marker lights on Stealth w/ FB = 232 compared to 5 Pathfinders and Devilfish = 145pts.)

I use two 3man squads w/ 3 Markers - team leader has two drones + markerlight + FB with the other two just standard (this way two can die and you still have 3 markerlights and a Fusion Blaster.)

I run Pathfinders between 5 and 8 - it may just be me, (it often is), but I get 1 or 2 hits a turn with those while I get 2 per stealth team. Not sure why and I'm sure Mathhammer while show real results. I am just stating what happens/works for me.

I'll just say that every Tau player should try Stealth suits out several times and then judge. Not only are the models cool, but used as Marker light delivery and last resort Tank killing, they do well. (ps....and I do mean, "LAST RESORT" tank killing!)

well, i did just buy a piranha, and i would like to convert up some pathfinders using fire warriors, as i have said.
also, would it be a good idea to take both the pathfinders and the stealth suits?

glomscient wrote:well, i did just buy a piranha, and i would like to convert up some pathfinders using fire warriors, as i have said.
also, would it be a good idea to take both the pathfinders and the stealth suits?

In higher point games or if you were using mass seeker missiles I can see it otherwise no. If you don't have the models, I would definately start with using Firewarriors and a Devilfish for Pathfinders. Later you can try Stealthsuits. (don't forget that the Pathfinders Devilfish gives you rerolls on deepstriking units that it has in LOS.)

Im sorry but I would not say pathfinders are mandatory by any means, especially when you can just upgrade your units to automaticaly have bs4, but things I would say that are mandatory

If you run pathfinders no rail rifles
Ethreals suck
Stealths...sometimes suck? like the above poster said it really depends on how you use them
Kroot sharpers are not worth it
A lot of fire warriors will just die and run away after a round of shooting, must have devil fish to keep them from dying.
Crisis suit load outs are CRITICAL. They are the most important thing to get right for your army, pathfinders are a waster of points in my opinion and most certainly not "mandatory"
But this is something I would say is, b/c they are gonna be what kill most of the enemy if you get the number and loadout right
Then obviously dont use vespids, pirahnas are optional. I personally dont use them, but they can be effective at road blocking
Then heavy support wise im gonna just say I think broadsides are better than hammer heads, just gonna throw it out there lol But ya im not saying dont use any hammerheads they can be effective. But broadsides are more worth for the price. Twinlinked for cheaper? 2 wounds and can be equiped with shield drones, and shoot rail rilfe after moving? Il take a broadside team over one rail rifle shot any day

Da-Rock wrote:Stealth suits are not about Fusion Blasters and I don't understand why every poster reacts to Stealth Suits with that story line. Stealth suits are really only great at one thing and that is Markerlights.

You wrote:Adding a 2pt Fusion Blaster is always smart for late game kills or things that come after you, (I killed/disabled two Baal Predators with 1.....I said 1 Fusion Blaster Stealth suit who melted and punched them into submission.......show me a Pathfinder doing that).

You're being slightly hypocritical here.

They are mobile, hard to hit and can "WHEN" needed, kill things. Yes they are more expensive - (5 marker lights on Stealth w/ FB = 232 compared to 5 Pathfinders and Devilfish = 145pts.)

They are mobile, hard to hit with shooting, but they cannot kill things. They have BS3 and the equivilant of a heavy bolter with less AP. 1.5 hits per suit and 1.0005 wounds vs MEQs does not kill things, and if you're in fusion blaster range then you're also in range to be rapid-fired; only the fusion blaster is reliable enough to kill something, taking 30pt BS3 burst cannons is a terrible investment and they take up space needed for crisis suits.

I use two 3man squads w/ 3 Markers - team leader has two drones + markerlight + FB with the other two just standard (this way two can die and you still have 3 markerlights and a Fusion Blaster.)

[color=red]I assume you mean that you have your Shas'ui have 1 marker drone each and that your team leader has two marker drones and a markerlight? That means you're paying 454 for 6 T3 3+ save models that are equipped to do the work of 6 pathfinders for more than 2.5 times the cost.

I run Pathfinders between 5 and 8 - it may just be me, (it often is), but I get 1 or 2 hits a turn with those while I get 2 per stealth team. Not sure why and I'm sure Mathhammer while show real results. I am just stating what happens/works for me.

I run pathfinders in a unit of 6 and they get what they get, rolling badly with one unit isn't an excuse to dump them any more than rolling well with a unit is an excuse to keep them, especially when the unit you're rolling badly with is getting the same amount of hits as a unit several times it's cost.

I'll just say that every Tau player should try Stealth suits out several times and then judge. Not only are the models cool, but used as Marker light delivery and last resort Tank killing, they do well. (ps....and I do mean, "LAST RESORT" tank killing!)

As a Tau player for 4 years I can say i have tried them and they were gak, i've also seen them used and they were equally as gak, in terms of markerlight delivery, pathfinders beat stealth suits, and last resort tank killing shouldn't be a factor, I can take a fusion blaster Piranha for that.

darkcloud92 wrote:Im sorry but I would not say pathfinders are mandatory by any means, especially when you can just upgrade your units to automaticaly have bs4, but things I would say that are mandatory

I would say they very much are mandatory, bearing in mind that the BS4 upgrade you speak of can only be given to 1 model per unit.

If you run pathfinders no rail rifles
Ethreals suck
Stealths...sometimes suck? like the above poster said it really depends on how you use them
Kroot sharpers are not worth it
A lot of fire warriors will just die and run away after a round of shooting, must have devil fish to keep them from dying.

Crisis suit load outs are CRITICAL. They are the most important thing to get right for your army, pathfinders are a waster of points in my opinion and most certainly not "mandatory"

Pathfinders are not a waste of points, I will repeat the point because it needs to be repeated, they are the cheapest way of delivering markerlights to your army and markerlights are almost essential in 5th edition, what with cover everywhere and every shot counting. We are not marines, we cannot shoot at something that it will die, we need to make sure our important shots hit and do damage.

But this is something I would say is, b/c they are gonna be what kill most of the enemy if you get the number and loadout right
Then obviously dont use vespids, pirahnas are optional. I personally dont use them, but they can be effective at road blocking
Then heavy support wise im gonna just say I think broadsides are better than hammer heads, just gonna throw it out there lol But ya im not saying dont use any hammerheads they can be effective. But broadsides are more worth for the price. Twinlinked for cheaper? 2 wounds and can be equiped with shield drones, and shoot rail rilfe after moving? Il take a broadside team over one rail rifle shot any day

Broadsides don't have rail-rifles, nor can they move and shoot unless they have a certain piece of battlesuit wargear. Also bear in mind that hammerheads are automatically BS4 and can fire submunition shots to thin hordes, as well as being able to move 12" and still fire the railgun if you take a certain piece of wargear.

Ya I was talking about the ASS upgrade, just give broadsides the ASS upgrade and they can move and shoot. And ya i missed typed rail gun, rail rifle, you knew what I meant. But your looking at only one thing, one situation where the hammerhead is more effective-killing a horde unit- and saying because of that its better. Broadsides are still better in every other way when it comes to spending points. They can throw out more shots and survive longer, and you get more for the amount of points your spending, add it up if you want.
And as I said before ya pathfinders can benefit you, but I would not say the markerlights are necessary. instead of having two units shoot at two enemy units you now have two of your own units shooting at the same one, with only one of them getting the ability to hurt it. An a four or most of the time when I play 5 up cover save is not a big deal. The upgraded bs is nice and the ability to remove cover save is nice, but its not by any means mandatory.

But your looking at only one thing, one situation where the hammerhead is more effective-killing a horde unit- and saying because of that its better. Broadsides are still better in every other way when it comes to spending points. They can throw out more shots and survive longer, and you get more for the amount of points your spending, add it up if you want.

I'm not looking from one thing, read again where I said with a bit of wargear it can move 12" and still fire the railgun; Broadsides cannot do that, and as such it's easier to hide from them.

I also have added it up, many, many times; I do play Tau you know, and I can say that hammerheads should not simply be ignored. Land Raiders can make your opponent squirm just by being on the table, so can a hammerhead, what with its S10 AP1 railgun; yet another reason to take one.

As for pathfinders, I have to again disagree with you on all points. Only one unit getting to hurt it is fine since you're getting to hurt it more than you would have done otherwise. Strip cover down with markerlights, increase BS of units firing on them and whittle down Ld so they take 25% casualties and have to test on low Ld.

When you take into account that Tau cannot compete with other armies in terms of quantity of fire, we have to take every measure to ensure that we have quality. As many of our shots need to hit and wound as possible, and we cannot do that when our whole army bar one or two units is BS3. Markerlights are essential, without them we're just Imperial Guard without the masses of powerful weaponry or bodies.

Da-Rock wrote: Jump forward and shoot Markers, then jump back out of 36" range for protection.

I didn't think you could do this.

Markerlights are heavy 1, right? Stealth suits don't let you move & fire heavy weapons?

Both Crisis Suits and Stealth Suits are jet-pack infantry, and so are relentless with the exception of Crisis Suits who have a rule that specifically disallows them to move and shoot heavy weapons, a rule that Stealth Suits are devoid of.

Right but broadsides can still fire the rail gun and move D6 with ass. Listen im not trying to argue that hammerheads are useless, and you said it your self we want the best quality of fire we can get as tau. Broadsides simply have the better gun and are more survivable. Im not saying you should never take a hammerhead or take 1 broadside over 1 hammerhead, as a team they are way better. But that broadsides should be taken over hammerhead, if you only picked one for you elite slot b/c your using less than 1500 points. After that I dont see much of a problem with picking both, but I personally use two slots of broadside teams b/c its 3 TL rail gun shots per team before I choose to use a hammerhead-1 rail gun shot not TL

glomscient wrote:I have a few ideas regarding tau tactics. this may evolve into my army list. I haven't played much, so i would like to hear opinions from those who have played. Here are some ideas:

Hammerhead to be guarded by kroot. This protects it from close-up tank killers. Also, anything within 24 inches will be shot at. Should I include kroot hounds? How about a shaper? A krootox rider would be expensive, but i will not be infiltrating them, and it could help destroy tank busting things.

Kroot are better used to wall for infantry or your whole army in my opinion, that and outflanking and objective holding when the situation permits. Unless your playing on tables with lots of tree terrain and are gonna krootbox, don't use a krootox. Shapers are nice for allocating wounds if you have the extra points, just don't buy the armor upgrade...

A close support crisis team, with burst cannons (I know what you're thinking) and plasma rifles to hunt infantry units, and a shas'o with bodyguard, all with plasma rifles and missile pods to clean up what the close support team can't.

There are two realms of though for battlesuits, many swear by the fireknife setup (missilep/plas) and others run many of the different loadouts. First rule of thumb: Your army doesn't need any more strength 5, so no burst. Second: Give your suits the fireknife or give them a job. Example: I run 3 suits with twin linked missile pods and flamers, for transport and horde killy. It helps to give their guns a second job, such as fusion/plas (something I swear by on my commander and his two bodyguards) kills MEQ, TEQ and deepstrikers like nothing else.

Piranha with fusion blaster (maybe targeting array?) and 1 or 2 seeker missiles, to deal with tanks up-close. Also, the gun drones can support the crisis teams.

Excellent idea, fusion piranhas with targeting arrays and a few seeker missiles for first turn side armor hits from marker support works well. The gun drones can assist where they are needed as well. If only I had more than one piranha...

Maybe pathfinders to supply much-needed markerlights? Also, a drone controller on a fire warrior team with a marker drone or 2 to help with this.

Pathfinders (cheaper, easier to lose) or stealth marker teams (tad more expensive, get gun drones to take hits) I prefer SMT's because they can support me on the move, can draw fire that does nothing and with a few extra gun drones tossed in take quite a few hits. They also are excellent anti-horde support. Never take the fusion. If you love to deep strike, then I would argue for the pathfinders.

By the way, all crisis suits will have multi trackers, and the commander will have shield drones. Should I also add a team leader to the close support team, to give him shield drones, too?

If the crisis teams is more than 2 suits, give a commander with bonding and two shield drones. Better safer suits than sorry dead ones. This is a standard for ALL battlesuits, and broadsides.

These are my ideas so far. What do you guys think?

That's all I can think of atm.


Edit: The hammerheads are primary anti-infantry and secondary tank killers in my book. If you need an av14 vehicle dead, call the broadsides.

Avatar 720 wrote:Both Crisis Suits and Stealth Suits are jet-pack infantry, and so are relentless with the exception of Crisis Suits who have a rule that specifically disallows them to move and shoot heavy weapons, a rule that Stealth Suits are devoid of.

Can you site where in the codex it makes this distinction? I don recall there being any exceptions between stealth and crisis suits as far as moving and shooting.

SickSix wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:Both Crisis Suits and Stealth Suits are jet-pack infantry, and so are relentless with the exception of Crisis Suits who have a rule that specifically disallows them to move and shoot heavy weapons, a rule that Stealth Suits are devoid of.

Can you site where in the codex it makes this distinction? I don recall there being any exceptions between stealth and crisis suits as far as moving and shooting.

Page 27.

Under Stealth Armour it states 'Stealth team members are Jump Infantry subject to the Jetpack rules', which in the BRB confers relentless.

Under XV8 Crisis Battlesuit it states 'Crisis suits members are Jump Infantry subject to the Jetpack rules' but then further in also states 'The battlesuits are designed to compensate for the recoil of light weapons fire, so they do not count as moving when they fire Rapid Fire weapons. The ability does not extend to heavy weapons, however, and the user must be stationary to fire them.'

The second part isn't in the Stealth Armour rules, and as such they can move and fire heavy weapons because they are relentless.

Juraigamer, you seem to know how to cut through the flames, and into the actual questions; i'm impressed. Thanks for the info, by the way. once i get superglue, i will clip off the burst cannon, and add a fb on my battlesuit. Good thing you suggested something that i have! (also, with meq coming out every other release, i can't really deny good anti-meq)

edit: also, how should i outfit my stealth marker teams? unless i used the unreliable marker drones, i would only have one markerlight per team. is this enough? should i go with marker drones anyway?

I said = "Stealth suits are not about Fusion Blasters and I don't understand why every poster reacts to Stealth Suits with that story line. Stealth suits are really only great at one thing and that is Markerlights."

Adding a 2pt Fusion Blaster is always smart for late game kills or things that come after you, (I killed/disabled two Baal Predators with 1.....I said 1 Fusion Blaster Stealth suit who melted and punched them into submission.......show me a Pathfinder doing that).
You're being slightly hypocritical here.

You are still misunderstanding what I am saying - the FB is 2pts, that's it. For that cost it should always be added as it allows late game tank killing ability. My point was as soon as I mention the FB almost every poster jumps on the "If you are within 12" you will be rapid fired/assaulted" bandwagon. Most of us are aware of the FB range and what that means. Now explain where that matters if a Tank is 12" away or hopefully 6" away? The unit is meant for Markerlights and not being shot, but at the same time they are great for moving around and killing things when needed. Who in the hell cares about the Burst Cannon? I look at two things:

1. Fusion Blast at 6"
2. Assault with 9 attacks at strength 4

Not great, but has utility in the late game

I said = "I use two 3man squads w/ 3 Markers - team leader has two drones + markerlight + FB with the other two just standard (this way two can die and you still have 3 markerlights and a Fusion Blaster.)"

I assume you mean that you have your Shas'ui have 1 marker drone each and that your team leader has two marker drones and a markerlight? That means you're paying 454 for 6 T3 3+ save models that are equipped to do the work of 6 pathfinders for more than 2.5 times the cost.

No, that is running a full squad - I run 2 standard Stealth suits and 1 Team Leader. The Team Leader has x2 Marker Drones, Markerlight and a Fusion Blaster at 167pts - I use 3 and 3 on Markerlights because for some unknown reason I roll more hits this way.

I said = "I run Pathfinders between 5 and 8 - it may just be me, (it often is), but I get 1 or 2 hits a turn with those while I get 2 per stealth team. Not sure why and I'm sure Mathhammer while show real results. I am just stating what happens/works for me."

I run pathfinders in a unit of 6 and they get what they get, rolling badly with one unit isn't an excuse to dump them any more than rolling well with a unit is an excuse to keep them, especially when the unit you're rolling badly with is getting the same amount of hits as a unit several times it's cost.

I flatly disagree as you play what works for you and not what someone else tells you does. If 6 works with you, great....6 it is. I run Stealth suits because that's what works, having said that I still do run Pathfinders on occasion when I can waste points, but it almost always is when I am running deepstrike and Positional Relay and I want the rerolls.

I said = "I'll just say that every Tau player should try Stealth suits out several times and then judge. Not only are the models cool, but used as Marker light delivery and last resort Tank killing, they do well. (ps....and I do mean, "LAST RESORT" tank killing!)"

As a Tau player for 4 years I can say i have tried them and they were gak, i've also seen them used and they were equally as gak, in terms of markerlight delivery, pathfinders beat stealth suits, and last resort tank killing shouldn't be a factor, I can take a fusion blaster Piranha for that.

This is exactly my point - you just stated what works for you and then made even a bigger point by comparing a 75pt vehicle to a 2pt FB. I could not have put it any better then the Piranha to Stealth suit Fusion Blaster. YOUR Pathfinders beat out YOUR Stealth suits as I have shown MY Stealth suits not only beat out MY Pathfinders, but crushed them in every value conceived besides point cost of course.

darkcloud92 wrote:Im sorry but I would not say pathfinders are mandatory by any means, especially when you can just upgrade your units to automaticaly have bs4, but things I would say that are mandatory

I would say they very much are mandatory, bearing in mind that the BS4 upgrade you speak of can only be given to 1 model per unit.

In no way shape or form are they mandatory because you would have to explain why a unit of 6 pathfinders in my dead pile on turn 2 is mandatory and I still can win the game?

I flatly disagree as you play what works for you and not what someone else tells you does.

If that is the case, then why are you commenting on this thread? Surely you should be letting him play how he wants to.

In no way shape or form are they mandatory because you would have to explain why a unit of 6 pathfinders in my dead pile on turn 2 is mandatory and I still can win the game?

If your 6 pathfinders are dead by turn 2 and you're wondering how you can possibly win from there, then you obviously don't have the tactical knowledge to comment on their usage, since you don't know how to use them yourself.

They start in a building in your DZ, they light up what needs to be killed. The amount of effort needed to kill 6 pathfinders in your DZ by turn 2 would be enough for you to have 2 turns of the rest of your army killing stuff. If they're dying by turn 2 without the enemy throwing everything at them, then you are doing something terribly, terribly wrong.

These are the only two points I considered commenting on, since you're obviously not willing to listen to reason.

I consider the Ninja Tau commander a must have. In the event you're facing some sort of spam army of some sort that's shooty, like razors or IG, you can use the reserve control to limit what comes on the table until later. On turn 4 when things come in on a 2+, let up on the reserve and watch everything come in.

If that is the case, then why are you commenting on this thread? Surely you should be letting him play how he wants to.

Commenting.....not telling. Do you understand the difference? I explained in detail what I liked and why I liked it even when it didn't make sense. Why do you have such a hard time understanding that?

If your 6 pathfinders are dead by turn 2 and you're wondering how you can possibly win from there, then you obviously don't have the tactical knowledge to comment on their usage, since you don't know how to use them yourself.

They start in a building in your DZ, they light up what needs to be killed. The amount of effort needed to kill 6 pathfinders in your DZ by turn 2 would be enough for you to have 2 turns of the rest of your army killing stuff. If they're dying by turn 2 without the enemy throwing everything at them, then you are doing something terribly, terribly wrong.

Again you failed to read it right. I said they are dead turn two and I still win without issue so why are they mandatory? I use them all of the time up until the last game in which they again failed to do anything at all. I do love their Devilfish. I am also NOT saying they are bad, but that I, (as in ME) have a bad time with them and prefer the Stealth suits. My comments are centered on what works for ME.............I'm not sure why you can't see that. If Pathfinders work for you....GREAT! Stealthsuits work better for me.

My tactics match yours with Pathfinder placement, apparently your gaming area needs to learn how to Outflank and Drop Pod to eliminate any tard throwing all his stuff in the back. If you bubble wrap or keep them off just a bit it works, but nothing is safe. I have a feeling you are one of those players who plays well against his local Meta and thinks the rest of the world is the same. Sorry, but different players, different Meta means different game experiences.

If you left your supposedly Mandatory Pathfinders in your DZ in a building they would be eaten alive by Drop Pods, Infiltrators or Outflankers, (depending on actual deployment of course) in my gaming area.

You do realise how incredibly patronising your post is, right? Because arguing this point is now becoming more like arguing with a stubborn angsty teenager who thinks they're better than everyone else.

Lose the attitude.

Avatar 720 wrote:You do realise how incredibly patronising your post is, right? Because arguing this point is now becoming more like arguing with a stubborn angsty teenager who thinks they're better than everyone else.

Lose the attitude.

why?

Da-Rock wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:You do realise how incredibly patronising your post is, right? Because arguing this point is now becoming more like arguing with a stubborn angsty teenager who thinks they're better than everyone else.

Lose the attitude.

why?

Maybe because it's against the rules?

Avatar 720 wrote:

Da-Rock wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:You do realise how incredibly patronising your post is, right? Because arguing this point is now becoming more like arguing with a stubborn angsty teenager who thinks they're better than everyone else.

Lose the attitude.

why?

Maybe because it's against the rules?

My opinion is against the rules? I still do not understand what you are talking about. Are you just grasping at straws because you are frustrated? If you think my tone is too immature or filled with angst, then there are a variety of options for you.

The last time I was an angsty teenager as you put it was 20 years ago, but I am definitely stubborn. I would suggest the attitude lies elsewhere here.

Da-Rock wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:

Da-Rock wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:You do realise how incredibly patronising your post is, right? Because arguing this point is now becoming more like arguing with a stubborn angsty teenager who thinks they're better than everyone else.

Lose the attitude.

why?

Maybe because it's against the rules?

My opinion is against the rules? I still do not understand what you are talking about. Are you just grasping at straws because you are frustrated? If you think my tone is too immature or filled with angst, then there are a variety of options for you.

The last time I was an angsty teenager as you put it was 20 years ago, but I am definitely stubborn. I would suggest the attitude lies elsewhere here.

I encourage you to take your own advice and to re-read what was said. I asked you to lose the attitude, you asked why, and I told you that it's against the rules to post as I described.

Implying that I said your opinion is against the rules is completely baseless, and simply suggests that in fact you are the one clutching at straws by ignoring what I said.

Can you guys take it to PMs? It is a shame to see an interesting discussion get derailed by bickering that is unrelated to the topic.

My question is why one would use kroot to defend a hammerhead? The hammerhead has a range of 72" which is among the range for the IG units. If you have things getting behind your lines without deepstrike then you're doing something wrong.

Pirahnas are good for taking out anything putting a lot of pressure on you or sitting in the back of the enemy forces.

Disruption pods are great, but some players argue that barrage weapons ignore the cover save granted by the pod. Things like an Imperial Guard Basilisk which is strength 9 or 10 and a barrage weapon with more range than the hammerhead. If you and your friends agree to the rule that disruption pods are ignored by barrage weapons, Pirahnas would be used to eliminate those threats.

Firewarriors and their Devilfish tactic is known as the Fish of Fury and works in a lot of cases if you do it right.

Hit and run tactics used by broadsides or battlesuits can also mess people over by letting you fire and then jumping behind cover.

The other thing with the battlesuits and stealthsuits is that they use wounds(IIRC) instead of a vehicle armor value.

Marker lights are amazing additions to any vehicle, and sniper drones are usually a better drone option.