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Alpha Legion is suspected of still being loyal to the emperor and the Imperium, with some sources going so far as to say that Alpharius purposely allowed his legion to fall to Chaos to better combat it. Does anyone have any substantial examples of Imperial loyalty within Alpha Legion history/fluff during and post-Heresy? IMO, it seems pretty radical, but its what I've been reading lately and wanted to see what others thought.

They still use Imperial battle cries like "For the Emperor!"

Given their nature to be super sneaky, they would be the legion to do this. I don't know of any definite examples, but summoning a daemon could be, in their own way, helping the IoM... somehow.

No, they are traitors.

In the HH book Legion it hints at this.

They're still loyal to the Emperor, but they're either still trying to destroy the Imperium to accomplish their original mission, perhaps hoping that Abaddon will do the same thing Horus was meant to (and if he doesn't they'll be pretty annoyed at the Cabal), or else the Imperial armies they're killing are corrupted by Chaos and they're weakening Abaddon's allies.

Malivon wrote:In the HH book Legion it hints at this.

No, it hints they joined the Heresy to save the galaxy, and ultimately destroy Chaos.

10 thousand years of depravity has shown they weren't so successful at staying true to their original goal.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Malivon wrote:In the HH book Legion it hints at this.

No, it hints they joined the Heresy to save the galaxy, and ultimately destroy Chaos.

10 thousand years of depravity has shown they weren't so successful at staying true to their original goal.

Play a role long enough, and sometimes you can forget you were ever pretending.

lol I like his explaintion for them

snake wrote:Alpha Legion is suspected of still being loyal to the emperor and the Imperium, with some sources going so far as to say that Alpharius purposely allowed his legion to fall to Chaos to better combat it. Does anyone have any substantial examples of Imperial loyalty within Alpha Legion history/fluff during and post-Heresy? IMO, it seems pretty radical, but its what I've been reading lately and wanted to see what others thought.

This is a relatively new interpretation of the background - new as in LEGION and not really carried forward anywhere else, except a little bit in the AGE OF DARKNESS anthology.

Hopefully BL authors actually read LEGION and save us from the mustache twirling drama of THE HUNT FOR VOLDORIUS and "The Long Games at Carcharias".

The most likely ending of their 'too clever by half' attempt at outsmarting the Cabal and Horus is that some of the Legion remain dedicated to humanity and The Emperor, but not necessarily the Imperium, and some have fallen to Chaos.

I mean, can you see BL authors NOT using the Brother vs. Brother angle, quite literally here in the Legion, within the larger scope of the Horus Heresy?

As Alpharius said (creepy) they did hint at this in the book Legion by Dan Abnett. A secret cabal of psykers showed them that the Horus Heresy could only end one of two ways, one of which destroyed humanity and Chaos in the process, should Horus kill the Emperor and lead the traitors, and another way which resulted in the stagnant decline of the entire galaxy resulting in humanity's eventual destruction, should the Emperor kill Horus and finish his Great Crusade. The impression I got was that the Alpha Legion was trying to create a third option, orchestrating the events which led to the downfall of both leaders, in order to give humanity a fighting chance.

They are one of two of the Chaos legions which actually make some kind of sense, and I really hope they do something with this material in the future.

Jimsolo wrote:As Alpharius said (creepy) they did hint at this in the book Legion by Dan Abnett. A secret cabal of psykers showed them that the Horus Heresy could only end one of two ways, one of which destroyed humanity and Chaos in the process, should Horus kill the Emperor and lead the traitors, and another way which resulted in the stagnant decline of the entire galaxy resulting in humanity's eventual destruction, should the Emperor kill Horus and finish his Great Crusade. The impression I got was that the Alpha Legion was trying to create a third option, orchestrating the events which led to the downfall of both leaders, in order to give humanity a fighting chance.

They are one of two of the Chaos legions which actually make some kind of sense, and I really hope they do something with this material in the future.

Yes, that too!

Also, "The Face of Treachery" in AGE OF DARKNESS shed a little more light on the subject.

Well in DoW the Alpha Legion seems to be very much chaos...but the idea of them still being loyal to the Imperium is really cool, Although I doubt they will ever take it anywhere close to a definite answer.

Yo dawg, i heard this super secret Cabal of powerful alien psykers, who all have a reason to hate/fear us, wants us to destroy humanity in order to defeat Chaos...
You know...because the dark gods are fed by humanity alone...
Realy? Yes! Sure. They seem totaly legit. Ah well, DEATH TO ALL HUMANS!
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Kazerkinelite wrote:Well in DoW the Alpha Legion seems to be very much chaos...but the idea of them still being loyal to the Imperium is really cool, Although I doubt they will ever take it anywhere close to a definite answer.

Yeah, the DoW series.... no.

snake wrote:Alpha Legion is suspected of still being loyal to the emperor and the Imperium, with some sources going so far as to say that Alpharius purposely allowed his legion to fall to Chaos to better combat it. Does anyone have any substantial examples of Imperial loyalty within Alpha Legion history/fluff during and post-Heresy? IMO, it seems pretty radical, but its what I've been reading lately and wanted to see what others thought.

Alpharius did purposefully side with the Traitors because he felt that's what the Emperor would want him to do. He did it out of loyalty (personally, I would have told those aliens to go stuff themselves and go on to ravage Horus' supply lines).

Whether that's still the case, is unclear. It could be argued that since many of their plans result in massive insurrections that require vast cleansing efforts by the Imperium, that they are still trying to wipe out all of humanity. For the Emperor.

I think Alpharius is still loyal but the legion itself is working for chaos even if they do not know what Alpharius actual plans are.

AFAIK, the Alpha Legion don't devote themselves to one God above all others like WE, DG, TS and EC, nor do they have a history of summoning daemons like WB or trapping daemons like IW did to create the Defiler, nor are they led by a Chaos Ascendant spearheading strikes against the IoM from within the EoT.

This would make them possibly the least Chaos-y of the Legions, with the Night Lords not far behind, as they too don't seem to have taken to anything particularly chaos-y like summoning hordes of daemons, spreading plagues, creating daemon engines or developing odd fetishes.

There is certainly room to suggest they may be loyal in some respects, but it'd be a twisted loyalty such as that of the Soul Drinkers.

In my opinion no legion can be completly free of chaos. Once a marine goes renegade he can do whatever the hell he wants which means he can choose to worship a single god if he wants. Uzas is a good example.

My theory is they joined because AlphariusOmegon wanted to destroy Chaos but they became tainted and eventually became those they vowed to destroy.

Alpharius wrote:

Kazerkinelite wrote:Well in DoW the Alpha Legion seems to be very much chaos...but the idea of them still being loyal to the Imperium is really cool, Although I doubt they will ever take it anywhere close to a definite answer.

Yeah, the DoW series.... no.

Hahaha, I was talking about the 2004 RTS game, not the book series. Correct me if i'm wrong but doesnt GW over see what game developers do with their universe?

I'm not so sure that the DoW books or games are considered canon...

I just read Legion, before they turn, Alpharius says to Omegon

"everything we do from this point on, we do for the emperor"

They are loyal alright.

I want them to be loyal, that would be sweet.

I wish thousand sons were loyal, i really like their armor... then i could buy their army!

mattyrm wrote: I just read Legion, before they turn, Alpharius says to Omegon

"everything we do from this point on, we do for the emperor"

They are loyal alright.

That was 10 thousand years and multiple daemonic summonings ago.

10000 years may as well be 10 seconds, as long as you have a pure heart and your soul devoted to the emperor...jk, they are fethed

dajobe wrote:I want them to be loyal, that would be sweet.

I wish thousand sons were loyal, i really like their armor... then i could buy their army!

The Thousand Sons would have been loyal if the Emperor had just taken a step back and actually understood exactly what Magnus had done. Instead of immediatly sending the Space Wolves to go and bring him to justice. Thats my interpretation at least, I have not read the HH books going into the details of the Thousand Sons, there could be other variables that could have inevitably led them to chaos either way.

As for the Alpha Legion we don't even know which brother is alive...or if they are actually the same person. So I doubt we will ever fully know there intentions

even though i hate SW's with a passion, i do have to say that it wasnt all their fault... they were sent just to bring magnus to the emperor, Horus, who was the acting warmaster, told leman russ that the emperor changed his mind and wanted the thousand sons dead, so it amounts to leman russ was gullible and Horus was a giant piece of gak! poor thousand sons! WHY? they look to cool to be chaos!

dajobe wrote:even though i hate SW's with a passion, i do have to say that it wasnt all their fault... they were sent just to bring magnus to the emperor, Horus, who was the acting warmaster, told leman russ that the emperor changed his mind and wanted the thousand sons dead, so it amounts to leman russ was gullible and Horus was a giant piece of gak! poor thousand sons! WHY? they look to cool to be chaos!

Hmmm interesting, i did not know this. I must agree with your last sentence also, Their pre heresy armor was very much to my liking.

dajobe wrote:even though i hate SW's with a passion, i do have to say that it wasnt all their fault... they were sent just to bring magnus to the emperor, Horus, who was the acting warmaster, told leman russ that the emperor changed his mind and wanted the thousand sons dead, so it amounts to leman russ was gullible and Horus was a giant piece of gak! poor thousand sons! WHY? they look to cool to be chaos!

The only source for this are the taunts of a daemon, so we're not sure of its veracity. Space Wolves were spoiling for a fight with the Thousand Sons long before Magnus' ill-fated attempt to reach his father.

DarknessEternal wrote:

mattyrm wrote: I just read Legion, before they turn, Alpharius says to Omegon

"everything we do from this point on, we do for the emperor"

They are loyal alright.

That was 10 thousand years and multiple daemonic summonings ago.

They make use of cultists, but I've never heard of them making extensive use of daemon summoning - outside of Dawn of War, anyway, which I don't consider tip-top canon. They aren't even known to operate out of the Maelstrom, much less the Eye of Terror - they hang out in nooks and crannies in the Imperium.