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Made in gb
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





UK

Once again, pretty dire, especially as finales go.

Do not read the below if you actually liked the episode, it's a bit of a rant!


Spoiler:


The plot was again weak, lacking substance and ultimately underwhelming. Missy/The Master taking over the world with Cybermen was bad to start with, sidelining the owed-a-good-story classic villains to basically henchmen, but then handing that army over to the Doctor in a feeble attempt to get him to 'join me on the dark side' was just nonsensical, out of character and poorly written to boot. In terms of gaps in the plot, the cyber-pollen has to be the worst; fair enough that they are programmed to grow new cybermen, but what about the materials? Unless the dead of centuries have been buried with computer chips, metal sheeting and a few yards of wire, it just doesn't hold water. (no pun intended).

The handling of Danny also annoyed me. Ok, we finally got a resolution to the conflict between him and the Doctor, but it was far harder to appreciate when, at most, he was sacrificing people who were already dead and likely to kill him. Then him taking command and remaining himself despite the inhibitor (which has never been, nor should be, optional for Cybermen) was again silly and badly written. Don't get me started on his face still being inside the suit.

Missy/The Master/Whatever, I'm still annoyed with. On a personal level because there was still no reason given for the regenderation, or explanation for how she escaped Gallifrey, when last we saw her she was being killed by Rassilon and chucked back into a Time War. On a more objective level, I have to say she did a somewhat decent job with the role in places, chanelling the John-Simm-esque 'mad as a box of frogs' lunacy, but ultiately, I still feel it was a role that never should have existed. And in terms of plotting, all she did was turn up largely for the shock factor, kill some people because she could, and then take over the world only to hand it over to the Doctor who was ostensibly in charge of it anyway...Poorly written, poorly handled and pooly thought out.

Osgood's death was slightly saddening, but ultimately a waste; ever since Day of the Doctor I'd been hoping she'd get those five words, 'all of time and space', and when at last she did, she was killed, for no reason other than to prove that The Master (who anyone who's seen the show in the past knows is insane) is insane...

There was also no real resoltution to all those characters that wasted our plot time by being 'Missyed' over the series, I suppose we can assume that they were Cybermen, but that's hardly satisfactory.

The writing out of Clara was just weak, there was really no emotion to it, it was largely unfounded, and really just pathetic. She's grown a lot as a character, to just sideline her based on a set of lies is again a massive waste and lacked any real impetus or feeling.

But by far the worst bit, in terms of sheer offensiveness, inappropriateness and 'look how radical I am' Moffatness, was the resolution of Kate's 'death'. To put it bluntly, I think that making The Brigadier a Cyberman is not only an insult to the late Nicholas Courntney, but also to the character as a whole anyone who ever wrote or watched the character. Glossing over the fact that, as previously mentionded, a Cyberman with a conscience largely stupid in this context, that's the fething Brigadier! It was just a cheap shot by Moffat to try and show that he's paying homage (read: dancing on the grave of) the classic show.

Ok, rant over. For now, at least...


And the ending? Just no!



 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







I didn't think it was entirely terrible. But yeah, I had plenty of issues - It reminded me of The Angels of Manhattan actually, some good character moments, interspersed between awfulness.

Spoiler:

The 'all of time and space' line is a major death sentence. As soon as The Doctor said that, I knew Osgood was a goner.

Overall, I enjoyed Missy and, personally I don't have any issues or complaints with her being The Master at all. I may be wrong but... When the Doctor shot her at the end, it was a blue disintegration, whereas the rest of the time, it was a red one. I imagine it's actually a transport beam of some form. So we'll probably see 'Missy' again.

With The Brigadier at the end, I can imagine that hugely irritating fans of the original show. On the other hand... He didn't self destruct. Could it be that there's been an intentional setup now of potentially having both Cyberman and Da'lek 'resistance' cells operating. So perhaps we'll see him again.

I didn't mind the hint for the Christmas show. It could be quite entertaining.

It also suggests that we haven't seen the last of Clara either. "Doctor, you know it can't end like that. We need to get this sorted. And quickly. She's not alright you know, and neither are you."

I imagine what will happen is. We'll have a Christmas special with The Doctor having his adventure on his own. Then in the last 5 minutes of the special, he'll be talked into going back to see Clara, they'll talk it out and she'll rejoin him for the next season. The whole Orson Pink thing wasn't resolved...




So, that's the sort of positive things out of the way.

Spoiler:
Negative things... Like Angels in Manhattan, they take a potentially interesting idea (Cyberman zombies), then take it to ludicrous extremes. - Really, was every dead person, from the last 50 years at least) becoming a Cyberman Zombie that necessary? They could very easily have had the exact same type of Graveyard Scenes if they had set it as something like 'those that the 3W company had access to since it was first set up.' That'd then allow the logic of, maybe the coffins or some sort of preparation were actually technologically designed to convert the dead into cybermen. As opposed to magic water.

Then all would need to have done was switch Danny's scene to him being in a coffin in a funeral parlour, as opposed to a mortuary slab. Heck, that'd have arguably been even 'scarier.'

It seemed a massive waste of Sanjeev Bashkar to just kill him off like that. Very strange too.

Unless there is a major future plot point with the Brigadier Cyberman, I can't see why they just didn't have the Doctor getting into the TARDIS as he did, then having it fly over to catch Kate, yet still have her injured/unconscious for the rest of the episode. That way, the character is kept around and loads of fans aren't annoyed.

I'm crossing my fingers that Nick Frost as Santa is going to be alright...
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

Wow. I can't disagree more with paradigm again. Maybe Doctor Who isn't for you?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Re: Brig. The first thing I said to the wife when the rain started was 'oh crap, there's gonna be Amy, Rory and Brig cyber men." I was one third right.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/09 19:56:40


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Made in gb
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





UK

 pretre wrote:
Wow. I can't disagree more with paradigm again. Maybe Doctor Who isn't for you?


It most certainly is, I've been glued to it ever since it came back and love almost every episode since then. That's actually why I've been so annoyd with some of the stuff this series, because in my eyes it's such a decline from what has gone before and what the show could/should be. Although this series has been pretty good on the whole, especially after second watchings of most things, some of them are just worse than the worst of previous series (just the last three episodes, really). Of this series, only Flatline, Mummy and possible Dalek and Listen can really sit alongside the really good ones, in my opinion (and it's just that, opinion. I fully appreciate that plenty of people prefer the show as it is now to how it was before, and I won't argue with that.)

Capaldi is completely amazing, and Coleman has come a long way from her first appearances, so the show is in good hands on screen. Behind that, though, all I can see if Moffat making the show more and more convoluted, showing no respect for the history of the show (see: The Master, Cyberbrig), writing terrible plots that just lack substance (particlarly those last two), and basically letting the fact he's showrunner go to his head.

It's not so much that it's bad, it's just that it could be so much better...

I suppose that's actually how many people feel about 40k these days

 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

It's funny how people can get opposite conclusions from the same things. (Ie. the master, cyberbrig)

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Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in south-central England.

Paradigm is right about this episode.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I can't even remember much about it except a general sense of disappointment.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Master never used to be a frothing loon in Jon Pertwee's time. It actually weakens the character IMO for him/her to be a nutter.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/11/09 22:38:01


I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in gb
Lord Commander in a Plush Chair





Beijing

I thought that was nonsensical twaddle. Doctor Who is or was the show for me, I've been watching it for about 25 years. I don't know what this is other than a mess. I love Peter Capaldi, but I don't really know where to begin with the disappointment that was the last few episodes. The Brigadier thing felt surprisingly crass given he's only a fictional character.
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







It's definitely Moffat and the other showrunners which is the issue, I think. Keep the actors, but look at doing a complete refresh of all the behind the scenes people.

Ok, maybe keep the set, costume and sound designers
   
Made in gb
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





UK

 Compel wrote:
It's definitely Moffat and the other showrunners which is the issue, I think. Keep the actors, but look at doing a complete refresh of all the behind the scenes people.

Ok, maybe keep the set, costume and sound designers


I think it's just Moffat. From the likes of Mark Gatiss, Toby Whithouse and newcome Jamie Maitheson, there has been some great stuff produced in recent years, but the key issues with the show, at least for me (convoluted plot acrs, hanging resolutions, shock factor writing) all really come from him.

I never thought I'd ever say this a few years ago, but bring back Russel T Davies!

 
   
Made in nl
Did Fulgrim Just Behead Ferrus?





The Netherlands

Hmm, bring back Davies, but not the designs, sound/music, Satan, costumes, special effects, actors, Mickey, etc from his era...

By the way, food for thought: http://io9.com/all-of-doctor-whos-big-thematic-arcs-pay-off-with-clar-1656439341

Bits Blitz Designs - 3D printing a dark futuristic universe 
   
Made in gb
Ultramarine Librarian with Freaky Familiar





I really liked the Doctor's "Thankyou! You're right! I'm not a Good man! But nor am I a bad man! I'm just an idiot with a box" monologue.

They really laid it on thick with the "Soldier" theme with it being Remembrance Sunday.

The Cyberman pollen idea was stupid.

But Capaldi was brilliant. He's definitely my favourite doctor to date. I didn't like Eccleston or Tennant. I loved Matt Smith's Doctor, and he was the Doctor who won we over and got me watching the show regularly. But Capaldi is by far the best of the four Doctor's that I've seen. All the old Doctors from the classic Seasons in the 90's and earlier were way before my time.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/11/11 19:30:36


 
   
Made in gb
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





UK

So with the dust now having settled on the series and the wait (either in anticipation or dread) until Christmas upon us, what are folks thinking about the series as a whole?

I know I have certainly changed my opinion a lot on the earlier episodes; while I still don't put many of them up there with the best of the earlier series and still think there was quite a lot of wasted potential (looking at you, Listen!), I think the run got steadily better until the last 3 episodes, peaking with Mummy and Flatline. Jamie Mathieson, the writer of both of those, has to be one of the best finds of the series, so I hope he gets at least 2 scripts next year if not more. His episodes were good enough to have fitted perfectly alongside the best of Tennant, Smith or Ecclestone.

The most consistent thing, this year, was the leads, both Capaldi and Coleman. Both of them had to deal with some pretty difficult or weak scripts at points, and pulled them together remarkably well. Coleman actually did a great job of taking Clara from plot device to character, and Capaldi may just be my favourite Doctor of all time (sorry, David). Even in the episodes I was less than thrilled with, the interplay between the two of them had a spark that quite a few Doctor-companion dynamics have lacked in the past.

The effects and music were great as ever, and the new title sequence I think I've commented on every episode, as it's just brilliant.

I still think there needs to be a big step back from plot arcs that span a season or even 2, and get back to the 'adventure of the week' format from the earlier series (and bring back regular 2-parters while you're at it), but overall, I think this series has played out pretty well, and although it ended not with a bang but with a whimper (and Santa), I am hopeful for next series.

What's everyone else's thoughts?

 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 Paradigm wrote:
I still think there needs to be a big step back from plot arcs that span a season or even 2, and get back to the 'adventure of the week' format from the earlier series (and bring back regular 2-parters while you're at it), but overall,

Although I agree that more smaller arcs are good, I thought this season was very much 'adventure of the week'. Yes, there was a little bit of tie in in each episode and such, but even the old series had continuity between the individual episode arcs.

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Made in gb
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





UK

 pretre wrote:
 Paradigm wrote:
I still think there needs to be a big step back from plot arcs that span a season or even 2, and get back to the 'adventure of the week' format from the earlier series (and bring back regular 2-parters while you're at it), but overall,

Although I agree that more smaller arcs are good, I thought this season was very much 'adventure of the week'. Yes, there was a little bit of tie in in each episode and such, but even the old series had continuity between the individual episode arcs.


I'll admit it did become far less significant as the series went on, I was more referring to the earlier episodes where we were basically hit over the head with Missy and/or Danny incase we hadn't realised they would be important. In short, I miss the days when Bad Wolf would be namedropped every couple of weeks and that was it

 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

Bad wolf was referenced in every episode of that season wasn't it?

Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 pretre wrote:
Bad wolf was referenced in every episode of that season wasn't it?



I think so, but there were quite a few episodes where the only reference to it would be some graffiti in the background or something. It wasn't like the Vegas neon signs we got in the early parts of this season with Missy/Danny
   
Made in gb
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





UK

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
 pretre wrote:
Bad wolf was referenced in every episode of that season wasn't it?



I think so, but there were quite a few episodes where the only reference to it would be some graffiti in the background or something. It wasn't like the Vegas neon signs we got in the early parts of this season with Missy/Danny


Yeah, it was like that most of the time actually. Graffiti on the TARDIS, mentioned by some extras as they walked past and stuff like that. I can't quite recall every reference to it, but I'm pretty sure it was never played up as something significant. That sort of thing started happening in S5 when the cracks started showing up, and after Flesh and Stone the Doctor actually notices and starts paying attention to them (which was an interesting move at the time, but since then things have become more and more obvious).

I think some of the best examples of how to set up a finale come with Rise of the Cybermen and Human Nature in S2 and 3. Both introduced elements that would come into play as in the finale (Cybermen from another dimension and Human Time Lords respectively) but other than that remained entirely self-contained and brilliant stories.

 
   
 
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