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I went into my local GW last week; the third biggest GW store in the world (Mt Gravatt) from 3:00pm untill 9:30pm. And this is what I saw:

*over 40 customers playing on various tables around the store
*Aproximately 8 people with painted armies that looked... ...well... ...lets just say not so great!
*At least 20 unpainted, unprimered, armies (from 1000pts to 2000pts)
*About 10 customers with HALF painted armies
*ONLY 1 fully painted army that was at tabletop quality
*And me and my friends fully painted armies (They look pretty great IMO)

What has happened to hard work and progression that should be happening? People should be proudly bringing out painted armies to go with those amazing boards that the hardworking staff has taken hours to make. I was supprised that 20 people had unpainted armies, it just seemed wrong. Great boards and commited staff, yet the customers aren't even painting ONE model of their army.

I would be expecting good work from Australian painters because of the horrible prices Australians have to bear with, not to mention the price raise and the upcoming one. When you pay $64 (US) for a Tactical Squad (In Australia), you should get the most value out of what you have, right?

The skill level needed to paint a good looking model is really not much skill needed at all. Basecoat the model, wash the model, paint the detail (even without highlights) and the model will look great. Even then, you can make things even easier by using spray cans and army painter dips etc. Painting a decent tabletop quality army doesn't take much time either, maybe an hour per squad or less. I wasn't angry or sad, but just disapointed.

What is others stores like in your area? Do you face the same issue in other contries, or is it as disapointing as what I saw?

Mt Gravatt is the 3rd biggest GW store in the world??

I've never seen that many people in the store... let alone with an army (painted or otherwise)...

Mayhaps there is hope of getting a WHFB game one of days... lol

In Hornsby GW (NSW), there's quite a few well painted armies. There's the girl with the 'Nids, the guy with Grey Knights...

I have a half painted army, but the half the is painted is painted good...and it's the only half I use.

What's this? People not painting armies? We should have them staked and burned for crimes of Heresy against GW!

Or maybe you should realize that some people may not like painting, and others don't have the time.

Some may even be proud of however they painted it. Sure it looks better if you get to play against a well painted army though.

Generally I do the same, but haven't had as much time to paint lately.

AFAIK, MOST of the gaming in OZ doesn't happen in a GW store.

Most of the clubs I've been a member of or visitor to have had a majority of painted armies (for whatever game).

Of course, many have also had access to beer. It's how I select my clubs. Makes being beaten less of a problem.

It is the same in most places.

However I think your being very un-fair. Yes, I do think that un-primed armys are unforgivable.

However, critisising people for there lack of painting skill or the fact that the army is only half ready is very unfair. Painting takes time, and to say that you can paint a squad in an hour is rubbish. I have been painting my DW force over the last few weeks. I have just been doing the bolt gun metal parts (weppon, Crux, wireing etc) and that is taking about 20mins per modal on its own.

I'm not the best, or fastest, painter in the world, but I do enjoy it and the last thing I would want to do is rush just to get on the table, or to not be able to play for six months because i'm painting.

I would not take an unfinished force to an event, but to play friendly games? Hell no.

None of my armies are 100% because I take a ridiculous amount of time to paint, and, to be honest, I can never finish a project... I mean I've been wargaming for two years and I have four armies.

Space Marines... did them to 100%. Moved onto IG, did them to about 80%. Repainted my Space Marines as Dark Angels and now the rest are stripped. Got some Eldar, they're about 50%; fun to paint but not competitive at 750pt size.. then I moved onto Nurgle, bought 1500pts and got very swiftly bored of green stuff'ing. Now I'm painting a Rapid Fire scenario which actually looks like it might hit 100% simply because 1/72 is so darn easy to paint.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In short, my prime reason for being in the hobby is gratification from painting; the momeny stuff gets samey I move on.

Chowderhead wrote:What's this? People not painting armies? We should have them staked and burned for crimes of Heresy against GW!

Or maybe you should realize that some people may not like painting, and others don't have the time.

I'm not wanting to punish them or anything. I would just think more people would enjoy painting...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Paul wrote:It is the same in most places.

However I think your being very un-fair. Yes, I do think that un-primed armys are unforgivable.

However, critisising people for there lack of painting skill or the fact that the army is only half ready is very unfair. Painting takes time, and to say that you can paint a squad in an hour is rubbish. I have been painting my DW force over the last few weeks. I have just been doing the bolt gun metal parts (weppon, Crux, wireing etc) and that is taking about 20mins per modal on its own.

I'm not the best, or fastest, painter in the world, but I do enjoy it and the last thing I would want to do is rush just to get on the table, or to not be able to play for six months because i'm painting.

I would not take an unfinished force to an event, but to play friendly games? Hell no.

I'm not critisizing them, I'm just saying that I was suprized to see only 1 army painted.

Almost everyone on Dakka has a decent looking army and I only saw one.


The main idea of this post was really to ask: Does this happen at your gaming area? Is it normal?

Unprimed armies are win!
Painting is a shrinking part of the hobby. It's a shame but the people who do paint regardless of quality should be complimented, it helps encourage them to achieve more.
We can wish and hope that everyone had time to paint or the desire but the simple truth is not everyone does.

MaximusPrime wrote:The skill level needed to paint a good looking model is really not much skill needed at all. Basecoat the model, wash the model, paint the detail (even without highlights) and the model will look great. Even then, you can make things even easier by using spray cans and army painter dips etc. Painting a decent tabletop quality army doesn't take much time either, maybe an hour per squad or less. I wasn't angry or sad, but just disapointed.

Those techniques produce a table quality army, not a good looking army.

Also, the reason more people don't attempt to paint their armies is because of comments like these

MaximusPrime wrote:*Aproximately 8 people with painted armies that looked... ...well... ...lets just say not so great!

Telling someone their stuff looks bad is a sure fire way to ensure them, and anyone in the vicinity with a similar painting skill level, never try to paint another model. If you're trying to encourage painted armies, stop being That fething Guy about the quality of the painting people do. Not everyone it going to be able to paint well, and really, playing an average, or below average, yet consistently painted force is going to be better than playing a bare force.

-Loki- wrote:If you're trying to encourage painted armies, stop being That fething Guy about the quality of the painting people do. Not everyone it going to be able to paint well, and really, playing an average, or below average, yet consistently painted force is going to be better than playing a bare force.

This. I've been debating getting into 40k for a while because I don't enjoy painting and I'm not good at it, nor do I have the time to devote to practicing just to get some random joe to be happy. I'll paint to a level I can, and if too many people complain I'll just write the whole thing off as a waste of time and sell my minis...

rigeld2 wrote:

-Loki- wrote:If you're trying to encourage painted armies, stop being That fething Guy about the quality of the painting people do. Not everyone it going to be able to paint well, and really, playing an average, or below average, yet consistently painted force is going to be better than playing a bare force.

This. I've been debating getting into 40k for a while because I don't enjoy painting and I'm not good at it, nor do I have the time to devote to practicing just to get some random joe to be happy. I'll paint to a level I can, and if too many people complain I'll just write the whole thing off as a waste of time and sell my minis...

Don't quit because someone gets pissy over your painting quality.

I mean, I can admit it right now - my painting isn't that hot. My Tyranids are painted extremely simply. I can do a batch of gaunts in a few days. I could do them better - I could do highlights on the red skin, I could paint the eyes, I could do some intermediary layers between the carapace and weapon highlights. But I'm teaching myself techniques on my gaunts so I can use them in a more refined way on my larger Tyranids.

However, they look fine on the table, and I enjoy painting them when I actually do some painting. I have a friend who spends far more time on his models, and they look utterly gorgeous. My brothers models look uttterly gorgoes. Because both have more experience painting than me and spend more time on it. However, when my army is on the table with one of theirs, it hardly matters, because while not the best, it's consistent and looks like a coherent army.

To the OP, don't be a dick when it comes to peoples painting. Some are going to have unpainted armies, or partially painted armies, or badly painted armies. it's their hobby as well as yours, and it's not their duty to have nice looking models for you to play against. If you happen to play against someone with an unpainted army, partially painted army, or badly painted army, don't get gakky over it. Strike up a (pleasant) conversation over it, and offer some advice on how to improve. You'll get better results than coming on Dakka and saying a bunch of people at your local tournament other than your friends had badly painted models.

I guess that it is just certain areas. I for one don't care if someone's army isn't painted or not done well. Heck I wasn't that great of painter when I started. I wouldn't even call myself decent. I just used a quick and simple technique to get my tau painted fast and simple with 3 colors.

At my LGS the majority of us have painted armies or partially painted armies because we have way too much time on our hands (Military town). Our main thing is that all the models are WYSIWYG or tell us what each model is in a friendly game before it starts. The only people that don't have their armies painted are those with Nids or Orks. I can understand why, I wouldn't want to paint all those models. My only gripe is you better be able to tell the difference between squads when you assault me with multiple squads.

Yeahh... Some people don't have the time to paint for hours on end let alone everyday. Why even bother getting caught up about it in the first place? I'm sure people have their reasons, best to keep to yourself IMO.

A few people in my area have fully painted armies, it's mostly 50/50, hell sometimes i even bring an unpainted unit or 2, to try out.
I may not be the best painter in the world, but i would prefer playing against a painted army then the wall of grey that can happen

2 completely (doesn't have to be high quality) armies fighting against each other on a table with some nice terrain on it is my favourite part of the hobby.

Also is it just me who feels a slight feeling of satisfaction when you have a fully painted army and you opponent doesn't? It's like, even if your opponent tables you in turn 2, in a way, you still feel like you've won lol.

Plus, we all know that fully painted armies perform better. You can't argue with that. It's science!

I completely agree with the OP.

I know that people don't like painting. I know that people might be shabby painters. I know that painting is only 1 aspect of the hobby .. but c'mon, unprimed models??? I maintain the 3 colour rule should be enforced.

All you need is to undercoat, drybrush the model and paint the base.

But hey, that's why I never play at GW stores. One gets tired of hearing 'this is my counts as ....'

I would imagine that most Australian Warhammer players would have little time to paint what with the three jobs they need to hold down in order to afford a box of marines every year.

Conandoodle wrote:I completely agree with the OP.

I know that people don't like painting. I know that people might be shabby painters. I know that painting is only 1 aspect of the hobby .. but c'mon, unprimed models??? I maintain the 3 colour rule should be enforced.

All you need is to undercoat, drybrush the model and paint the base.

But hey, that's why I never play at GW stores. One gets tired of hearing 'this is my counts as ....'

Thanks brother! I mean to imply the fact that half aren't even primed. Its nearly impossible to see what usit they actuall are if you are versing space marines or orks.

One funny example was when a Blood Angels player was Versing a Ultramarines player. They had a 30 minute argument over whose tactical squad was whose!

Positive encouragement is the best form of motivation and impetus that you can give to any player. Frankly, if I met a player whom considered my army 'shabbily painted' I would rather not give him the gift of a game. Painting your force up to personal taste and standards, to the best of one's ability, is just one facet of Warhammer 40,000. The other aspects include gaming, enjoyment, friendship and beer! Generally, be nice and enjoy the tabletop. Don't be a paint-dick.

It seems to me that the unprimed masses is a growing trend. I remember when GW shops used to be pretty strict with the 3 color minimum rule. I won't play against a gamer so slack that he has no intention of painting his figures. It's the casual, dimissive attitude I object to. Don't have time? BS. If you have one figure painted and your force is in progress, then cool, armies take time (been there, done that). It's the culture of instant gratification. I think a veteren gamers should think more carefully about the values that they are promoting through their participation in this hobby. Getting a well painted force takes months or even years, getting an army that I'll play against takes a can of primer, three minutes, and a shred of pride.

Don't nearly all tournaments have a '100% painted' rule? Or is that just in the South of the UK? Where I live, you can't go to a tournament without having all your models painted to a basic standard at least.

Basic standard = at least 3 colours + details + basing

MaximusPrime wrote:

Paul wrote:It is the same in most places.

However I think your being very un-fair. Yes, I do think that un-primed armys are unforgivable.

However, critisising people for there lack of painting skill or the fact that the army is only half ready is very unfair. Painting takes time, and to say that you can paint a squad in an hour is rubbish. I have been painting my DW force over the last few weeks. I have just been doing the bolt gun metal parts (weppon, Crux, wireing etc) and that is taking about 20mins per modal on its own.

I'm not the best, or fastest, painter in the world, but I do enjoy it and the last thing I would want to do is rush just to get on the table, or to not be able to play for six months because i'm painting.

I would not take an unfinished force to an event, but to play friendly games? Hell no.

I'm not critisizing them, I'm just saying that I was suprized to see only 1 army painted.

Almost everyone on Dakka has a decent looking army and I only saw one.


The main idea of this post was really to ask: Does this happen at your gaming area? Is it normal?

I'm am quite sure not almost everyone on Dakka has a decent looking army. I'd venture to guess there may be 50% of Dakka posters who do. I, for one, do not. I have lots of half-painted armies, and I do paint decently, but I find your attitude arrogant. I certainly cannot paint a full tactical squad in an hour to any even halfway decent looking standard. Painting a group of two or three miniatures, sometimes maybe four, to my own medium level, takes me up to 8 hours.

If you are not worried about how armies look or don't care for the painting and modelling aspect of the hobby then wh... Can everyone see what I'm getting at?

Sorry if this post was dead but i want to add my cents..

I am new to the hobby(6months) and i have to agree with the OP. I game from chermside which is like a hr drive from Mount gravvat and i am disapointed with their store quality to be honest. They have a huge store and huge gamming area, like 15 tables of 6"X4" tables.. Yet nearly everyone has not painted armies.

At 50$ a box, why the hell arnt you taking pride and looking after your plastic by painting it?

The hobby is quiet expensive, travelling is expensive(1.50$ a ltr for petrol), yet everyone cares just about winning a casual game? We sink so much money into this that to not be stuffed spending 6$ for a tub of paint is pathetic. Harsh statement, yes, and honestly the ones who dont have painted armies are letting this hobby down.

I personally dont care if a monkey can paint better, its the effort that has gone into it.

Ill award someone points in a tourney if all there army is painted, even if its sh$t because they took the time to take pride in their things.

Mount Gravvat doesnt have a policy of playing in their wolves den if your army isnt painted. Personally i think that when you sign up to be a member they should make you have a painted army. It is a privilage to play in a special area, so should your army be special.

Things like: i just assembed this box, the glue is setting thats why it isnt painted. Is perfectly acceptable excuses, but when the player has been playing for years and years ~ well, your fkn lazy and im not playing you.

if you cant slap some paint on a 3inch model, how the hell have you even read a 200+page rule book or your codex?*which takes way more time to do*

fist: it wasnt dead, 2 days may be an eternity on the interwebs, but here we wait 15 eternities to kill a thread (literally, we wait 30 days for those of you who dont understand my humor)
second i feel you contradict yourself, TheExilEdArcHitECt
, you say your agree with the OP, but then you add the bold type at the end.
third: my take: at least prime the models, if you dont have time for that how can you even have time to play...just my take on it, i personally wont play with an unpainted model, but idc if my opponent hasnt painted them yet.
im a modeller first, gamer second
finally: 3 inch model? even my giant warboss biker only stands (err, sits) 2 inches tall...and he towers over everything
my 2 cents, take it or (more likely) leave it

With the embargo and prices Aussies need to pay for GW product, i would be happy if people even play warhammer.
To be able to see them painted is just blessing of god.

I can understand where the thread starter is coming from. If you take the time to make your army look good, it can be disappointing to play against a grey horde. Specially, if these armies are all flavor of the month and you just know, that the same people will get another one of those when the next shiny new codex comes out.

On the other hand I have to agree with some of the posters, that some people just don't have the time or the skill to spend on a beautifully painted army. But they should at least give it some effort. If you use a colored primer, paint a few details and dip the whole mini, you should at least have something you won't be ashamed to pluck down onto the table.

Cheers,


IK-Painter