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I mean the amount of psykers is growing, the warp is becoming more turbulent and daemon incursions are happening more frequently so how would you cut off the warp (and all associated things) from reality (obviously meaning 40K reality)? The obvious answer is the C'tans pylons but how do they work and how would you make more of them? Could with that technology you make anti-warp weaponry? Would the Eldar approve of the plan? these sorts of questions will (hopefully) be answered or speculated here.




(sorry if something like this is already up I did look and couldn't find anything)

It's impossible. If anything was going to seriously threaten the gods' ability to mess with reality, they'd join forces to destroy it.

Durza wrote:It's impossible. If anything was going to seriously threaten the gods' ability to mess with reality, they'd join forces to destroy it.

The C'tan pylons are capable of severing the warp connection to reality however the network of them was never finished and only the ones on Cadia remain, these are speculated to be the source of the Cadian gate and appear to prevent the warp, so if enough of these pylons were deployed and guarded quickly enough then it might be the beginning of the end for chaos forces.

Warpfire wrote:

Durza wrote:It's impossible. If anything was going to seriously threaten the gods' ability to mess with reality, they'd join forces to destroy it.

The C'tan pylons are capable of severing the warp connection to reality however the network of them was never finished and only the ones on Cadia remain these are speculated to be the source of the Cadian gate and appear to prevent the warp, so if enough of these pylons were deployed and guarded quickly enough then it might be the beginning of the end for chaos forces.

It might be possible, but it's not going to happen. The gods would become aware of the attempt, decide to pause the Game for a second and flood wherever they were trying to construct the pylons with daemons.

Destroying real space. With no food the warp would just blink out of existence.

Unfortunately, I've read somewhere that the moment the network of pylons across the galaxy is completed and activated, every living creature will have their soul ripped out as the galaxy is disconnected from the warp - essentially, everyone becomes a pariah. 'Course, this is old codex material, so...

I believe that the warp is the physical manifestation of emotions, or is that just daemons? If that was true, then the only way to be rid of the warp is to kill every emotion- feeling being in the universe...

Tadashi wrote:Unfortunately, I've read somewhere that the moment the network of pylons across the galaxy is completed and activated, every living creature will have their soul ripped out as the galaxy is disconnected from the warp - essentially, everyone becomes a pariah. 'Course, this is old codex material, so...

This isn't old Codex material. The old Necron Codex only suggests the pylons will seal the area they cover off from the warp. Nothing is said about anyone having any souls ripped out or becoming a pariah.

Again I honestly don't know where you are getting some of this stuff from. It sounds like you are making it up or have remembered someone else's badly made up fanfiction. If you have evidence, cite and quote it directly. Otherwise all that is happening is the spreading of misinformation about the background.

The Warp is intrinsically tied to the darker side of human nature. Realspace is an allegory for the rest of human nature, discipline/honor and such. There is no way for Chaos to win, and no way for the Imperium to conquer Chaos, because they are merely two halves of human nature fighting each other.

If the Necrons manage to sever the Warp from realspace, they will have taken everyone's darker side away. Which causes horrific troubles when it actually happens, see the original Star Trek incident where Kirk got split into good and evil halves for the reasons why.

IGdude354 wrote:I believe that the warp is the physical manifestation of emotions, or is that just daemons? If that was true, then the only way to be rid of the warp is to kill every emotion- feeling being in the universe...

Not really the warp an alternate dimension and so it be impossible to barely possible to destroy however the daemons and the chaos gods are made of emotions. Also we don't have to kill every emotion-feeling being in the universe we just have to separate the warp from this one and stop the chaos gods from feeding off this universes emotions (which will happen with the separation).

Kinda forgetting something - namely the 4th Dimension - the element of Time.

ie: The Warp that is being described is the Warp as it is in the 42nd century.

Go backward for a moment, back before the death of the Emperor, back before there was even an Emperor, to when the Eldar where just young kids in a great big mysterious universe.

And what does the Fluff tell us the Warp is?

Calm. Absolutely Calm.

The Necrotyr (prior to the whole "let's stick ourselves in metal bodies' debacle) and the Old Ones were already feeding the Warp their collective emotions without much of a hiccup really. There's some speculation about that - mainly because the Old Ones were (once upon a time at least), supposed to be the Slann.

The Two combatants in the war of Heaven were two races not really given over or prone to feeling the depth of emotion that well Humans Eldar and Orks are susceptible to in this day and age. Ergo, a whole intergalactic battle could be waged without much of anything happening Warp wise.


Until the Old Ones created the Krok and the Eldar. At least "old fluff" wise, they were both created in order to make use of those very very strong emotions to construct weapons of sorts in the Warp - ie: the Eldar gods. Cue Necrotyr beatings till one wakes up the C'tan...


But the point im trying to make is simply this - there is nothing Inherently Evil about the Warp. It only reflects the collective emotions of Intelligent Species throughout the Universe.

Heck, it wasn't even until Humans popped up that the Chaos Gods started appearing. 3 of the 4 Gods are literally our fault.

What does that say about us i wonder?

ContemplativeSphinx wrote:

Heck, it wasn't even until Humans popped up that the Chaos Gods started appearing. 3 of the 4 Gods are literally our fault.

What does that say about us i wonder?

It means our gods are stronger than the others.

It also means that my theory that everything that's happening is just a big ...just as planned... by the Emperor, Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, and maybe Slaanesh (not so big on the last, all the others consider him/her/it an outcast).
Oh yeah!

What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Warpfire wrote:What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle ARE Human Gods.

Tadashi wrote:

Warpfire wrote:What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle ARE Human Gods.

yes, they are known as the chaos gods though. However that is my point that humans created them, hence if humans created them then humans can defeat them, not destroy them as when we do, given time, they will form again but if humans learned to control there thoughts and emotions better then they can create others to battle them.

It's impossible...
Slowly but surely Chaos is begin to grow.

You cannot stop us.

Slowly but surely, Chaos is begin to grow.

There is no way for Chaos to win

The ultimate victory of Chaos is inevitable. Eventually, every system of order descends into anarchy.

The Necrons do possess highly advanced anti-warp tech. The pylons are not the only way they can acheive this. Most Necron Tombworlds have massive Null Field matrices that protect them from the warp. The Necrons also possess other, much smaller devices that push back the influence of the warp in areas as large as star systems but not block it completely like the Null Fields do.

My source for that third part is the Word Bearers books. So, its cannon, the Necrons have even more Null Field tech that you might imagine.

Warpfire wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

Warpfire wrote:What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle ARE Human Gods.

yes, they are known as the chaos gods though. However that is my point that humans created them, hence if humans created them then humans can defeat them, not destroy them as when we do, given time, they will form again but if humans learned to control there thoughts and emotions better then they can create others to battle them.

They also fight among themselves already. They're not actually controlled rather they feed like a leech off of the emotions the only way to probably defeat them would be if every single living being with warp presence suddenly became emotionless. But, even then I believe a new form of chaos is begin to grow.

n0t_u wrote:

Warpfire wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

Warpfire wrote:What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle ARE Human Gods.

yes, they are known as the chaos gods though. However that is my point that humans created them, hence if humans created them then humans can defeat them, not destroy them as when we do, given time, they will form again but if humans learned to control there thoughts and emotions better then they can create others to battle them.

They also fight among themselves already. They're not actually controlled rather they feed like a leech off of the emotions the only way to probably defeat them would be if every single living being with warp presence suddenly became emotionless. But, even then I believe a new form of chaos is begin to grow.

The problem with Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle is that unlike the Eldar Gods, Humans cannot cooperate with their gods - they reflect the instability and enormous potential of the Human psyche. I would argue that the the Imperial Truth was NOT supposed to destroy the Chaos Powers, but rather to moderate them and transform them into true Human warp gods who would protect and guide Mankind alongside the Emperor and the Primarchs just as the Eldar Gods protected and guided the Eldar.

There can be no doubt: Chaos is begin to grow.

Psienesis wrote:

There is no way for Chaos to win

The ultimate victory of Chaos is inevitable. Eventually, every system of order descends into anarchy.

Anarchy is start to flourish?

In the 40K universe? Sure... every year, more planets revolt against the Imperium, more cults and radical factions appear on more planets, there's more unrest and more discontent... even if these rebellions and uprisings aren't successful, they're simply symptomatic of the entropy in the system.

Not terribly unlike certain real-life scenarios, really.

Lets assume we can stop the warp, would highly psychic races like the eldar (and regular psykers) agree?

Depends on what you mean by "stop the warp". The warp was once a calm and peaceful place, just a sort of primordial soup of energy. Currently, it's all jacked up.

If you mean "stop the warp" as in returning it to as it was before, then you'd be doing these sorts a favor.

if you mean "stop the warp" as in getting rid of it entirely/utterly cutting it off from realspace, there would no longer be psykers, and probably no longer be Eldar.

Tadashi wrote:

n0t_u wrote:

Warpfire wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

Warpfire wrote:What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle ARE Human Gods.

yes, they are known as the chaos gods though. However that is my point that humans created them, hence if humans created them then humans can defeat them, not destroy them as when we do, given time, they will form again but if humans learned to control there thoughts and emotions better then they can create others to battle them.

They also fight among themselves already. They're not actually controlled rather they feed like a leech off of the emotions the only way to probably defeat them would be if every single living being with warp presence suddenly became emotionless. But, even then I believe a new form of chaos is begin to grow.

The problem with Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle is that unlike the Eldar Gods, Humans cannot cooperate with their gods - they reflect the instability and enormous potential of the Human psyche. I would argue that the the Imperial Truth was NOT supposed to destroy the Chaos Powers, but rather to moderate them and transform them into true Human warp gods who would protect and guide Mankind alongside the Emperor and the Primarchs just as the Eldar Gods protected and guided the Eldar.

The three oldest gods aren't human gods. They took some power from humans, sure, but they're not formed only from humanity. Slaanesh is the only one of the four created by a single race.

Durza wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

n0t_u wrote:

Warpfire wrote:

Tadashi wrote:

Warpfire wrote:What if we learned to control our emotions and thoughts (somehow) and made chaos gods to battle the chaos gods? Since they are creatures of our thought and emotion.

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle ARE Human Gods.

yes, they are known as the chaos gods though. However that is my point that humans created them, hence if humans created them then humans can defeat them, not destroy them as when we do, given time, they will form again but if humans learned to control there thoughts and emotions better then they can create others to battle them.

They also fight among themselves already. They're not actually controlled rather they feed like a leech off of the emotions the only way to probably defeat them would be if every single living being with warp presence suddenly became emotionless. But, even then I believe a new form of chaos is begin to grow.

The problem with Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle is that unlike the Eldar Gods, Humans cannot cooperate with their gods - they reflect the instability and enormous potential of the Human psyche. I would argue that the the Imperial Truth was NOT supposed to destroy the Chaos Powers, but rather to moderate them and transform them into true Human warp gods who would protect and guide Mankind alongside the
Emperor and the Primarchs just as the Eldar Gods protected and guided the Eldar.

The three oldest gods aren't human gods. They took some power from humans, sure, but they're not formed only from humanity. Slaanesh is the only one of the four created by a single race.

They might as well be. They're so bound to the Human psyche that destroying Mankind would destroy them as well. Slaanesh might survive by continuing to drain the Eldar, but the elder three would pop like a bubble.

Durza wrote:The three oldest gods aren't human gods. They took some power from humans, sure, but they're not formed only from humanity. Slaanesh is the only one of the four created by a single race.

Incorrect. The Realms of Chaos are quite explicit that Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle are human gods. They formed from humans and were younger than the Emperor.

Slaanesh is an Eldar god that has since switched pantheons to become a human god, since now Slaanesh draws the bulk of its nourishment from humans, who are one of the most widespread species (behind Orks and Tyranids).

No one ever said however, not even the Realms of Chaos, that the other 3 gods had to be formed at their current level of power. Drawing power only from 1 species confined to 1 world originally, they would likely have been weak gods, and subsequently grew in power as humanity too grew and spread across the stars. Slaanesh is unique in that it formed and exploded into being at the top power level. Slaanesh is like the lottery winner, going from zero to multi-millionaire overnight.

Iracundus wrote:

Durza wrote:The three oldest gods aren't human gods. They took some power from humans, sure, but they're not formed only from humanity. Slaanesh is the only one of the four created by a single race.

Incorrect. The Realms of Chaos are quite explicit that Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle are human gods. They formed from humans and were younger than the Emperor.

Slaanesh is an Eldar god that has since switched pantheons to become a human god, since now Slaanesh draws the bulk of its nourishment from humans, who are one of the most widespread species (behind Orks and Tyranids).

No one ever said however, not even the Realms of Chaos, that the other 3 gods had to be formed at their current level of power. Drawing power only from 1 species confined to 1 world originally, they would likely have been weak gods, and subsequently grew in power as humanity too grew and spread across the stars. Slaanesh is unique in that it formed and exploded into being at the top power level. Slaanesh is like the lottery winner, going from zero to multi-millionaire overnight.

Basically, what you're saying is this:

Khorne, Tzeentch, and Nurgle initially formed during the Ancient War in Heaven, but did start maturing until the unstable psyche of the Humans began to feed them. However, this effectively made them into Human Gods, albeit unstable ones, both helpful and malignant at the same time. As Human Gods, they failed to achieve control of the warp until Mankind began to expand across the galaxy. The Fall would create Slaanesh, originally an Eldar God, but with Mankind ascendant, he/she/it became a Human God as well; the same event would secure not just Human ascendance over the galaxy, but of their gods' over the warp. Of course, not everyone was happy about this, especially Khorne and Nurgle.

Now, IMO, the Emperor sought to stabilize not just the Human psyche but their gods as well through the Imperial Truth. The gods knew about this, and 'helped' in the creation of the Primarchs. Big mistake on both their parts. The gods and the Emperor underestimated the chaotic nature of both the Human psyche and their gods' psyche. The result: catastrophe.

New Question: assuming Isha remains under Nurgle's control, and my theory regarding the Imperial Truth is correct and the Emperor somehow brings it back on track, can she, like Slaanesh, become a Human God?