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What are some bad match ups for blob guards? Is there anyway to prepare or counter these match ups besides not play blob guard army?

I think Chaos Space Marines could lash blobs out of cover into some nice templates for obliterators and defiler(s). Dual lash princes is what I run, not many competitive alternatives for HQ's in C:CSM nowadays..

Preparation to counter lash would be killing princes, making them main priority targets. IG has lots of weapons who wound them on 2's from loong range..

Really fast armies always give me a problem when I'm playing power blobs. Which more or less comes down to Dark Eldar and Blood Angels with their weird-ass flying dreadnoughts and jump packs.

Though you still have Move Move Move for faster running, it's still easy to get corralled by fast skimmers. This of course is what Autocannons are for, but you can't stop everything unless you get really lucky.

Fast close combat units with lots of attacks also make it tough for power blobs. I've had units of 15 men wiped out in one round by Wyches which is never fun. Of course, on the other hand it's bad for dedicated close combat units to wipe out an entire squad in one turn, because then you can light them up the next time. Fortunately blobs aren't super expensive but it still hurts to lose an entire unit one turn.

That's about all i can think of in terms of weaknesses. Normally power blobs can just grind down squads into dust, but you can't do that if your entire squads can't even get into combat range!

Kind Regards,
Vladsimpaler

The worst things for blobs are things that put down enough attacks in a single charge to be able to force the commissar to take an armor save. Also, things that can pick the commissar out of a squad. Also, armies that can systematically stop you from getting into close combat/melta range.

With power blobs, the things I've found the hardest to deal with is DE skimmer spam, a few blood angels builds, and, interestingly enough, eldar. Wraithlords are literally invincible to blobs in close combat, and fortuned wraithguard practically are, while mind war does really bad things to blobs and scorpions can shred a whole blob in a single go. Also, of course, jetbike armies.

Blood Angels, with their fast vehicles and jump infantry, will almost definitely get the charge on you turn 2. In such an instance I'd recommend switching to vehicles.
Otherwise the only real problem is if your opponent knows you're playing blob and specifically builds an anti-blob army. Blob guard can handle most take-all-comers lists.

The problem with power blobs is that they have a notorious habit of being assault cushions; in that one or more assault oriented squads can literally wipe away 1/2 or 3/4's your blob and you stay in combat long enough for him to wipe out your blob during your assault phase.

Most blood Angel Builds; Dark Eldar Wych Cult or Carnival of Flesh, or even Venom Spam. What can really tar pit your blobs are the Necron C'tan Shards; unaffected by strength three, all the darn things have to do is breathe on you for the entire game...

As above; Dark eldar are a pain, and blood angels can cause some problems.

Any horde army is also irritating, as it means the game will probably take a couple of years...

KplKeegan wrote:The problem with power blobs is that they have a notorious habit of being assault cushions; in that one or more assault oriented squads can literally wipe away 1/2 or 3/4's your blob and you stay in combat long enough for him to wipe out your blob during your assault phase.

Well, that's why you bring multiple blobs. Those khorne berzerkers do terrible damage to the blob, but it survives long enough to get bailed out by another blob. Berzerkers aren't so scary when they don't have the charge, and will get bogged down and attritioned to death just like anything else.

Plus, in REALLY bad cases, you always have the option to put a wound on the commissar on purpose, and break the squad to get shot at on your next turn.

Ailaros wrote:

KplKeegan wrote:The problem with power blobs is that they have a notorious habit of being assault cushions; in that one or more assault oriented squads can literally wipe away 1/2 or 3/4's your blob and you stay in combat long enough for him to wipe out your blob during your assault phase.

Berzerkers aren't so scary when they don't have the charge, and will get bogged down and attritioned to death just like anything else.

This is very important. Yes I know that in most cases it's not entirely possible (because of fleet/jump packs/whatever) but a Guard blob charging you is probably the worst thing that most armies can experience. Especially when you have Straken giving them Furious Charge.

Or if you shoot them with a battlecannon (or whatever) before they arrive.

Ailaros wrote:Or if you shoot them with a battlecannon (or whatever) before they arrive.

I do find that battle cannons to the face solve a lot of problems.

Every highly mobile force with good shock troops is superior to blob guard.

Blood angels, Battlewagon orks, Massorks if played well (although its rather drawish because they are not mobile...), Mass Grey hunters, Grey Knights, CSM with Lash and Oblits and Berzerkers.

I wouldnt count on Mech-DE too much. If the paperkites start dropping, there will be less quality inside. And shooting a whole blobguard out of 3+ cover with only venom weapons is dull work.
I also wouldnt count on Eldar. Wraithlords die to lascannons and missile launchers within one turn. Wraithguard is nearly impregnable but wont get past a single blob throughout the game, scorpions are good but lack staying power. (Having 3 units of scorpions of course is devastating for blob guard. But it is also tailoring against them). Dire Avengers stop being a danger when you are in cover.

Another interesting matchup would be tyranids. I think a good mixture between stealers and Tervigons will be a bad matchup too. As well as maybe Necrons using Spyders a ton of Scarabs and Wraiths and Destroyer Lords.

As far as I can see no-one has mentioned this specifically yet, which surprises me.

Grey Knight Purifier Spam.

Didnt I say Grey Knights?

Didn't see it there , well, picking on Purifiers specifically. Most Grey Knights builds are bad for blob IG, purifiers are the worst.

I was on the receiving end of necron cheese with initiative stolen on 4+, solar flares (I suffer night fighting) and av 13 ( front and side) skimmer spam now with power scything action. Admittidly I was totally unprepared for the level of my opponent. Theres always next time.

TheLionOfTheForest wrote:I was on the receiving end of necron cheese with initiative stolen on 4+, solar flares (I suffer night fighting) and av 13 ( front and side) skimmer spam now with power scything action. Admittidly I was totally unprepared for the level of my opponent. Theres always next time.

Why would a guard player want to go first anyway? Especially against an enemy that steals on a 4+, that's just asking to be spanked.

Ailaros wrote:Plus, in REALLY bad cases, you always have the option to put a wound on the commissar on purpose, and break the squad to get shot at on your next turn.

I did this in a game with a 30 man blob squad, and it worked out very well.

Bezerkers and Karn (sp) assaulted the squad and did ~20 wounds to them. I knew that he would wipe the rest on my turn, so I allocated a wound to the commissar. Without a commissar to ensure they stayed in the fight, the rest of the blob squad broke and ran, allowing me to show the bezerkers what 2 LRBTs and a demolisher can do to a squad. Even with a 3" consolidation, he could not spread out enough to prevent from losing his heavy hitter assault squad.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

-Nazdreg- wrote:Blood angels, Battlewagon orks, Mass Grey hunters, Grey Knights, CSM with Lash and Oblits and Berzerkers.

While some of these really I agree with, others I'm not so sure about.

BW orks are a problem for foot guard simply because of the sheer number of STR 4 attacks they can dish out. 20 sluggas can bring 80 attacks to the party when assaulting! Their hitting and wounding on 3s!

CSM with lash and oblits are nice, but are vulnerable to getting sniped by LC spam before getting into Lash range. I don't see many competitive players bringing bezerkers, but when they are dropped off via a LR, its a problem

Grey knights can really bring the numbers to do the job. Sure, force weapons are great when killing MEQ, but their not as much good vs guard. Purifiers aside, are they as big of a threat? Puriifer spam armies can be a big issue for blobs.

Mass grey hunter lists can be highly effective and hard to dislodge. 80 SWs are just hard for anyone to dislodge.

Testify wrote:

TheLionOfTheForest wrote:I was on the receiving end of necron cheese with initiative stolen on 4+, solar flares (I suffer night fighting) and av 13 ( front and side) skimmer spam now with power scything action. Admittidly I was totally unprepared for the level of my opponent. Theres always next time.

Why would a guard player want to go first anyway? Especially against an enemy that steals on a 4+, that's just asking to be spanked.

It was my first time fielding my guard army and my first time this edition facing Necrons. I really didn't know what I was doing. The only mitigating factor was that I at least had a decent list thanks to Dakka.

I would imagine you could be creative with counters.

True, any dread gets into cc then you have to get lucky with meltabombs, purifiers as well will just eat through you, also blood talons in particular are nasty.

I am imagining the blob sits in front to give cover saves for the heavy weapon squads. You only need a thin line in front with most of the blob sitting behind, thus cc and templates will not be as deadly.
Then heavy weapon teams are pretty cheap and deadly. DoW doesn't even affect them anymore. There should be some gunlanes on the board for you to abuse.

This is all more thinking aloud

Normal GK will outshoot Blob guard. The dreads have a good time sniping off the squishy HWS as well as razorbacks. The storm bolter in addition to selective charges with grenades (remember: T2, so 3s to hit, 2s to wound for GK or Deathcult assassins and a bad effect on blobs (LD2 for example...)) will do the job against the blobs. Maybe a vindicare to kill off the commissars...

-Nazdreg- wrote:Every highly mobile force with good shock troops is superior to blob guard.

On a per-unit basis, yes, there are individual units that can break individual blobs.

To say that their army is going to be better than the blobs isn't true. Guard can use multiple blobs to make up for the deficiencies of any one blob on the field, and guard armies can make use of a LOT of firepower options to reduce threatening CC units down to the point where they can no longer beat blobs on an individual basis.

If Battle Cannons are not to your liking a Psyker Battle Squad can drain the leadership to 2 before a blob charges. could be fun...

Dark Eldar are the only army I hate to play with blob guard. Everything else I feel like I can handle fairly easy provided I play correctly. Dark Eldar are so mobile, and have so many tricky abilities, not to mention my complete lack of knowledge of them. Every other army I know fairly well, but I can never remember their abilities. Thankfully I don't play them often, but when I do, it hurts.

Ailaros wrote:The worst things for blobs are things that put down enough attacks in a single charge to be able to force the commissar to take an armor save. Also, things that can pick the commissar out of a squad. Also, armies that can systematically stop you from getting into close combat/melta range.

With power blobs, the things I've found the hardest to deal with is DE skimmer spam, a few blood angels builds, and, interestingly enough, eldar. Wraithlords are literally invincible to blobs in close combat, and fortuned wraithguard practically are, while mind war does really bad things to blobs and scorpions can shred a whole blob in a single go. Also, of course, jetbike armies.

I thought purifier spam might be a worst case scenario. A single purifier with cleansing flame is going to take out about 1/3 of a blob, and it's in the same army as the vindicare.

MrMoustaffa wrote:Dark Eldar are the only army I hate to play with blob guard.

Honestly, DE and BA are the only two armies that have given me any guff. Thanfkully fast vehicles can be taken down by heavy weapons just as easily as slow ones...

schadenfreude wrote:I thought purifier spam might be a worst case scenario. A single purifier with cleansing flame is going to take out about 1/3 of a blob, and it's in the same army as the vindicare.

Yeah, vindicares stink. Mind war with a LOT more range. I seem to recall something about assassins not being able to join squads (like marbo's special rule). If that's true, then thankfully you only need a single S8+ shot to put him down.

Purifier spam is one of those things that, in theory, really sucks, but they're not actually going to be that bad of a deal if your opponent only brings one squad of them for you to focus fire on. Even with their cleansing flame, a 2 or 4-man purifier squad is still going to get drug down - assuming they weren't wiped out straight away by shooting first. Thankfully, GK units are all so expensive that I don't anticipate more than one squad in a balanced GK army. In any case, it's the hammerhand falchions and halberds that keep me up at night more than cleansing flame.

@Ailaros

Yep, assassins cannot join squads as they are no ICs.

On a per-unit basis, yes, there are individual units that can break individual blobs.

I am not talking about an individual unit. I am talking about an army based on that principle of the unit: Fast and heavy hitting. (i.e. 4 Battlewagons loaded up with boyz + some trukkboy squads, death company and jump pack marines, and so on)

Also terrain is important. On a table with only area terrain and no LOS blocking stuff that really interferes with shooting, Blobguard has advantageous terrain.
And given the size of the blob its not too hard to avoid a counter assault. If they are close together the second blob must be tied up in a second combat (important), if they are a bit apart, the consolidation move should be sufficient to get out of range.

Walking through blobs with a decent number of meq is not really that hard if you do it correctly. If the decent number of MEQ doesnt exist (i.e. Termies or mech-meq) it is far harder.

-Nazdreg- wrote:@Ailaros

Yep, assassins cannot join squads as they are no ICs.

On a per-unit basis, yes, there are individual units that can break individual blobs.

I am not talking about an individual unit. I am talking about an army based on that principle of the unit: Fast and heavy hitting. (i.e. 4 Battlewagons loaded up with boyz + some trukkboy squads, death company and jump pack marines, and so on)

Also terrain is important. On a table with only area terrain and no LOS blocking stuff that really interferes with shooting, Blobguard has advantageous terrain.
And given the size of the blob its not too hard to avoid a counter assault. If they are close together the second blob must be tied up in a second combat (important), if they are a bit apart, the consolidation move should be sufficient to get out of range.

Walking through blobs with a decent number of meq is not really that hard if you do it correctly. If the decent number of MEQ doesnt exist (i.e. Termies or mech-meq) it is far harder.

Yeah in my area all you see are mech marine armies and a couple of the all termie armies. I don't think I've seen hardly any "mass" marine armies except for one guy who plays Black templars. If anything, that's the majority of marine builds (mech heavy or elite/termie heavy) I rarely see large numbers of marines on the table, especially without mech support.

-Nazdreg- wrote:Walking through blobs with a decent number of meq is not really that hard if you do it correctly.

I'd like to see this.

There are a couple of power-armor units that can run a pretty rough ride for blobs, but I'd like to see a power armor army just steamroll a blob player without something like crazy bad luck for the blob player, or some other obvious outlying factor.

Ailaros wrote:

-Nazdreg- wrote:Walking through blobs with a decent number of meq is not really that hard if you do it correctly.

I'd like to see this.

There are a couple of power-armor units that can run a pretty rough ride for blobs, but I'd like to see a power armor army just steamroll a blob player without something like crazy bad luck for the blob player, or some other obvious outlying factor.

Drop-podding sternguard, vanguards assaulting after DS, Whirlwinds. Shooty marines can deal with blob guard just fine. The one thing that blobs have is their cover save, and Marines have plenty that can take that away.