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I created my own chapter, and plan on using a lot of Dreadnoughts in my lists. However, as a new chapter, they really don't have many mortally wounded to fill the Dreadnoughts. But what if they put servitors in there instead, or even a Power of the Machine Spirit-like AI into the Dreadnought? If a Land Raider can hold off an ork invasion for a while with just that keeping it going, then a Dreadnought shouldn't be all that much different.

Well they wouldn't be dreadnoughts if they weren't a space marine inside, you can call them weapon servitors, combat servitors, something like that, and use dread rules. I think changing the name of it is easier than changing the fluff behind a dreadnought.

Warning Incoming Crazy Idea From A Person Who Doesn't Know Much About Space Marines:
What about a recruit who survived the geneseed implant process but his body was badly damaged during the changes?

That is a good idea necrosis

Well, how old is your chapter Mcninja?

If its at least a century or two, I would't see why it could not.

Remember, dreadnought are sacred machine, only the most devoted and courageous member get to be entered into one.

Simple Servitor are definatly out of the question, there criminal and other low life, not worthy to be put into a machine like that. Machine spirits are too simple for a machine.

Necrossis idea is not bad, but putting an untrained initiate who's not even a brother does not have a pretty ring to it.

How bout this: some of your deadnought come from a different chapter. They have been transfered to your chapter for help and guidance. also If your chapter is at least 150-200 years old, I'm sure thats enought time to get those heroes.

Well, they were founded in the most recent founding. They also have an insane affinity for technology, and are such radicals in their ideas and how they build, enhance, and wield their technology (like building their own armor and breaking "sacred" things like Terminator armor down for parts to do so) that the AdMech was forced to watch over them and make sure they follow protocol and tradition. Not that they do, but now they have members of the AdMech keeping watch over them.

Think Salamanders+Mentor Legion, but every other Brother is a Techmarine in terms of technological expertise. For now, I'm running them as a normal Vanilla SM army (with 4 or 5 dreads), but I'm writing up a sort of mini-dex for them.

Surely if they really wanted to they could just plug in a regular marine?
I mean, it would seem that in the course of normal battles marines are injured almost beyond saving...
It doesn't have to be anyone massively heroic, some marines are saved because they have lived so long and losing their experience would be a tragedy.

Necrosis wrote:Warning Incoming Crazy Idea From A Person Who Doesn't Know Much About Space Marines:
What about a recruit who survived the geneseed implant process but his body was badly damaged during the changes?

I like that idea.

motyak wrote:Well they wouldn't be dreadnoughts if they weren't a space marine inside, you can call them weapon servitors, combat servitors, something like that, and use dread rules. I think changing the name of it is easier than changing the fluff behind a dreadnought.

Well, not really. All that's inside Dreadnoughts are space marines hooked up to computers. You can replace the SM with something else, such as Necrosis suggested, or replace the SM with more computers. A Dreadnought isn't defined by the fact that there's a critically injured SM inside of it, just like Power Armor isn't defined by the fact that there's a person wearing it. It's just a suit of armor, and a Dreadnought Chassis is a big suit of armor.

Dreadnoughts are the symbiotic fusion between man and machine.
The difference between them and servitors are that servitors are not truly alive anymore.
They have been lobotomised whereas a dreadnought still retains thought.

That's how they usually are. Sure, Servitors don't retain independent thought, but if all you're using them for is a weapons platform (as servitors are sometimes used for), then there really isn't a difference. One is just bigger and has better guns.

Dreadnoughts are only as good as what's put inside of them. It doesn't matter if its a wounded marine or a modified combat servitor, it does the same job.

I like where your going with this, but I have to admit, this sounds alot like the Adeptus Mechanicus codex that more than a few people have made themselves.

What if they use Dreadknight-esq battle frames and just count them as Dreadnoughts on the tabletop.

McNinja wrote:That's how they usually are. Sure, Servitors don't retain independent thought, but if all you're using them for is a weapons platform (as servitors are sometimes used for), then there really isn't a difference. One is just bigger and has better guns.

Dreadnoughts are only as good as what's put inside of them. It doesn't matter if its a wounded marine or a modified combat servitor, it does the same job.

Dreadnoughts aren't just a weapons platform though...
They are veteran warriors holding centuries of accumulated knowledge.
They advise the chapter council and teach the younger members.
If all you want is a weapons platform in dreadnought armour then that's that but your chapter wouldn't really have the same respect for dreadnoughts that other chapters do...

sub-zero wrote:I like where your going with this, but I have to admit, this sounds alot like the Adeptus Mechanicus codex that more than a few people have made themselves.

Really? Well, great minds think alike

purplefood wrote:

McNinja wrote:That's how they usually are. Sure, Servitors don't retain independent thought, but if all you're using them for is a weapons platform (as servitors are sometimes used for), then there really isn't a difference. One is just bigger and has better guns.

Dreadnoughts are only as good as what's put inside of them. It doesn't matter if its a wounded marine or a modified combat servitor, it does the same job.

Dreadnoughts aren't just a weapons platform though...
They are veteran warriors holding centuries of accumulated knowledge.
They advise the chapter council and teach the younger members.
If all you want is a weapons platform in dreadnought armour then that's that but your chapter wouldn't really have the same respect for dreadnoughts that other chapters do...

Not all Dreadnought have to be wise old ancients, and not all have to be weapon platforms. If there is a fellow battle-brother interred inside a Dreadnought, they respect the man inside. They don't respect the walking tank he's in, just him. If a Servitor is piloting a Dreadnought, there's nothing really to respect other than it as a tool to be used in battle, as it will follow orders to the letter.

You could put a wounded marine in anything and still be able to learn from him; a tank, a ship, or even just put him into a nutrient-water-filled tank and hook his brain up to the speakers. Dreadnoughts are simply the usual suspects because they allow the marine to get back into the fighting.

Are you playing to use the standard Dreadnaught model or something else and simply use it as a DN on table? I really like the failed Geneseed idea myself, but do not think I would use the common models for them, even if they acted the same on table.

I am. I found the AoBR models for cheapsies, so I'll be buying a couple of those.

Would Dreadknight models work as well? Or something else?

dreadknight (IMO) are ugly and a bit to pricy. The AoBR ones are cheap i agree, you might could mod them to make em look different or if your not opposed to non GW Models, something like the Incursion Ape Grunts might be modded with SM or DK bits to give a nice look.

Dreadnoughts are expensive, prized, valuable and revered, but technically they are just specialized suits of armour; albeit suits of armour you don't take off until you die. There's a reason Terminator armour is also known as Tactical Dreadnought Armour (TDA) after all.

This being said, because they are rare and prized artefacts, it's highly unlikely that anyone other than the best and most skilled —yet mortally wounded— individuals would be interred in one.

A 200 year old chapter, especially a technophilic one, would probably have a few Dreadnoughts running around and, unless they haven't been fighting at all, I'm sure they'd have a few near fatal veterans to plonk in them.

Now a techmarine Dreadnought would be an interesting idea... mega servo harness?

DoW

DogOfWar wrote:Now a techmarine Dreadnought would be an interesting idea... mega servo harness?

When you said that, this crazy idea entered my head, apothecary dreadnought!

You'd need to be both apothecary AND techmarine dread. Crack him open, fix him up, glue him shut. Would also be a funny sight, a dread kneeling over another with tiny scalpels and stuff doing precise operations.

Dreadnaughts are mortally-wounded war heroes, yes, but there's no rule that says new Chapters can't have mortally-wounded war heroes. Who's to say that your...I don't know, Imperial Fists successor chapter wasn't founded by a Captain given his own Chapter after some grand heroic campaign, and his old mentor's Dreadnaught and the Dreadnaughts of a couple of his comrades wounded in that campaign? It's not unheard-of for Chapters to be founded with older Space Marines from their parent Chapter as the initial officers/mentors/trainers, there's no reason that's necessarily limited to non-Dreadnaught Marines.

An apothecary dreadnought??? could you imagine them trying to extract gene-seed from his brothers?

blazinpsycho&typhooni wrote:An apothecary dreadnought??? could you imagine them trying to extract gene-seed from his brothers?

I imagine he wouldn't have too much trouble getting to the geneseed... although it would probably be a hell of a mess to clean up.

DoW

blazinpsycho&typhooni wrote:An apothecary dreadnought??? could you imagine them trying to extract gene-seed from his brothers?

Could be worse, prostate exam would be the stuff of horror. Though a walking hospital that kills people can sure be useful in war, i mean imagine all the medical equipment that this thing can carry.

I would think that if your going for an adeptus mechanicus flavor, then the SOB penitent engines might be worth a look.

Or this?

http://www.warpathgames.com/wholesale/warpath.php?m=detail&p=78723

DoW

I prefer something with more ranged weaponry.

But my chapter really does not like the AdMech, their taboos, their traditions, how they regard technology, etc.

I'd go with something other than a dreadnought chassis...
Or maybe convert the dreadnought chassis to show the difference...

DogOfWar wrote:Or this?

http://www.warpathgames.com/wholesale/warpath.php?m=detail&p=78723

DoW

WOW That model even has the cogs molded into it!

The warpath mini is cool and all, but Not really what the OP is after and they are 50 bucks a pop. He has already said he can get some dreads cheap

If he can mod them they would work well Some of the AT-43 miniatures might work as well. I really think it depends upon the story and look you want to go with