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Well, I've seen at lot of England disasters and managers in my time: Euro 88, Euro 92, failure to qualify for USA 94, the shambles that was Glenn Hoddle, and the bigger disaster that was Steve Maclaren. As I've said before, my user name is drawn from something Graham Taylor said during his infamous reign as England manager. As you can imagine, news that Roy Hodgson is on the verge of being appointed fills me with dread. Not because he's the wrong choice (I think he's a good choice) but because already the backlash against him from fans and the papers has already begun, and he hasn't even gor the job yet!!

To my mind, the euros this summer was always going to be mission impossible, what with Germany and Spain dominating world football, and the fact that we have a tough group. Roy's appointment is going to fill the nation with a collective mood of despair. What does everybody else think of this appointment?

Finally, the American thing in the title is because this thread will most likely descended into how bad England are, and a collective round of self-loathing. Our cousins across the Atlantic don't need this, because they won't be at Euro 2014. In other words, it's for your own good!!

PS does this thread make sense? I've had a few drinks

no..... English are good.

Nurgle wrote:no..... English are good.

As my Ex is so fond of saying 'Your England is not good'
England is gonna lose anyway though perhaps not quite as badly as various other times...

Welsh Independance!!! Viet-taff unite.

Hell, there is no manager that England could have hired that could produce the results that the English press and fans seem to think they deserve. The majority of quality players in the EPL are foreign and very few English players are willing and/or able to make in roads out of Great Britain. The money being spent in English soccer is counter productive to growing and improving the local talent. Oddly, America had the same issue w/ the old NISL, our owners spent too much money on foreign talent in order to produce quality soccer and were unable to keep up with the inflationary spiral the league started. When MLS came around w/ the minimal player budget limits it forced players that wanted more money to be better players to entice European clubs to buy them.

In short, England fans and FA to come to grips with the fact that just because the EPL is great, it isn't helping your domestic players. Which is more important, club or country?

*Football
You're right obviously.
Though the league makes more money for people here than the national side does AFAIK...

mwnciboo wrote:Welsh Independance!!! Viet-taff unite.

Nah.

MrDwhitey wrote:

mwnciboo wrote:Welsh Independance!!! Viet-taff unite.

Nah.

Welsh independence is a silly idea...
Even sillier than Scottish independence...

What I never get is that England always up themselves so much they genuinely believe they can win the euro/world cup hands down then cry as their team of individually good players break down on the field. we scots do the same but it's more tongue in cheek than all out seriousness.

Roy getting the England job will hurt WBA and he'll probably won't have a job after Euro 2012 for the reason above. Let psycho do it for you first

purplefood wrote:

MrDwhitey wrote:

mwnciboo wrote:Welsh Independance!!! Viet-taff unite.

Nah.

Welsh independence is a silly idea...
Even sillier than Scottish independence...

Yeah, is it as silly as England winning Euro 2012? every few years this happens and everytime England are 'meh. Last good performance was Italy 90 and that was 22 years ago. It's great to watch England get all excited, especially the press and media. Then afterwards rather than admit England aren't good enough it's "SACK THE MANAGER, IT'S ALL HIS FAULT, OUR PLAYERS ARE GREAT!".

Bit like the Rugby, Grand Slam anyone?

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:What I never get is that England always up themselves so much they genuinely believe they can win the euro/world cup hands down then cry as their team of individually good players break down on the field. we scots do the same but it's more tongue in cheek than all out seriousness.

Roy getting the England job will hurt WBA and he'll probably won't have a job after Euro 2012 for the reason above. Let psycho do it for you first

Everyone says this.
Every time England is in a big international match and everyone still gets excited...
Then they always lose.
It's like the 'Come on Tim' woman...

"Come'on Tim" is brilliant, it's superbly funny when people shout it at Andy Murray and it always makes me smile. The champions of Middle England, "Tennis Mom's". Personally I like Cricket (long time Glamorgan Dragons fan) but cannot stand tennis.

mwnciboo wrote:"Come'on Tim" is brilliant, it's superbly funny when people shout it at Andy Murray and it always makes me smile. The champions of Middle England, "Tennis Mom's". Personally I like Cricket (long time Glamorgan Dragons fan) but cannot stand tennis.

People shout it at Murray?
That has made my day...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

mwnciboo wrote:

purplefood wrote:

MrDwhitey wrote:

mwnciboo wrote:Welsh Independance!!! Viet-taff unite.

Nah.

Welsh independence is a silly idea...
Even sillier than Scottish independence...

Yeah, is it as silly as England winning Euro 2012? every few years this happens and everytime England are 'meh. Last good performance was Italy 90 and that was 22 years ago. It's great to watch England get all excited, especially the press and media. Then afterwards rather than admit England aren't good enough it's "SACK THE MANAGER, IT'S ALL HIS FAULT, OUR PLAYERS ARE GREAT!".

Bit like the Rugby, Grand Slam anyone?

I just get around it by supporting other teams...
Though England are really inconsistent in their games most sports i can think of

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/jun/23/andy-murray-wimbledon-tim-henman

I couldn't help myself, if I went to wimbledon, I would so shout it.

EDIT - I might possibly shout "Go on PIGS" for Scott Mills on Radio One.

mwnciboo wrote:http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/jun/23/andy-murray-wimbledon-tim-henman

I couldn't help myself, if I went to wimbledon, I would so shout it.

I'll go with you...
Though the Guardian seems pretty annoyed at people doing it...

Well the Guardian can "Suck on mah plums".

Being Puerile is not illegal.

back on Topic, it will be one long disappointment, with only TESCO, SAINSBURY'S and ASDA shifting double the normal amount of Carlsberg, Carling and BBQ stuff. Then everyone will shift back to the Olympics.

'Woy' is completely and utterly the wrong choice (lovely bloke thou he is)

As an England fan, I want 'arry! At international level these players do not need coaching, not in the traditional sense. What they need, and what Fabio could never achieve, is man management and general motivation....
Just look at what Di Matteo had done for Torres. Couldn't hit a barn door with a banjo for months and now he's banging them in like nobody's business!

As a Blackburn fan I respect 'Woy' as a coach but as a motivator? Hell no, no no no

The FA are making the wrong move here, and WBA will miss him for sure....

Here's hoping that even if everything goes badly for England France will still provide the entertainment that they did at the World Cup

I just want to see Mario Balotelli, he's one amazing loose cannon. You never know what's going to happen but it's always entertaining. The man blew up his own bathroom by letting off a Firework in there. He's Keith Moon for the 21st Century.

Now that would be awesome! Sadly, without Raymond 'leading' them this time, I fear it could be a very different French team that turns up....


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Mario is my new hero! Having a fireworks display in your bathroom?! Driving around dressed in a blue Santas outfit handing out wedges of cash?!

Absolute legend!....

purplefood wrote:

Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:What I never get is that England always up themselves so much they genuinely believe they can win the euro/world cup hands down then cry as their team of individually good players break down on the field. we scots do the same but it's more tongue in cheek than all out seriousness.

Roy getting the England job will hurt WBA and he'll probably won't have a job after Euro 2012 for the reason above. Let psycho do it for you first

Everyone says this.
Every time England is in a big international match and everyone still gets excited...
Then they always lose.
It's like the 'Come on Tim' woman...

Who exactly is this "everyone" you speak of?

What the morons in The Sun write to sell papers to chavs, does not in any way mean that "England" think their team/competitors are any good.

You dont recall the thread I made a few years back at the last tournament? Nobody said England would do any better than the quarter finals, and I think only one guy said that!

Not a single English adult with more than a handful of brain cells actually sits there and goes "Yeah! England are awesome, totally win the world cup!" Basically, "The English" that our Welsh and Scottish neighbours like to mock, aren't half as stupid as you like to think they are, and I don't know a single bloke who actually thinks they way you say they do. Literally every guy at work I have asked has said "England have no chance" and I concur.

Seriously, go find me an actual Englishman who thinks England are going to win anything in football. This nonsense that the English are "arrogant" and think they are going to win anything is horse gak that our bitter whinging neighbours like to spout to try and give themselves a superiority complex. The English being the biggest nation display far less idiotic flag waving patriotism that the Scots and Welsh, so I think they are far more likely to say "We are gak at X" than the Jocks or the Welsh are.

Do i actually have to find you someone or are you fine just ranting?
Because i'm fine with the ranting...
I didn't say people thought England would win.
Just that people get excited.
Though there is a guy down the street from me who constantly think England is gonna win...

mattyrm wrote:Stuff

I'd agree - we may as well put out the under 5's team. At least they wil be better behaved on and off the pitch - and a hell of a lot cheaper since we would not have to pay them anything... except maybe a few plates of half time orange slices for the first round

I'd also agree with SPARKEYG about the wages being counter productive to getting quality players through the grass roots system.

There's a lot of nonsense in this thread, for example 'England never win any matches'. What are you smoking, and more importantly, are you prepared to share it?

England are one of the highest performing teams in world football - they consistently reach the final stages of competitions, and their win record is better than the vast majority of countries. Now that doesn't mean we can go into any competition expecting to win at a canter, but we can definitely expect to make it to the knockout stages and further, which is more than most countries - especially our Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish pals, all of whom regularly struggle to qualify at all.

England and the UK are better at sports than most countries. I don't get why we talk ourselves down so much.


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SPARKEYG wrote:
In short, England fans and FA to come to grips with the fact that just because the EPL is great, it isn't helping your domestic players.

I couldn't agree less. English players are holding their own in teams packed with quality internationals, be it Hart, Milner, Johnson and Richards at Man City, Welbeck, Ferdinand and Carrick at Man Utd, Gerrard and Downing at Liverpool, or Terry, Lampard, Cole and Sturridge at Chelsea. I mean, these are teams with world-class player in them. It isn't good English players that's the problem, it's finding a good National team coaching set-up.

For some reason, we seem to struggle with that. I'm inclined to blame the FA.

Albatross wrote:There's a lot of nonsense in this thread, for example 'England never win any matches'. What are you smoking, and more importantly, are you prepared to share it?

England are one of the highest performing teams in world football .

Well how about when they didn't qualify ? Like 1994 World Cup or 2008 European Championship. England are reasonable, they are not contenders, they are also rans.

In the entire history of the World Cup Competition, they Have been in the Final just once, Won just once, and reached the Semi finals twice. So they are much more of an also ran. Quarter - Finals are the best to hope for, they are not in the top 5 but are in the top 10.

As long as England looses to Germany this year, I don't care who the coach is.

Albatross wrote:

SPARKEYG wrote:
In short, England fans and FA to come to grips with the fact that just because the EPL is great, it isn't helping your domestic players.

I couldn't agree less. English players are holding their own in teams packed with quality internationals, be it Hart, Milner, Johnson and Richards at Man City, Welbeck, Ferdinand and Carrick at Man Utd, Gerrard and Downing at Liverpool, or Terry, Lampard, Cole and Sturridge at Chelsea. I mean, these are teams with world-class player in them. It isn't good English players that's the problem, it's finding a good National team coaching set-up.

For some reason, we seem to struggle with that. I'm inclined to blame the FA.

I agree with this except the part where you say John Terry is good. He's one player I think should be dropped completely from the England squad. He has no pace and gets completely ripped to shreds on the world stage. You only have to watch our game against Germany in the last world cup to see it. They scored most of their goals by kicking it long (even from a goal kick ) and the striker just ran past our defenders before tapping it into the net. We were missing Ferdinand badly in that tournament.

Our team lugs around a lot of dead weight players just because they have been in it for ages and because the fans would throw a hissy fit if they were dropped. We need to drop a lot of the old guard and bring up new young players, with a few older players to provide experience whilst the younger ones find their feet. May lead to short term losses but in the long run it would be better to get them used to international play sooner rather than later, in my opinion.

However one old player I would like to see back for one last time is Paul Scholes. He may be 37 but damn can he still play.

Long term planning for ultimate victory, but short term defeat? Do you know nothing about football? A manager, upon appointment after the last guy is fired because the team lost a match, must immediately have results! And do everything fans want him to!

Albatross wrote:
England are one of the highest performing teams in world football - they consistently reach the final stages of competitions, and their win record is better than the vast majority of countries. Now that doesn't mean we can go into any competition expecting to win at a canter, but we can definitely expect to make it to the knockout stages and further, which is more than most countries - especially our Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish pals, all of whom regularly struggle to qualify at all.
.

Just because the pool system doesn't totally put you with easier teams that you should be beating.

d-usa wrote:As long as England looses to Germany this year, I don't care who the coach is.

Same here

Off topic: But why enter a tournament if you don't believe you can win it? Yes, the media big up the chances of England to sell papers / generate advertising revenues and the fans latch on to this as it has a positive effect psychologically. During a tournament, the country, England, not UK, is on a high for a few weeks, the economy also picks up as this flows over the retail sector. Even when the team invariably implode and get knocked out, the feel good factor continues as the public latch on to their next favourite (usually any one other than the Germans or French...) Obviously this doesn't apply to the other 'home' nations, but then they haven't qualified in recent history and will always be anti-England which is a shame - I'm English but have Scottish heritage and actually support the Scottish rugby team over England, but England Football over Scotland, don't ask why as I don't really know...

On topic: Don't really care who manages England, glad that it's not 'Arry as I'd hate to see his reputation damaged - The job is a poisoned chalice, although I think Woy may get away with it as he's a 'nice' guy and the media like him, so let's say Yes to him. Psycho, as much as I like the guy, was never a contender... TBH, I'd rather see my team (West Ham) win the Championship play-offs this year than England win the Euros.