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So I've been thinking about getting into warmahordes (mainly Hordes) and I am tempted to start with the circle vs legion battle pack when it comes out. However, I still need some convincing. I should probably give you some of my pro's and con's to begin.

Pro's:
1) The models look great
2) I hear it is a good/balanced game
3) My favorite looking faction is Circle (wouldn't mind adding Kromac, druids +UA, blackclad wayfarer, shifting stones +UA, and possibly some other models)
4) The box comes with a second faction to let other friends try it out. Legion also happens to be one of my other favorite looking factions (eThagrosh )

Con's:
1) I definitely prefer plastic to metal (which the new box would be good, but the rest would have to wait.
2) I really don't play too often and the closest lgs is a GW.
3) Not sure how to play, but the new box comes with rules
4) Not sure if the other models I like in Circle would match with both warlocks

So what do you guys like about Circle of Orboros? What do you like about Legion? I guess I am looking for advice/support to pick up the Circle/Legion set when it comes out. Would this be a good starting point for me?

Con #3 The basics of the game is explained quite well in the quick start rules.
Warmachine
http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/the-game
Hordes
http://privateerpress.com/hordes/the-game

They have a number of units included so to play all you need is some dice, a ruler, pen & paper and a couple of card circles to represent the models.

I'll try to address your cons as best as I can.

1)The PP metals are usually quite good quality and almost always have a great fit. Some of the oldest ones are not that good, but many of them have already been resculpted. If you are apprehensive about a model check it's release date and if it was made after 2006/2007 it's probably a good model. You may need to work on some of your modeling skills to accommodate metal models though.
It is also worth noting PP use a different kind of plastic than you are probably used to. I believe it is a PVC rather than styrene. This means plastic glue won't work and it will have a slightly different feel.
2) This is probably going to be your biggest hurdle. I don't think there is a good fix to this short of moving, making a game room, or starting your own store. Otherwise you'll have to improvise at home. At least the table only needs t be 4'x4'.
3)As noted above there are quickstart rules in the link with which you can proxy a game or two and both those starter rules and the full rules will be printed in the starter set.
4)Druids, blackclad, and shifting stones are circle staples and generally work with every warlock. They will make a terrific expansion.

Just do it. All the cool kids are doing it now.

If you are a 40k or WFB player there is 1 thing I felt was missing, dynamic dreadnaught vs dreadnaught combat, dread vs monstrous creatures, or overall a dynamic fight when 2 big nasties go toe to toe.

In 40K it looks like this. I have better initiative, I roll, I chip off your wounds.

In WMHD it looks like this. During the owners action phase they brawl it out. Its not just shoot, and punch. There are real options, like shooting, headlocks, arm locks, 1 or 2 hand throws. Then if models collide after a throw there is damage. Models have multiple attacks you roll for independently. It feels more like what you'd expect.. and there's a LOT of it. Big nasties don't just have 3-4 wounds, they have a massive grid, where you can take lots of damage slowly or quickly.

Then you get into the whole focus / fury aspect where you can boost for more damage, a higher likelihood of hitting, and fun results. Its faster. The board is smaller, and scenariors force you to the middle. So your not playing 1 guy sitting at a table edge shooting and the other guy running. In Scenarior play if you do not move into a pre-determined square in the middle you lose. It is a fast, more balanced rules set, and violent game.

The models are moving towards plastic. Then new models go together more simply, and you do not need many models in a upper limit game. Oh and tournments if you decide to goto them... even on the huge scale they tend to be $10. The ones that are $30 at coventions... they tend to have 4-5 tournments over 2 days.

All the metal models are well put together and go together quite nicely(except for the Harbinger, that stupid flag )

Guessing by your Sig. Your from GW games.

Pro's
Rules mean what they say

Every army is competetive (not necessarily every caster but more then half for each faction)

Cheaper to get into and try.. Start with a battlebox army for like $50 find somone to play a battlebox game with and see if you like it.

Cons.. Easy to get sucked into a faction.. yea i can do 2x 25 pts lists and call it good.. but im on my way to owning the entire Menoth Range.

Spyder68 wrote:Guessing by your Sig. Your from GW games.

Pro's
Rules mean what they say

Every army is competetive (not necessarily every caster but more then half for each faction)

Cheaper to get into and try.. Start with a battlebox army for like $50 find somone to play a battlebox game with and see if you like it.

Cons.. Easy to get sucked into a faction.. yea i can do 2x 25 pts lists and call it good.. but im on my way to owning the entire Menoth Range.

I'll second that. Almost done with my Skorne and I keep looking at the units I don't have and it keeps nagging at me "oh I could do this and this with that unit...maybe I should splurge a little"

NO!!! RUN WHILE THERE'S STILL TIME!! IT WILL SUCK YOU IN!!!


but srsly, it will suck you in and you will own 90% of the models for whatever army you pick. And then you will start another army...or three...

Thanks for the replies.

It sounds like a fun, dynamic, and engaging game. I got into GW through Necromunda and really haven't found any of the other GW games to keep me as engaged and entertained as Necromunda did. I'm hoping this might. I am a little reluctant to get "sucked into another game", but figure I am going to give it a try anyway. The nice thing is that my next favorite looking faction would be legion.

Does anyone know when the Hordes 2-player battlegroup box will be available? I think I am going to break down and pick that up first. I have a small group of friends that try to get together a couple of times a month when life and families allow us to. This might be a perfect addition to our other RPG's and other gaming we try. I will try to control my urges (shouldn't be too hard since the closest stores to buy W/H would be at least an hour drive) and wait for more plastics to be released. How often does PP put out new plastics?

Thanks again.

The hordes starter will be out some time in September.

PP release new models every month, but which ones are plastic is sporadic. You probably won't have to deal with a whole lot of metal units as a legion player since you can run mostly beasts, but don't restrict yourself entirely to plastic. for the rest of the year they will probably focus on finishing hordes domination releases and colossals/gargantuans. I think there is also one khador plastic kit from wrath that has not been given a release date yet. Generally releases are sporadic, but more plastic seems to be coming than it used to.

boogeyman wrote:4) Not sure if the other models I like in Circle would match with both warlocks

That's one of the things I like so much about the game. If you like a specific unit or a caster there is a good chance that there are several other models who fall into the same category. Like all the constructs in Orboros for example.

boogeyman wrote:So what do you guys like about Circle of Orboros? What do you like about Legion? I guess I am looking for advice/support to pick up the Circle/Legion set when it comes out. Would this be a good starting point for me?

Play a few games with the starter box and then order the faction book and pick what you like.

This may be a variation based on where you play, but another con worth noting (for me anyway) is that the community for PP games is much less friendly. That isn't to say they aren't nice players, but it is a very aggressive game and PP, as much as I like their models and games, has a whole ridiculous machismo with how to play it that it creates hard competitive atmospheres, even in casual games.

That might be something you want, but it doesn't suit me for regular games.

I have never found that to be the case, in my own community. I also find there are less "hairy" rules as everything tends to be very well defined with regular FAQ and errata.

curran12 wrote:This may be a variation based on where you play, but another con worth noting (for me anyway) is that the community for PP games is much less friendly. That isn't to say they aren't nice players, but it is a very aggressive game and PP, as much as I like their models and games, has a whole ridiculous machismo with how to play it that it creates hard competitive atmospheres, even in casual games.

That might be something you want, but it doesn't suit me for regular games.

Hmm I haven't seen that in my experiences with the game. it might be an unfortunate local phenomena. I don't blame you for not being happy with that kind of community though.

Dais wrote:
Hmm I haven't seen that in my experiences with the game. it might be an unfortunate local phenomena. I don't blame you for not being happy with that kind of community though.

I'll freely admit that this may be a local thing, and it is entirely based on personal experience, but yeah, it does seem like the PP community where I am is generally more...

Hmm, I'm struggling for the right word here. "Hostile" makes it sound like they are really unpleasant and hunt down new players, and the community is definitely not that. It is more like it is a more cutthroat community, but even I'm not happy with that term. I can still enjoy the games, but because of the nature of WM/H and the nature of the playerbase here, the games are always very hardcore and tough as nails to be more casual with. There's very little banter, very little BSing for a laugh while a game happens, it is all very intense. Now don't get me wrong, I like intense games as much as anyone else, I'm no cupcake or anything but when I pop down to the FLGS that does the most PP stuff, I do like to expect a good time.

Also, and this is another trait of the community that rubs me the wrong way, the community tends to be utterly dismissive of any game other than WM/H. Now I'm not gonna get into the whole GW vs PP vs Infinity claptrap here, but when I am ridiculed for wanting to play other games, that is blah.

That is blah, indeed. I think that sort of elitism stems from being in your current game because you were really pissed off at the game you started at.

Da Boss wrote:That is blah, indeed. I think that sort of elitism stems from being in your current game because you were really pissed off at the game you started at.

Yeah, sort of a bad ex-girlfriend syndrome. And I hate to bring that to a thread for someone wanting to get into WM/H because it is a great game. But so is Fantasy and 40k. And so is Infinity. They're all fun, enjoy that aspect, don't waste time tearing down the others.

I think it is an issue with gamers as a whole; there is this mindset of that they can only support one game and they have to take out the rest.

Indeed, I've encountered it myself.

@curran12

yikes. I'm sorry that the tfgs in your area went the PP route man. that'll suck the life out of any game for sure.

back on topic:

Pro/Con: Your winning list/strategy/tactic can easily fold by placing the wrong model in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Had a game in the bag when a magehunter assassin got to my fury-naked warlock for the win. Totally didnt see the elf hiding behind a piece of terrain.

this game can be very unforgiving.

Pros: tighter rules , compeditive,

Cons: relatively expensive, build dependant.

I find it a bit boring myself.

Phototoxin wrote:Pros: tighter rules , compeditive,

Cons: relatively expensive, build dependant.

I find it a bit boring myself.

You must be mistaken, WarmaHordes is quite a bit cheaper than ANY GW game. I've spent less than my normal warhammer budget in the month and a half that I've been playing, and I have four factions, each can form a decent 25-point list. It all depends on where you shop (eBay/amazon ftw), and how much you study Battlecollege to see how units mesh together.

A 50 point list will run your about as much as a 1500 point 40k army. Practically speaking you won't play bigger games(although their rules define 50> as being small games, they have tiers up to 750)

Thanks for all of the responses. I think I will start with the Hordes 2-player battlegroup box. ( and the waiting begins) If I plan to play Orboros, I guess I would start with:
Kaya
feral warpwolf
argus
5 skinwalkers.

I figure my next purchase would be another warpwolf (stalker), but is there any advice on what I should get after that to build up slowly? I am a big fan of the druid models (including overseer and blackclad wayfarer) and like the idea of the shifting stones (and stone keeper). Also, I really like Kromac.

So I am open to any suggestions and tips that anyone can offer.

Thanks again.

Shifting Stones are always good, no matter what. With their UA (Stonekeeper) they just get even better. Stalker is a fantastic warbeast. Argus is... situational so maybe consider Gorax. Add Kromac to the mix and you have a pretty solid starting base. Then stop buying for a while and play several games with Kaya/Kromac to catch grip on the rules and find out what playing style suits you best. Then you'll know what your list lacks and so what you need to buy next.

baritowned wrote:

You must be mistaken, WarmaHordes is quite a bit cheaper than ANY GW game. I've spent less than my normal warhammer budget in the month and a half that I've been playing, and I have four factions, each can form a decent 25-point list. It all depends on where you shop (eBay/amazon ftw), and how much you study Battlecollege to see how units mesh together.

it can be cheaper. then again, when you buy 1 of everything your faction has to offer, 2 of each of the non character jacks, the 2 rulebooks, all the faction books and expansions, and then start into a second army.... yeah, its not cheap. for the most part though, you can do budgetmachine, and get something decent though.

I have another quick question. How long does a typical game last?

1) Just starting out - quick start rules 15 pts?

2) increasing to 25 - 35 points?

3) using all of the rules?

4) being pretty familiar with all of the rules and playing 35 points?

In my experience:

1) 1 hour ish (but I'm not a PG)

2) 2-3 hours

3) If your not playing battlebox you should be using all of the rules.

4) 1.5 hours

It doesn't take that long to pick up the basic rules. Its really simple from a mechanical stand point.

I just started last month and picked up the rbasics within the first game, which was about an hour. Now it's just trying to get all the synergies and the 40k out of my head.