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The FAQ and the brb made harlequins beefy. The changes make them add +3 to cover at all time and they still have the 2d6 x2 spotting power.

Only if you play eldar, DE didnt have any mention of harlies in the faq lol.

But yes they actually seem pretty worth getting now.

Let us not forget they also have rending which means they can deal with terminators.

chewielight wrote:The FAQ and the brb made harlequins beefy. The changes make them add +3 to cover at all time and they still have the 2d6 x2 spotting power.

(emphasis mine)

I think we can be pretty sure they're not meant to have both. The spotting distance mechanic is going away, and the +3 cover saves is its replacement. Giving them both makes no practical sense, and I can only surmise the GW FAQ team has committed a blunder.

I think having at least a 4+ cover save all the time is better than the spotting distance thing.

Agamemnon2 wrote:

chewielight wrote:The FAQ and the brb made harlequins beefy. The changes make them add +3 to cover at all time and they still have the 2d6 x2 spotting power.

(emphasis mine)

I think we can be pretty sure they're not meant to have both. The spotting distance mechanic is going away, and the +3 cover saves is its replacement. Giving them both makes no practical sense, and I can only surmise the GW FAQ team has committed a blunder.

I can't disagree with you but I can only go by what's written. The FAQ is fairly detailed on that errata for it not to be meant. It doesn't make sense to have that detailed of a change though.

Xeriapt wrote:I think having at least a 4+ cover save all the time is better than the spotting distance thing.

Generally, not being shot is just a little better than getting a cover save while being shot.

chewielight wrote:
I can't disagree with you but I can only go by what's written. The FAQ is fairly detailed on that errata for it not to be meant. It doesn't make sense to have that detailed of a change though.

Substitute paragraph for sentence in the FAQ entry and it magically makes sense.

Harlequins are only better if you fortune them for a 2+ re-rollable cover save making them almost not worth shooting at all. otherwise, mass firepower will take the Harlequins down 2+ or not =(. I preferred not being able to be shot.

2d6x2 isnt going to save you from people running up and rapid firing you, Iv had quite a few games where all harlies have done is die and not get into combat.

Yeah the spotting distance stops long range against you but why use long range on harlies when they need to be close to do dmg?

The new rule helps them especially against Overwatch fire, where the old one would have led to them being decimated. And thanks to their flip belts, a harlequin unit should always try to charge in via some kind of cover to boost their save even higher.

Agamemnon2 wrote:The new rule helps them especially against Overwatch fire, where the old one would have led to them being decimated. And thanks to their flip belts, a harlequin unit should always try to charge in via some kind of cover to boost their save even higher.

Yeah charging through cover would be a pretty good tactic for them.

After I read about the changes Id really love to do a harlie themed army.

I have one which I have used for years. Also Wraithlords are fearless and cause fear lol so t8 and st10 wasn't enough. I need to look but vehicles get cover for 25% now I wonder if MCs do as well?

Yes, everyone gets cover at 25% - so a technical drop for non MC and vehicles.

I don't understand the confusion. The FAQ/errata is quite clear on which sentences to replace. The spotting distance does not in any way contradict the cover saves conferred by Shrouding and Stealth. It's a no brainer. Harlequins get good cover saves, and are hard to shoot.

What's the problem? Imperial players don't like it when Xenos get an advantage they don't?

Uh... isn't "pre-measuring" allowed now? If so, then the old Viel of Tears doesn't work... if you can't spot them, then you can target another unit.

Thus the new Stealth+Shrouding for Harlies...

Right?

Pre-measuring would let you know how far away the Harlies are. VoT kicks in once you declare you're shooting at them.

If you see that the Harlequins are far enough away to not waste the shots (over 16" away is statistically unlikely), you're free to pick another target. VoT will only punish you if you decided to try to shoot them and fail.