Greater Daemons

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**Tiarna Fuilteach**

Have they become better in this latest edition? Are they more viable than merely taking a bloodthirster as a support cast for Kairos?

**Testify**

Lord of Change is pretty badass. 6s to hit, T6, has a heap load of ranged attacks...what's not to love?

Bloodthirsters tend to get bogged down and killed and by and large aren't worth their point cost. People tend to use them in 6th to fly around vector striking flyers/light vehicles and picking off weaker infantry squads.

**Tiarna Fuilteach**

Hmm maybe I'll throw a lord of change into my Karios list, cheers bro

**calypso2ts**

Lord of Change got a boost and the Bloodthirster overall got a boost I think too. The Thirster does suffer from not being able to get bonus wounds from fearless on swarms now.

The Heralds overall got much better with Look Out Sir! letting Crushers allocate wounds or a Slaanesh Herald providing Hit and Run to Seekers.

**Martymunster**

Also do monstrous creatures no longer ignore armour saves, unless they half their attacks ?

**htj**

Martymunster wrote:Also do monstrous creatures no longer ignore armour saves, unless they half their attacks ?

The smash rule gives a MC AP2 on it's attacks, and the ability to make smash attacks. So you're still good.

**Martymunster**

Yeah but at half attacks. I realise they test a bunch of other stuff, just means I wall have to re-evaluate a few things

**htj**

Martymunster wrote:Yeah but at half attacks. I realise they test a bunch of other stuff, just means I wall have to re-evaluate a few things

No. They get AP2 AND they can make half number double attacks, if they wish. So they've not lost any AP, as all MCs come with Smash. Not happy about the loss of 2D6 armour pen, but at least they get +1 on the chart now.

**Lord Rogukiel**

Spoiler:

Grater demons can be very potent now...

**htj**

They're certainly good against cheese.

**Martymunster**

Oh cool beans. Just fyi though because if the change to the vehicle damage table 1+ isn't really a buff per say. But with hull points now a pen is always nice

**SagesStone**

It's still a total of +2 on open topped when you think about it. That's a nice 4+ explosion that's pretty likely to not even phase the beast.

**htj**

Yeah, I wouldn't say it's a buff per se, more of a consolation prize for losing 2D6 pen. They'll still be good against tanks, but weirdly, stronger MCs will get less of a benefit from Smash that weaker ones.

**Martymunster**

Also get to re-roll pens. Poor DE.

**Xeriapt**

I played a game with 2 LoC against some GK, both the Greater daemons survived the entire game while doing some decent dmg in and out of assault.

1 killed a Dreadknight in CC and the other stomped on a Librarian.

I think under 5th thats not something LoC usually did.

**Martymunster**

I got ta gets me one o these LOC

**Tiarna Fuilteach**

With the amount of psykers and GREY knights in my area I've decided to run a bloodthirster with blessings of the blood god to really wreck face

**Manchu**

I have extensively edited this thread to remove off-topic comments.

Please remember: Rule Number 2 is "Stay On Topic."

Thanks.

**htj**

Sorry, Manchu.

No hard feelings, chaps. Didn't mean to start a war with you.

**Spellbound**

You guys don't find that GD just get shot and killed? I've noticed the only two discussed are LoC and BT. What about keeper, GUO? They just terrible since they can't fly?

**Tiarna Fuilteach**

Not terrible just with the new flying mc rules their just not as good as their direct equivalents