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Looking over the current votes for anyone interested.
Manchu 2
Arctik 2

My vote is leaning towards Arctik, but I haven't made up my mind yet to vote. Don't want to accidentally get a lynch when I come back to change my mind after thinking it through a bit

@Arctik: I have no idea what you mean by contradictory methods. I think people should be free to make up their own minds after reviewing each person's statements rather than constantly harassing them. That last part is what Thor and I seemed to disagree on. This lead him to denounce me in public and (paradoxically, so I'd be surprised if the xenos was telling the truth) protect me in private.

Here is what seems to be your argument:

- Thor voted for me for most of the first day. Then he changed his mind and voted for someone else.

- This made me, according to you a genestealer, frightened so I killed him.

- You, in a stroke of genius, figure out that I had a motive to kill Thor.

I have to say, that's pretty pathetic. If I was a traitor why would I kill the person who's death would draw the most attention to me?

Having asked that question, allow me to summarize my argument against you:

- My argument with Thor makes me look bad once Thor is dead.

- The person who killed Thor would divert suspicion from himself by blaming me for Thor's murder.

- Arctik desperately blames me for Thor's murder on the basis of no evidence other than I argued with Thor yesterday.

What a coincidence! I think not. Clearly, you murdered Thor and are blaming me on a pretense.

I think my argument holds a little more water. I think that's doubly apparent to everyone who realizes how stupid it would be if I were a genestealer and killed Thor. You yourself even recognize that, calling it "sloppy":

Arctik_Firangi wrote:Had I announced my suspicion of Joan yesterday, I would have been a much smarter choice for her to kill, rather than sloppily knocking off the one giving her the most grief.

So, you basically admit that the most crucial premise of your argument--that I would kill Thor for arguing with me yesterday--is stupid? Well, I agree. That is very stupid and I'm afraid it exposes just how unsound you're entire argument is.

But you basically admit that, too:

Arctik_Firangi wrote:Neither of you can be linked directly to the death of Thor, but it makes sense that you would want rid of him.

Right, so your argument that I killed Thor is not based in any kind of fact but rather on the shakiest of arguments. Furthermore, this ridiculous statement could be applied to anyone suspected of being a traitor, including you. For example: I cannot "directly" link you to Thor's death (no one can be, none of us--except the murderers themselves--have that kind of evidence), but it makes sense that you'd want him dead.

"You were contradictory in the quotes I provided in that you asked me to refute your claims, then attacked me for doing so, and yet you have no issue with engaging in 'protracted argument' yourself. Your claim that you would not have lobbied for Thor's death on the basis that he was your strongest opponent seems strange, when you are so opposed to me arguing against you.

Ultimately, I was nothing more than suspicious of you yesterday. My actions last night dramatically reinforced my perspective. Now the evidence adds up perfectly, and I believe that Lord-Loss has damned himself in defending you."

::Firangi stands up straight and tosses back his heavy black robe, to reveal a gleaming suit of silver-lined carapace armour, and a shining broadsword at his hip. His 'mechanical' right arm folds back and over his shoulder, snapping agressively, and the calipers on his mechadendrite limbs lock together into sharp, deadly points. Hanging from his neck is a glowing penant, wrought into the symbol of the Inquisition. His right arm, previously hidden, wrenches the sword from its scabbard, and he points its damning tip at Joan::

"You are not entirely mistaken in entitling me 'xenos', but I will clarify it for you - I am an Ordo Xenos Inquisitor. I have seen what you have done. You are undeniably a traitor to us all.

Companions, join me in destroying our dear Sister, for they will come for me tonight, and I will be able to provide you with no more aid."

.........

I am not sure about this, you reveal this to us now?

Surely If your case was strong enough you could just convince people to vote for Joan, you will have to convince me to vote, Inqusitior or not, you must make a strong case.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:My actions last night dramatically reinforced my perspective. Now the evidence adds up perfectly, and I believe that Lord-Loss has damned himself in defending you.

First, Lord-Loss has never defended me. He merely defended himself against YOUR accusations of working with me. The fact that you call that "defending me" in order to link him to me as a traitor shows how desperate and threadbare your argument really is.

Attention, everyone! I would suggest being careful around Arctik: if you defend yourself against his accusations, that constitutes automatic proof that you are a traitor.

Moving on, I have no doubt that your actions last night--murdering Thor--rendered you "suspicious" of me. I have also shown how the "evidence" does add up perfectly: against you and your shallow attempt to blame me for your misdeeds.

I laugh--laugh--at your claims to be an Inquisitor. I am entirely sure that you are not an Inquisitor. Besides, no true Inquisitor would reveal himself at this juncture. Every loyal Imperial Citizen knows the penalty of impersonating an Inquisitor is ipso facto excommunication and death by burning "or method most expedient under the circumstances." You are xenos scum and this facade of Inquisitorial authority proves it.

How convenient that the penalty for impersonating an Inquisitor so neatly coincides with that for being an alien-fething traitor. I suggest we loyal citizen get around to executing the penalty.

Lord-Loss will reveal his vote for now, but remains supicous of both Manchu and Arctik_Firangi.


Unvote:Arctik_Firangi

"Where's a bolt pistol when you need one?" laughed the Eldar

Arctik_Firangi wrote:"You are not entirely mistaken in entitling me 'xenos', but I will clarify it for you - I am an Ordo Xenos Inquisitor. I have seen what you have done. You are undeniably a traitor to us all.

"Ohh yes Arctik, and I am the big mon keigh leader guy person" Laughed the Eldar "I don't believe they will beleive you unless you can find some proof."

"Also, as the big mon keigh leader guy person, I would like someone to clean the Gaunts of the windsheild of this ship, do we have any volunteers?" Laughed the Eldar, pointing towards the control room

Manchu wrote:

Arctik_Firangi wrote:My actions last night dramatically reinforced my perspective. Now the evidence adds up perfectly, and I believe that Lord-Loss has damned himself in defending you.

First, Lord-Loss has never defended me. He merely defended himself against YOUR accusations of working with me. The fact that you call that "defending me" in order to link him to me as a traitor shows how desperate and threadbare your argument really is.

Attention, everyone! I would suggest being careful around Arctik: if you defend yourself against his accusations, that constitutes automatic proof that you are a traitor.

Moving on, I have no doubt that your actions last night--murdering Thor--rendered you "suspicious" of me. I have also shown how the "evidence" does add up perfectly: against you and your shallow attempt to blame me for your misdeeds.

I laugh--laugh--at your claims to be an Inquisitor. I am entirely sure that you are not an Inquisitor. Besides, no true Inquisitor would reveal himself at this juncture. Every loyal Imperial Citizen knows the penalty of impersonating an Inquisitor is ipso facto excommunication and death by burning "or method most expedient under the circumstances." You are xenos scum and this facade of Inquisitorial authority proves it.

How convenient that the penalty for impersonating an Inquisitor so neatly coincides with that for being an alien-fething traitor. I suggest we loyal citizen get around to executing the penalty.

"Where shall I begin to pull apart your lies? Let's start with the idea tha defending yourself against my accusations is proof that your are a traitor... and I'll ask you to tell me where I have done so. My suspicion of Lord-Loss has been long-running, and I have given many reasons. His blundering attempts to refute what I say about his actions barely need to be pointed out for what they are, but as long as he does so whilst defending the one I know to be guilty, he will be reprimanded.

I was right on my gut feeling about Orkeo, and turned out to be correct in my decision to investigate you, Joan. Should there be a third traitor, I am quite confident that it will be Lord-Loss. I have provoked him thus, and his reaction has been to stumble and jabber contrary nonsense. There is no doubt that you are an alien insurgent, Joan, and if the best defense you can manage is to laugh in my general direction, then you are laughable yourself.

I am the Emperor's Hand - I am your doom. You need not quote me doctrine, scum. You need not criticise my strategy, because there is no way you will reach Terra now that you have been revealed. Just as you spitefully disposed of Thor, so you would do the same of me. Should you not be executed this day, my death overnight would damn you anyway. If you or any allies you may have do not kill me tonight, I will be keeping a close eye on your suspicious comrade. You cannot afford not to dispose of me, xenos traitor. This is not the first genestealer infestation I have purged, but I fear it will be my last. Martyrdom was probably a concept you once held dear, Sister... how delicious that mine will spell doom for your wretched cause."

I will once again openly outline what is going on so that everyone can know my thought process:

- Everything Arctik said previously was based on one fact, that Thor is dead and not a traitor.

- I showed how that fact does not actually support Arctik's argument and, if anything, that basing his vote against me on that argument made a better case against him being the traitor.

- Seeing that his argument was indeed very weak, Arctik needed to come up with something to give his accusations charisma.

- Suddenly, he claims to be an Inquisitor who just happened to investigate me. Why would he, you might ask, investigate me? Why because QUITE CONVENIENTLY he suspected Orkeosaurus yesterday (oh, but did NOTHING about it except for cover himself by passingly criticizing Orkeo).

- There is no reason why Arctik's suspicions about Orkeo have anything to do with me, no logical connection whatsoever. But that doesn't matter . . .

- . . . because this is just a little trick to distract all of you you from the OBVIOUS LIE that Arctik is an Inquisitor. He wants to look like he's putting the pieces together, thinking that will make him seem more Inquisitorial.

In summation, Arctik's arguments against me have gone from relying upon a faulty argument to relying upon a very bad lie. I reiterate, I am entirely confident that Artick is lying about being an Inquisitor. With the discovery of a possible serial killer, a real Inquisitor would not be so quick to show his or her hand.

Yeah, there's a time to reveal who you are. This obviously wasn't the right time because people don't seem to belive you. Are you able to prove that you are?


What is it with everyone about this "serial killer"?

Manchu wrote:I will once again openly outline what is going on so that everyone can know my thought process:

"Sister Jones [sic]. Again we see that there is nothing you can claim, that I cannot refute."

- Everything Arctik said previously was based on one fact, that Thor is dead and not a traitor.

- I showed how that fact does not actually support Arctik's argument and, if anything, that basing his vote against me on that argument made a better case against him being the traitor.

"An interesting point, other than the fact that you are blatantly lying. The fact that Thor is dead helps me to explain to the others what I already know. It is not the only point that I made, and in saying so you give weight to my argument that you have been trying to restrict information. Everyone else can go back through the voice logs for themselves and see that you are lying. You will win no friends by treating your companions like fools. I hardly need to point out your pitiful attempts at deception when you make them so obvious."

- Seeing that his argument was indeed very weak, Arctik needed to come up with something to give his accusations charisma.

- Suddenly, he claims to be an Inquisitor who just happened to investigate me. Why would he, you might ask, investigate me? Why because QUITE CONVENIENTLY he suspected Orkeosaurus yesterday (oh, but did NOTHING about it except for cover himself by passingly criticizing Orkeo).

"In my mentioning Orkeo and his death, I spoke only to the matter of my confidence in exposing my true identity. You are clearly very threatened by this. I repeat, if I am killed today or tonight, you are exposed. So just go ahead and try to get me lynched - you will bring about your own doom. Why not offer yourself up as a sacrifice in order to prove my supposed guilt? You would never even hint at such a thing, because you are scum, and your cause would be placed in the hands of your inept companion."

- There is no reason why Arctik's suspicions about Orkeo have anything to do with me, no logical connection whatsoever. But that doesn't matter . . .

- . . . because this is just a little trick to distract all of you you from the OBVIOUS LIE that Arctik is an Inquisitor. He wants to look like he's putting the pieces together, thinking that will make him seem more Inquisitorial.

"One way or the other, you will die very soon, because there are two very simple ways to prove my identity, both of which are obvious and inevitable. Again, I challenge you to martyr yourself, confident that you cannot afford to, because you are a traitor. I can also predict that you will try to avoid my death... a logical loop in your favour, and one that I will be most certain to point out when you try. No doubt you will pretend I had never said it, and try to compare my entire case against an irrelevant matter."

In summation, Arctik's arguments against me have gone from relying upon a faulty argument to relying upon a very bad lie. I reiterate, I am entirely confident that Artick is lying about being an Inquisitor. With the discovery of a possible serial killer, a real Inquisitor would not be so quick to show his or her hand.

"Etcetera, etcetera, you will be exposed one way or the other and so on. Now, if you like to actually address an actual topic, tell us about this 'serial killer'. It is hardly a pressing matter in the given situation - we are expecting assassinations - unless this 'killer' is targeting scum, in which case you have a lot to worry about, Sister. Mekboy has mentioned it too... or simply coined the term you have used to describe the mystery killer. There has been no discussion so far about how Orkeo was actually killed, and I for one have to admit that I have no theories on what could have resulted in his death."

n0t_u wrote:Yeah, there's a time to reveal who you are. This obviously wasn't the right time because people don't seem to belive you. Are you able to prove that you are?

[OOC: There are only two ways to prove a character's identity in this game. One is to be killed, and the other is to be investigated by an Inquisitor. It is up to you whether or not you believe me until then, because it simply cannot be proved. For example, I have proved to myself that Manchu is a genestealer through investigation, but of course it is impossible to actually 'prove' to anyone. I have brought many strong theories to light in order to back up my claim, and Joan has nothing with which to reply but excuses and denial.

Her insistence on proof in either matter (that I am an Inquisitor, or that she is a Genestealer) is another strong case against her reasoning. Joan will continue to ask for 'proof' which cannot logically exist, and I will continue to critique her methods. If you can understand this, you can understand why Thor was absolutely correct to damn her for her 'do nothing' method - she has only voted against people who have threatened her, which does not even match the method she has claimed to be using. Biding time only works in the traitor's favour at the beginning of the game. As an example of Thor's method, I have been provoking Lord-Loss, and sure enough, he has been making mistakes. Whether or not he is scum is unproven, but should the game continue after Joan's death, it is a good start.

On the other hand, since we have a dead traitor and I have exposed another, exposing myself early is fairly prudent. I am aware that Joan had a reasonable amount of support yesterday, and cannot allow that to build up. Whether Joan or I are lynched, she will be exposed as guilty. The sooner this is sorted out, the better, and the less scummy influence she will have on everyone else.

Now, when you say that people don't seem to believe my claim to be an Inquisitor, surely you have noticed that Joan is actually the only one who has denied my claim? Drk_Obllitr8r is a neutral NPC, and is misleading you in this case. As gamesmaster, he knows perfectly well that I am telling the truth. Joan is also probably the most convinced of the fact that I am an Inquisitor, but it is against her interests to promote that belief. No one else could be so assured of her guilt.]

If it is so clear from the "voice logs" that I am lying, why don't you make a little list of this evidence. You keep insisting that you have this evidence and that anyone only need reread everything that has already been said (knowing that few to no people will actually do this) but when it comes to it you only have two arguments:

(1) That Thor, the dead loyal citizen you killed, and I argued before he died

(2) The ridiculous lie that you are an Inquisitor

Your demand that I be martyred is nothing more than a and transparent attempt to set me up for an easier lynch so that you can do away with another loyal citizen at night. You're own death would prove more than mine. It would prove either that you are an Inquisitor (which I am certain it would not) or that you are a traitor--genestealer of serial killer . . . and I am beginning to suspect the latter.

You're getting pretty desperate, Arctik. What's the matter? Are you starting to suspect that the Inquisitor lie was a bad move? Are you starting to suspect that I might be the Inquisitor?

What do you think,n0t_U? Surely you can see that Arctik is trying to worm his way out of my arguments with mere smoke and mirrors. The smoke is rhetoric and the mirrors are lies!

((OOC: It's getting kind of annoying to be the only one beside Arctik who is actually contributing to this game. Others really need to pitch in more than two or three sentences here.))

You should be careful, no telling if anyone has that damn Bolt Pistol or not. I might not vote for you, but also might not vote for Manchu. If you can tell me what my character is through investigation next chance you get, I'll belive and assist you. That's if the traitors can't do the same thing

Hopefully you won't be dead before you can prove it.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:Her insistence on proof in either matter (that I am an Inquisitor, or that she is a Genestealer) is another strong case against her reasoning.

That's your best line yet! You go on and on about how there is so much evidence that I am guilty and then you say that me asking you to show everyone that evidence is itself "proof" of my guilt??? Utterly ridiculous!

I ask you, fellow citizens, is this a convincing argument?

And I have never and will never ask you for proof that you are an Inquisitor. No such proof exists because you are not an Inquisitor. The only person who has asked for that proof is n0t_U . . . so are you saying that him asking for proof is an argument for me being a traitor? Or are you going to accuse him of being a traitor next?

Manchu wrote:What do you think,n0t_U? Surely you can see that Arctik is trying to worm his way out of my arguments with mere smoke and mirrors. The smoke is rhetoric and the mirrors are lies!

I think I know who killed Orkeo.

@n0t_U: Your reluctance to do anything is the same thing that Thor criticized me for and now Arctik is criticizing me for the same reason. Funny that he is not criticizing you . . .

So who killed Orkeo? And how did you come to this conclusion?

Well theres a lot to take in, plus I want my vote to be hiting the right target.

If anything the people who haven't contibuted for a fair while (Ultrafook, etc) are probably the traitors rather than Arctik. Besides if he's guilty the serial killer would probably get him anyway. The way I see it is that if one of you two gets lynched the other will probably be killed anyway, I think that you're both loyalists so this arguing is kind of dumb. We should target the ones who have vanished from the game, perhaps they're hiding from the real Inquisitor.

n0t_u wrote:You should be careful, no telling if anyone has that damn Bolt Pistol or not.

Actually, Arctik claims he has made a deal with the xenos witch to use it as an informant to find out things like this.

Remember how he was trying to convince you that I had made a deal with the xenos and he would bring it to light so as to prove that I was a traitor?

Notice how he shut up about it? Well that means one of two things, or maybe both:

- I didn't make any deals with the xenos (Artick is the only one who claims to have)--which I know to be true

- Arctik actually has no deal with the xenos and this was a lie just like the Inquisitor lie--which I don't know one way or the other

@n0t_U: Arctik would have made a better impression on me as a loyal citizen if he had not lied about being an Inquisitor and done exactly what any traitor would attempt by framing me. How do you respond to those arguments?

Also, you still have not mentioned who killed Orkeo or why you think this . . .

Manchu wrote:So who killed Orkeo? And how did you come to this conclusion?

Obviously I'll explain it later in case Arctik decides to convince everyone to vote for this important loyalist tool.

Manchu wrote:@n0t_U: Arctik would have made a better impression on me as a loyal citizen if he had not lied about being an Inquisitor and done exactly what any traitor would attempt by framing me. How do you respond to those arguments?

This deal is interesting. Well Arctik if you found out who has the pistol tell us.

n0t_u wrote:Obviously I'll explain it later in case Arctik decides to convince everyone to vote for this important loyalist tool.

What? You suspect that there is yet another pro- imperial power role (I mean other than Inquisitor) rather than a serial killer? Surely you can explain something about this without compromising the identity of the person. And if you're so convinced that Artick is a loyal citizen or even Inquisitor, why would you think he'd lead a lynch against such a person?

Manchu wrote:

n0t_u wrote:Obviously I'll explain it later in case Arctik decides to convince everyone to vote for this important loyalist tool.

What? You suspect that there is yet another pro- imperial power role (I mean other than Inquisitor) rather than a serial killer? Surely you can explain something about this without compromising the identity of the person. And if you're so convinced that Artick is a loyal citizen or even Inquisitor, why would you think he'd lead a lynch against such a person?

I thought you were an Inquisitor as well before it, I mearly gave him a chance to prove it to me later. It isn't 100% that he is a loyalist, this loyalist tool might just kill him just to see what he is, that's all I was saying. If he is loyalist he has nothing to fear from them and probably won't even know about them until the end of the game.

n0t_u wrote:I thought you were an Inquisitor as well before it, I mearly gave him a chance to prove it to me later. It isn't 100% that he is a loyalist, this loyalist tool might just kill him just to see what he is, that's all I was saying. If he is loyalist he has nothing to fear from them and probably won't even know about them until the end of the game.

Where are you getting this information?

((OOC: Is this the xenos thing? Thor was right, very frustrating if so.))

OCC: Just a guess actually.

((OOC: Oh, okay. The Eldar thing constantly throws me on top of this being a closed game.))

Manchu wrote:

n0t_u wrote:You should be careful, no telling if anyone has that damn Bolt Pistol or not.

Actually, Arctik claims he has made a deal with the xenos witch to use it as an informant to find out things like this.

Remember how he was trying to convince you that I had made a deal with the xenos and he would bring it to light so as to prove that I was a traitor?

Notice how he shut up about it? Well that means one of two things, or maybe both:

- I didn't make any deals with the xenos (Artick is the only one who claims to have)--which I know to be true

- Arctik actually has no deal with the xenos and this was a lie just like the Inquisitor lie--which I don't know one way or the other

"I am perfectly happy to correct you again, Sister. I said that I had entered into a bargain, and nothing more. I certainly made no mention or inference about you bargaining with the other xenos, and I am glad that you have taken this bait. Your point is utterly redundant, and your desperate protests are noted. The Eldar can confirm himself that he did not acknowledge my request.

I have never claimed to have tangible proof of your guilt, only evidence. There can be no proof until one of us are dead. I would a fool to expose myself this early if I was not an Inquisitor, because I would be killed tomorrow when it was clearly proven that I was not. I have no need to provoke n0t_u at the present time, because I am assured of your guilt.

Joan - cease your endless calls for 'proof'. There can not be proof, save on our dead bodies. My evidence, however, is present despite your attempts to brush it aside."

OCC:So my guess is right?