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Hi Dakka

I have a pure infantry Nurgle Army in 40k (you can find a link to them below) and a foot sloggers Imperial Guard army. Reason being, for Death Guard I wanted to stay in character, for the imperial guard I just didnt have the money and still dont for chimeras and other transports.

In the past when armored companies were allowed in 40k as their own army I built one as well ( 1 x Vanquisher, 3 x Demolisher, 2 x LRBT, 1 x exterminator, 1 x storm troopers, 1 x armored fists).

So my question stands - are foot slogging Death Guard and IG (albiet backed up with up to 3 squadrons of 3 Leman russ') compeditive/ viable in the new 6th edition game?

Cheers !

I can't say anything about nurgle, but you can still certainly do foot guard. Without vehicles, you're going to be relying on your elites choices more, but given the versatility of infantry platoons, you can easily cover all of your bases while providing too many targets for your opponents to kill off.

I'll direct you towards some of my recent battle reports. I've switched over now to russes, but most of the games in that link are with more or less infantry models only.

Armored companies still are, just get the new IA Imperial vehicles second edition.

Oh, I think I misread the original post. Yes, all-foot is viable, but foot+russes is viable as well.

In my most recent game I played, my 1850 point list was:

CCS - plasma pistols, 3x sniper rifles, standard

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

Vanquisher - lascannon, Pask

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Some variant of this list is likely going to be what I'll be continuing with into the near future. At 5 russes, you're bringing a lot of AV14. With 95 infantry models, you're bringing a horde. With lascannons and meltaguns frigging everywhere, your opponent's most threatening stuff is going to drop, and drop fast.

I've only sort of just started with this play style, so I can't say for certain if it's awesome or very awesome. Time will tell. You can see my only battle report with this style so far here, with a new one in this style out before the weekend is through.

As for all-russes, as was just mentioned, you can certainly do all-russes, still, it's just that the name of the rules for them changed, and you can only find the rules in optional forgeworld expansions.

I run all infantry armies all of the time with a great deal of success.
My Blood Angels are an almost all Jump Army with one or two Sternguard Squads to hold the Objectives on my side of the table [Yes I know they are not scoring].
My Dark Angels are either a Deathwing or a Plasma SPAM Green Wing.
My Grey Knights is a Deeps Striking Infantry force; usually only have one Vehicle and that is a Razorback for my Purifiers.
My Imperial Guards are a Gunline with one Squad of Rough Riders.
My Space Marines are Gunline Plasma SPAM
My Space Wolves are usually a Grey Hunter Gunline or Logan lead Terminator footsloggers

I usually win with all of these or at least make a good showing.

Ailaros - thanks so much for the links to the reports. Its awesome to see you racking up so many wins! it brings me alot of hope that my army will get me a high win ratio like yours

Im glad that the fetish with mech armies is over, that was soooo annoying !

What do you think of my army here (http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/501405.page) and how I can make the best use of my models up to a max of 2000 points ?

barnowl is that the IA 2 from 2002 or something? Isnt that outdated now/ superseded?

Anpu42 that sounds mean - plasmagun and autocannon is my favourite combo for infantry armies, though I wish I had the models to make it =)

 Ailaros wrote:

CCS - plasma pistols, 3x sniper rifles, standard

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

Vanquisher - lascannon, Pask

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

What happens if you face green tide?

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Ailaros wrote:

CCS - plasma pistols, 3x sniper rifles, standard

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

Vanquisher - lascannon, Pask

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

What happens if you face green tide?

One of his other lists took the TL autocannon russes with HB sponsons. I imagine those would handle ork mobs handily.

Cheesedoodler wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Ailaros wrote:

CCS - plasma pistols, 3x sniper rifles, standard

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

PCS - lascannon
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun
PIS - lascannon, meltagun

Vanquisher - lascannon, Pask

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

What happens if you face green tide?

One of his other lists took the TL autocannon russes with HB sponsons. I imagine those would handle ork mobs handily.

Yeah, I saw it. Handily? No. Better than 5 Vanquishers, sure.

Of course, this is all meta-specific. I assume Ailaros' Meta is very Deathstar/Mech heavy. What works, works. As far as TAC is, though, I dunno about the above.

How to handle green tide? Start with 53 lasguns, many of which are FRFable. Even without orders, that's 12 dead orks at an 18" threat range (assuming 5+ cover). Then add the 36 I hate you guns for another 10 orks. That's 22 dead orks in a single round of really rather non-optimal shooting.

Combine this with the occasional order that passes and the fact that they're not GUARANTEED to have KFF protection all the time, and that at some point they loose fearless, and I get a turn or two of longer-range shooting at them first, and that they have to remove casualties from the front of the squad, and there's enough firepower here to handle a horde.

My experiences with my foot horde in 6th ed so far have shown me that you no longer need dedicated anti-horde weapons to handle horde armies anymore.

It is precisely because of this fact that I'm bringing pretty much only anti-heavy-hitters in my lists nowadays.

I'm definitely going to be looking at your list style with regards to how to build my army Alairos, it seems fairly solid, and from what I see, exactly what I've been planning for my guard.

It's nice to see someone getting success with Vanquishers. The exact same lay out I was planning in fact. Granted with my meta I only need 2 (the other 3 are exterminators). While I'm not planning on using pask, I figure 8 at shots a round should handle the predators, defilers and rhinos I run into.

So, the deal with the vanquishers isn't that I want vanquishers per-se.

The deal with the vanquishers is the autocannons are crappy, and the only damage I was doing with the tanks was damage I was doing with the hull weapons. If the turret doesn't matter, then I can rather pick any turret. In this case, the fact that they're vanquishers is incidental to the fact that it's basically the same price as an exterminator, while also not being an exterminator, or having the vagaries of being an ordnance weapon in a post-lumbering-behemoth world.

And, I mean, this isn't new. I ran exterminators for awhile in 5th ed (and also earlier in 6th), and the exterminator cannons scarcely did anything worth praising.

I mean, if there was a way where I could take a russ for 20 or 30 points cheaper and have it come without a turret, I'd be seriously tempted to take it.

The one exception I'm starting to find is a pask vanquisher. Holy hell can that guy beat face. That's a tank that I'm taking because it's a vanquisher, not because I didn't have any other better options.

 Ailaros wrote:
I mean, if there was a way where I could take a russ for 20 or 30 points cheaper and have it come without a turret, I'd be seriously tempted to take it.

Leman Russ Annihilator says hi. Except it's 20 points cheaper but still gets a TL LC turret, so it's better than what you asked for.

How are people finding running lists with more than 3 leman russes? Useful? Waste of points?

Im curious to know because at this point im running 3 russes and trying to decide if to increase that number or not to 6 russes

You can see my present list and battle plan here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/501405.page

So, nowadays, the only serious drawback to squadroning is overkill - the tanks in the same squadron have to shoot at the same target, which means they might apply too much firepower. This firepower wouldn't be wasted if they could engage separate targets.

That said, outside of a few circumstances (such as having two bolter-boat punishers in the same squad), this tends not to be ALL that big of a problem.

The bigger problem is that the best way to kit russes is with fancy hull weapons, and a russ with fancy hull weapons easily runs you 200+ points. You simply won't have enough points to throw at a lot of russes before you hit the 2 FOC points level, at which point there isn't much reason to keep them in squadrons when they could be independent units.

Yeah I see where your going with that line of thinking.. So run 3 leman russes, each in their own HS slot, kitted out around the 200 mark where they come into their own

OR run naked Russes say 2 in a squadron, and take 3 squadrons (6 russ total)

Hmmm interesting .. I think 6 LRBT would kick some bum when placed next to 80 or so foot sloggers with autocannons and plasma guns, a nice 2k point army right there

 Ailaros wrote:

PIS - lascannon, meltagun
Vanquisher - lascannon, multimeltas

Have you tried a PIS with Autocannon, Plasmagun and melta bomb sarg?
I found it to get the job done just a little bit better than Las/Melta squads.
As for the Russes, is 1020 points the way to go?


I'd much rather have:
CCS (standard)
2xPCS, Lascannon
8x PIS, Lascannon, meltagun
4x Veteran Squad, 3x meltaguns
2x2 Vendettas
1x Vendetta
1855 (so 1 meltagun gets down graded to flamer)

10 Lascannons, 21 meltaguns, and 15 twin-linked lascannons.
IMO, it will out-shoot those 5 tanks, and show up with an extra 40 scoring veterans packed to the gills with meltaguns and krak grenades.

If 95 guardsmen is good, 135 is better, right?

-Matt

 Ailaros wrote:
How to handle green tide? Start with 53 lasguns, many of which are FRFable. Even without orders, that's 12 dead orks at an 18" threat range (assuming 5+ cover). Then add the 36 I hate you guns for another 10 orks. That's 22 dead orks in a single round of really rather non-optimal shooting.

That's assuming you get to fire all 36 heavy and special weapons, which seems unlikely. Also, killing 22 Orks in one turn is not always enough. If you do that for 7 turns, you still won't be able to kill all the Orks in a 180-model army. Similarly, if they have a Nob Biker unit up front you'll be hard-pressed to down it before it hits, much less it and the rest of the army.

I personally feel that the Manticore is the best HS option at the moment. High strength weapons are a bigger factor now than ever. Even with the medium level AP of the Manticore it doesn't pop elite Infantry easily I terms of them being denied saves but the mass amounts of shots it can put down has the potential to force enough saves to wipe the squad anyways. Not to mention that it can snipe important guys out of squads and make Agies line redundent for your opponent. Its also good at putting pens on vehicles and stripping hull points. They seem to work better though in mass (2-3) as they can scatter off add ruin a good plan.

I note a big difference between ailaros writtings and polonius writings when it comes to the guards units competitiveness, is this because ailaros is writting from a foot slogger only perspective? I enjoy reading both and have kind of been taking polonius here on dakka as gospel when it comes to army composition... though ailaros has really shaken me up and made me more flexible when it comes to thinking how to deploy and use a guard army

I wonder what other 40k playeres thoughts are on polonius writing with regard to 6th edition?

 sumi808 wrote:
How are people finding running lists with more than 3 leman russes? Useful? Waste of points?

Im curious to know because at this point im running 3 russes and trying to decide if to increase that number or not to 6 russes

You can see my present list and battle plan here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/501405.page

I used to play with 5 russes but found people no longer wanted to play games as it is so OP
2 solo demolisher with plasma cannons and lascannons
3 in a unit with battle cannon, 9 heavy bolters, 3 heavy stubbers and camo netting
you dont need them but i also run 2 techpriest with 10 seritors

Plague Marines are tough as nails. MEQ Bolters are less effective against them than GEQ Lasguns are against normal marines.
This means you can pretty much ignore bolter fire. A GEQ lasgun has a 1/54 chance of killing a PM, so they are quite literally flashlights.

The only drawback of PMs is they don't bring as many guns to the fight. This can be a disadvantage when you need to have more bullets for less problems.

 yorkskargrimironklaw wrote:

I used to play with 5 russes but found people no longer wanted to play games as it is so OP
2 solo demolisher with plasma cannons and lascannons
3 in a unit with battle cannon, 9 heavy bolters, 3 heavy stubbers and camo netting
you dont need them but i also run 2 techpriest with 10 seritors

That's not OP. That's awful. The demolishers can't fire the Plasma Cannons if their main gun fires, and they have to snap shoot their lascannons.

Bolterboat LRBT's are mediocre, squadroning them with Heavy Stubbers and Camo netting is ridiculous. Too many points to overkill one unit a turn.

 yorkskargrimironklaw wrote:

 sumi808 wrote:
How are people finding running lists with more than 3 leman russes? Useful? Waste of points?

Im curious to know because at this point im running 3 russes and trying to decide if to increase that number or not to 6 russes

You can see my present list and battle plan here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/501405.page

I used to play with 5 russes but found people no longer wanted to play games as it is so OP
2 solo demolisher with plasma cannons and lascannons
3 in a unit with battle cannon, 9 heavy bolters, 3 heavy stubbers and camo netting
you dont need them but i also run 2 techpriest with 10 seritors

Methinks that someone has not read the Guard FAQ which removes "Lumbering Behemoth" from Russes...

orkz orkz orkz orkz da green tide, Waaaaaaaaaagh!

DA would seem to have the ability to do a decent Infantry only list. We have d3ecently cheap devastators, cheap tacticals, and a banner that lets us shoot bolters as salvo 2/4. Not to mention very cheap librarians with Divination and if you need scoring troops in the backboard just take Belial and two deathwing squads to drop and stomp on turn 2.

Nice, so infantry with massed HS is well competitive in 6th - NICE

1000+ point Pure footsloggin style you need all your Heavy Support choices and lots of bodies with decent LD values or re-rolls when you take those 25% shooting LD rolls.
Usually one or two "shoot at me" units provide the spongy soaking of most few turns of shooting while the main blob force waddles up.

front AV 13 is your friend as is re-rolling LD and free cover saves however you get them.