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After reading through the entry for this unit I find something a bit confusing

First off can an Apothecary take any additional wargear, he already has his bolt pistol replaced, but can he change his chainsword for a power weapon or plasma gun?

It says any veteran can take a standard, does this mean they can still take a bolter/plasma gun and power weapon?

Same with storm shield, simply states that a veteran can take one. Does this mean I can have a banner holding, storm shield bearing plasma gunner with a power weapon?

IF there is something in the BRB that mentions about 'equipment slots' or something is anyone able to direct me to the page, or just clear this up for me in general? thanks.

First, the command squad had pretty substantial errata. Have you read it and bookmarked the FAQ? The link is in my signature.

Second, generally speaking, there are no "equipment slots" in 40k anymore, and haven't been since 3rd or 4th edition. Different codices MAY put limits, often by making you swap one of your existing weapons for a new weapon, thus making you ineligible to get more weapons if you don't have something to swap for it.

 Mannahnin wrote:
First, the command squad had pretty substantial errata.

Actually, it was the Company Veteran Squad that was FAQ'd, there was nothinfg in the FAQ about the power armour command squad at all.

As to the OP, a veteran may be upgraded to an apothecary, but the apothecary is no longer a veteran so may not take any of the options for veterans

Technically all of them could take a melta gun/storm shield/thunder hammer with one taking a standard/banner in addition.

They are my new hotness. In a drop pod btw...

410 points before the banner.... That's just crazy enough to work.

 Cortez667 wrote:
410 points before the banner.... That's just crazy enough to work.

I actually don't deck mine out to the max, but yes, there's options...

ItsPug wrote:


As to the OP, a veteran may be upgraded to an apothecary, but the apothecary is no longer a veteran so may not take any of the options for veterans

What stops a me from replicating a vetern's chainsword to a power fist before upgrading that same veteran to an apothecary?

IMO, the Apothecary is still a Vet (as a matter of fact, they have the very same stats), so he still can swap the chainsword as per the table...
... also the Codex does not state that - upon becoming an Apothecary or a Company Champion, the Veteran loses all the options; it is logical that the first cannot swap the bolt pistol (since he doesn't have it anymore) nor the second can trade the -now absent- chainsword, but other options are still there.

Same for any theoretical equipment combo: it is legit as long as it is permitted by the table and is representable in the mini:

Standard bearer with plasma pistol, melta bombs (ok bombs can be stashed somewhere), storm shield and thunder hammer? Yes, if you model the marine wearing all this (and, with weapons fluffily equipped with maglocks, you technically don't need even a holster).

Champion with storm shield and plasma pistol? Doable (until otherwise faqed)

Apothecary with lightning claw? Why not (same as above )

It is easy to put an arsenal on a single mini? Well, no

Personally, I left my apothecary, champion and bearer "plain" to minimise the damage in case of death - and that still gave me not less than a 200 points unit.

I am also of the opinion that you can give a veteran options before you convert them into a medic. The change to medic swaps out one bit of warger for another, so provided you still have the thing to swap, you can fiddle with other options.

The issue is multiple FAQs have addressed this differently.

Per the Ork FAQ, A Nob in a Boyz squad can swap out for an item that any model can have, before the whole unit switches from Shoota Boyz to Slugga Boyz.

Per the BA FAQ, a Furioso Dreadnought not only loses any upgrades already bought, but cannot take any other upgrades after becoming a Furioso Librarian.

I cant comment on the Orks but the BA codex requires you replace all the wargear for the dreadnought to upgrade it. The apothecary upgrade here only requires you replace the bolt pistol.

 DJGietzen wrote:
I cant comment on the Orks but the BA codex requires you replace all the wargear for the dreadnought to upgrade it. The apothecary upgrade here only requires you replace the bolt pistol.

Per the wording of the codex, you exchange all wargear when becoming a Furioso Librarian. People claimed that they could take upgrades after making the Furioso a Librarian. GW said No.
In regards to Orks, in a mob of Boyz, for every 10 models, 1 model can take a Big Shoota or Rokkit Launcha (trading in his Slugga or Shoota). GW ruled per the FAQ that you could give a Boy a Big Shoota, upgrade him to a Nob, swap out the Choppa for a Power Klaw and then switch the mob to shoota boyz.

 Happyjew wrote:
The issue is multiple FAQs have addressed this differently.

Per the Ork FAQ, A Nob in a Boyz squad can swap out for an item that any model can have, before the whole unit switches from Shoota Boyz to Slugga Boyz.

Per the BA FAQ, a Furioso Dreadnought not only loses any upgrades already bought, but cannot take any other upgrades after becoming a Furioso Librarian.

Forgive me, but I don't see the problem:

The Ork Faq refers to Ork Codex and to costs, restrictions and procedures to build an Ork Army

The BA Faq refers to BA Codex and to costs, restrictions and procedures to build an BA Army

The DA Faq refers to DA Codex and to costs, restrictions and procedures to build an DA Army

As for now, DA Command squad "special" characters are fully customizable. Future versions of the Faq for DA will confirm or deny this "actual" assumption.

While its true that the FAQs only apply to the individual codices, they are often used to set precedents in similar situations. For example, in 5th edition, people pointed to the BA FAQ to allow non-BA vehicles with Scout and Smoke Launchers to use them during the Scout move.

This one's actually pretty simple - If they're a Veteran they can take any option available to the Veterans, if their stat line says something other than Veteran they can't.

Apoth - all options still a Vet
Banner Bearer - all options still a Vet
Company Champion - no options has separate stat line

Apoth and Champions being able to upgrade is a reach at best. The entry clearly states...

Vet can be upgraded to x replacing x with x.

If Apoth and Champions were meant to be able to take melta guns the entry would say, "any member of the squad can replace", it doesn't it says Vets can.

The army entry has Vets, Apoths, and Champion listed with different profiles. Upgrading a standard vet to apoth or champ changes their profile. They no longer veterans for purposes of wargear options.

Consider that the Apoth and Champ are both Characters.

So what does the BRB say about Characters?

BRB pg 63 wrote:
Most characters are fielded in units from the start of the game, and represent squad leaders, such as a Space Marine Veteran Sergeant. They have their own profile, but do not have a separate entry. They are effectively just another trooper in their unit, with enhanced characteristics and perhaps a wider selection of weapons and wargear choices.

This says to me that they are STILL VETS but with better stats and more options not less.

imho

andystache wrote:
This one's actually pretty simple - If they're a Veteran they can take any option available to the Veterans, if their stat line says something other than Veteran they can't.

Apoth - all options still a Vet
Banner Bearer - all options still a Vet
Company Champion - no options has separate stat line

So why is the Apoth not a character, therefor loose his vet status for purposes of choosing wargear. They have their own stat line. Banner bearer, that was random, they were not in question.

40k-noob wrote:
Consider that the Apoth and Champ are both Characters.

So what does the BRB say about Characters?

BRB pg 63 wrote:
Most characters are fielded in units from the start of the game, and represent squad leaders, such as a Space Marine Veteran Sergeant. They have their own profile, but do not have a separate entry. They are effectively just another trooper in their unit, with enhanced characteristics and perhaps a wider selection of weapons and wargear choices.

This says to me that they are STILL VETS but with better stats and more options not less.

imho

So a sergeant in a Tac squad can take a heavy weapon?

40k-noob wrote:
Consider that the Apoth and Champ are both Characters.

So what does the BRB say about Characters?

BRB pg 63 wrote:
Most characters are fielded in units from the start of the game, and represent squad leaders, such as a Space Marine Veteran Sergeant. They have their own profile, but do not have a separate entry. They are effectively just another trooper in their unit, with enhanced characteristics and perhaps a wider selection of weapons and wargear choices.

This says to me that they are STILL VETS but with better stats and more options not less.

imho

They are "Apoths" and "Champions", not "Veteran Apoths" and "Veteran Champions".

 Byte wrote:

40k-noob wrote:
Consider that the Apoth and Champ are both Characters.

So what does the BRB say about Characters?

BRB pg 63 wrote:
Most characters are fielded in units from the start of the game, and represent squad leaders, such as a Space Marine Veteran Sergeant. They have their own profile, but do not have a separate entry. They are effectively just another trooper in their unit, with enhanced characteristics and perhaps a wider selection of weapons and wargear choices.

This says to me that they are STILL VETS but with better stats and more options not less.

imho

They are "Apoths" and "Champions", not "Veteran Apoths" and "Veteran Champions".

 Happyjew wrote:


So a sergeant in a Tac squad can take a heavy weapon?

I would refer both of you to the rule.
"They are effectively just another trooper in their unit.." not, they are separate units albeit attached to this units or some other differentiating type of model etc.

A Tac Sgt, is still a Tactical Marine and Apoth/Champs are still vets as both are members of the their squads.

Until such a time as a FAQ/Codex changes them.

40k-noob wrote:

 Byte wrote:

40k-noob wrote:
Consider that the Apoth and Champ are both Characters.

So what does the BRB say about Characters?

BRB pg 63 wrote:
Most characters are fielded in units from the start of the game, and represent squad leaders, such as a Space Marine Veteran Sergeant. They have their own profile, but do not have a separate entry. They are effectively just another trooper in their unit, with enhanced characteristics and perhaps a wider selection of weapons and wargear choices.

This says to me that they are STILL VETS but with better stats and more options not less.

imho

They are "Apoths" and "Champions", not "Veteran Apoths" and "Veteran Champions".

 Happyjew wrote:


So a sergeant in a Tac squad can take a heavy weapon?

I would refer both of you to the rule.
"They are effectively just another trooper in their unit.." not, they are separate units albeit attached to this units or some other differentiating type of model etc.

A Tac Sgt, is still a Tactical Marine and Apoth/Champs are still vets as both are members of the their squads.

Until such a time as a FAQ/Codex changes them.

That's ridiculous.

So a Vet can take a banner, upgrade to Apoth, and take a storm shield. Not a chance.

It's not even RAW.

40k-noob wrote:

I would refer both of you to the rule.
"They are effectively just another trooper in their unit.." not, they are separate units albeit attached to this units or some other differentiating type of model etc.

A Tac Sgt, is still a Tactical Marine and Apoth/Champs are still vets as both are members of the their squads.

Until such a time as a FAQ/Codex changes them.

So if a Tac Sgt is just another marine, anything that a Tac Sgt can take a normal marine can.
combi-plasma for everyone! And powerfists!

rigeld2 wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

I would refer both of you to the rule.
"They are effectively just another trooper in their unit.." not, they are separate units albeit attached to this units or some other differentiating type of model etc.

A Tac Sgt, is still a Tactical Marine and Apoth/Champs are still vets as both are members of the their squads.

Until such a time as a FAQ/Codex changes them.

So if a Tac Sgt is just another marine, anything that a Tac Sgt can take a normal marine can.
combi-plasma for everyone! And powerfists!

Depends on whether or not you choose to read the codex as saying "any Space Marine may...." as opposed to what it actually says, i.e. "The Space Marine Sergeant may..."

But sure, if you want to, you can play it that way, it would a very expensive unit!!

 Happyjew wrote:

 DJGietzen wrote:
I cant comment on the Orks but the BA codex requires you replace all the wargear for the dreadnought to upgrade it. The apothecary upgrade here only requires you replace the bolt pistol.

Per the wording of the codex, you exchange all wargear when becoming a Furioso Librarian. People claimed that they could take upgrades after making the Furioso a Librarian. GW said No.
In regards to Orks, in a mob of Boyz, for every 10 models, 1 model can take a Big Shoota or Rokkit Launcha (trading in his Slugga or Shoota). GW ruled per the FAQ that you could give a Boy a Big Shoota, upgrade him to a Nob, swap out the Choppa for a Power Klaw and then switch the mob to shoota boyz.

Right, these FAQs don't contradict one another. Having read a friends Ork codex I can see what your talking about. 1 of the boyz in the mob may be upgraded to a Nob, and that Nob can replace its Choppa for a Power Klaw. Only the Nob can replace the its Choppa in this way. The entire mob can replace its slugga with a shoota. This would include a Nob if he has a slugga as its the entire mob. One out of 10 boyz may replace its slugga with a Big Shoota. You CAN NOT replace the Nob's slugga with a Big Shoota as this option is only open to boyz. There is no restriction on the order you take these options. So you can select 1 of 10 boyz and replace his slugga with a Big Shoota, then replace all the slugga's with shootas (our 1 out of 10 does not have a slugga any more so there is nothing to replace) then make that 1 out of 10 a Nob (the only requirement is it be a 1 of the boyz in the mob) then Replace the Nob's choppa with a Power Klaw.

You can give a furisoso dread a bunch of extra war gear only to replace all of it to make it a furisoso librarian. You can't replace the FL equipment because there are no options too, its a FL not a FD now.

As long as the veteran keeps his bolt pistol so he can turn into an apothecary, the veteran can take any other veteran options THEN stop being a veteran and start being an apothecary.

 Happyjew wrote:
Per the Ork FAQ, A Nob in a Boyz squad can swap out for an item that any model can have, before the whole unit switches from Shoota Boyz to Slugga Boyz.

That's a misleading representation of the Ork FAQ, given the Painboy in a Nobz unit is much more analogous to the Apothecary situation and the FAQ says he Can't take Nob Wargear.

 Byte wrote:

andystache wrote:
This one's actually pretty simple - If they're a Veteran they can take any option available to the Veterans, if their stat line says something other than Veteran they can't.

Apoth - all options still a Vet
Banner Bearer - all options still a Vet
Company Champion - no options has separate stat line

So why is the Apoth not a character, therefor loose his vet status for purposes of choosing wargear. They have their own stat line. Banner bearer, that was random, they were not in question.

Oops at work and working from memory. The Banner Bearer was in there because that was part of OP's question. Whether they can be upgraded depending on the entry. If it says "a Vet may replace" then I read Champ/Apoth would not be able to use that option as they are no longer "Vets". Part of the FAQ update to the Vet Squad was to change the wording from "a Vet" to any model" which covers the Sgt and the squad, not just the squad

40k-noob wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

I would refer both of you to the rule.
"They are effectively just another trooper in their unit.." not, they are separate units albeit attached to this units or some other differentiating type of model etc.

A Tac Sgt, is still a Tactical Marine and Apoth/Champs are still vets as both are members of the their squads.

Until such a time as a FAQ/Codex changes them.

So if a Tac Sgt is just another marine, anything that a Tac Sgt can take a normal marine can.
combi-plasma for everyone! And powerfists!

Depends on whether or not you choose to read the codex as saying "any Space Marine may...." as opposed to what it actually says, i.e. "The Space Marine Sergeant may..."

But sure, if you want to, you can play it that way, it would a very expensive unit!!

Your assertion is that a Sergeant is the same as a normal marine. Which would mean that anything a Sergeant can take, a normal marine can as well.
Different names mean different things. You're trying to say they don't.

rigeld2 wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

I would refer both of you to the rule.
"They are effectively just another trooper in their unit.." not, they are separate units albeit attached to this units or some other differentiating type of model etc.

A Tac Sgt, is still a Tactical Marine and Apoth/Champs are still vets as both are members of the their squads.

Until such a time as a FAQ/Codex changes them.

So if a Tac Sgt is just another marine, anything that a Tac Sgt can take a normal marine can.
combi-plasma for everyone! And powerfists!

Depends on whether or not you choose to read the codex as saying "any Space Marine may...." as opposed to what it actually says, i.e. "The Space Marine Sergeant may..."

But sure, if you want to, you can play it that way, it would a very expensive unit!!

Your assertion is that a Sergeant is the same as a normal marine. Which would mean that anything a Sergeant can take, a normal marine can as well.
Different names mean different things. You're trying to say they don't.

I am not trying to say anything. The book says it.

Aside from that, A can do what B can does not mean that B can do what A can.

In other words a Space Marine Sergeant is still a Space Marine, but a Space Marine is not a Space Marine Sergeant.

andystache wrote:

 Byte wrote:

andystache wrote:
This one's actually pretty simple - If they're a Veteran they can take any option available to the Veterans, if their stat line says something other than Veteran they can't.

Apoth - all options still a Vet
Banner Bearer - all options still a Vet
Company Champion - no options has separate stat line

So why is the Apoth not a character, therefor loose his vet status for purposes of choosing wargear. They have their own stat line. Banner bearer, that was random, they were not in question.

Oops at work and working from memory. The Banner Bearer was in there because that was part of OP's question. Whether they can be upgraded depending on the entry. If it says "a Vet may replace" then I read Champ/Apoth would not be able to use that option as they are no longer "Vets". Part of the FAQ update to the Vet Squad was to change the wording from "a Vet" to any model" which covers the Sgt and the squad, not just the squad

I agree on all your points. However, the discussion is Command Squad, not Company Vet Squad that the FAQ covers.