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Buttons wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

So we've officially seen our first codex unit with an Apocalypse weapon. So much for that whole "Escalation isn't real 40k" thing.

The Deathstrike already had a blast diameter>5". It was D3+3" RADIUS blast, emphasis on radius.

I think he's commenting on the fact it's "Apocalyptic Blast", which is from Escalation. IMO that's hardly enough to convince the teeming masses that a Revenant Titan is part of "normal" 40k.

So guys, on this whole "vets still get 3 special weapons" thing. I found this floating around-

http://www.mariscal40k.es/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Veteranos.jpg

My spanish is kinda rusty, but I am seeing on the sixth bullet point that only 2 veterans may exchange rifles for special weapons.

Oh and by the way...
http://www.mariscal40k.es/reglas-definitivas-del-codex-astra-militarum/

Yeah the augur array is going to be worth it if you plan on deep striking a few platoons of scions. For the fire barrels is anybody going to model Donkey Kong on their vehicle?

On a side note the orders for the militarum tempestus were listed and we already have the stats and points cost from the WD. Is there any reason to not use the rules? A scion command squad with 4 plasma guns ordering "Directed Firestorm Sanctioned" (Twin-linked) is pretty powerful.

 Peregrine wrote:

Inquisitor Jex wrote:
Peregrine: Yes, I confirm, it is a plasmagun for 15 pts. and an autogun for free

Interesting. Special weapons on an HQ IC aren't exactly common. I suspect the other HQs will be better for shooting armies, but I kind of like the idea of adding a fourth plasma gun to my vets.

I think you mean a 3rd plasma gun for your vets.

Hmmm so the Spaniard is saying 2 special weapons while Jex is saying 3.....

I'm going with Jex since we both speak and read English.

 ph34r wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

Inquisitor Jex wrote:
Peregrine: Yes, I confirm, it is a plasmagun for 15 pts. and an autogun for free

Interesting. Special weapons on an HQ IC aren't exactly common. I suspect the other HQs will be better for shooting armies, but I kind of like the idea of adding a fourth plasma gun to my vets.

I think you mean a 3rd plasma gun for your vets.

Dosent seem like it matters now with the limit on firepoints for the chimera.

 ultimentra wrote:
So guys, on this whole "vets still get 3 special weapons" thing. I found this floating around-

http://www.mariscal40k.es/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Veteranos.jpg

My spanish is kinda rusty, but I am seeing on the sixth bullet point that only 2 veterans may exchange rifles for special weapons.

Oh and by the way...
http://www.mariscal40k.es/reglas-definitivas-del-codex-astra-militarum/

Sucks, but seems to be right.


So basically Veterans aren't cheaper, they just don't have krak grenades per default anymore.

 Maxurugi wrote:

 ultimentra wrote:
So guys, on this whole "vets still get 3 special weapons" thing. I found this floating around-

http://www.mariscal40k.es/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Veteranos.jpg

My spanish is kinda rusty, but I am seeing on the sixth bullet point that only 2 veterans may exchange rifles for special weapons.

Oh and by the way...
http://www.mariscal40k.es/reglas-definitivas-del-codex-astra-militarum/

So basically Veterans aren't cheaper, they just don't have krak grenades per default anymore.

Doctrines went down in price. So they CAN be cheaper.

Oh but it does! I tend to lose a plasma gunner a from each squad each turn. Heck I lost 3 chosen to Get's Hot the last time I played My Chaos Space Marines zombie army.

 Sparkadia wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

Inquisitor Jex wrote:
Heavy flamer is 10pts; and (har har!) if vets don't take it, they can still sport 3 Special Weapons instead of 2.

THANK GOD. Nerfing them to two specials and making a lot of armies illegal would have been stupid even by GW's standards. I might not have to give up on the new codex after all!

This is what I was most concerned about, along with the Chimera changes. 3 Specials are Vets whole identity, taking that away is just the worst kind of douchebaggery.

 Peregrine wrote:

Yes, Executiooner gains Gets Hot for main weapon..

Sigh. What a stupid change. At least with the decrease in point cost you can buy a divination slave inquisitor to fix the problem and even give it an accuracy boost.

Agreed. It seems to have been done because reasons, which is monumentally frustrating. The whole idea of the Executioner pattern was to avoid leaking Plasma all over the tank. Was there a change in cost for Plasma Sponsors? Might help recoup the costs for the Prescience Slave.

it was done because the points went down by 35 if the cap is true...

thats awesome... its only getting hot once in a blue moon, for the pts saved its awesome.,..

this whole thread has been filled with moaning about this and that, heck even the chimeras, which got a buff, since now you get 10 laguns to shoot and two specials vs 3 from the FP's as well as normal shooting. sure they also went up in points, but 55 for av 12 was on the cheap side, not by much though, but pretty much everything else got a points reduction, vets included, to mitigate that anyways.

this codex is actually quite powerful with lots of buffs from what has been seen so far.

it seems to have options other then "spam chimeras with plas/melta vets in it behind an aegis with some dettas" which has been 99% of the guard Ive seen the past year,

so I will actually enjoy chimera spam getting a slight pts increase, while foot guard get a great buff, as do mech tank guard, and things like sentinels.

the orders alone make this a stupid powerfull codex... blobs with precision fire? yes please... tanks with precision fire... yes please...


oh you had a lynchpin guy giving you ++ rerolls? a HQ? some guy you didnt want to die?

sry bro, hes dead.

cue laughter.

Any word on combined squads? PCS finally able to blob up? HWS?

I'm not sure how firing 2 plasmaguns and 10 lasguns is an improvement over firing 3 plasma guns and two lasguns, on top of a points increas, could be considered "a buff".

What's the astropath's ld? 20 points for a lvl 1 telepathy psyker is a steal.

Primaris IC lvl2 divination is 15 points more than a pbs that's lvl1, 5 wound squad instead of IC, pays out the nose for more wounds, and doesn't have divination. Looks like the primaris is the doom of the pbs. It also means IG has more allies options in a single allies tournament now that we don't need allies for divination..

Is a lord commissar still a force org IC or an upgrade to a commissar ?

@CountCyrus - Jex said it was the same as the last codex. So yes they can combine but the PCS is forever alone but with a 12" order radius.

What officers can issue bring it down and fire on my target?

Are we still in 5th ed prices for power weapons?

As an ally to my sisters, Guard does get tasty with the Psykers. 50pt Divination Dispensers? Sure, why not.

portugus, the 3 weapons for vet squads Jex was saying was poorly worded, in that there was the option for a heavy flamer, which if not selected, allowed you to take a third special weapon. It might just be that the Spanish version was cropped poorly or some such. Alternatively my life is a lie and the relief I felt at hearing that vet squads could still carry 3 was premature and I will have to settle for just the points drop

 ultimentra wrote:
So guys, on this whole "vets still get 3 special weapons" thing. I found this floating around-

http://www.mariscal40k.es/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Veteranos.jpg

My spanish is kinda rusty, but I am seeing on the sixth bullet point that only 2 veterans may exchange rifles for special weapons.

Didn't the guy say that they could take two special weapons and a flamer or three special weapons? Sounds like the previous rumour might be right, simply worded weirdly.

 TheKbob wrote:
As an ally to my sisters, Guard does get tasty with the Psykers. 50pt Divination Dispensers? Sure, why not.

Why bother? its 50pts for Ld8 or take an inquisitor that is Ld10 for 55. Not to mention servo skulls make guard ordnance and blast weapons more accurate.

 Ravenous D wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:
As an ally to my sisters, Guard does get tasty with the Psykers. 50pt Divination Dispensers? Sure, why not.

Why bother? its 50pts for Ld8 or take an inquisitor that is Ld10 for 55. Not to mention servo skulls make guard ordnance and blast weapons more accurate.

Primarus are Ld9 and can be ML2 for 25 more points. 75pt psychic power crappers? Yes, please.

Nothing stops you from bringing them AND Inquisitors, technically. so you could have 5 guys slinging divination around for 260 points. Pretty much the entire army is twin-linked at that point.

AkhilleusK42 wrote:
portugus, the 3 weapons for vet squads Jex was saying was poorly worded, in that there was the option for a heavy flamer, which if not selected, allowed you to take a third special weapon. It might just be that the Spanish version was cropped poorly or some such. Alternatively my life is a lie and the relief I felt at hearing that vet squads could still carry 3 was premature and I will have to settle for just the points drop

Google translate of those dot points for vets:

- the veteran sergeant can choose items from lists combat arms and / or ranged weapons
- any veteran can replace your laser rifle from a shotgun (free)
- one veteran voice transmitter can be equipped with (5pts)
- another veteran can replace your rifle for a heavy flamer (10pts)
- two other veterans may form a Heavy Weapons Team Veteran must choose an item from the list of heavy weapons
- up to two veterans who have not chosen one of the above options can replace their laser rifles by an object from the list of special weapons


Then the other dot points are obviously for the Taurox, krak grenades and doctrines.

So, Hydras, they have Skyfire and....that's it? No ignore jink? No shooting ground targets? No interceptor?
It could be 40pts and still be pathetic.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
I'm not sure how firing 2 plasmaguns and 10 lasguns is an improvement over firing 3 plasma guns and two lasguns, on top of a points increas, could be considered "a buff".

5 max casualties vs 12, you trade one special for 8 las guns... sure against terminators its worse, but against stuff like tau or eldar, the volume of fire is more advantageous.


also, you are giving a las gun to bs 4 guys that had pistols, so there is that... with my vets going from 70 pts to 60 pts, and my chimera going from 55 to (60 65?).. it evens out, and comes ahead slightly...

Thanks AllSeeingSkink, that translation sheds a little more light and makes it seem like perhaps Jex misinterpreted the rules. *Sigh* Still, I can live with the reduction in points and cheap doctrines.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
I'm not sure how firing 2 plasmaguns and 10 lasguns is an improvement over firing 3 plasma guns and two lasguns, on top of a points increas, could be considered "a buff".

Well, you save 15 points by not buying the third plasma gun, so the overall cost of the unit dropped by nearly 10%. 6 BS 3 lasguns vs. 1 BS 4 Plasma Gun and 2 BS 4 Lasguns is a pretty bad drop in firepower, but the extra lasguns are slightly better against light infantry. I'll break out a spreadsheet and see how it balances out in a moment...

EDIT: the overall drop in killing power for a plasma veteran squad in a static Chimera with HB and ML, firing all weapons at MEQ (T4, Sv 3+) in 5+ cover at 13-24" is about 9%, according to my calculations. A tiny, tiny bit worse if you have to snap fire the heavy bolter due to moving, but still pretty close to 10%.

 TheKbob wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:
As an ally to my sisters, Guard does get tasty with the Psykers. 50pt Divination Dispensers? Sure, why not.

Why bother? its 50pts for Ld8 or take an inquisitor that is Ld10 for 55. Not to mention servo skulls make guard ordnance and blast weapons more accurate.

Primarus are Ld9 and can be ML2 for 25 more points. 75pt psychic power crappers? Yes, please.

Nothing stops you from bringing them AND Inquisitors, technically. so you could have 5 guys slinging divination around for 260 points. Pretty much the entire army is twin-linked at that point.

Many TOs have a 1 ally restriction

Inquisitor + lvl2 primaris is 25 points cheaper than inq + coteaz

or go 2 inq + primaris if you want 2 grenade caddies and double hammer hand. Conscripts then effectively become s7 and priests can smash ID t7 or less.

 schadenfreude wrote:


Many TOs have a 1 ally restriction

Inquisitor + lvl2 primaris is 25 points cheaper than inq + coteaz

or go 2 inq + primaris if you want 2 grenade caddies and double hammer hand. Conscripts then effectively become s7 and priests can smash ID t7 or less.

I'm aware. If you're guard primary, take Inquisition probably. It's a cheap tack on for more power.

For Sisters, I get to choose between Inquisition or Guard. Guard gets me Vendettas and cheap Psykers, Inquisition gets me Coteaz, Grenade Caddy, Servo Skulls, a 3x cheap scoring units.

I'll play test both. Right now I run SoB + IG + Inq, but that won't fly anymore :(

 schadenfreude wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:
As an ally to my sisters, Guard does get tasty with the Psykers. 50pt Divination Dispensers? Sure, why not.

Why bother? its 50pts for Ld8 or take an inquisitor that is Ld10 for 55. Not to mention servo skulls make guard ordnance and blast weapons more accurate.

Primarus are Ld9 and can be ML2 for 25 more points. 75pt psychic power crappers? Yes, please.

Nothing stops you from bringing them AND Inquisitors, technically. so you could have 5 guys slinging divination around for 260 points. Pretty much the entire army is twin-linked at that point.

Many TOs have a 1 ally restriction

Inquisitor + lvl2 primaris is 25 points cheaper than inq + coteaz

or go 2 inq + primaris if you want 2 grenade caddies and double hammer hand. Conscripts then effectively become s7 and priests can smash ID t7 or less.

You can only take one inquisitor unless they are primary detachment. Anyone know the cost per weapon on heavy weapons. The base cost for a HWT is 45 points. Not sure if the HWT's are 3 models or 1-5 or w.e

 BlaxicanX wrote:
I'm not sure how firing 2 plasmaguns and 10 lasguns is an improvement over firing 3 plasma guns and two lasguns, on top of a points increas, could be considered "a buff".

QFT.

 Tomb King wrote:

You can only take one inquisitor unless they are primary detachment. Anyone know the cost per weapon on heavy weapons. The base cost for a HWT is 45 points. Not sure if the HWT's are 3 models or 1-5 or w.e

I have the book. You can bring two in allied slot. It's an "Inquisitorial Detachment" and has separate rules like a formation does.