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so what is the worst example of cheating in 40k you have ever seen.
il start, I once saw a guy claim that all of his terminators had WS, BS and toughtness 5, and that they have 3 wounds.

There's this kid at my GW who does a lot. Tau player, who likes to give his suits upgrades as they're needed on the battlefield. By the end of most games, his point total goes way over whatthe game is supposed to be. One time, he was playing another Tau player. The kid got mad because the other guy had given his crisis suites some support system I can't remember claiming they couldn't take it. Quick look at the book shows they can, and game moves on. On the kid's next turn all of a sudden his crisis suits have that upgrade.
Only reason we still play him is because he never wins. Also the occasional joke about his paint job.

Couple guys like to add inches onto their movement at my FLGS, no too many "Hey that squad has WS 10, BS 10 Ap1, Eternal Warrior" shenanigans. But there is an Eldar player that has to be reminded constantly that he doesn't have AV14 tanks.

Then you've got the guys who never bother to learn how to play but insist they know everything, and I don't consider them cheaters...just lame players.

When I play there aren't really any cheaters, all my pals play respectively which is what I like to see.

But sometimes, you can see the occasional bull**** lies that players ( Usually in GW ) do or say to you if you are not familiar with the race. Going over the point limit is very common, lying about saves and all that craic is common as well.

I once had someone try and bring 4 versions of Captain Sicarius in an apoc game under the pretence that 'I've given them different names'... Not to mention the fact that we had agreed 3k points max per player, and his list was, off the top of my head and without adding upgrades, closer to 4.5k. He also brought every SM character (most of whom were proxied) and while I don't really have a problem with that as it's within the rules, there was no way that, given the rest of the list, he could have had them all in under 3k.

Other than that, I've been fairly lucky with cheats, not really seeing anything more than a few people trying to occasionally use the 'wargamer's inch'. I also tend to let a hell of a lot slide when playing, always giving my opponent the benefit of the doubt if there is a dispute and even allowing people to backtrack entire phases if they realise they forgot to move something, so maybe people don't feel they need to cheat against me. I play with a very casual crowd, pretty much the epitome of the 'casual' gamer, and I doubt any of my regular opponents would even consider cheating to win.

 Paradigm wrote:
I once had someone try and bring 4 versions of Captain Sicarius in an apoc game under the pretence that 'I've given them different names'... Not to mention the fact that we had agreed 3k points max per player, and his list was, off the top of my head and without adding upgrades, closer to 4.5k. He also brought every SM character (most of whom were proxied) and while I don't really have a problem with that as it's within the rules, there was no way that, given the rest of the list, he could have had them all in under 3k.

Other than that, I've been fairly lucky with cheats, not really seeing anything more than a few people trying to occasionally use the 'wargamer's inch'. I also tend to let a hell of a lot slide when playing, always giving my opponent the benefit of the doubt if there is a dispute and even allowing people to backtrack entire phases if they realise they forgot to move something, so maybe people don't feel they need to cheat against me. I play with a very casual crowd, pretty much the epitome of the 'casual' gamer, and I doubt any of my regular opponents would even consider cheating to win.

Man, that's damn decent of you with the whole "Forgot an entire unit's movement, redo the phase thing.". I play predominantly with my close friends and I NEVER get that sort of slack. Lol.

 Frankenberry wrote:

 Paradigm wrote:
I once had someone try and bring 4 versions of Captain Sicarius in an apoc game under the pretence that 'I've given them different names'... Not to mention the fact that we had agreed 3k points max per player, and his list was, off the top of my head and without adding upgrades, closer to 4.5k. He also brought every SM character (most of whom were proxied) and while I don't really have a problem with that as it's within the rules, there was no way that, given the rest of the list, he could have had them all in under 3k.

Other than that, I've been fairly lucky with cheats, not really seeing anything more than a few people trying to occasionally use the 'wargamer's inch'. I also tend to let a hell of a lot slide when playing, always giving my opponent the benefit of the doubt if there is a dispute and even allowing people to backtrack entire phases if they realise they forgot to move something, so maybe people don't feel they need to cheat against me. I play with a very casual crowd, pretty much the epitome of the 'casual' gamer, and I doubt any of my regular opponents would even consider cheating to win.

Man, that's damn decent of you with the whole "Forgot an entire unit's movement, redo the phase thing.". I play predominantly with my close friends and I NEVER get that sort of slack. Lol.

It's not so much redo the whole phase but If, for example, someone had missed moving a squad onto an objective in the movement phase and had started shooting before realising this, I'll often let them pause shooting and move, and then just go back to where we were. It's not game changing, and to be honest I wouldn't expect my opponent to do the same for me, but when it's obvious they forgotten something important, then I think it's only fair to give them a chance to correct it. Same as if it's unclear whether a particular model or squad can see to shoot, then I'll generally either dice-off or just let the opponent have it.

At the end of the day, winning is less important than having fun, and I'd also rather win through my own skill than through my opponent making a simple mistake. When it comes to 40k, I'll let almost anything go, the only time I'll make a point of contesting something is if it is apparent the opponent is openly cheating or taking advantage of something they shouldn't. But as I only very rarely encounter cheating, this rarely occurs. If I did find someone cheating repeatedly in game I probably would just stop playing immediately. If they're the kind of person that's willing to cheat in what is nothing more than a game, then they're probably not someone I'd want to play.

I only do that with newbies - I was raised on chess, though, where the rule is "take your finger off the piece and you're done", so... remembering to move all your units is part of the game to me.

The rule in 40k for us is "We don't go back in time".

Making mistakes is a lack of skill, after all.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Making mistakes is a lack of skill, after all.

Forgetting to move a squad now and then is more down to simple forgetfulness, rather than lack of skill.

However, remembering to take full part in all of the phases in the right order is a part of the game, and there should be a level of tolerance depending on the situation. I.e. tournament games should have more of a zero tolerance policy if you forget to move anything. A friendly down your LGS... not so much.

This Tau player once told me I couldn't get cover save against his gun even though it doesn't have the Ignore Cover rule. He also didn't allow me to use my armor save. Then, because his super cheat gun hit me (of course it will, you don't let me take cover or armor saves!) he said the rest of his army now ignore cover. What the feth?

This other time I played this Space Marine player. He kept moving his bikes 12" into and out of terrain and he didn't even bother rolling for tests!

Had a Tau player infiltrate Stealth Suits 12' behind a squad of Cultists. When I tried to split-charge, he told me no and I was/am too new and stupid to argue (especially then because it was my first game).

Later that month we played a Kill Team of my 6 Chosen v. his Necrons and he fielded an entire Necron Warrior blob with Reanimation Protocols.

Needless to say, I don't play this kid anymore and it's not just because he has every army ever created, painted and to full WYSIWYG.

This was one of those guys who, no matter what you said, his answer was "Well I've got one of those."

Ex: I don't have any vehicles in my army except a couple Helbrutes. THIS GUY sends a Monolith after me, singing "Oh, I've got this one thing that, when I open my mouth, I win."

That said, because rules (and remembering rules) is such a pain at times, I play as freestyle as possible so no one can get butt-hurt about screwing the pooch one way or another. That said, I also have an army list with 5 HQ choices on it, so you make do with what you can. XD

 Tyberos the Red Wake wrote:
This Tau player once told me I couldn't get cover save against his gun even though it doesn't have the Ignore Cover rule. He also didn't allow me to use my armor save. Then, because his super cheat gun hit me (of course it will, you don't let me take cover or armor saves!) he said the rest of his army now ignore cover. What the feth?

This other time I played this Space Marine player. He kept moving his bikes 12" into and out of terrain and he didn't even bother rolling for tests!

well... although i don't play tau, im pretty sure your thinking of what they like to call a "markerlight"

and yes while it is a real rule (i think) it is still a super cheat gun like you said


as for my disgusting cheat time...
going for first vs a guy in a tournament, played BA (it was in 5th when assult BA was vaible) and he had mephiston. while i was setting up and deploying, he "rolled" his sychick powers. i say "rolled" because i saw him role soemthing down low onto his codex that was on a chair, wasnt really paying attention and asked,
"what was that you rolled?"
and he said,
"my psychic powers, i got iron arm"
"what was the other one?"
"doesn't matter"
"oh lucky, thats gonna be nice"

now heres why i think he cheated.
1) i didnt see the reults on the dice
2) i asked the other people he faced after and they all say he got iron arm also
3) i dont trust the guy.


and because of this iron arm i lost D:

 Tyberos the Red Wake wrote:
This Tau player once told me I couldn't get cover save against his gun even though it doesn't have the Ignore Cover rule. He also didn't allow me to use my armor save. Then, because his super cheat gun hit me (of course it will, you don't let me take cover or armor saves!) he said the rest of his army now ignore cover. What the feth?

Back when I was a newbie in 5th with only a couple games experience, I played against a guy who told me that a Deep Striking unit which suffered a Mishap and rolled Misplaced, would suffer a 2nd mishap if he placed it on the seemingly inaccessible roof of a tall ruined tower

(cannot recall if we agreed that it was accessible difficult terrain or was impassable, but as I recall there was certainly no visible way for a model to climb up - no intervening balconies, ledges or ladders).

This was despite the 5th ed rules clearly stating that when Misplaced, the unit must be placed in a valid formation anywhere except impassable terrain, and that difficult terrain is treated as dangerous. Naturally, I rolled Destroyed and lost my Terminators.

This being just my 2nd or 3rd game (and I being 17 and him in his mid 20's) I took his word for it. The rest of the continued in a similar fashion, with him taking advantage of my unfamiliarity with the rules.

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

1) i didnt see the reults on the dice
2) i asked the other people he faced after and they all say he got iron arm also
3) i dont trust the guy.

4) There were no psychic powers called iron arm that mephiston could take in 5th? Weren't random psychic powers including the biomancy table introduced in 6th?

Had a Grey Knight player bring a 2k point list to a 1.5k point game, no list.

I told him about it after i realized it, and I laughed since I had him on the ropes, but still lost at the end of it

Just a suspious player at our store,
younger kid plays eldar,
he is insanely protective of his dice and will not allow ANYONE to touch them,
he rolls 5s and 6s for days which doesnt seem right

and one day he told a couple guys about how to turn the odds in your favor by soaking the low side of the dice in mineral oil...

I dont know if it works but as far as im concerned hes done it and it works....

 Anfauglir wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Making mistakes is a lack of skill, after all.

Forgetting to move a squad now and then is more down to simple forgetfulness, rather than lack of skill.

However, remembering to take full part in all of the phases in the right order is a part of the game, and there should be a level of tolerance depending on the situation. I.e. tournament games should have more of a zero tolerance policy if you forget to move anything. A friendly down your LGS... not so much.

My friends and I often get caught up in the moment, like seeing someone move a unit into a nice killing field unknowingly, then at the start of the turn get so excited we forget to move and get into the fun business of killing the unit dead... while the other person smiles at such forgetfulness.

Fortunately we're all friends, so we allow 'mulligans' for that sort of thing. Everyone tends to get one per game, any more than that they usually get told no. I've done it enough to appreciate it when I'm allowed to take a mulligan that I let my friends do so.

This is, however, a friendly game with friends. Against a random person, probably not, because I know the favour won't be returned.

For most of my games it's halfway through the movement phase and I say "aw heck, I forgot to see if my Riptide pilot burns his fingers".

The other player usually lets me roll, my riptide loves to overheat...a lot...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
To add something actually relevant to the thread though, back when Tau first came out (I mean the original first codex) I was watching someone play a game, Dark Eldar vs Tau. I happened to have the codex at the time but I wasn't a real player yet, just a kid with big dreams.

Watched the tau player fire first turn and destroy a huge part of the opposing force, then he says "and my battlesuits use their 'core point' to fire again."

There is not, nor ever was, a mechanic in the Tau codex called "core points", nor is there or ever was a mechanic allowing Tau to fire twice in the same shooting phase. The only reason I didn't call him on it was because I was a little grade school kid and 1. nobody would take me seriously, 2. I wasn't sure if there might be some weird variant rule I didn't know about.

Not so much "cheating" - as I reserve that word for intentionally breaking rules...

I played three games with an extra vindicator on the table. One of my friends finally messaged me the next day and was like "Man I can't figure out how you built that list."

I looked it up and sure enough I had mixed two lists. My fault completely. I came clean with everyone. It didn't really matter though - I had lost all three of those games....

Which doesnt say much about my playing skill.

I played a guy who ran Blood Angels. Funny how all his units had "red paint job" from the orcs and got +1" movement.

 KonTheory wrote:
Just a suspious player at our store,
younger kid plays eldar,
he is insanely protective of his dice and will not allow ANYONE to touch them,
he rolls 5s and 6s for days which doesnt seem right

and one day he told a couple guys about how to turn the odds in your favor by soaking the low side of the dice in mineral oil...

I dont know if it works but as far as im concerned hes done it and it works....

I would just tell your FLGS owner about it, just say you have concerns about the dice and go from there. We had someone like that and after our FLGS owner and TO asked the kid to see his dice, he never brought them in again. Magically he started to lose a few games as well so it was a win win

I love this thread.

It's not cheating that I claim my army get a 2+ cover save because they are painted camouflage. Trololol

 motyak wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

1) i didnt see the reults on the dice
2) i asked the other people he faced after and they all say he got iron arm also
3) i dont trust the guy.

4) There were no psychic powers called iron arm that mephiston could take in 5th? Weren't random psychic powers including the biomancy table introduced in 6th?

lol your right....

early 6th then.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 dementedwombat wrote:
I happened to have the codex at the time but I wasn't a real player yet, just a kid with big dreams.

There is not, nor ever was, a mechanic in the Tau codex called "core points", nor is there or ever was a mechanic allowing Tau to fire twice in the same shooting phase. The only reason I didn't call him on it was because I was a little grade school kid and 1. nobody would take me seriously,

you say you didnt call him out cause 1) you were a little grade school kid.
the tau dex was only realeased like what, half a year ago? woudnt you still be in grades school?

no im not insulting you, cause im not that old myself, but just saw that and something felt off.

 gmaleron wrote:

 KonTheory wrote:
Just a suspious player at our store,
younger kid plays eldar,
he is insanely protective of his dice and will not allow ANYONE to touch them,
he rolls 5s and 6s for days which doesnt seem right

and one day he told a couple guys about how to turn the odds in your favor by soaking the low side of the dice in mineral oil...

I dont know if it works but as far as im concerned hes done it and it works....

I would just tell your FLGS owner about it, just say you have concerns about the dice and go from there. We had someone like that and after our FLGS owner and TO asked the kid to see his dice, he never brought them in again. Magically he started to lose a few games as well so it was a win win

Yeah the owner of the store knows... His answer to the problem is... He spends lots of money in the store so if it bothers you just don't play him
Seems legit to me... I have never played the kid personally.. And don't plan on it

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

 motyak wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

1) i didnt see the reults on the dice
2) i asked the other people he faced after and they all say he got iron arm also
3) i dont trust the guy.

4) There were no psychic powers called iron arm that mephiston could take in 5th? Weren't random psychic powers including the biomancy table introduced in 6th?

lol your right....

early 6th then.

All good, I wasn't sure if the cheating in that scenario was him making up psychic powers (which happened to share with this edition's powers) or the whole rolling thing etc.

 ninjafiredragon wrote:

 dementedwombat wrote:
I happened to have the codex at the time but I wasn't a real player yet, just a kid with big dreams.

There is not, nor ever was, a mechanic in the Tau codex called "core points", nor is there or ever was a mechanic allowing Tau to fire twice in the same shooting phase. The only reason I didn't call him on it was because I was a little grade school kid and 1. nobody would take me seriously,

you say you didnt call him out cause 1) you were a little grade school kid.
the tau dex was only realeased like what, half a year ago? woudnt you still be in grades school?

no im not insulting you, cause im not that old myself, but just saw that and something felt off.

You saw the bit where he mentions it was their first Codex right?

GW opened up a brand new store in the supermall in auburn, Washington. It had been open I would say 6 months, when they felt comfortable with the amount of people that they decided to run a league, and first place would get into white dwarf with their army, as it was a company wide thing going on, and some minor prizes. This was back in 3rd, I was playing my orks, and got all the way to the finals. The other player was playing blood angels (this was before chaos 3.5. Anyway we are told a week before what the final mission will be......cleanse......with every model in your army that you own allowed. Now it dosent take a genius to figure out what is wrong with this idea. Basically it was GW's way to convince people you need to buy more stuff.

Long story short, I show up (shouldn't have really to protest the BS) with my 2200 points of orks, only to see across the board roughly 4.5k worth of blood angels. Not only did he buy like 4 more units that week, he had his friends and him paint them 3 colors to be board legal, and they looked crappy. Its a bad sight when you see the ORKS are outnumbered by MARINES. Even though I did about 2800 in points deaths to him, I was tabled.

I only mention this because Im still pretty bitter about it, having a COMPANY cheat just to push their plastic crack. Everyone after either thought A:: this is how it is with GW, and If I want to compete, I have to play just the one army so I can buy enough stuff to compete, or B: this is bullcrap, I am not even going to bother competing next time.

I once took a phone call and came back to find an objective marker on the other side of a building, much closer to the guys who were going to run up and get it. There was another guy who would move his guys and then space them out 2 inches away from each other, effectively giving himself a 8'' move. Another guy who I clearly saw pick up a 3 when he needed 4s to wound.

But off all those the one that makes me the most mad was the first player I ever played. I went into a GW looking for a beginner battle but no one else showed up so one of the regulars decided to play against me. He had dark eldar, an army I was really interested in getting at the time. I told him I had 750pts and he spent a while making his list. He then wiped the floor with me. When I went home I added up the points to his list and taking just the bare minimum he was over 300pts higher than he should be.