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 Jancoran wrote:

 Zarroc1733 wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:

Drider wrote:
TBH i don't see this as a reflection on dominions but more a reflection of the randomness of exorcists.

I'll buy that but it makes it no less true. The random nature of the Exorcist and the reality that it can and often is one-shot'd by the crazy number of alpha strikes people can and do bring now is highly relevant.

I rarely have this issue, but I run my sisters with inquisition. I park my Exo right beside a heavy weapons squad with Coteaz and anyone who tries to alpha strike my exo gets blown off the field.

I dont think we're talking about just pods here. But sure, if someone attempts it ion that way, sure. But a Lascannon to the side arc will do it just as well from 48 inches out. So i dont think Coteaz is going to save you from that, nor the turn one charges. And Wulfen, while you might think 3+ invuls are no issue with two wounds, actually, as it turns out, are.when podding.

So yes. there are some things you can attempt to do about it. I'm not going tto rely on a plan for a tournament that involves hoping none of these things happen. =)

True enough. I suppose it's just a difference in lists and preferences.

Well it's the new codex's, not preferences. the new codex's and the ITC are combining forces to make Alpha Strikes, even ranged ones, the absolute way to go.

All the rulings the ITC stuffs down our throats make alpha strikes the best plan. All the new codex's have super in your face speed ups that take away any opportunity for clever deploying and movement. what good does a well timed battle plan do if the enemy simply locks you in place round one and forces you to do nothing but roll dice in close combat or forces you into a corner in round ONE before you move a muscle and the entire battle happens there?

So Exorcists are really a "damage over time" kind of unit that relies on the weight of time to be its ally in providing value. If it only gets one turn to express how cool it is, it probably won't.

Under normal ciscumstances you might have been able to ensure that more. Now? White Scars can fire on it with ignores cover round one. Done. Wulfen can send their Wolfstars turn one downrange. Maaaaybe it gets one round off.

meanwhile the Tyranid Formation has people coming in within 1" of you and charging round one. Yup.

and Chaos can bring its assault pods. thats super fun.

Skyhammer Annihilation? you actually have an answer for that in Coteaz, which is cool.

The game has really diminished the tactical possibilities of the game by making everything happen so fast. maneuvering and such are taking a back seat in a huge way. That's the new reality.

Again that's what i am seeing at ITC events. I saw a triple Knight with three Riptide list last tournament. it can sit and shoot you all day and throw up 2+/3+ invuls and 4+ ion Shields. Once you're ranged stuff is dead, they just walk away and shoot the closest thing, rinse, repeat.

This is why I bring the fight to them. That is why Dominions are needed. They cannot escape the Dominions nor play keep away. The Dominions are coming and they can get AROUND the enemy, forcing the ion shield decision in the case of Imperial Knights and obviously they bring a lot of firepower that now must dominate that units attention if it survives it. It's in every way more survivable if you slap the Rhino shells on them and force them to fire through two levels of ablation to stop the damage dealing element of the unit.

Anyways i really do preferthe Dominions in all cases to the Exorcist. That's reflected pretty obviously in my list. But i have three lovinging ly painted exorcists and only one of them ever gets to come out and play. Until GW and the ITC stop teaming up to obliterate strategic play, it's just going to come down to who can last longer.

We've seen that in the bent togards Nurgle forces, the taking of units like Triple Tides and Triple Knights, or other fairly powerful deathstars that are hard to remove like the Tau Crisis star with Shadowsun in the middle.

It's just where we are at.

Maybe so, where I live there are few 40k players and while we have tournaments they definitely aren't big. (Actually I have to drive 3 hours for tournaments, but I go when I can.) So its possible I just haven't seen a lot of all that, and what I have seen I've been able to outplay.

Honestly Exorcists are just so unreliable I'm starting to think that the best way to play them may well be to dangle them out to draw fire away from the rest of your army rather than actually hiding them away in the back line. I mean at least if the dice are cold and their shooting sucks they could potentially draw fire away from transports and they look a lot more threatening in the middle of the table.

Exorcists are the bees knees. They have a great punch for their points. The only problem is keeping them alive passed turn 1. Recently, If I don't go first, I've been keeping them in reserve. It may limit their overall usefullness but it guarantees you get to fire them both once. At LVO neither exorcist got to fire twice in any of the 6 games.

 deviantduck wrote:
Exorcists are the bees knees. They have a great punch for their points. The only problem is keeping them alive passed turn 1. Recently, If I don't go first, I've been keeping them in reserve. It may limit their overall usefullness but it guarantees you get to fire them both once. At LVO neither exorcist got to fire twice in any of the 6 games.

I am going to the Bay Area Open and if i take sisters of battle, I will have probably one. I just can't justify more. And its mostly there to say "look at me! Oh me first! Can i be first?!'

I'll be going to the OFCC Open in July and here's my list. I haven't gotten to play SOB for a while, so it'll be nice to get back in the saddle. Got a bunch of work to do to repair damage and apparently I never converted a fourth Repressor, so I need to do that as well. Super basic SOB pure list with Knight.

Saint Celestine - 135 (On VSG and Counter charge)
5 BSS with MM and TL-MM Immo - 130 (on VSG)
5 BSS with 2 Melta in Repressor - 155
VSG with 2 extra shields - 100
5 Dominions with 4 Melta in Repressor - 180
5 Dominions with 4 Melta in Repressor - 180
5 Dominions with 4 Melta in Repressor - 180
Exorcist - 125
Exorcist - 125
Exorcist - 125
Acheron - 415

1850

Ah! I will also be at OFCC. And for that one I am taking two Exorcists. Mostly becauseI needed a filler at 2K.

Adepta Sororitas

: Combined Arms Detachment (Primary Detachment) (71#, 1999 pts)

6 Retributor Squad(Simulacrum Imperialis + Heavy Flamer x4)
1 Veteran Retributor Superior (Melta Bombs + Combi-Flamer x1)
1 Rhino(Dozer Blade)

1 Exorcist

1 Exorcist

4 Battle Sister Squad (Flamer + Flamer)
1 Sister Superior, (Melta Bombs)
1 Rhino (Hunter-killer Missile)

4 Battle Sister Squad (Flamer + Flamer)
1 Sister Superior, (Melta Bombs)
1 Rhino (Hunter-killer Missile)

7 Repentia Squad
1 Rhino (Hunter-killer Missile)

1 Ecclesiarchy Battle Conclave
2 Crusader, 8 Death Cult Assassin
1 Rhino (Hunter-killer Missile)

1 Uriah Jacobus

1 Canoness (Combi-Flamer x1+ Melta Bombs+ Rosarius, 1 Mantle of Ophelia)

1 Ministorum Priest (Melta Bombs, 1 Litanies of Faith)

7 Dominion Squad (Simulacrum Imperialis + Meltagun x4)
1 Veteran Dominion Superior (Melta Bombs + Combi-Meltagun x1)
1 Rhino

7 Dominion Squad (Simulacrum Imperialis + Meltagun x4)
1 Veteran Dominion Superior (Melta Bombs + Combi-Meltagun x1)
1 Rhino (Laud Hailer)

7 Dominion Squad (Simulacrum Imperialis + Meltagun x4)
1 Veteran Dominion Superior (Melta Bombs + Combi-Meltagun x1)
1 Rhino

 Jancoran wrote:
Ah! I will also be at OFCC. And for that one I am taking two Exorcists. Mostly becauseI needed a filler at 2K.

Well, that's team event though.

True. I haven't signed up for the other event. I suppose i need to make a decision on that pretty soon. I might take Tau Empire to the ITC event beforehand.

Question really is: will my back handle 8 games of Warhammer in one weekend? Hmm...

Agreed on the exorcist, I'm having way more luck with heavy bolter heavy squads (rending twice a game is fun) and dominions.

 sfshilo wrote:
Agreed on the exorcist, I'm having way more luck with heavy bolter heavy squads (rending twice a game is fun) and dominions.

Have you tried Bastion Retributors with Uriah? 2 Extra HB and an extra use of rending.

Jancoran, you seem to enjoy the hunter-killers... any tactical commentary in support of them? Its an easy enough modelling add-on and quick points sink, maybe I need to whip up a couple on magnetic hard points and mess around with them.

Edit: Can you HK the same round you Smoke?

 pretre wrote:

 sfshilo wrote:
Agreed on the exorcist, I'm having way more luck with heavy bolter heavy squads (rending twice a game is fun) and dominions.

Have you tried Bastion Retributors with Uriah? 2 Extra HB and an extra use of rending.

I prefer the firestorm redoubt with cannons and a void shield.

 MacPhail wrote:
Jancoran, you seem to enjoy the hunter-killers... any tactical commentary in support of them? Its an easy enough modelling add-on and quick points sink, maybe I need to whip up a couple on magnetic hard points and mess around with them.

Edit: Can you HK the same round you Smoke?

Hunter Killers are like all weapons. Can't fire if you blow smoke.

It's about a couple things. First, i want units that cant contribute, to contribute. the missile is an easy way to cause that. Also, certain armies are going to come at you full tilt and i want some extra chances to slow them down or damage them first. A little whittling goes a long way when you have a finisher units like the Battle Conclave and the Sisters Repentia. Sisters Repentia will kill Imperial Knights and just about every other target you point them at as long as the Canoness and her Priest friend are there. But you want to make sure you limit the hit when it comes because sisters are not QUITE wet noodles in cloe combat (that distinction goes to Tau Empire) but they are the next closest thing.

40 points will only buy me another Priest maybe, or 2-3 more Sisters of Battle but that same 40 points can buy me a couple dead Rhinos or Raiders or whatever. With Sisters of Battle the best defense is a good offense..

 sfshilo wrote:

 pretre wrote:

 sfshilo wrote:
Agreed on the exorcist, I'm having way more luck with heavy bolter heavy squads (rending twice a game is fun) and dominions.

Have you tried Bastion Retributors with Uriah? 2 Extra HB and an extra use of rending.

I prefer the firestorm redoubt with cannons and a void shield.

It's cool, but it's automated, more expensive and doesn't give you extra HB. The Bastion is fairly cheap and is a force multiplier for Rets.

Fun picture, just because I've been painting the last two days.

I saw your melta spam pic on facebook and was interested in what list are you are planing using?

I have also come into a large windfall of mini's myself recently,

Yeah, which list needs 28 meltas? I'm curious. I just painted and converted up a bunch for mine.

Im on the road so i cant cut and paste. But my blog has an article on it. You can fit about 60 meltas in 2 CAD's by various means at 2k. A few less in 1850. Either way, Adepta Sororitas don't have plama and Gravity B.S. and easy access to drop pods, nor a single formation. Not one. What we do have is a reeeeeal bad attitude at close range and the ability to get there.

 pretre wrote:
Yeah, which list needs 28 meltas? I'm curious. I just painted and converted up a bunch for mine.

Coincidently, it takes 27 melta shots to kill one D-Cannon Wraithkinght (assuming average rolls and no other factors such as Preferred Enemy, Cover, etcetera).

27 Shots @ BS 4 = 18 Hits

18 Hits @ S8 vs T8 = 9 Wounds (no armor saves)

9 Wounds vs 5+++ FNP = 6 Wounds go through and 1 D-Cannon Wraithknight is dead.

More shots would be needed for Sword & Board Wraithknight.

Which raises the question, how do Sisters deal with Wraithknights?

 hllshire wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Yeah, which list needs 28 meltas? I'm curious. I just painted and converted up a bunch for mine.

Coincidently, it takes 27 melta shots to kill one D-Cannon Wraithkinght (assuming average rolls and no other factors such as Preferred Enemy, Cover, etcetera).

27 Shots @ BS 4 = 18 Hits

18 Hits @ S8 vs T8 = 9 Wounds (no armor saves)

9 Wounds vs 5+++ FNP = 6 Wounds go through and 1 D-Cannon Wraithknight is dead.

More shots would be needed for Sword & Board Wraithknight.

Which raises the question, how do Sisters deal with Wraithknights?

60 meltas

 hllshire wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Yeah, which list needs 28 meltas? I'm curious. I just painted and converted up a bunch for mine.

Coincidently, it takes 27 melta shots to kill one D-Cannon Wraithkinght (assuming average rolls and no other factors such as Preferred Enemy, Cover, etcetera).

27 Shots @ BS 4 = 18 Hits

18 Hits @ S8 vs T8 = 9 Wounds (no armor saves)

9 Wounds vs 5+++ FNP = 6 Wounds go through and 1 D-Cannon Wraithknight is dead.

More shots would be needed for Sword & Board Wraithknight.

Which raises the question, how do Sisters deal with Wraithknights?

I've found with sisters I can generally ignore wraith knights and play the mission. Killing Eldar ObSec is normally a higher priority

I can only remember the last 3 wraithknights I faced, but 2 died to drop pod meltas + exorcists on top of 1, and the third dude was a dummy and moved at me 6 inches top of 1, and my Celestine wolf star ate it bottom of 1. I don't get to play against eldar much, but I don't think a wraithknight has ever lasted more than 2 turns against me. Maybe I'm the lucky outlier?

 hllshire wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Yeah, which list needs 28 meltas? I'm curious. I just painted and converted up a bunch for mine.

Coincidently, it takes 27 melta shots to kill one D-Cannon Wraithkinght (assuming average rolls and no other factors such as Preferred Enemy, Cover, etcetera).

27 Shots @ BS 4 = 18 Hits

18 Hits @ S8 vs T8 = 9 Wounds (no armor saves)

9 Wounds vs 5+++ FNP = 6 Wounds go through and 1 D-Cannon Wraithknight is dead.

More shots would be needed for Sword & Board Wraithknight.

Which raises the question, how do Sisters deal with Wraithknights?

A knight ally is what I use. Soften up the wraithknight with shooting, assault by turn 2 or 3. If they focus fire on the knight, well all the better they ain't shooting at you.

via Lady Atia on War of Sigmar
https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/941
Fellow Sisters and Arbites players - be happy, the Repressor should be back soon @ Forgeworld within the next weeks

Here's a question for y'all...

Does anyone ever upgrade weapons on a Seraphim Superior? I've been running them with dual pistols, but I have the models for power sword, power axe, or eviscerator. They'll eventually get painted, but will they ever get fielded? I mainly use them in bigger games (1850 and up) to drop deep and either burn objective holders in cover or tie up scary shooters for a turn or two. One squad runs with Celestine in big games and is that much more likely to see an assault or two as they hunt backfield buffing HQs. Do the sword and axe have a place in these squads?

Feel free to argue for melta bombs, too.

The melta bomb is the only upgrade worth it's point on the seraphim superior IMHO.
For the price of the power weapon upgrade, i think you're just better off paying an extra body or option somewhere.

I think i didn't field any upgrade on the superior (except said melta bomb) since 5th ed...

I agree. Melta bombs or dual pistols.

TBH, never run them. Celestine runs solo or with a fast ally, my fast attack is always Dominions. Beautiful models though.