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Before I begin, allow me to apologise if this should go in GD. I hope an appropriate mod will move it there if that is the case.

The Objective
So, the name of the game is Units that are strictly speaking good, but have such a high price that you just can't justify them. This can be a unit that was once awesome but in this edition its price just makes it too hard to take and have a good army. My Goal here is to see what units would people take if they were just that smidgen cheaper.

The Rules
The unit Must be from a current, running Codex.
As Tyranids are about to drop, I would like it if people did not submit tyranid options for the time being.
The unit must be good. I.e; it can't be something you'd take as cannon fodder if only it were 3 points.
You have to be able to justify why the unit is good and in what respects. (The reason *can* be that it would make good cannon fodder.)
The Price decrease must be no more than 20% to make them effective (of course, for units below 10 points this is just 1 point.)
You may submit any number of entries for any number of codex, as long as all are justified.

Format
Unit name
FOC place
Codex
Base Price
Upgraded Price (If applicable)
Why it is good
Why it is too expensive

I'll begin with my personal Choices

Unit name: Centurion Devastators
FOC place: Heavy Support
Codex: Space Marines
Base Price 60
Upgraded Price: 90
Why is it good?
The Centurion Devastator is a surprisingly shooty unit for SM. Upgraded to carry Grave Cannons and missile launchers, and given either tigurius or a Dark Angels / Blood Angels/(space wolves?) libby, you're looking at 30 attacks with full re-rolls that wound against armour. Add to that, 6 missiles per turn. The unit is a tanky if slow threat, so your opponent will shoot most likely have to shoot at it or face the consequences down the line. This means your unit can soak a tremendous amount of firepower, ensuring the effectiveness of the rest of your army quite nicely. To top it all off, you're looking at a marine unit with the fire power of a xenos unit, ensuring that it is a huge, very well-focussed shooter.
Why is it expensive?
For the above build, you're looking at 540 points, not including a librarian. If the squad got a models 17% decrease to 75 points, (10 off the price of centurions base, since they have no invulnerable saves compared to terminators, and 5 off grav cannons given their horrendous range and lack of deep strike options), you'd be looking at an overall drop in price of just 90 points that would enable them to be a good firesoak in sixth edition while being cost effective.

Unit name: Chaos Possessed
FOC Place: Elites
Codex: CSM
Base Price: 26
Upgraded Price: 32-35 depending on choice of marks and veterans of the long war
Why is it good?
Possessed have strength 5 basic, plus 2 attacks per model on their profile and are fearless, with a 5+ invulnerable save due to being daemons in addition to their standard power armour. They also have the possiblility of ap3 attacks amongst other bonuses due to their vessels of chaos rule. Their stats can be boosted to make them more damaging (marks of khorne or slaanesh) or more resilient (nurgle or tzeentch). They can also take icons for feel no pain or other bonuses depending on their mark.

Finally, and this won't come up much, they also cause fear due to being daemons.

Why is it expensive?
A minimum sized unit is 140pts for 5 possessed and a champion. This unit has no ranged potential or a transport vehicle. Also unfortunately they struggle to get into assault without a land raider which makes a squad of 10 plus their ride cost around 500pts.

To improve Possessed, I would consider a points drop to around 20-21pts per model, but also allow them to purchase upgrades to either give them wings (jump infantry) or make them beasts. This would help them get into combat which is where they want to be without them relying on a transport vehicle.

I would also like the champion to buy melee weapons and allow the squad to take rending attacks.

There is sooo much changes that need to be done on Possesed to make them viable, and i don't even speak of good...

Unit name: Necron Heavy Destroyers
FOC place: Fast Attack
Codex: Necron
Base Price: 40
Upgraded Price (If applicable): 60
Why it is good: A Lascannon on a T5 frame that moves 12"
Why it is too expensive: 60 points is *way* too much for a 1 wound T5 model with a 3+ save. If they were 40 points (and regular destroyers 30) they'd be amazing. Destroyers used to be thing thing for Necrons, now they're terrible.

Sorry in a bit of a rush so going to just say what I see. Wave serpents - not too exepensive, rather far too cheap, and we all know why. Also servo skulls, taking away certain units and even whole armies entire strengths is ridiculous for 3 fething points.
For too expensive - jp death company. Stupid stupid price.

Unit:Kommandoz
FOC: Elite
Codex:Orks
Base Price:10 per model
Why they are good:Orks that can take burnas and can outflank or inflatrate
Why they are too expensive: Still just an ork boy stat line and cant take a group no more that 15 in a unit. sure this is a hell of a lot cheaper than alot of other armies units but hey, they are orks and when a normal boy cost 6 pts why must i pay 10 for a little snazzier boy

Unit name: Lych Guards
FOC place: Elite
Codex: Necrons
Base Price: Squad - 200 Individual - 40
Upgraded Price: Squad - 225 Individual - 45

Why is it good?
A solid armor save combined with heavy hitting potential, they can be upgraded to have an Invulnerable save and a Power sword. They are a solid close combat unit because they are durable and hit harder than any other unit in the codex, and also harder than units from other armies. Ignoring armor saves and rolling 2d6 to hit vehicles allows them to effectively wreck anything in close combat.

Why is it expensive?
Because Terminators exist. Lych Guards have a 3+/4++ and a S5 AP3 Melee weapon for 45pts. Terminators have a 2+/3++ and a S8 AP2 Melee weapon for the same points cost. If Lych Guards were just 36pts when upgraded then taking them in an army would be justifiable. They would still be an expensive unit, but for the killing power you have it would be at least justifiable. They would function as a Glass cannon unit. As they stand now, there is simply no reason to take them.

Jump pack DC. Done. OH! Poly ninjaed me.

Unit name: Terminators
Codex: Tons of them
Base price: Like, a million points or something

Why is it good: Uh...2+ save, I guess?

Why is it expensive: Because you got to roll 2d6 for it's saves in 2nd Edition; it has not been good since then.

Unit name -Storm Troopers
FOC place -Elites
Codex -Imperial Guard
Base Price -16 ppm
Upgraded Price (If applicable) -12 ppm

Why it is good

Versatile, variety of special rules and deployment strategies like scout, outflank, infiltrate and deepstrike with re-roll, can take 2 specials, BS4, AP3 base gun and a rare 4+ armour save for IG make them interesting and fairly effective as a Commando style unit that can fulfill a particular role like tank hunter or be harassment.

Why it is too expensive

They're more expensive than Marines and their overall anti-Marine firepower is greatly exaggerated by the points cost, if they were considerably cheaper they'd be more viable. Other Codexes get far better alpha strike units for less or equal points with more special weapons, the cost is just a joke. Paying the huge premium just for putting two BS4 specials where they need to be is hugely cost inefficient.

You pit 10 Storm Troopers against 10 Marines and I personally guarantee that given he doesn't roll abysmally or you don't roll insanely well the Storm Troopers will almost always lose, probably still with specials tacked on top. And they're about 40-50 points more expensive overall then.

Ogryn

Elites

Codex: Imperial Guard

Base Price: 130 pts

Upgrade price : 40 points per additional model.

Why it is good: Ogryns are very tough and strong, even more so than Terminators. They have good abilities and a decent number of attacks in CQC. If you buff them with a Lord Inquisitor they can make for a very mean assault unit.

Why it is too Expensive: Ogryns pay terminator prices for a unit with a 5+ save and LD: 7. In addition, they suffer from a problem many otherwise good units suffer: Being in Codex: Imperial Guard. For the same cost as them you can get a Vendetta which has better firepower, can transport guys and is much more durable.

Defiler

Heavy

Codex csm

Base price 195

Why its good: use to be point efficient. Can upgrade for 2 additional dccw for free. Can shoot cannon and move/charge.

Why its expensive: because GW wanted to sell mualerfiends/forgefiends so they nerfed the king of hvy metal and made him more expensive.

Was going to discuss demon prince but people still use them.

Khorne Berzekers
Elites or Troops
Chaos Space Marines
105pts for a squad of 5 including Champion, additional members 19pts each.
Upgraded price can be 22-37 points for members with Plasma Pistol

Why is it good?
These guys were pretty good in 5th Edition, with a healthy number of attacks and weren't too expensive. They still retain some good aspects such as WS5, FC and MoK.

Why is it too expensive?
These guys are 4ppm more expensive than a standard CSM with CCW and Mark of Khorne, with the Berzekers' only advantage being WS5. The standard Chainaxe in the kit is now an upgrade, nice Ap4 CCW, but is an additional 3 points per model. Not a lot but when upgrading a whole squad it's a lot of points.

Filch wrote:
Why its expensive: because GW wanted to sell mualerfiends/forgefiends so they nerfed the king of hvy metal and made him more expensive.

Was going to discuss demon prince but people still use them.

This isn't the kind of reason we're looking for here. Blaming GW doesn't actually tell me anything. Is it too expensive for its current points because it's not survivable? Too expensive because it doesn't have the range, mobility or firepower to be effective? What makes the current price unbearable?
Also you can discuss any unit you'd like. It's personal opinions here.

TheCustomLime wrote:
Why it is good: Ogryns are very tough and strong, even more so than Terminators. They have good abilities and a decent number of attacks in CQC. If you buff them with a Lord Inquisitor they can make for a very mean assault unit.

One niggling thing here, CQC refers to Close Quarters Combat. CQC refers to Fighting with shooting weapons in close quarters. i.e; they may be 1 meter from you, but you shoot them instead of stabbing them. Close combat is not the same thing as CQC and to avoid this error, refer to it as assault.

Otherwise a nice appraisal. I can see why they could be lowered. I'd put them around 28-ish points personally.

Valkyrie wrote:
Why is it too expensive?
These guys are 4ppm more expensive than a standard CSM with CCW and Mark of Khorne, with the Berzekers' only advantage being WS5. The standard Chainaxe in the kit is now an upgrade, nice Ap4 CCW, but is an additional 3 points per model. Not a lot but when upgrading a whole squad it's a lot of points.

So, wait. You can't make the bare-bones model out of the kit? That's kind-of weird.

Unit name - Vespid Stingwings
FOC place - Fast Attack
Codex - Tau Empire
Base Price -18 ppm
Upgraded Price (If applicable) -10 for Strain leader

Why they are good - AP 3 weapons which are pretty decent.

Why they are bad - WAY to expensive for what they do in a codex that has better options for AP3

Honestly I would still use them though. I find that the Tau codex is pretty good for points and all the 40k newer codex releases. Compared to Warhammer Fantasy where pretty much EVER named character Lord choice is outrageously overpriced. 300-650 points for a single character makes a 200 point model in 40k extremely reasonably priced haha

Stormtroopers are great. 115 pts for 2 meltas + plazma pistol with an insured deepstrike. They're an awesome tank-hunter death-drop. And instead of 3 melta-drop chaos termies, they have to be dealt with cause their weaponry ain't 1-use. So compared to a fairly effective chaos combi-melta termies that cost 112 pts which is like the same they've got less survivability and are afraid of mellee but have an ensured drop mechanics and non-1-use weapons.

So what i consider overpriced:

Unit name - Flash gitz
FOC place - Heavy Support
Codex - Orkses
Base Price -25 ppm
Upgraded price (if applicable) - 40 or 45 if you get cybork bodies with grotsnik.

Why good: they're basically nobz with some bigger gunz and a shinier armor for just 5 pts!
Why expensive: to make them effective u'll need all the weapon upgrades which are 5 pts each cause you want + 1 str to make it s6, -1 ap to make ap1-3 appear more often when you need it and you definitely need +1 shot cause bs2 ain't that good with such a low rate of fire and 4+ armor means you want to have 5++ that costs 5 pts per model or they'll get mowed down by a few autocannonz. So to make them good you need to pay 45 pts for guyz with t4, 4+/5++ bs2 and ld7 that can't take no power klawz or even bosspoles. For 40 pts you can take almost 6 boyz that are gona be more durable, do more damage and remain way more reliable with mob rule and a nob with bosspole. Also with a -1 ap upgrade they get a free Gets Hot! Which means that with bs2 and 4+ armor u're inflicting the same ammount or even more wounds to flash gits themselves rather than an enemy. To compensate that u'll need Kaptain Badruk that has 3 rerolls to hit. So a squad of 9 guyz + badruk + dok for fnp are 600 pts. For a squad that is afraid of mellee, is slow, not very durable and has damage output like a single wave serpent but 1/3 of the time can have ap1 or ap2.

Also a fully upgraded truck is 85 pts. For a 10-10-10 opentopped without jink and a 2/3 chance to explode with every destroy result (even wreck).

Unit: Stealth Suits
FOC: Elites
Codex:Tau Empire
Base cost: 30ppm
Upgraded cost: 35+ depending on upgrades

Good because. Coming with stealth and shrouded as standard, a stealth team in all but the lightest cover will have a 2+ cover save. And they get all the bonuses of having jet packs. They have burst cannons as standard, so are great at taking on hordes, and there is the possibility of tank hunting when equipped with fusion blasters. You can also boost their utility with drones.

Overpriced because: they are in the same FOC slot as both crisis suits and riptides. Unlike the former there is no stealth team commander or bodyguard and while crisis suits lack stealth and shrouded they are tougher and have more wounds, crisis teams also have access to more drones. They are also expensive per shot, a crisis team will have more dakka per point, and more dakka overall and retain similar surviveability due to the JsJ mechanics of tau battlesuits. Crisis teams also surpass stealth teams in tank hunting, being able to take more fusion blasters and in cheaper squads, and tank hunting can also be performed by Pirhanas. Stealth teams are something that is rarely taken, mainly because compared to riptides and crisis teams they are a bad buy

How I would fix them: for what you get they are perhaps a little overpriced,so a drop to 25ppm would be welcome, but what would make them more commonly seen is an FOC switch, possibly to troops. Perhaps even allow them to take more fusion blasters in a squad and they would take back a tank hunting niche from the crisis teams. Stealth teams are by no means a bad unit, but compared to crisis teams and riptides you just can't justify 30ppm AND and elites choice, and the elites choice is really the truly overpriced aspect

Unit: Thousand Sons
FOC: Elites/Troops
Codex:Chaos Space Marines
Base cost: 23ppm plus Sorcerer-upgrade
Upgraded cost: Icon of Flame and Rhino are the only upgrades available besides Sorcerer wargear.

Good because: AP3 Bolters and a 4+ Invulnerable save. The AP3 obviously murders any MEQ squad caught in rapid-fire range without cover saves, while the Invul effectively allows you to carry decent cover with you at all times. The Sergeant also comes with a Force weapon over a standard Power weapon, and gains a single power from the Tzeentch table. Finally, Fearless ensures they will hold an objective until death.

Overpriced because: They are ludicrously expensive for their offensive and defensive capabilities that are irrelevant against many opponents. Orks, DE, Guard and Deathwing do not care at all for your AP3, and similarly the 4++ only means a thing when you have neither Armour nor Cover to fall behind. All of this comes in so expensive that you can attain similar defense and Marine-killing abilities simply by taking larger numbers of stock Chaos Marines and throwing dice about. No special weapons, Slow & Purposeful and absent melee abilities make the squad weaker in all areas that aren't spamming AP3.
The Sorcerer is silly-expensive for his upgrades that are forced upon you. The Tzeentch powers are also all awful to the extent that an actual Plasma Gunner would probably serve you better. Finally, Champion of Chaos exists to make sure your expensive, fragile investment just cannot wait to throw himself in harms way,

How I would fix them: I would make the Sons far, far cheaper. As in, a handful of points more than a stock CSM expensive. I would then make the 4++, AP3 etc. abilities bestowed by the Sorcerer as Psychic powers. These would then be increased with powers to grant FNP, ignore cover etc so that the unit becomes a psychically-powered toolbox that adapts to the enemy, to compliment the melee juggernauts, infantry-slaughtering shooting and absurd durability of the other Cults. Finally I would remove Champion of Chaos from him so he can actually use his Rubrics as a guard.

Unit: The Sanguinor
Foc: HQ
Codex: Blood Angels
Base Cost: 275

Good because: Assassin in a challenge. Upgrades a sergeant. Gives units within 6" +1a. 2+/3++ Eternal warrior.

Overpriced because: Can't realistically harm models with a 2+ which is pretty pants for a model that is supposed to challenge enemy comanders. Cannot join units and has t4 and only 3 wounds so dies when some Eldar Guardians look at him funny. Is quite a spread out model so needs big terrain to hide. Costs 275pts.

Hiw to fix him: either reduce his points or give him FMC or at least jump MC status. Means he still can't join a unit and solves his ap3 issue, also quite a fluffy fix. At 275pts he either needs T5 or w4, so he wont vapourize in front of guardians.

Any and all marine dreadnoughts.
Foc: elites/heavies
Cost: 100ish+ upgrades in general

They're good for weapon load outs, and being able to jump into melee and be nigh invulnerable against weak troops.

Overpriced: In today's meta, anyone can easily handle av 12 or 13 with whatever unit they brought that was intended to hunt flyers. That and the slow movement speed of the dreads makes them easy to ignore, or easy to kill.

Fix: -25 points. Or add a parry/block invulnerable save to dreads who still have their dccw.
Additionally, they need some small movement boost, like being able to run while shooting.

Poly Ranger wrote:
Unit: The Sanguinor
Foc: HQ
Codex: Blood Angels
Base Cost: 275

Good because: Assassin in a challenge. Upgrades a sergeant. Gives units within 6" +1a. 2+/3++ Eternal warrior.

Overpriced because: Can't realistically harm models with a 2+ which is pretty pants for a model that is supposed to challenge enemy comanders. Cannot join units and has t4 and only 3 wounds so dies when some Eldar Guardians look at him funny. Is quite a spread out model so needs big terrain to hide. Costs 275pts.

Hiw to fix him: either reduce his points or give him FMC or at least jump MC status. Means he still can't join a unit and solves his ap3 issue, also quite a fluffy fix. At 275pts he either needs T5 or w4, so he wont vapourize in front of guardians.

I hate the Sanguinor so much it hurts.

 Scipio Africanus wrote:

TheCustomLime wrote:
Why it is good: Ogryns are very tough and strong, even more so than Terminators. They have good abilities and a decent number of attacks in CQC. If you buff them with a Lord Inquisitor they can make for a very mean assault unit.

One niggling thing here, CQC refers to Close Quarters Combat. CQC refers to Fighting with shooting weapons in close quarters. i.e; they may be 1 meter from you, but you shoot them instead of stabbing them. Close combat is not the same thing as CQC and to avoid this error, refer to it as assault.

Otherwise a nice appraisal. I can see why they could be lowered. I'd put them around 28-ish points personally.

Actually, I think CQC is apt for Ogryn as they have an Assault 3 S5 R12" gun, so even before charging they can put out a lot of mid-strength shots. While they are perfectly usable as-is, I wouldn't say no to a price drop in the new Dex.

Valkyrie wrote:
Why is it too expensive?
These guys are 4ppm more expensive than a standard CSM with CCW and Mark of Khorne, with the Berzekers' only advantage being WS5. The standard Chainaxe in the kit is now an upgrade, nice Ap4 CCW, but is an additional 3 points per model. Not a lot but when upgrading a whole squad it's a lot of points.

So, wait. You can't make the bare-bones model out of the kit? That's kind-of weird.

Mozzamanx wrote:
Unit: Thousand Sons
FOC: Elites/Troops
Codex:Chaos Space Marines
Base cost: 23ppm plus Sorcerer-upgrade
Upgraded cost: Icon of Flame and Rhino are the only upgrades available besides Sorcerer wargear.

Good because: AP3 Bolters and a 4+ Invulnerable save. The AP3 obviously murders any MEQ squad caught in rapid-fire range without cover saves, while the Invul effectively allows you to carry decent cover with you at all times. The Sergeant also comes with a Force weapon over a standard Power weapon, and gains a single power from the Tzeentch table. Finally, Fearless ensures they will hold an objective until death.

Overpriced because: They are ludicrously expensive for their offensive and defensive capabilities that are irrelevant against many opponents. Orks, DE, Guard and Deathwing do not care at all for your AP3, and similarly the 4++ only means a thing when you have neither Armour nor Cover to fall behind. All of this comes in so expensive that you can attain similar defense and Marine-killing abilities simply by taking larger numbers of stock Chaos Marines and throwing dice about. No special weapons, Slow & Purposeful and absent melee abilities make the squad weaker in all areas that aren't spamming AP3.
The Sorcerer is silly-expensive for his upgrades that are forced upon you. The Tzeentch powers are also all awful to the extent that an actual Plasma Gunner would probably serve you better. Finally, Champion of Chaos exists to make sure your expensive, fragile investment just cannot wait to throw himself in harms way,

How I would fix them: I would make the Sons far, far cheaper. As in, a handful of points more than a stock CSM expensive. I would then make the 4++, AP3 etc. abilities bestowed by the Sorcerer as Psychic powers. These would then be increased with powers to grant FNP, ignore cover etc so that the unit becomes a psychically-powered toolbox that adapts to the enemy, to compliment the melee juggernauts, infantry-slaughtering shooting and absurd durability of the other Cults. Finally I would remove Champion of Chaos from him so he can actually use his Rubrics as a guard.

As much as i love the models i have to agree the rules suck. the champion of Chaos definitely needs to be removed. my reason is alot more fluffy though. did Ahriman do some big giant spell that got him kicked out of the main Ksons and make all the rubrics in the first place. which was intended for his sourcerous allies to NOT mutate???????

Unit name: Kroot Shaper
FOC place: Troop
Codex: Tau Empire
Base Price: 6
Upgraded Price: 15
Why it is good:
- +1 Ld over base Kroot
- 3W. 3A
Why it is too expensive :
- It's a 21 point Kroot, more expensive than the previous edition, and offers absolutely nothing to Kroot other than LD buff. Even the hounds give acute senses for a third of the cost.
-He does have 3 wounds, but at T3 6+ they won't be too useful. He is three times the wounds of a standard kroot, for three times the price, without having three times the gun.
-The addition of a single pulse rifle or pulse carbine just doesn't really help, except extend their lethal range by 6". It's more of a situation where that's how the model was so they kept it in the codex.

Hexwolf wrote:
Unit name: Lych Guards
FOC place: Elite
Codex: Necrons
Base Price: Squad - 200 Individual - 40
Upgraded Price: Squad - 225 Individual - 45

Why is it good?
A solid armor save combined with heavy hitting potential, they can be upgraded to have an Invulnerable save and a Power sword. They are a solid close combat unit because they are durable and hit harder than any other unit in the codex, and also harder than units from other armies. Ignoring armor saves and rolling 2d6 to hit vehicles allows them to effectively wreck anything in close combat.

Why is it expensive?
Because Terminators exist. Lych Guards have a 3+/4++ and a S5 AP3 Melee weapon for 45pts. Terminators have a 2+/3++ and a S8 AP2 Melee weapon for the same points cost. If Lych Guards were just 36pts when upgraded then taking them in an army would be justifiable. They would still be an expensive unit, but for the killing power you have it would be at least justifiable. They would function as a Glass cannon unit. As they stand now, there is simply no reason to take them.

Hi, what s8 ap 2 melee weapon are You refering to?

gausus wrote:

Hexwolf wrote:
Unit name: Lych Guards
FOC place: Elite
Codex: Necrons
Base Price: Squad - 200 Individual - 40
Upgraded Price: Squad - 225 Individual - 45

Why is it good?
A solid armor save combined with heavy hitting potential, they can be upgraded to have an Invulnerable save and a Power sword. They are a solid close combat unit because they are durable and hit harder than any other unit in the codex, and also harder than units from other armies. Ignoring armor saves and rolling 2d6 to hit vehicles allows them to effectively wreck anything in close combat.

Why is it expensive?
Because Terminators exist. Lych Guards have a 3+/4++ and a S5 AP3 Melee weapon for 45pts. Terminators have a 2+/3++ and a S8 AP2 Melee weapon for the same points cost. If Lych Guards were just 36pts when upgraded then taking them in an army would be justifiable. They would still be an expensive unit, but for the killing power you have it would be at least justifiable. They would function as a Glass cannon unit. As they stand now, there is simply no reason to take them.

Hi, what s8 ap 2 melee weapon are You refering to?

Powerfist is 2xS and AP2, termies have S4. Also assault termies can have Thunder Hammers, which have the same stats.

 chiefbigredman wrote:
Unit name - Vespid Stingwings
FOC place - Fast Attack
Codex - Tau Empire
Base Price -18 ppm
Upgraded Price (If applicable) -10 for Strain leader

Why they are good - AP 3 weapons which are pretty decent.

Why they are bad - WAY to expensive for what they do in a codex that has better options for AP3

Honestly I would still use them though. I find that the Tau codex is pretty good for points and all the 40k newer codex releases. Compared to Warhammer Fantasy where pretty much EVER named character Lord choice is outrageously overpriced. 300-650 points for a single character makes a 200 point model in 40k extremely reasonably priced haha

I've used these as allies in a Drop Pod Space Marine list. With their ability to Deep Strike into cover, they can come down next to a locator beacon to avoid scatter, secure themselves some safety in area terrain, and use their AP 3 weapons to do some horrific damage to MEQ units.

I feel like you could pick any non AV14 vehicle or walker in the game right now sans maybe well.. (Wave Serpent).

Unit Name - Flash Gitz
FOC - HS
Codex - Orkz
Base Price - 25 ppm
Upgraded Price - Can cost between 45 and 50 points per model.

Why are they good? - Very capable as a source of ranged Ignores Cover s6 shooting on an assault weapon profile.

Why are they bad? Upgrades are overcosted and the unit is not capable of taking a Power Klaw. Part of the points cost of these gitz is the amazing melee statline and assault class weapon, not having a klaw relegates assault targets to light infantry. They don't have a dedicated transport and are in Heavy Support, conflicting with the only other transports we can take.

Seems that I'm stating the obvious... but anyways, here it goes.

Unit name - Nephilim Jetfighter
FOC place - Fast Attack
Codex - Dark Angels
Base Price - 180
Upgraded Price - n/a

Why it is good - One of the few means of air defense in the Dark Angels codex. Ravenwing players may find room for those in their forces if they have the points to spare - other players will find them conflicting with the more useful Ravenwing bikes and speeders.

Why it is too expensive - Chronically undergunned, the Nephilim is mediocre at every role - lacks the strenght to deal with hard targets and the ROF to threaten soft ones. The mandatory missiles are laughable at S:6 AP:4. Unlike the (way cheaper) Stormtalon, it only offers two weapon loadouts: An avenger mega bolter (essentially an assault cannon without the rending USR), and a twin-linked lascannon that somewhat conflicts with the fixed heavy bolter and missiles. Given that 90% of the Nephilim's armaments are unable to penetrate armor values over 11, the "relentless hunter" special rule is next to useless.

 koooaei wrote:
Stormtroopers are great. 115 pts for 2 meltas + plazma pistol with an insured deepstrike. They're an awesome tank-hunter death-drop. And instead of 3 melta-drop chaos termies, they have to be dealt with cause their weaponry ain't 1-use. So compared to a fairly effective chaos combi-melta termies that cost 112 pts which is like the same they've got less survivability and are afraid of mellee but have an ensured drop mechanics and non-1-use weapons.

That's literally the only use for them, and if your opponent didn't bring medium-heavy tanks (otherwise the overkill just made your investment pointless) uses predominantly MC's or bubble wrapped the vehicles to the extent that getting within 6'' is a physical impossibility, they're lackluster.