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Hello all,

Lately I've been trying to do oil washes and somewhat failing at it. I'm beginning to think maybe the thinner I'm using isn't well suited to it. I'm just using Mineral Turpentine (which I've been told is the same as "white spirits"), but even over a gloss coat, it soaks in to the underlying paint instead of into the crevices like I've seen in tutorials (initially it seeps in to the crevices, but after a few seconds simply darkens the entire area). Then when I come to clean it up, it takes off the underlying gloss coat and several layers of paint. The only real success I've had it to paint it in to the crevice and almost immediately get a clean brush to blend it in to the surrounding panel, but this isn't really ideal as it's very time consuming and not the effect I'm trying to achieve.

One tutorial I read mentioned that some turpenoid thinners will strip paint and aren't appropriate for oil washes, but I've tried 2 different brands of mineral turps and both had the same effect.

Could it be I'm using the wrong thinner? What should I use? Maybe the gloss coat I'm using is insufficient (using GW 'ardcoat)? Am I not mixing the wash properly?

I dunno, any help would be appreciated.

I had the exact same problem.
Turpentine is WRONG. it eats the acrylics and therefore ruins the entire point of the excercise.. It's not the same as white spirit, although the naming sometimes really does overlap, which leads to this problem.
You need proper white spirits, these won't attack the acrylics.

That is very well worth knowing.

I have real turpentine but I haven't used it for oil washes.

Now I am forewarned!

Just to be sure, test it on some sprue. I had a RW Bike piece with feathers I used to test this... The turpentine ate down right onto the primer and on some edges even removed it with strokes of the cotton bud!

Yes, it's very deceptive, because I've had multiple people tell me to use turps and when you initially use apply it, it looks great. A few seconds later it soaks in to the surrounding paint and when you try and clean it up, it just strips all the underlying paint with the slightest touch of a cotton bud.

I just noticed the brand of mineral turpentine I used also makes something called a white spirit, it must be in a different section of the store though because I never saw it. Will go back to the shop tomorrow and see if that works better.

I have a feeling what I currently have would probably work fine as a wash over an enamel, but it seems it just eats acrylics.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
This is what I was trying to use, it even says "Diggers Mineral Turpentine is a white-spirit hydrocarbon solvent commonly used for thinning oil-based paints and cleaning paint brushes and equipment after painting."

http://www.bunnings.com.au/diggers-1l-mineral-turpentine_p1560821

I'll go back and buy some of this and see if it works better...

http://www.bunnings.com.au/white-spirit-diggers-1l-whs0106_p1563471

I wonder if the confusion comes from "white spirit" being a more generic term? I really don't know, I'll try the thing labelled as white spirit and hopefully that works.

Exactly. If you happen to be not in an English speaking land, it just gets worse. Somehow White Spirit and Mineral Spirit are used interchangeably.. Probably Mineral Spirit is a sup type of white spirits. Just take care it does not say turpentine anywhere and is cheap, that should work.
Here in Germany, it's Waschbenzin, which roughly translates to (washing) benzine.

Don't know that brand, but just the fact it's sold in 1l quantities is a good indicator it is the right one

Yeah, white spirit (at least this brand) seems to be marketed more as a cleaner than a thinner, so hopefully that's the same thing as the "washing benzine" you have.

I believe Digger is an Australian brand.

Turpentine is a natural oil from pine trees. Oil painters use it for mixing and thinning their paints.

White spirit is cheaper than real turpentine and house painters use it for cleaning brushes and so on. It works for thinning enamel paints. House painters don't usually need to think their oil based paints -- just use it straight out of the can. I don't know what white spirits is made of.

Here's a safety data sheet that says Benzene is in it.

http://www.crowndecoratorcentre.co.uk/Product%20Data%20sheets/decorators%20choice%20white%20spirit%20112012.pdf

There might be different types of white spirit.

The stuff I use is 'Daler-Rowney Low Odour Thinners'.

No issues with it over Klear / Future.

Yeah, what I have is called mineral turpentine, so I assume that doesn't come from pine trees. Wikipedia says white spirits = mineral turpentine, but then the Diggers brand has one thing called mineral turpentine and another thing called white spirits.

So I'm really confused, lol. I'm going to buy some of what is branded white spirits tomorrow and see if that works as desired.

Mineral Turpentine is super cheap, even cheaper than the white spirits ($3 per litre vs $6 per litre).

It's all very confusing. Maybe I'll go with something actually marketed as a thinner if the white spirits too easily soaks in to the gloss coat/acrylic.

Here is a link to some oil wash tutorials I did;

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/572215.page

I talk about using mineral spirits and some other general tips with oils, might help.

A.

Iv been using this for oil wash with no problems

Yeah, I wonder if it's just a subtle difference in naming of solvents that are close together but not the same. It seems the people talking about mineral spirits are from the US and people talking about white spirits are European and somewhere in the middle there are also people saying white spirit and mineral turpentine are the same even though this Australian brand sells one thing called white spirit and another called mineral turpentine, suggesting they aren't the same. All very confusing, lol.

Just stay way from anything that says "turpentine", that's probably your best guess

If you have any good information on this issue and product recomendations - please add them to the "painting with oils" dakka article (you can find it quickly by clicking in my article edit link under my profile picture).

Cheers

Also, give your models a gloss coat before applying the wash, this will help reduce the absorption of the surface areas and help pooling in the recesses.

best of luck!

Would mineral turpentine be good for stripping paint off tanks? I have a baneblade and the thought of soaking that in god knows how much dettol makes me cringe...

Maybe... it might melt it though. I only apply small amounts of mineral turpentine when oil washing and it's enough to take off several layers of paint with a wipe, but if you applied enough of it to get the paint out of the cracks, it may melt the plastic... I really don't know, never tried it!

FYI, the stuff is pretty horrible on the lungs as well, so I'm not sure it'd be an improvement over dettol anyway.

EDIT: Just googled it, apparently it's not great for stripping, it softens both paint and plastic, so will destroy detail before you really get much paint off. I guess I'm using comparably very little when oil washing that it's only enough to take off a few layers of paint with a cotton bud but not actually destroy the detail.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Yeah, I wonder if it's just a subtle difference in naming of solvents that are close together but not the same. It seems the people talking about mineral spirits are from the US and people talking about white spirits are European and somewhere in the middle there are also people saying white spirit and mineral turpentine are the same even though this Australian brand sells one thing called white spirit and another called mineral turpentine, suggesting they aren't the same. All very confusing, lol.

The best thing is to look up the web site of your local manufacturer and download the safety data sheets, which will list the ingredients.

Got some white spirits, works a heck of a lot better!

It has less capillary action, so you have to apply it a bit more, but it doesn't soak in to the underlying paint and when you come to remove it with a cotton bud, you CAN actually remove it without stripping the underlying paint.

I still need to play around with it to learn how to use it better, but it's a lot better than mineral turps.

It will still strip the underlying paint (even with a gloss varnish) if you aren't careful, but it takes a lot more force to accidentally strip the underlying paint.

Lesson learned: Whoever says mineral turpentine in Australia is the same as mineral spirits/white spirits in other countries is lying (including wikipedia!) lol

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Got some white spirits, works a heck of a lot better!

It has less capillary action, so you have to apply it a bit more, but it doesn't soak in to the underlying paint and when you come to remove it with a cotton bud, you CAN actually remove it without stripping the underlying paint.

I still need to play around with it to learn how to use it better, but it's a lot better than mineral turps.

It will still strip the underlying paint (even with a gloss varnish) if you aren't careful, but it takes a lot more force to accidentally strip the underlying paint.

Lesson learned: Whoever says mineral turpentine in Australia is the same as mineral spirits/white spirits in other countries is lying (including wikipedia!) lol

I must agree. I only started using Oil Wash not to long ago myself. And I had these exact same issues. I now currently own white spirits, and like 2 bottles of turps and minerial turps. I cannot for the life of me find oderless in Australia, so currently using White Spirit's from Riot Arts And Crafts. Does the job, plus you might want to get some - Long Life self shining floor polish. Or Future floor polish as it use to be called or w/e. A coat of that stuff, straight no dilution threw an airbrush, nothing is getting threw it lol, stuff is super strong. I hope this helped.

regards,


James

I use sansodor from Winsor and newton. Although it is quite slow drying I never had any problem with it eating through vallejo gloss varnish. On the linky you will see that it is recommended for those that don't want to use turpentine.
http://www.winsornewton.com/products.aspx?PageID=297&ProductID=835