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Stumbled upon human civilians that are no threat to them?

Let's say they are on patrol and run into them farming or doing another peaceful activity...

Depends on the type of Eldar.

Some Eldar will leave them alone. If the world the Humans have settled on is a Maiden World, they will tell the Humans to leave. Some Eldar will simply wipe them out.

The Tau will attempt to bring them into the Tau Empire.

So they would not just slaughter them (most of the time)?

And what would happen if the same circumstances were to happen but with IG finding eldar civilians....

I think the eldar might. If they were trying to be sneaky and were spotted by some farmers, I imagine they would kill them to make sure they didn't inform anyone.

IG are told to kill any xenos they find. That is not a guarantee they will though.

Highly Dependant on which Eldar Craftworld finds them. Biel-Tan would almost certainly wipe them out with no warning whatsoever if that planet happened to be a Maiden World. If Ulthwe came across the settlement, Eldrad would peer into the future and read the strands of fate. If he determined there was even a small chance that one day, in the distant future, this planet would raise an army that could in some way threaten the Craftworld or the Eldar race, they would be wiped out. Saim-Hann would probably activly search for a reason to invade, and destroy them. Iyanden would most likely avoid them, as would Alaitoc. My own Craftworld, Mymeara, would probably never have discovered the planet in the first place, as they are isolationists.

usmcmidn wrote:
So they would not just slaughter them (most of the time)?

Eldar see humans as animals. If the humans are not threat to them or if they do not require any of the resources the humans posses, the Eldar might just leave them alone. On the other hand, if the humans are somehow troublesome or just in the way, the Eldar will exterminate them without a second thought.

Tau see humans more as equals, and might try to negotiate.

And what would happen if the same circumstances were to happen but with IG finding eldar civilians....

IG are taught to hate all xenos, and they will attack the Eldar mercilessly. (But because all Eldar civilians are trained as Guardians, they will slaughter the IG.)

 Psienesis wrote:
Depends on the type of Eldar.

Some Eldar will leave them alone. If the world the Humans have settled on is a Maiden World, they will tell the Humans to leave. Some Eldar will simply wipe them out.

The Tau will attempt to bring them into the Tau Empire.

Or if the Ranger wants the D/V at the moment...

Love can bloom!

usmcmidn wrote:
So they would not just slaughter them (most of the time)?

And what would happen if the same circumstances were to happen but with IG finding eldar civilians....

The Eldar would either leave them alone or kill them all.

The Tau would subvert the society into their own Empire, any who resisted would be killed or sterilized.


IG would wipe out Eldar civilians, although Civilians is somewhat of a Misnomer with Eldar. Guardians are civilian eldar.

Depends on the Eldar society it is. If it's Exodites they'd probably attack then fight dinosaurs for a while. If things get too bad for the Exodites they can ask a Craftworld for help and then things go veeeeeeery bad for the IG.

 Grey Templar wrote:

usmcmidn wrote:
So they would not just slaughter them (most of the time)?

And what would happen if the same circumstances were to happen but with IG finding eldar civilians....

The Eldar would either leave them alone or kill them all.

The Tau would subvert the society into their own Empire, any who resisted would be killed or sterilized.


IG would wipe out Eldar civilians, although Civilians is somewhat of a Misnomer with Eldar. Guardians are civilian eldar.

Tau don't sterilize people.

Tau would try to make them join their Empire or would wipe them out.

Eldar would either leave them alone or wipe them out depending on what their mystics told them.

I'm guessing the Tau response would look about like this:

Stranger, I bid you greetings in the name of the Tau.

If you are reading this then you will have encountered one of our messengers drones and are therefore a spacefaring race. Soon you will see more evidence of us, this is no cause for alarm.

When you encounter one of our ships or outposts then welcome it. We have much to offer a faithful friend. We are five castes, one people. The earth caste build and manufacture, the air caste pilot and navigate, the water caste liase and arbitrate, the fire caste guard our holdings and defeat our enemies. All are bound to the dream of bringing a new way to the universe.

I hope you will choose to share the culture, technology and protection of the Tau empire.

The one constant in the universe is change, the wise adapt.

Believe in our destiny.

I have read somewhere that the Tau do quietly sterilize resistant or troublesome populations as part of their “routine medical treatment.” Though that isn't in any codex I've read, so I'm not sure how much I trust it. However in the 6th Ed Tau codex, it does mention troublesome leaders that refuse to be re-educated never return from their re-education trips. Additionally I've read somewhere (once again not sure where, so take with a grain of salt) that most human populations, in more hotly contested space, are removed from their planets and sent further into Tau space. This serves to both to better educate them in the greater good and to protect them from Imperial retaliation. The IoM gets really upset with traitors for some reason. It also lets the Tau build up a better garrison.

As for the Eldar encountering the world of farmers; I would like to note that the Eldar Corsair Fleets run the spectrum of friendly trading, to pirating ships entering and leaving the planet, to almost Dark Eldar type stuff.
The Dark Eldar would just unleash untold horror on the world, then probably claim (lie) that they destroyed countless PDF before enslaving the few remaining citizens when they returned to their Dark City.

The sterilization thing I am pretty sure was from the tau ending of Dawn of War. Some of that got carried forward in the FF RPG to make the Tau more sinister.

Not sure if any of that has come from black library stuff, I avoid it.

Depends on the eldar commander. In the 4e codex a corsair of Biel-Tan attack an imperial settlement until it surrendered and moved the population to a nearby moon. If the humans aren't causing trouble the eldar I doubt will care. Its only when humanity/aliens are a genuine threat or in Biel-Tan's case when they colonize eldar worlds do craftworlds' act.

Most of what I've read about the Tau generally portrays them as more focused on the 'long game.' While the Imperium will respond as soon as the Bureaucracy notices that they are taking losses, the Tau will take generations to bring a planet into the Greater Good; if they can afford the time and it's safely behind the front lines. Tau are most likely patient enough to just wait until the malcontents die of old age, while swaying the hearts and minds of their children. More efficient that way, you get more Gue'la workers.

Oh, and I forgot to mention, wandering Troupes of Harlequins are said to roam the galaxy, frequent and perform on just about Every Species' worlds. They believe it's important to pass on the lessons of the Fall to the 'Younger' or 'Lesser' Races. Though I have trouble seeing how anybody can understand a bunch of crazy space-elf interpretive dance without actually knowing the legends before-hand.

Anybody else ever notice just how fractured and varied Eldar are? No wonder the IoM doesn't trust them.

I doubt Eldar would just murder people. They only do things if it helps the survival of their race [as in redirecting Nids into Imperial], so killing some civilians would be a waste of time.

 sing your life wrote:
I doubt Eldar would just murder people.

The really enlightened Eldar can stretch themself so far as to admit that lesser races might possibly be "people". Those that want to bring back the Eldar Empire admit no such thing. It's not murder if they're not people.

Besides, if the Farseer says they're a threat the Eldar will put on their War Masks and not give a second thought to who or what they kill until the battle is over.

 sing your life wrote:
I doubt Eldar would just murder people. They only do things if it helps the survival of their race [as in redirecting Nids into Imperial], so killing some civilians would be a waste of time.

Dark Eldar are Eldar too, and they love murdering! ( ) Most races have trouble telling the Eldar apart, so you can't forget the Soul-Thieves' impact, in my opinion.

According to the 4th and 6th Ed Eldar Codecies: Biel-tan's view is, (and I'm paraphrasing here) when it's finally time to rebuild the Eldar Empire (whenever that may be), the Exodite Worlds (only mentioned in the 6th Ed Codex: Maiden Worlds as well) will be their staging ground. Biel-Tan is (implied unknowingly to their victims) known to slaughter Explorator Fleets who land on (important: both of the Codecies only says) Exodite worlds. Biel-Tan sees any colonization by other species as a threat to their (eventual) dream of an Empire.
How I read into that is, it could go either way with Biel-Tan. If they've got nothing better to do other than keep their swords sharp, might as well sharpen those blades on some innocent colonists. If they've got bigger fish to fry (as most races do at the close of the 41 Millennium), they will let them be... for now. But whenever it's time to start the Eldar Empire again, watch out!

 sing your life wrote:
I doubt Eldar would just murder people.

To Eldar humans are not people.

 Crimson wrote:

usmcmidn wrote:
So they would not just slaughter them (most of the time)?

Eldar see humans as animals. If the humans are not threat to them or if they do not require any of the resources the humans posses, the Eldar might just leave them alone. On the other hand, if the humans are somehow troublesome or just in the way, the Eldar will exterminate them without a second thought.

Tau see humans more as equals, and might try to negotiate.

And what would happen if the same circumstances were to happen but with IG finding eldar civilians....

IG are taught to hate all xenos, and they will attack the Eldar mercilessly. (But because all Eldar civilians are trained as Guardians, they will slaughter the IG.)

the slaghter of guardsmen is very unlikely, they would presumably be a regiment or better yet a battlegroup capable of killing an eldar settlement. And basilisks.

 Farseer Morlengal wrote:

 sing your life wrote:
I doubt Eldar would just murder people. They only do things if it helps the survival of their race [as in redirecting Nids into Imperial], so killing some civilians would be a waste of time.

Dark Eldar are Eldar too, and they love murdering! ( ) Most races have trouble telling the Eldar apart, so you can't forget the Soul-Thieves' impact, in my opinion.

Murdering is far to quick for DE. They prefer things that are more often considered war crimes.

And yes, if they found an undefended human planet, they would remove the population

I think the question isn't as grand as people are answering.

It asks what happens if Eldar or Tau run into civilians and specifically suggests that its a small group of Eldar/Tau not a full army.

Chances are if the civilians didn't notice the Eldar/Tau then the Eldar/Tau would continue performing whatever mission they were assigned.
Extermination of those civilians is only going to be of benefit if the scouting party are identified, and thus put at potential risk of the civilians reporting them. Extermination also creates missing people and bodies and things like that draw attention.

As a direct result they might avoid killing simply to avoid detection of themselves by the Imperium; or they might specifically be out there to kill those civilians to draw the Imperial attention in that direction and away from other areas.


Going onto the grander scale we can assume that Eldar keep very close watch over their CraftWorlds - as a result any landing upon them is likely killed off before it even reaches the planets surface; if they do reach that far they'd be killed without question.

Tau are more likely to approach and attempt to convert the population; however that relies upon there being almost no Imperial threat - and that has to oft remain the case for a considerable length of time (ergo if you do start negotiations you've got to block or otherwise isolate the population from contacting the Imperium at large). It's very hard to convert people to your way of life when you're being shot at.



And if IG discover innocent Eldar or Tau - depends on the sizes of the forces. Again a group of scouts is unlikely to engage them. They'd likely report them for greater powers to decide if they should be attacked; or they'd simply ignore them in the case of the Tau - no point devoting resources to attacking civilians unless there is a reason to do so (That reason can, of course be, Xenophobia - but you've got to make sure that the attack won't spark a response you can't meet).

Another possibility hasn't been mentioned yet: the Eldar might use the humans as slaves or pawns. ESPECIALLY if they're DE or corsairs with a strong DE element. Many Eldar are happy to use humans for their own purposes if it will save some of their own hides.

 Overread wrote:
I think the question isn't as grand as people are answering.

I both agree and disagree. I think the majority of the answers here can be summed up with, "just about anything you imagine." It all depends on the size of the group, who makes up the group (to use an old pun, there's a rainbow of Eldar types), the exact circumstances of the meeting and the length of time we are talking about. Depending on all of these, the situation can get as grand or insignificant as we want. However, I think you've pointed out something that most of us have been forgetting:

It asks what happens if Eldar or Tau run into civilians and specifically suggests that its a small group of Eldar/Tau not a full army.

I do agree that In a small enough group (a scouting party of Rangers or Pathfinders {both kinds of Pathfinders?}) it would most likely go down exactly how you say. But they have to report back what they find eventually, and where would the Eldar or Tau take it from there? Depending on who we're talking about, that tale could turn very bloody or extremely insignificant (a Troupe of Harlequins discovers planet of Agra-workers, dances for them, leaves planet. End of story). For the Eldar, especially, this limits what groups we are talking about. Harlequins don't scout, they wander. Craftworld Eldar have Rangers and Pathfinders to do the scouting for them, which would make them the only Eldar to consider from a Craftworld perspective. But Rangers/ Pathfinders are known to mostly just wander around as well, only giving information and doing recon-scouting for a Craftworld, when said Craftworld goes to war. Exodites have no reason to leave the planet (they don't wear soulstones, their Planet is their soulstone, so why leave the safety of the world?), and if an Exodite scout party found a Human settlement on the the Exodites' world, you can expect the Humans to get eaten by Eldar-Trained Dinosaurs. Corsairs and DE could probably be compared quite well in how they scout, though not so much in how they react. This may end with a Corsair detachment scanning the planet, deciding it's nothing and flying on about their business, or with him heading back to tell his Fleet that he's found a primary target for piracy or just hiding out, or even worse. As for the DE, they would all be variations on, "Raid the planet and party in their blood; then carry as many Humans as we can, back to be used as cattle."

As for the Tau, the same question can be posed, though slightly differently. Which Caste is doing the scouting? If it's a first-time encounter, it's most likely an Earth Caste Probe doing the encounter, so I would like to second this response:

 dementedwombat wrote:
I'm guessing the Tau response would look about like this:

Stranger, I bid you greetings in the name of the Tau.

If you are reading this then you will have encountered one of our messengers drones and are therefore a spacefaring race. Soon you will see more evidence of us, this is no cause for alarm.

When you encounter one of our ships or outposts then welcome it. We have much to offer a faithful friend. We are five castes, one people. The earth caste build and manufacture, the air caste pilot and navigate, the water caste liase and arbitrate, the fire caste guard our holdings and defeat our enemies. All are bound to the dream of bringing a new way to the universe.

I hope you will choose to share the culture, technology and protection of the Tau empire.

The one constant in the universe is change, the wise adapt.

Believe in our destiny.

 dementedwombat wrote:
I'm guessing the Tau response would look about like this:

Stranger, I bid you greetings in the name of the Tau.

If you are reading this then you will have encountered one of our messengers drones and are therefore a spacefaring race. Soon you will see more evidence of us, this is no cause for alarm.

When you encounter one of our ships or outposts then welcome it. We have much to offer a faithful friend. We are five castes, one people. The earth caste build and manufacture, the air caste pilot and navigate, the water caste liase and arbitrate, the fire caste guard our holdings and defeat our enemies. All are bound to the dream of bringing a new way to the universe.

I hope you will choose to share the culture, technology and protection of the Tau empire.

The one constant in the universe is change, the wise adapt.

Believe in our destiny.

Nicely done

re the sterlisation - I think it fits quite nicely with the Tau ethos - especially if the population don't know its happening like the Ascen did to Earth in Stargate Season 4 Epsiode "2010" - very effective and they would likely consider it a "kinder" way.

Didn't realise the Tau would move humans about. Do they have a sense of family? For example if the Tau empire rocked up tomorrow and told the whole of the earths population to move out, would you just be herded into a transport and sent off god knows where or would you all be split up depending on skill sets.

For example my wife is an amazing at organisation and communication and yet I am good at electronics and computer, would they see that as an excuse to scatter us across the depths of space?

If so my Zombie Apocalypse planning can halt.....I need to prepare for the alien overlords!

 Overread wrote:

Going onto the grander scale we can assume that Eldar keep very close watch over their CraftWorlds - as a result any landing upon them is likely killed off before it even reaches the planets surface; if they do reach that far they'd be killed without question.

Craftworlds are enormous spaceships and many of them are covered in weapon batteries. They are packed with eldar, unless most of them have been killed, in which case they are packed with Wraithguard. To say that Eldar keep a close watch on the the only vehicles that a faction of them live on seems kind of silly.

Do you mean Eldar Maiden Worlds or Exodites Worlds and not Craftworlds?

 Mr Morden wrote:

 dementedwombat wrote:
I'm guessing the Tau response would look about like this:

Stranger, I bid you greetings in the name of the Tau.

If you are reading this then you will have encountered one of our messengers drones and are therefore a spacefaring race. Soon you will see more evidence of us, this is no cause for alarm.

When you encounter one of our ships or outposts then welcome it. We have much to offer a faithful friend. We are five castes, one people. The earth caste build and manufacture, the air caste pilot and navigate, the water caste liase and arbitrate, the fire caste guard our holdings and defeat our enemies. All are bound to the dream of bringing a new way to the universe.

I hope you will choose to share the culture, technology and protection of the Tau empire.

The one constant in the universe is change, the wise adapt.

Believe in our destiny.

Nicely done

re the sterlisation - I think it fits quite nicely with the Tau ethos - especially if the population don't know its happening like the Ascen did to Earth in Stargate Season 4 Epsiode "2010" - very effective and they would likely consider it a "kinder" way.

...except we have numerous examples of the Fire Caste killing off races that didn't conform to the Greater Good with missiles and pulse rifles. If that was a method the Tau used, they wouldn't slaughter xenos that resisted.

I need to correct myself. According to the 6th Ed Tau Codex, sine the First Sphere Expansion it has been that the Air Caste visits and scans a planet. If has a population, they send for the Water Caste who introduces themselves to the native population. If they encounter outright refusal, they give the ultimatum. While the codex doesn't explicitly say this, I imagine that process has been further refined since their First Sphere Expansion to have Earth Caste Probes identify plausible planets first. However the Codex does say that worlds targeted as part of the (currently ongoing, I think) 3rd Sphere Expansion have been maliciously planned out and those with indigenous populations have had many preemptive visits by the Water Caste. The likelihood of Tau Scouts just stumbling across a world would be low (but still plausible), and the scouting party would probably be an Air Caste Scout Flotilla.

Mr Morden wrote:re the sterlisation - I think it fits quite nicely with the Tau ethos - especially if the population don't know its happening like the Ascen did to Earth in Stargate Season 4 Epsiode "2010" - very effective and they would likely consider it a "kinder" way.

I agree, I too think it fits nicely. I'm just not sure how canon it is.

Daston wrote:Didn't realise the Tau would move humans about. Do they have a sense of family? For example if the Tau empire rocked up tomorrow and told the whole of the earths population to move out, would you just be herded into a transport and sent off god knows where or would you all be split up depending on skill sets.

For example my wife is an amazing at organisation and communication and yet I am good at electronics and computer, would they see that as an excuse to scatter us across the depths of space?

If so my Zombie Apocalypse planning can halt.....I need to prepare for the alien overlords!

Once again, I'm not sure how canon this one is. I should note that I am not a Fluff Guru (though I'm trying to become one) and I read a lot of secondary sources, though I always try to make note of where it's cited if it seems 'out there.' If I know for certain a piece of fluff is from some codex (or even a BL novel), I usually try and say where it's from. But I'm not afraid of mentioning things that I've read elsewhere, especially if I like it or I think it fits well into the discussion. The closest official source that I could find (as in, get my hands on and read for myself) to claims of forced relocation by the Tau was in the 6th Ed Tau Codex. It mentions that upon a planet capitulating to the Tau, Tau leaders set up camp at all of the "major institutions" of a planet to direct them. They allow the indigenous ruling faction(s) to keep their power (though Tau provide the initial plan and have veto-power) and start by calling the ruling faction(s) to a series of discussions. The Ethereals are known to show up to these discussions. "Important alien dignitaries" are taken to private conferences, often returning with comforting plans about how things will proceed, sometimes not returning at all. It's the closest I can find to any statement that they are just outright taken away, and it sounds more like they're called to the Boss' Office and sometimes thrown into a Sarlacc. Though it might also be translated as taken off-world, as many large conferences in real life are out of city or state and thus require travel (That logic works to some people).

Thus said, I love the idea of the Tau splitting up families. I think it works well as a darkening of the Tau Ethos. There have been a few ancient Earth (Terra, I guess, this is a 40k thread) empires who would break up conquered populaces, including families, and ship them across their borders. If I remember correctly, it was usually done to stop troublesome or rebellious provinces. (Because speculation is fun) I can see this working mostly for Human Populaces that have surrendered after a long military campaign. Those with an intact world, who willingly surrendered, would have probably been slowly turning Tau over the last several decades due to Water Caste Negotiation and would already be in the process of 'upgrading.' In the case of a conquered world, you have to do something with the native population that's got a lot of bad memories tied up in their now broken land. Efficiently rebuilding and populating the world would be best carried out by the Tau, without the threat of resistance cells. And, if that area is in severe threat of retaliation by the IoM, it would probably help the offers of Surrender to give the Gue'la a safe non-bombed home. The 6th Ed Tau Codex states in worlds the IoM retook from the Tau after the 2nd Sphere Expansion, while on their way to Dal'yth, the Inquisition fell on the "remaining human populations" and "meted out cruel punishment." I'm sure the Tau would've learned a lesson from that because everybody is afraid of the Inquisition.

Do they have a sense of family? For example if the Tau empire rocked up tomorrow and told the whole of the earths population to move out, would you just be herded into a transport and sent off god knows where or would you all be split up depending on skill sets. .

But more to your questions. The Tau don't really have any sense of family, as they give their children over to the various academies, where they are raised in squads. Most Tau Fluff has them slowly assimilating populaces and slowly introducing Tau culture, so I'm sure they'd do their best to respect human culture. I'm sure that in a most cases, the Tau would recognize family units as a mini-ta'lissera, and to break up a bonded unit is to reduce efficiency. However your extended family (clan) and extended groups of friends may be shipped off to different planets within the Tau Empire to both reduce the ties malcontents have and to help facilitate both your dependence on (and thus love and drive for) the Greater Good. Your children will most-likely have to attend a mandated school with extreme hours, where dedication to the Greater Good first and their Unit second is highly stressed. Long work hours and seminars and classes probably await you and your wife. You'll hardly have time to see each-other, but you will still be able too. But at least your 40k IoM Food Synthesizer is now closer to a true Star Trek Food-Replicator.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 EmpNortonII wrote:


...except we have numerous examples of the Fire Caste killing off races that didn't conform to the Greater Good with missiles and pulse rifles. If that was a method the Tau used, they wouldn't slaughter xenos that resisted.

In the 6th Edition Codex, in the First Sphere Expansion it specifically says that an outright refusal meets with a ultimatum to bring in the Fire Warriors. And there are instances of Tau Commanders offering a peaceful surrender to groups of entrenched IG. I think the offer of Surrender depends on if the Ethereal thinks it's a good idea, if he's even there and how militant your Shas'O is.