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teamroocket wrote:re: Lash.

I think we just need to remember the LOS rules.

You can't see through a CC.

And the targeting rule

Due to the chaos and swift nature of a melee you can't pick out individual units / dudes.

It's still one damn powerfull ability .... but you don't get the carte blance to target anything within 24" like some people think you can.

Unless you are a Vindicare assassin..................

WarpTime, re-roll ALL misses to hit and wound, I belive that means ALL which overrides the big book which states you can only Re-roll once. And it does state in the Codex in the "Close Combat Weapon" "... to the bloodstained chainaxes carried by Khorne Berzerkers ..." So it one way or the other we get a 4+ or and only re-roll once or we get no 4+ and get ALL re-rolls for warptime.

Let me know what you think.

-Tim

Dr_Chin wrote:WarpTime, re-roll ALL misses to hit and wound, I belive that means ALL which overrides the big book which states you can only Re-roll once. And it does state in the Codex in the "Close Combat Weapon" "... to the bloodstained chainaxes carried by Khorne Berzerkers ..." So it one way or the other we get a 4+ or and only re-roll once or we get no 4+ and get ALL re-rolls for warptime.

Let me know what you think.

-Tim

Re-rolling all misses to hit and wound as opposed to re-rolling ONE missed to hit and/or wound. It in no way overrides the BGB's rule for only re-rolling once. If you miss on your re-roll, you miss, you cannot re-roll the re-roll. Them's the rules.

As to the Beserkers, they now have Close Combat Weapons and not Chain Axes or Heavy Close Combat Weapons, which would be the two things that follow the save reduction. Sorry, fluff =/= rules.

Platuan4th wrote:As to the Beserkers, they now have Close Combat Weapons and not Chain Axes or Heavy Close Combat Weapons, which would be the two things that follow the save reduction. Sorry, fluff =/= rules.

Hilariously nobody gets heavy close combat weapons anymore, unless I'm mistaken

Warp-Time Caveat

Sorcerer casts warptime and rolls a 2. The power goes off but he takes a S6 hit from Perils. Can he reroll that to-wound roll too??

(I know which way I'd call it, but curious on the RAW here)

- Salvage

Boss_Salvage wrote:Sounds like Codex:Space Marines Get the Nerf Too (aka SM Redux) can't come soon enough to justify the power downgrade in the Chaos codex.

That said, I finally beat stealer shock + zilla nids for the first time with my CSM, and it was using the new codex

- Salvage

DOOD! All I have to say is PlagueMarines. I played a friend yesterday who was playing them (has since last codex) and even he was saying as we were playing that they were broken. T5 Fell No Pain? 'nuff said.

In all fairness I was also playing CSM and got spanked b/c I trotted out a bunch of overpriced demons and possessed (WTF is with the new possessed rules?)

Yea plague marines are scary. I can't believe how many bolter rounds the girls have poured into them that just bounced off.

Important note I kept forgetting though, is that meltas (and Exorcist missiles) ignore FNP due to being instant death causing (due to double base toughness 4). So once you wound, there is no armor save (AP1) and no FNP save.
Granted, having to use anti-tank weapons vs. troops to kill them is less than prime, but hey, for all the Sisters out there (both of us) it's something good to know.

Sorry like I said before it has to be both or none at all, Since newer codexs over rule the Big Book of Everything


CODEX =
Warptime
The power is used at the start of any player's turn. if successful, the pyyker may re-roll all to hit and rolls to wound for the entirety of that players turn.

Sorry but ALL mean ALL so I would have to disagree

and again if you look in the codex in the wargear section under Close Combat Weapon it states
"Chaos space marines utilise an arry of close combat weapons, from the dripping blades wielded by Plague marines to the bloodstained chainexes carried by the Khorne Berzeerkers. All are equalt deadly in the hads of an exper warrior. Chainswords, chainaxes and combat blades are close combat weapons, as described in the Assault Phase Chaptor of the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook"

Old Codex
Khornate Chainaxe
"Blows struck by a Khornate Chainaxe are so powerful that they cab penetrate virtualy any armor. The best armor save possable aganst its attacks is a 4+. ..." No where does it say its a heavy close combat weapon.

The Big book of everythign it states
" ... the mighty chainaxes of Bezerkers oh Khorne are used to batter though and an opponents defences.."

So again I would have to say its one re-roll and 4+ for Khorne OR no 4+ for Khorne and Multi Re-rolls sorry

Dr_Chin wrote:
and again if you look in the codex in the wargear section under Close Combat Weapon it states
"Chaos space marines utilise an arry of close combat weapons, from the dripping blades wielded by Plague marines to the bloodstained chainexes carried by the Khorne Berzeerkers. All are equalt deadly in the hads of an exper warrior. Chainswords, chainaxes and combat blades are close combat weapons, as described in the Assault Phase Chaptor of the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook"

Right, they are Close Combat Weapons, NOT Heavy Close Combat Weapons.

Dr_Chin wrote:
Old Codex
Khornate Chainaxe
"Blows struck by a Khornate Chainaxe are so powerful that they cab penetrate virtualy any armor. The best armor save possable aganst its attacks is a 4+. ..." No where does it say its a heavy close combat weapon.

The OLD Codex is irrelevant, as there is a new codex, and newer Codexes over-rule older Codexes. Also, the old Codex is a 3rd edition Codex, a time in which there was no such thing as a Heavy Close Combat Weapon, which was introduced in the 4th Edition BGB as a way to simplify things in the future. The new Codex is a 4th Edition Codex and states that a Chain Axe is a Close Combat Weapon, which is defined in the BGB.

Dr_Chin wrote:
The Big book of everythign it states
" ... the mighty chainaxes of Bezerkers oh Khorne are used to batter though and an opponents defences.."

Look at the BGB again. That is the FLUFF of a Heavy Close Combat Weapon, which is NOT what beserkers are armed with. Fluff =/= rules. Beserkers are armed with Close Combat Weapons and Bolt Pistols, NOT Heavy Close Combat Weapons. By your own quotes, a Chain Axe under the new Codex is a Close Combat Weapon, and therefore does NOT gain the HEAVY Close Combat Weapon rules. What you're doing here isn't following the rules, it's attempting to CHEAT, plain and simple.

Sorry not cheating I dont use the 4+ but I am just it to proving a point, to people that do people say no you can not re-roll re-rolls, but if that is the case neither codex refers to chainaxes as heavy nor can I find any referace to chainaxes as heavy anywhere other then the big book, sorry. Again I dont use the 4+ I am just using it to make a point to people that say you can not re-roll a re-roll.

-Tim

Uh ... you can't reroll a reroll. Ever. Is that not explicitly in the BBB? Hard to argue with that, me thinks.

- Salvage

Oh I see selective overruling I understand..


Page 4 of the big book:

“The codex books give the specialized rules and army lists for the different opposing forces of the 41st millennium and are designed to work in conjunction with the Warhammer 40,000 book”


Page 5 of the big book:

“RE-ROLLS”

“In some situation the rules allow you a ‘re-roll’ of the dice. This is exactly as it sounds – pick up the dice you wish to re-roll and then roll them again. The second score counts, even if it means a worse result then the first, and no single dice cane be re-rolled more then once regardless of the source of the re-roll.”


Again if we are counting as either the codex overrules or the big book overrules, not cheating blame GW for the rule not me.

Lets roll off, as it suggests on page 4.

Lol


-Tim

The power lets you reroll all misses to hit and to wound. After that, the rule from the BGB kicks in and you cannot reroll those misses. There's no wording in the CSM Codex for the rerolls that overrides the BGB.


And next time start a new thread.

There is no conflict in the warptime rules.

They allow you reroll all of your 'to hit' rolls, so if a model gets to roll five 'to hit' rolls you'd be allowed to reroll them all.

However, you cannot re-roll a re-roll so once you've rerolled any of those 'to hit' dice you wouldn't be able to re-roll the same die again.


There is no conflict. Both rules function perfectly together.