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If its a friendly game, I'll explain stuff as I go along to a newby, and I know what my friends tend to remember, so I'll volunteer new/obscure stuff.

At a Toury, I would expect a basic knowledge/ability to infer. First thing, I give them my list and ask if they have any questions. If they do, I'll answer them. I'll explain any rules I use as I go along if I think they need it, or if they query. If they do something daft, or don't ask about a unit's abilities and then get hit for it, more fool them. I will do everything I can to help them understand if asked, but it I will not babysit anyone through a Tourny game.

Store Tourny a few weeks back

"Ever have dealings with Wood Elves?"
"Nope"
"Fear the trees. They do not fear you." With a smile.

Its always a great look on someone's face when that piece of forest terrain walks across the board the first time.

I am more of the play to have fun types, even in a tournament i'm pretty laid back. While I don't expect for the opponent to tell me every little detail of his army. If I point at a unit I expect the opponent to tell me what kind of special abilities they may have, I may ask for any relevant statistic and that is all.

Although I am a seasoned gamer (12+ years) I also play WAY too many non-gw skirmish games and I can't remember all the rules/stats of everything.

I don't expect a full run down of all of the stat lines, but a "This weird Eldar unit is now a troop choice because of x" is just good sportsmanship. If I ask if there are any special rules I should be aware of, that is a good example.

To wait until the end of the game to say "Neener-Neener, these guys I parked on this objective are troops because of x", after I asked for any special rules I should be aware of is going to guarantee that I will never play you again.

I have to explain my special rules whenever I play Necrons. Few times I just picked up and played I was actually called cheating when I laid my casualties on the side instead of removing them. People who never fought Necrons make the funniest expressions seeing their shooting phase basically undone.

i offer them my army list and ask them if they know much about the army. if they admit to ignorance about it, i go into a general rundown and tell them the things that will most likely raise an eyebrow (like scoring termies in a deathwing DA army led by belial).

I usually only played fantasy (I don't play so much now), so Magic Items were usually a wait-and-see deal, but the odd time both my opponent and I would give each other a run down of our forces. At the tourneys I played in, they were usually open list so we'd show each other our lists. Of course, reading someones crappy handwriting on an Arby's napkin isn't too helpful, but I made it out alright. In addition, I usually played against the same gang of nerds in my gaming club, so we generally knew each other's tricks and magic item combos.

Here in Japan, in the fantasy department, their lists are pretty weak generally. They always seem to go for the 500 point special character in 1500 point games (They do that here....) I might be TFFG (the extra "F2 is for "foreign")

I usually ask "have you played orks before?" and if they haven't I give a rough outline of what everything is and what it does. I'll ask questions about stuff I don't know, and answer any questions they have.
Generally, I don't give actual advice unless it's a friendly game though. I wouldn't expect an opponent to give me advice either, until afterwards. I'd even be a wee bit uncomfortable with it, because I'd feel like maybe I should reciprocate, and that's not really what I want to do in a competative game.

The only time I generally feel the need to explain things is when my opponent says something like "Gee I've never played X before". Otherwise the assumption is that my opponent at least has the general idea of what's going on. I freely answer questions if my opponent asks and usually try to supply an army list, but I don't really feel obligated to hold my opponent's hand through my army unit-by-unit. You can only get so much out a cliff notes version of an army anyways.

After playing deamons in 40K my explanations have gotten notably more brief. My opponent's eyes usually glaze over about halfway through the daemonic assault rules, so I ended up simplifying the affair to "They all deepstrike, fight pretty hard, and this character named Epidemius buffs the army for every 5 models my guys kill".

A listing of statlines and abilities of an army will only go so far to creating a coherent picture of what it does in game.

I would expect people to know the basics of a mainstream army like Eldar though, it's not like he was coming in with a wych cult army.

The assault move on warp spiders is their thing, much like banshees always strike first, avatar is a beast in hand to hand and Wraith Lords are a pain.

Between myself & my fellow gamers that I play with, there are Blood Angels, Space Wolves, Orks, Tyranids, & Tau. During each of our gatherings we are always discussing what each of our respective armys can do and are always impressed to see em in action.
Being open with what can and cant be done with your army makes the game more enjoyable and gets us coming back for more! No ones likes and unexpected rule to pop up at the 11th hour and will usually spoil the players mood for the remainder of the game!

So ask away, ya wanna know what I can do... sure i'll tell you, now lets see if you can deal with it!
Knowing the path and walking the path... gotta love it

Keep those dice rolling all!

I always make it clear that my opponent can ask me any questions or see my codex/list at any time. My squads and transports are color-coded so there's no guess-work there either. If the person is clearly a noob (grey marines and what looks like a few a box sets thrown together) I'm very clear and volunteer, because there's a good chance I'm going to pound their face anyway I think my only conflict with another player at a tournament has been with the game time running out and him starting the next turn afterward, putting me at a clear disadvantage. The judges were all occupied with higher up tables and it was the final round so it didn't matter anyway.

People here have become pretty familiar with my daemons, so I don't have to explain too often. At a tourney, where people seem to come out of the woodwork, I'll show them my list, point out fateweaver (if I'm bringing a second greater daemon), which models have the bolt of change, where changeling is, and let them know if they have any questions. If they say they're unfamiliar with the daemon codex, I'll let them know I have to deepstrike, how my deployement works, that I'm fearless, and everyone has invulnerable saves. With time constraints, I don't go into too much detail until it comes up, or if I want to definitely make sure I attract attention to a particular unit so that another one has a chance to do even more damage. I do mention that everything I bring is nasty, and will usually give a brief 1-2 sentence synopsis for each unit or unit type if they're completely unfamiliar. (For example - Bloodletters, close combat specialists, eats marines in close combat. Screamers - flying meltabombs. Horrors - lots of midrange shooting.) Enough to get the point across without giving up everything. If they ask for more, I'll answer or give them the codex to peruse.

I let my opponent know my army wide special rules or special rules that might vastly affect how he deployed. I would rather win with skill than to blindside someone and leave a bad taste in their mouth.

I have a double sided laminated print out of my army and unit special rules as well as the range, strength, and ap of my guns. I leave it on my opponents side of the table for them to read.

I love the high-and-mighty players who feel its deceitful to not explain EVERYTHING about your army upfront. Have a question? Sure Ill answer it, even show it to you, but I am not going out of my way at the beginning of each game to baby you. Having a good list and dice rolls are only part of this game. Do your homework on the armies you will be playing, play practice games, whatever. Take some responsibility and learn. I learned by trial an error. I now know never to assault a Ctan expecting my storm shields to save me, and my opponent knows I can take termies as troops when paired with my special character.
New players are the only exception for obvious reasons.

Im sure the only reason Japan lost WW2 was because the US failed disclose beforehand they had Tactical Nuke special rule.

Cyporiean wrote:Store Tourny a few weeks back

"Ever have dealings with Wood Elves?"
"Nope"
"Fear the trees. They do not fear you." With a smile.

Its always a great look on someone's face when that piece of forest terrain walks across the board the first time.

THE TREEEEEEES!!!! TREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSS!!!!!!!1!

I always ask 'have you played Necrons before?' If I get a 'no,' then I explain WBB, teleporting, and C'tan nastiness.

If I get a 'yeah' then I proceed to tell him what is where as I deploy (Lord with Veil, Gaze of Flame, and warscythe here...2 units of 1 Heavy Destroyer there...Nightbringer here). If they ask any questions, then of course I explain the rules to them and (briefly) how it might affect the course of the game. If the person is a tool, then I won't bother to mention his Sonic Blasters can't hurt the Nightbringer or that I didn't get a Res Orb so he can negate WBB with krak missiles/equivalents.

At tournaments, I just set up and play. I ask a lot of questions about my opponent's army so that I know exactly what I am looking at. Unfortunately for quite a few of my opponents, they don't ask the same amount of questions until I lift the Lord and move him to the other side of the table...'uhh, what are you doing?' 'Veiling away from your meganobz and getting ready to light up your lootas...sorry'

combatmedic wrote:I love the high-and-mighty players who feel its deceitful to not explain EVERYTHING about your army upfront. Have a question? Sure Ill answer it, even show it to you, but I am not going out of my way at the beginning of each game to baby you. Having a good list and dice rolls are only part of this game. Do your homework on the armies you will be playing, play practice games, whatever. Take some responsibility and learn. I learned by trial an error. I now know never to assault a Ctan expecting my storm shields to save me, and my opponent knows I can take termies as troops when paired with my special character.
New players are the only exception for obvious reasons.

Im sure the only reason Japan lost WW2 was because the US failed disclose beforehand they had Tactical Nuke special rule.

Comparisons between 40k and WW2 are both fallacious and annoying.

Combatmedic

Maybe I play a different style of game than you but trying to equate the United States trying to control the Pacific Front to a game of 40k seems absurd. I far and above enjoy games were people understand each others armies., even in a tournament. Which is why I provide my opponent with the information. I guess being an underhanded cuss is just not my bag.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do you think crushing your opponents into the rules is the best way to spread the hobby?

Mannahnin wrote:I'll ask my opponent if they're generally familiar with my army, and summarize any army-wide special rules. As I deploy each unit I'll generally also tell my opponent what upgrades/weapons they have. I won't take the time to go into individual unit special abilities unless my opponent asks.

This is the p.o.v. I take with all of my games, regardless of being a tourney or regular game (though my regular group knows the armies almost inside out).

Eric

If I have never played my opponent before I will do a quick run-through of my army (as follows):
*Have you ever played against (insert current army)
*Are you familiar with so-and-so (special character or unique unit for said army)
*Just a reminder he/she does so-and-so (insert rules info prior to using it)

If I know the player is experienced, or has the same army then I will skip the above questions, but I will still do a run-through of my army (units, weapons, conversions, etc...).

If I'm playing with a special character that alters my army comp or special rules, I'll usually let them know ahead of time (like Forgelord Joachim Santos y Martinez).

My general rule for rules is this: I will probably assume that you know what's going on, but if you have any questions I will explain them until there is no longer any doubt the particulars of any model sitting on the table.

Don't know what that is? I'll tell you.
Don't know what weapon he has? I'll even tell you what it does.

I do not proxy or misrepresent, as I have no interest in obfuscating any part of any army that I play, ever.

RxGhost wrote:
Don't know what that is? I'll tell you.
Don't know what weapon he has? I'll even tell you what it does.

I do not proxy or misrepresent, as I have no interest in obfuscating any part of any army that I play, ever.

+1 here!

I don't even like putting something on the table that isn't painted to my personal standards.. never mind proxy's

Always let them learn the hard way they should look at other codices

combatmedic wrote:

Im sure the only reason Japan lost WW2 was because the US failed disclose beforehand they had Tactical Nuke special rule.

That belongs in someone's signature.

Unfortunately, mine is full.

Kind of arguments both ways though. From your original argument about the avatar, if you have never seen one before then you would not know its strengths necessarily.

On the flipside though, I think most don't model/paint him as perfectly as possible, isn't he described as looking like he is made of lava? Sometimes these shortcomings deserve further explanation. There is the style of playing where people do not disclose what is in transports, for example. This is not to be a jerk, but both agree and it is to make you feel more in the game - watching how transports move to see what is carrying important units.

Kind of rambling... For fun, I suggest don't tell. For serious, I think it is a fair thing to remind them. (Kind of goes against most of the other comments).

It depends on your degree of WAAC.

I mean, if your there with your 3 Tervigons and Flyrant and think you have a chance at top tables then it's probably best not to waste your time explaining paroxysm to the kid with half painted CSM vanila marines of fail.

But if your playing with your fluffy necrons and the guy across the table says he's never played against 'robots' then you could probably help him out a little by telling him about WBB.

Blackmoor wrote:My question to you is how much do you disclose to your opponent in a tournament?

There seems to be three options:
#1. Take the time tell them all of your special rules and abilities of your units.
#2. Hit just the important parts of the rules
#3. Have them learn the hard way

Here are 2 quick examples:
The first one is the Avatar who is immune to Flamers and Melta weaponry.
The other example is Warp Spiders who can do a warp jump move in the assault phase.

Do I disclose their abilities to my opponent, or have them learn the hard way?

So do I educate the new players, or the fact that you know the rules to other armies is just one of the things that separate the good players from the bad players?

In tournaments, unless they ask, I will let them learn the hard way because its a competitive setting so they should do the research beforehand and know the special rules.

Friendly everyday games I'll tell them everything.

Even in tournaments, perhaps especially in tournaments, I always tell my opponent everything about my army's special rules if they're unfamiliar with the army I'm playing or units I'm using. Saves time looking things up in books for one thing but most importantly I go to tournaments to prove I'm the best or to improve my playing ability so that I can be the best. An ignorant opponent helps me not at all in this regard.

For instance, I've run Mad Dok Grotsnik in several tournaments recently, and made sure I told my opponent every time (none were familiar with him) that he forces his mob to go after the closest enemy unit, which is perhaps his biggest weakness.