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Uh, I've gone through multiple translators now and they all translate the sentence "This can be used in either player's turn" to the german equivalent of "This can be used in both player's turn". Also multiple dictionaries tell me that "either" has to be translated differently than "either ... or".

Your examples are spurious as you're applying them to mutually exclusive choices.

Read the whole rule

This power can be used during the Assault phase in either player's turn,...

This is when language attacks. either here is simply saying that it doesn't matter who's turn it is not indicating an mutually exclusive choice. Either in this case refers to the different players, not the choice.

This is a common way to write the rules for GW, Blood Angels 'Might of Heroes' , 'Unleash Rage' and 'Sanguine Sword'. All these powers can be used in either players turn, i.e. in both players turn.

"Available in either black or white"

In this example your use of the 'OR' makes it exclusive, not your use of either.

This game was written in English and translated into other languages,

So surely the definition in the Oxford English Dictionary should take precedence.

You can't get a true meaning from a translated text.
There will always be contradiction.

I'm a Grey knight player and I would love this to be twice per game turn.......Alas this doesn't seem to be the case

So why doesn't it say:

This power can be used during the Assault phase in BOTH player's turn,...

It is twice per game turn. It is reiterating that, although it isnt a close combat attack you have permission to use it in your opponents turn.

nosferatu1001 wrote:It is twice per game turn. It is reiterating that, although it isnt a close combat attack you have permission to use it in your opponents turn.

Yes, but as long as it hasn't been used in your turn

f74 wrote:This game was written in English and translated into other languages,

So surely the definition in the Oxford English Dictionary should take precedence.

You can't get a true meaning from a translated text.
There will always be contradiction.

I'm a Grey knight player and I would love this to be twice per game turn.......Alas this doesn't seem to be the case

So why doesn't it say:

This power can be used during the Assault phase in BOTH player's turn,...

Because in English, reading the whole sentence it is in both player turn. In terms of language

This power can be used during the Assault phase in either player's turn,...

is equivalent to

This power can be used during the Assault phase in both player's turn,...

But using Either is more correct as it has the built in implication of choice and it reads better. Either mearly differentiates between the two players in this sentence. Stop trying to analyse the word 'either' and start reading the whole sentence.

Collins English Dictionary wrote:either
determiner
1.
a. one or the other (of two) either coat will do
b. (as pronoun) either is acceptable
2. both one and the other there were ladies at either end of the table
3. (coordinating) used preceding two or more possibilities joined by ``or'' you may have either cheese or a sweet
adv (sentence modifier)
(used with a negative) used to indicate that the clause immediately preceding is a partial reiteration of a previous clause John isn't a liar, but he isn't exactly honest either

Usage: Either is followed by a singular verb in good usage: either is good; either of these books is useful. Care should be taken to avoid ambiguity when using either to mean both or each, as in the following sentence: a ship could be moored on either side of the channel. Agreement between the verb and its subject in either…or… constructions follows the pattern given for neither…nor… See at neither

Kernerman English Multilingual Dictionary entry is almost the same.

f74 wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:It is twice per game turn. It is reiterating that, although it isnt a close combat attack you have permission to use it in your opponents turn.

Yes, but as long as it hasn't been used in your turn

No, in both players turns, if you wish.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

No, in both players turns, if you wish.

Or in fact in either players turn you might say.

I roll two dice, if either dice is a 6 I win, they both roll 6, I still win.

Edited and deleted

I can use it in either turn

If I use it in my turn, that is ok
If i use it in their turn, that is ok
If i use it in both turns, that is still fulfilling "either" turn

You've missed an "or"

Jidmah wrote:

Collins English Dictionary wrote:either
determiner
1.
a. one or the other (of two) either coat will do
b. (as pronoun) either is acceptable
2. both one and the other there were ladies at either end of the table
3. (coordinating) used preceding two or more possibilities joined by ``or'' you may have either cheese or a sweet
adv (sentence modifier)
(used with a negative) used to indicate that the clause immediately preceding is a partial reiteration of a previous clause John isn't a liar, but he isn't exactly honest either

Usage: Either is followed by a singular verb in good usage: either is good; either of these books is useful. Care should be taken to avoid ambiguity when using either to mean both or each, as in the following sentence: a ship could be moored on either side of the channel. Agreement between the verb and its subject in either…or… constructions follows the pattern given for neither…nor… See at neither

Kernerman English Multilingual Dictionary entry is almost the same.

After reading this quote I accept defeat and am grateful of this clarification, Its a shame GW can't get their act together and write this in a way that doesn't cause this amount of confusion.

f74 wrote:"Either" means one OR the other

I just quoted two dictionaries telling us "either" can be used as synoym for "both".

edit: curse you for turbo-boost posting

Yep, See above post

hehehe

Thanks for your tight grasp of the English language....Ever thought of proof reading for GW?

Has anyone posted this situation into the INAT thread yet?

I agree it can be read either way, which does not change my stance on the way it should be.

Editing to add:
Now at least I know not to use it in both phases but I will not worry if someone else thinks they can.

kirsanth wrote:I agree it can be read either way, which does not change my stance on the way it should be.

Editing to add:
Now at least I know not to use it in both phases but I will not worry if someone else thinks they can.

So you don't think you can use

Sword of Sanguineous
Unleash Rage
Might of Heroes
etc etc

Can be used in both players turns? Thats quite a big change to how people play now.

I think either can be read either way.

Which means both in that case, but only one option is correct--which means either of the options is correct (but not both).

That said I always play the weaker interpretation for myself and have no issue with my opponent playing the stronger.

Edited in more "either"s

I think you're still thinking of it as an Ethier ... or construction but whatever floats your boat I guess.

Aramoro wrote:I think you're still thinking of it as an Ethier ... or construction but whatever floats your boat I guess.

That is one way you can use either to state or.

Not the only way.

Using the exact same (non-English) dictionary you referenced it can be read. . .either way. see 1 a

kirsanth wrote:

Aramoro wrote:I think you're still thinking of it as an Ethier ... or construction but whatever floats your boat I guess.

That is one way you can use either to state or.

Not the only way.

Using the exact same (non-English) dictionary you referenced it can be read. . .either way. see 1 a

I have never referenced a dictionary, I think you have me confused.

I am in fact saying you should not reference a dictionary but rather read the whole thing and comprehend it as a sentence as the English language is designed to be used.

Aramoro wrote:I have never referenced a dictionary, I think you have me confused.

This is true.

Aramoro wrote:I am in fact saying you should not reference a dictionary but rather read the whole thing and comprehend it as a sentence as the English language is designed to be used.

This is self-righteous non-sense.

Cleansing Flame can be used in "either players turn" hence once per game turn.

This is how I understand it too.
only once per game turn but you choose in whos player turn.

Same as hammerhand, cast only once per game turn.

If the powers can be cast 2 times per game turn (once for each players turn) they are pretty overpowered.

It can be used twice per game turn. Once on your turn, and again on the opponents turn.
BRB Pg. 9:

"Hence one game turn will comprise of two player turns. Whenever a rule uses the word "turn", in both this rule book and in the codexes, it means 'player turn', otherwise it will clearly state 'game turn'.

In the GK codex, where it talks about how a squad of Grey Knights uses Psychic abilities, under the "Brotherood of Psykers" rule:

A Grey Knight unit can use one psychic power each turn. The unit counts as a single psyker and follows all the normal rules for psykers.

Also in the BRB on Pg. 50:

Psyker's can use one psychic power per player turn.

Since the Brotherhood of Psykers says 1 power per turn, and the BRB says that 'turn' is a "player turn", and if I can use 1 power per "player" turn, then I can use this ability in both turns, it can be used twice a 'game turn'. Just like Hammerhand can be used on your turn, and then again on your opponents turn. Just like Force weapons are psychic abilities that can be activated in your turn, then again in your opponents turn. Just like a Daemon Prince can use Warp Time for every assault phase.

The limit to using using Cleansing Flame though is that Psyker's can (unless otherwise stated) only use 1 ability per turn. So if you're using cleansing flame, you're NOT using Hammerhand for +1S. You're also NOT activating Force Weapons to instant gib the Nobz. This is the reason someone like Justicar Thawn (the GK terminator upgrade) is a Psyker Level 2 (can use 2 abilities a turn) but only has 1 power. The standard terminators have to choose, Hammerhand, or Force weapons, he can have both. You have to choose which ability you're going to use, but you can do it in every turn.

The other main downside is that using these powers every chance you get gives you a much higher chance of suffering Perils of the Warp, which on a unit with no Invun saves, means losing modles outright.

kryhavok wrote:It can be used twice per game turn. Once on your turn, and again on the opponents turn.
BRB Pg. 9:

"Hence one game turn will comprise of two player turns. Whenever a rule uses the word "turn", in both this rule book and in the codexes, it means 'player turn', otherwise it will clearly state 'game turn'.

In the GK codex, where it talks about how a squad of Grey Knights uses Psychic abilities, under the "Brotherood of Psykers" rule:

A Grey Knight unit can use one psychic power each turn. The unit counts as a single psyker and follows all the normal rules for psykers.

Also in the BRB on Pg. 50:

Psyker's can use one psychic power per player turn.

100% true, but you realize the issue is not in any rule you quoted, right?

The power itself mentions "the Assault phase in either player's turn".

So even if there is a restriction against using it in both turns the psykers have the option of using a DIFFERENT power on the other turn.

Aramoro wrote:So you don't think you can use

Sword of Sanguineous
Unleash Rage
Might of Heroes
etc etc

Can be used in both players turns? Thats quite a big change to how people play now.

Aye, the ability for Psykers to use an ability each Player turn is an often made mistake. I think this is mainly because most psykers don't have any abilities they can cast in the opponent's turn, save for activating their force weapon. For example, the Codex: Space Marines, Codex: Space Wolves or Codex: Tyranids don't have a single power that can be cast in the opponent's turn. But indeed, Codex: Blood Angels and the new Codex: Grey Knights have plenty of powers that can be cast on either player's turn, or even only in the opponents turn.

Redemption wrote:For example, the Codex: Space Marines, Codex: Space Wolves or Codex: Tyranids don't have a single power that can be cast in the opponent's turn.

Force Weapons (or the equivelent) for the marines can be used in both player turns. Tyranids are left out though, you are correct.

kirsanth wrote:Force Weapons (or the equivelent) for the marines can be used in both player turns.

Redemption wrote:save for activating their force weapon.

Gadzooks, man!

I read your post twice looking for that line and missed it both times.

My bad.

The fact that I used an ability during my turn doesn't limit my ability to use that power during my opponents turn. Only the fact I can't use most abilities except for during my own turn. All of the Psyker rules are limits on "Player turn". Meaning once that player turn is over, the limits are then "reset".

I don't see anything that limits a power to be used only once a "game turn". If someone knows of that rule, please let me know where it's written.

IMO The inclusion of the word "either" is simply (albeit a poor choice of words) to let players know that it can be activated during you opponents assault phase, meaning you you're forced to receive the charge it can still be used.