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Thats how it is in the codex. For some reason they left the special issue stuff off the master list. IDK why

...on 4shared you can download the 5th ed RB for free...don't see how this is any worse...

They are both just as bad.

Just because someone gets away with copyright infringement doesn't mean its okay for everybody else to follow in their footsteps.

The Bringer wrote:They are both just as bad.

Just because someone gets away with copyright infringement doesn't mean its okay for everybody else to follow in their footsteps.

*eyes narrow*

im2randomghgh wrote:

The Bringer wrote:They are both just as bad.

Just because someone gets away with copyright infringement doesn't mean its okay for everybody else to follow in their footsteps.

*eyes narrow*

You reprinted your post without the numbers, but you need to go back to the first one, (10 posts from the bottom of page 2) with the points numbers and click on the yellow "EDIT" button on the upper right hand corner of the post. Then *you* can edit the numbers.

Final list:

HQ:
Shas'el w/ CIB, TA, SI, Guard 1 w/ AFP, MT, BC, Guard 2 w/ BC, MT, Flamer-205 pts

Elites:
3x Fireknife-186 pts.
2x Deathrain + 1 w/ BC, MT, MP-138pts
3x XV25 TA-120 pts

Troops:
10x Carnivores, 6x hounds-106pts
12x FW, Shas'ui, BK-135 pts
12x FW, Shas'ui, BK-135 pts

Fast Attack:
5x Pathfinders+Dfish w/FD,DP-143 pts

Heavy Support:
2xXV88, 1 w/ MT, other w/ SD
1x Railhead w/BC,DP,MT,TL-170pts

Total: 1498pts

Note: I fethed up my math before which is why the kroot are cheaper now

All looks good except for your HQ unit.

Every suit (your 'el) should have 2 weapons... I think that they also need more similar weapons so that they can preform better. I'd suggest this:

'El
CIB/AFP/MT
Guards
MP/BC/HWMT
-215 Pts.

For those ten points you go over, you could get rid of a fire-warrior to equalize your points.

The Bringer wrote:All looks good except for your HQ unit.

Every suit (your 'el) should have 2 weapons... I think that they also need more similar weapons so that they can preform better. I'd suggest this:

'El
CIB/AFP/MT
Guards
MP/BC/HWMT
-215 Pts.

For those ten points you go over, you could get rid of a fire-warrior to equalize your points.

My TA on the 'El was a compromise-I wanted an 'O
I figured that with BS5 and 5 shots, he wouldn't really need really need a second weapon, and that I could make him twice as hard to kill with guns. Also, as you can probably tell, I wanted the HQ choice to be anti-horde..lots of local Nid/Ork players.
by doing this I can maximize the power of the CIB and still have the AFP do something, right?
The flamer was as much to keep it cheap as it was to give them a chance to survive a mêlée...good or no?



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If I make some wiggle room, would the 'EL be any good with CIB, PR, MP and HWMT? that would give him the firepower and extra weapons mentioned before...


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and with the second loadout for him, I would still have the TA.

PraetorDave wrote:I don't know who wrote that list, but its really weird. Half of those I haven't heard of, and the other half are really off. I have never heard of Deathrain having drones. Its either TL MP with a flamer, or with a targetting array (if you have the points). Also, why anyone would make fireknives even MORE expensive by adding useless gun drones is beyond me.

Back to the original question: the only reason for the multi-tracker is for pathfinders. They have both a markerlight and a pulse rifle. So they can benefit from it. However, normal firewarriors have no use for a multi-tracker.

You can use the gundrones to absorb an assault without hurting your precious suits.

im2randomghgh wrote:You can use the gundrones to absorb an assault without hurting your precious suits.

That's what Shield Drones are for. They'll 'absorb' the assault better by possibly surviving any power weapon attacks, maintaining XV8 Toughness and Armor Save. GDs sorry Toughness doesn't change (not mattering too much for majority toughness, but it could), they use their poorer Armor Save and they don't have an Invuln. GDs are cheaper, yes, but the extra cost of SDs is worth it. GD "fire-power" ?

In list after good list, you won't see GDs attached to *any* unit. They come with Dumbfish and piranhas, because the codex makes it mandatory. New players use them because they acquire them in the Battle Force and XV8 boxes. And GDs help fill out an army list until the new player buys better models, i.e. more Crisis Suits.

Well, would El` with TA, HWMT, CIB, MP, PR be any good or not...


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?

Re-read that loadout and spot the error.

Hint: It has 1 support system and 3 weapon systems.

Avatar 720 wrote:Re-read that loadout and spot the error.

Hint: It has 1 support system and 3 weapon systems.

Sry, I forgot to make it HW...

Also, I may switch the Fireknives for Blinding Spears.

I.E. switch the missile pod for BC, as I will already be fielding plenty of MP with the death-rains, and I save a few points...

Anyways, is that a decent HQ choice?

im2randomghgh wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:Re-read that loadout and spot the error.

Hint: It has 1 support system and 3 weapon systems.

Sry, I forgot to make it HW...

Also, I may switch the Fireknives for Blinding Spears.

I.E. switch the missile pod for BC, as I will already be fielding plenty of MP with the death-rains, and I save a few points...

Anyways, is that a decent HQ choice?

Forgot to make what HW? You can't hard-wire a weapon system or the TArray, so you're still stuck with the same problem.

As for weapon load-outs, don't think about that suit vs an enemy unit, think about how it could complement your other units; like Eldar, Tau require a reasonable amount of synergy (less so than Eldar but moreso than other armies) and whilst your commander might be king of the terminator killers, how would it help your army? Basic killyness is one thing, but combining that power with support from your other units is key.

So let me ask, what aspects do you think your list is lacking in? Are there any aspects where your list could do better, or where units might need to be supported in their tasks? I learned something on my apprenticeship, and it was that it's good to know how something works, but it's far better to know why as well, we can give you all the answers, but we can't ensure that you know why they're correct.

if you can look at your army and say "Actually, i'm a little short on ABC, and unit XYZ might not be able to do the job I intended without support..." then you might find that your questions start to answer themselves.

Just take a step back and examine your army; ask yourself what each units role is and how they're going to do it, wonder what could stop them and how you'd avoid or counter it, figure out which situations will be lost causes from the start and ask yourself how you'd incorporate units that would originally look to counter those situations into other parts of your army. Take bits of your army away and ask yourself if your force could still work without them.

Using this, take your commander and ask yourself those questions; how do I want to use him; will his role be direct attacks or fire support; will I be able to function without him; how much attention will he draw from the enemy; how best can I incorporate his skills into my army so far; am I lacking in anything that he could excel in?

Once you're done, take a look at the finished product and ask yourself if it's a decent HQ choice; if you've taken everything into account, then the answer will always be yes.

...That was profound on so many levels...Thank you.

I had taken into account how they all have different aspects, but not how they support each other. I will now, and when I finish thinking about it, I will repost my HQ choice, spend any excess points, and repost my finished list.




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HQ: Shas'El w/ HWMT, PR, TA, CIB
Guard 1: AFP, BC, MT
Guard 2: Flamer, BC, MT
Total HQ cost: 220pts

Elites:
3x Blinding Spear-174
2x Deathrain, 1x bladestorm (I think that is what it's called, BC, MP, MT)-156
3x XV25 TA, FB-122

Troops:
10x Carnivores, 6x hounds-106pts
12x FW, Shas'ui BK-135
12x FW, Shas'ui BK-135

Fast Attack:
5x Pathfinder, Dfish w/ FD, DP

Heavy Support:
2x XV88, 1 w/MT, 1 w/ SD-160
1x Railhead w/BC,DP,MT,TL-170

Total: 1521pts.

From where should the 21 points be excised?

???


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???