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"GW replaces its defective products, so your point is moot."

Thus proving that you really don't understand what the 'point' is. Well done new guy!

DaNewBoy wrote:Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers.

No, it's not. But it sure as hell isn't not giving a damn about them. And it's not just replacing faulty merchandise. It's supplying merchandise that isn't faulty to begin with. There's a word for companies that produce products without caring what the market thinks about them. Bankrupt.

Nope
We are not all jumping on any bandwagon
Some of us are talking from experience of dealing with other companies.

No they don't love us. We never said they do.
But they do behave courteously and treat customers with respect.
That is what is distinctly lacking from GW at present.
I don't mean the guys on the shop floor nor customer services. Which in any case is not relevant to this thread

So please, can we have less of the GW is "behaving like any other business" because they don't.
I have been reliably informed that Apple also employ the news blackout tactics.
Which is no justification for GW to do so.

DaNewBoy wrote:There are quite a few cry babies on this forum.
I know it's all a conspiracy and GW is bending you over and you don't even know it and all that...
Hopefully pissing and moaning about it will get GWs attention and they see the error of their ways, but if that never happens then it is both ineffective and annoying.

DaNewBoy wrote:Yes, and all the boo-hooing will fix that.
Infact, I think I'll give your method a shot and when my sink fills up with dirty dishes, I'll just throw a fit and cry and pout until my dishes realize I care about eating off clean plates.

H.B.M.C. wrote:They're just overflowing right now, aren't they?

Aren't you mister "care about the opinions of others?"
I don't have to be happy with the way things are going with GW to still be able to be 1) An adult and 2) enjoy playing a game and having fun with friends.
If you let corporate antics flip your "Piss poor" attitude switch every time they do something you don't like, you are in for a long miserable life. You may as well try to stop air, or kill yourself. It's all about the bottom line, not benevolence. Sorry to be one to inform you, and oh yea, there isn't a Santa Clause either.

DaNewBoy wrote:Try boo-hooing to Apple about their advertisements and see what kind of results you get.

DaNewBoy wrote:Booo-Hooo-hooo, I want my way!
If a "fanboi" is someone who doesn't live in a fantasy world where crying and name calling is how to get your way, then with pride.
You enjoy your "daycare lady won't let me swing" tactics and, "I've got more time to be on forums so my opinion has more weight then yours" rhetoric 1, 2 combo.

DaNewBoy wrote:And you'll be on some forum somewhere shocked and amazed at how they only care about making money and not keeping your diaper poopy free and ranting about the good ole circle jerk days.

DaNewBoy wrote:Yes, Steve job looses sleep all the time over a costumer who just isn't satisfied enough. I hear, every time someone calls costumer service and complains, he guiltily burns all his money and tries to leave his wife.

I love how we are all just jumping right on this fantasy wagon of "Company X knows and cares about ME!"

Costumer Service is not the same as caring about customers. GW replaces its defective products, so your point is moot. Like I said, call Apple and play your 4 year old "I didn't get my way again" tactics on their advertisement and see how much they care then.

Wow. That's what I call a 100% troll account. Almost no post without insulting fellow Dakka members, Please can a mod take care of that person?

Let's try and stay on-topic so we don't get the OP's thread locked.

Right, back on topic.

Why GW is so secretive, summarized:

1.) For some reason they hate leaks and perhaps believe that somehow, someone is going to beat them to the market with a similar miniature.

2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.

3.) They believe that this will increase impulse purchases of new shiny releases. I don't know anyone who buys their minis on impulse, my wargaming friends and I usually plan out what we want to buy. But I bet a lot of younger players do not do this and will buy the new shiny Necron/Sisters of Battle/Dark Eldar kit on impulse.

Well said, Goddard.



Everyone please stick to the topic and don't divert into attacks against each other.

I'd have to agree that GW's impulse buy strategy is a farce. Red Shirts telling you to buy a new release 'because it looks cool' is what really indicates to me that is what they are going for. But you just don't impulse buy something thats in excess of 50$. It's too expensive for that kind of shopping.

Yeah, that's the other thing, when they're charging as much as they do for their minis, their product is outside the realm of an "impulse buy" for a lot of people. Even if I had a ton of money to waste... well, it doesn't mean I would.

Exactly. And on top of this, they are targetting the younger generations who have even less money. And when mommy and daddy get involved, they'd much rather buy you a video game than 40-60$ every time you need to add something to your army.

Even the ten year olds at our library group go on the GW website, look at pics and stats as part of an army building project.

They are savvy enough to know that the cost is not cheap. I get told of their latest purchases always in the context of how they want the army to operate.

Don't ever recall them saying, "I bought the latest shiny cos it was so cool, I just had to have it."

Goddard and Ratbot
Nice summation

H.B.M.C. wrote:Some folks here would have you believe that their secrecy is due to a fear that if they reveal anything (anything!) that another company will copy their design and have it on shelves before the GW one is on sale.

I like to laugh at these folks. They make my time at Dakka all the more enjoyable.

Sort of a red herring. Maybe one person brought this up? Have there been any examples of a company doing this?

£15 is my limit for an impulse buy, it seems. But I won't even walk into a GW shop unless I want something, due to my distaste for the sales tactics the poor redshirts are forced to use.

But when I saw that necromancer on Dakka, I thought "He looks awesome! Plastic too? I'll get one!" and made time to go down to the local shop and pick one up. Rumour sites are free advertising for GW! Fans so rabid for a bit of information we spend hours chatting about it online are something that most companies would KILL for!

Goddard wrote:Exactly. And on top of this, they are targetting the younger generations who have even less money. And when mommy and daddy get involved, they'd much rather buy you a video game than 40-60$ every time you need to add something to your army.

Heh, no, they wouldn't.) Or not all of them.

I sell a hell of a lot of games by showing parents that it's better for them to spend money on miniatures (painting, chesslike strategy and thinking, hand eye co-ord, socialization, math and reading) than on a video game. Younger generations have 0 money, it all comes from someone else.


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Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Even the ten year olds at our library group go on the GW website, look at pics and stats as part of an army building project.
They are savvy enough to know that the cost is not cheap. I get told of their latest purchases always in the context of how they want the army to operate.
Don't ever recall them saying, "I bought the latest shiny cos it was so cool, I just had to have it."

I find it's mostly the veterans who act this way. )

Yeah, the veterans have done all their planned purchases, and have more income. So a lot of times, they might be looking for something new and interesting. I know that's how I work!

mikhaila wrote:

Goddard wrote:Exactly. And on top of this, they are targetting the younger generations who have even less money. And when mommy and daddy get involved, they'd much rather buy you a video game than 40-60$ every time you need to add something to your army.

Heh, no, they wouldn't.) Or not all of them.

I sell a hell of a lot of games by showing parents that it's better for them to spend money on miniatures (painting, chesslike strategy and thinking, hand eye co-ord, socialization, math and reading) than on a video game. Younger generations have 0 money, it all comes from someone else.

True, it really depends on the parents. But most of my friends parents, and parents I know in general, would not really spend this amount of money on this hobby. They would spend this kind of money on piano lessons, or the basketball team, etc. To them, this is just a very expensive game. They don't see it how we do.

mikhaila wrote:Sort of a red herring. Maybe one person brought this up?

Not really. I've seen Mystery and even Hobbs say it. I think even Kan mentioned it once, but he's not dumb enough to believe it (I hope).

mikhaila wrote:Have there been any examples of a company doing this?

Of course not, because it's a ridiculous concept.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

mikhaila wrote:Sort of a red herring. Maybe one person brought this up?

Not really. I've seen Mystery and even Hobbs say it. I think even Kan mentioned it once, but he's not dumb enough to believe it (I hope).

Mystery and I both said it when the Tyranid codex was leaked and we hadn't seen pictures of the Tyrannofex/Tervigon.

My statement was something like "We likely haven't seen the models because they're the second wave" or something to that effect.

mikhaila wrote:Have there been any examples of a company doing this?

Of course not, because it's a ridiculous concept.

Not that ridiculous.

I could point at certain third parties that had begun showing WIPs before the end of the first year that Tyranids was released for certain beasties that have yet to receive kits.

RatBot wrote:2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.

Which is understandable, really. It works so well for the multi-billion dollar Movie and Video Game industries...

insaniak wrote:

RatBot wrote:2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.

Which is understandable, really. It works so well for the multi-billion dollar Movie and Video Game industries...

The week thing is new, and I would be very surprised if we don't see it repealed.

Unless of course, they have some kind of information we don't about impulse buys that suggests a week before release is 'the sweet spot'.

I will be scared if they really do have some kind of information like that.

I should also clarify, before HBMC jumps all over my case, that Tyranids really has been a weird exception to the rule in terms of the 'wave' system.

It's mindboggling why we have yet to see a second wave.

insaniak wrote:

RatBot wrote:2.) They (erroneously, in my not so humble opinion) believe that not knowing what's coming until a week or less before it comes out builds more excitement for a product.

Which is understandable, really. It works so well for the multi-billion dollar Movie and Video Game industries...

Yeah, look at how terrible Spartan Games is doing. I mean, they showed us the Covenant ships already! Now their sales are going to tank because we've alr-


You know what? I can't even twist the logic to make it a bad thing. I cannot conceive it, let alone write it.

Kanluwen wrote:Not that ridiculous.

I stand corrected.

You are.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Not that ridiculous.

I stand corrected.

You are.

You really need to work on reading, I think.

Like I said--we did see certain third party companies begin announcing their plans for Tyranid kits within months of the codex launch.
Or are we just pretending that the boatloads of Doom of Malan'tai, Swarmlord, Tyrannofex, Spore Pods, and Tervigon kits out there don't exist?

Were they available "before the Codex"? No. Were they based off GW's models? No.
The "secrecy" in this point came back to bite GW in the bum, because now their own model kits for these whenever they're released, will just be more noise in an already noisy room.

In my view a rather better idea of planning would be to have the new unit kits ready to go when the book is released. Capitalise on the excitement of the release, and the marketing and publicity surrounding it.

Instead, GW left a gap of a year between releasing the Tyranid book without Tervigons, Spods and Tyrannofexes, and any sign they might release the missing models. It's hardly brain surgery to think that players might want those units and go to other sources to get hold of them.

With the IT"S A SECRET policy, even if GW actually plan to release official models, no-one will know in advance. There isn't any reason for a Tyranid player to decide to wait for the GW kit.

As the SAS kind of say, Piss Poor Planning and Preparation Prevents Proper Performance.

Kilkrazy wrote:In my view a rather better idea of planning would be to have the new unit kits ready to go when the book is released. Capitalise on the excitement of the release, and the marketing and publicity surrounding it.

Instead, GW left a gap of a year between releasing the Tyranid book without Tervigons, Spods and Tyrannofexes, and any sign they might release the missing models. It's hardly brain surgery to think that players might want those units and go to other sources to get hold of them.

With the IT"S A SECRET policy, even if GW actually plan to release official models, no-one will know in advance. There isn't any reason for a Tyranid player to decide to wait for the GW kit.

Exactly. This isn't a case of "GW kept it secret because they didn't want someone to copy their model", it was a case of their standard "six month window" then biting them in the bum.

I still want to know why there has not been a second Tyranid wave yet.
Were their models too similar to what ended up being put out? Did they decide they didn't want to do the kits because they probably are removing the kits from the next Tyranid book? Is it because Tyranids are going to be in the starter set, with Swarmlords and Tervigons in there?

Honestly Kan? I think it can't be anything other than disorganisation and incompetence. Too few creative people to do the work that is there.

They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.

Da Boss wrote:Honestly Kan? I think it can't be anything other than disorganisation and incompetence. Too few creative people to do the work that is there.

This is the most likely explanation, but it's not like it's stopped them before right?

Kilkrazy wrote:They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.

Woot! Figures! Thanks KK. Interesting. Guess that proves my assumption wrong then. The answer must be that they are not managing their creative staff effectively, or the creative staff they have are SLOOOOOOOW. Whatever it is, their release schedule is beyond turgid.

Da Boss wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:They've got 82 staff in Design and Development. They had 80 in that department in 2008-9.

Woot! Figures! Thanks KK. Interesting. Guess that proves my assumption wrong then. The answer must be that they are not managing their creative staff effectively, or the creative staff they have are SLOOOOOOOW. Whatever it is, their release schedule is beyond turgid.

I'm curious as to how many members of Design and Development are actually sculptors responsible for doing the work.

It sounds kind of like movies, where you've got a few dozen jobs that nobody really knows what they do and when you look they're responsible for like handing out scripts or something of that nature.