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Also, the Necrons ALWAYS had an Egyptian theme. It wasn't as pronounced previously, but you'd have to be blind not to see it. Scarabs, giant pyramid vehicles, resting in their tombs. The old models for the Lords looked very Egyptian. That's like being mad at them for giving GK a book. Way back when GK were just a cool unit of terminators you could add to Imperial armies. How dare they flesh out the concept! Same thing here. Just because you chose to ignore the Egyptian overtones that already existed doesn't make them wrong for expanding upon it.

Well... Has anybody read the new codex? I didn't ... and I think that the majority of people didn't too... And even if you'cve read the dex, have you played'em several times? Simply too soon to state that "they've been nerfed"
Just looking at the fact that they now have transports, cheaper elite units, no PO, entropic weapons etc... I really doubt that they have been nerfed...

Pointless post is Pointless

How can a thread complaining they're OP and one complaining that they're nerfed exist simultaneously? Maybe try playing with or against the army for a while, then decide what it is.

Durza wrote:How can a thread complaining they're OP and one complaining that they're nerfed exist simultaneously? Maybe try playing with or against the army for a while, then decide what it is.

The internet is a strange place, is it not?

This is actually just a little bit painful to read.

I have to agree, some of the things did get nerfed, the monolith got nerfed as I can now actually kill it rather than trying to phase out the army; but then again, the monolith really needed nerfing if you removed phaseout! you can't have your cake and eat it!

destroyers got nerfed, yes, the min size and 1 less shot are pretty bad, but they are cheaper and better against marines, as a trade off, the necrons got some pretty terrifying additional shooting to replace them.

Necron warriors have effectively been replaced by immortals, who are better, and given their name to a new, cheaper but weaker troop choice who represent a new design direction. also, bringing the minimum cost of your troop choices down quite a lot. yes, you can now bring more than a lord and 2 troops to a 500pt game!

Warscythes actually got better IMO, They've gone from the purview of pariahs, who had 1 attack and reduced your phaseout number, (and lords) to better lords and a better elites choice. They improved by virtue of where they are in the army rather than innate ability.

wraiths nerfed? I thought they got better, as now they can strike before things that hit at I6+, rather than simultaneously/after, and got an extra wound... and rending!

on top of that: Scarabs! Boom!

how do you "nerf" a unit that didn't even exist in the old codex?

StormForged wrote:

LordOfTheSloths wrote:

Hammer18 wrote:The c'tan can still kill most things. plus i believe the extra powers will help.

IMO, the heart of the problem with GW's approach to codex revision is the word "still". It's as if we players are constantly having to salvage things from new codices and to settle for things that GW feels like giving us, rather than getting revisions that improve all of our units and don't invalidate previous versions and conceptions of armies that many of us (myself included) have spent thousands of dollars on. That's what infuriated me about TK in WHFB, and about C:CSM previously.

At this point, I've got IG and Space Marines, as well as 'Nids and two CSM armies (World Eaters and 1K Sons) which were already butchered in the last round of revisions, and I've got the feeling that each of these will suffer the same fate as my other armies.

So forgive me if I "go Hulk" when every time I turn around another big investment in time and money gets nerfed.

Really? Are you just using the topic of this thread to backboard some lame attempt at complaining you have to buy models? The Necrons haven't been updated for a decade what the did you think was going to happen?

I swear. I'm not thrilled about prices increasing but in reality its not that much. And what's even funnier, you can actually make conversions for the models you don't have for even cheaper. It's not even that, most Necron players don't even mind paying for brand new units for an army that had literally no units to begin with.

Please stick to the thread or get out.

*Gets down* And I take a small bow.

"Really," before you comment on a post, you should try actually reading the entire post. I am not "just using the topic of this thread to backboard some lame attempt at complaining you have to buy models." As for "what the did I think was going to happen," this is exactly what I thought would happen. That is not the issue. My issue is, it seems to be the case that, whenever a unit (or units, or entire armies) need a revision, the default GW plan seems to be, "Cut its stats and just make it cheaper." Just ONCE I'd like to see something like, oh, "Necrons are too vulnerable to pie plates, so let's just revise WBB, but don't make their basic troops easier to kill in the first place!"

And btw: when I need your permission to post in a thread, I'll ask for it.


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SylvanaSekNadin wrote:I don't know, from what I have seen the Nercons have gained quite a lot. From a play perspective I feel that they have become reasonably balanced. The old codex had a mixture of extreme bad, and extreme good. I can remember multiple threads asking how to kill monoliths. As such, the too powerful have been brought back a bit, and the too weak have gotten a major upgrade.

I never found monoliths to be too powerful. I lost almost as many of them as I kept at game end. Maybe my opponents were just lucky *heh*

SylvanaSekNadin wrote:The only gripe I have, is the direction the fluff seems to have gone. It feels like its gotten too much of an Egyptian theme now unlike the previous undead hoard theme. I really liked the concept of this wall of soulless machines that get up again when you kill them slowly advancing on your position. It now feels like tyrannical Egyptian kings with petty squabbles fighting amongst themselves, while before it was this large implacable will and desire to end all life.

I couldn't have put it better. My point exactly about "TK in space". And new TK at that.

Nerfed? Oh, come on. I don't deny they were a powerful army back in the day but now they had become a one-trick pony.

Even the (also monstrously outdated) Eldar Codex can produce a nasty surprise or two, while the 'crons were struck with one or two moderately successful configs, and even those weren't competitive anymore. Even my lackluster Ork list could krump through the oh-so-standard Necron warriors+monoliths army with ease.

Warriors needed to be cheaper. Playing low point games with necrons was...boring...to say the least. Now you can at least have a little more wiggle room for list building at lower points.

^

You both officially fail this thread and this argument (Referring to "waaaaahhh Egyptian now")

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1380050a

bombboy1252 wrote: we now have named characters for some good special bonuses...

Out of curiosity, I thought Necrons were a massive legion of automated, souless, unindividualistic robots led by C'tan. So why do they have named individual characters? What does the new fluff say to explain this? I just want to get to know a brief outline of the new necron fluff?

I'd link you to the rumors thread but, in brief: No so soulless, not led by C'tan anymore.

Motivations changed from soul-munching to political imperialism. Fluff changed from "horde of bots in thrall of the star-gods" to trascendence gone wrong, whole race transferred into undying metal shells, no longer organic but not AI either (this was in the old fluff too but mostly got ignored) and still mostly sentient. C'tan (shards of them, apparently) are now slaves of the Necrons, not the other way around.

What can I say. Haven't read but what's been posted on the rumors section but I like what I have seen so far. Just one day and we'll know more

Basically, GW realized that it's really hard to make interesting, unique armies when the fluff says that they're all identical.

Yes, this does change the tone of the Necrons considerably, but in a good way, IMO.

Fair enough. They seem scarier when they just rise up, kill goons and leave without a trace. Personalities would explain other fluff like alliance with Blood Angels.

And now necrons apparently fight each other! And trade with other races! And work as mercs!

Weird ...

I like the new Codex (from what I've seen, since it isn't actually out yet), and I've been playing Necrons for many years.

The new direction they are taking has seriously reinvigorated my enthusiasm for the hobby.

No more phase out.

Awesome Models.

Anti-tank.

Transports other than a pricey monolyth.

Anyone bitching about the new Necron Codex can go get bent. I'm just not getting the hate.

Monoliths, with the current army structure and still at 220~ pts would be OP, to be honest. I'm not surprised they got rid of melta immunity simply because for it to be characterful, it would have to be on EVERY VEHICLE.

I've never played against the old Necron codex but if the rumours about the new ones are true, then if it's been nerfed, the old one must have been absolutely amazing! And judging by what most people say about how poor it is, it's clearly not amazing.

I think that there's a lot of really cool sounding stuff in the new codex. The big issue for me would be I2 but then I look at their shooting and realise that they are obviously a shooty army anyway. And when some of those Necrons do hit, they hit hard to boot.

Sorry, I don't agree it's been nerfed at all.

I think I like most of the changes I've heard of to date without having read the codex. My opinion may change a little afterwards, but most changes do sound really good. They have always had an Egyption theme, I'm not sure how you can argue against that one. After all their BFG big ships have a huge pyramind mounted on top and they have scarabs. Sound familiar?

Warscythes still ignore FNP, now cause ID on T3 models (T4 if you get the FC guy) meaning only one failed save is enough, and can absolutely shred vehicles in CC. Those extra two pips of strenght make a huuuge difference.

They were always, always, always losing ignore Inv saves. There have only been 3 items which ignored them, and every codex revision has removed them. Dreadaxe -gone. Ctan phase sword - now ID PW. Warscythe was always going to lose it.

In return you get a massive boost in offensive power. Oh, and now you get a 3++ inv save as well. Slightly better, no?

nosferatu1001 wrote:
They were always, always, always losing ignore Inv saves. There have only been 3 items which ignored them, and every codex revision has removed them. Dreadaxe -gone. Ctan phase sword - now ID PW. Warscythe was always going to lose it.

The old psycannons in the Daemonhunters codex also ignored invul saves as did incinerators. They lost those abilities, too :(

Banzaimash wrote:Fair enough. They seem scarier when they just rise up, kill goons and leave without a trace.

Yes. For about 1 game. 2 at most.

Seriously. Every single time anyone ever tried to actually DO something background-related with Necrons, say, play the army in a gaming-club campaign or some such, they howled at in frustration at the simplistic angle given to them faster than you can dip 10 Warriors in Boltgun metal.

I don't get why people are complaining about I2, they are not, and have never been an assault army. Sure they have a few CC units, but having them usually strike last highlights, for me, their theme of a slow, inevitable death brought by lumbering Tomb machines.

Banzaimash wrote:

bombboy1252 wrote: we now have named characters for some good special bonuses...

Out of curiosity, I thought Necrons were a massive legion of automated, souless, unindividualistic robots led by C'tan. So why do they have named individual characters? What does the new fluff say to explain this? I just want to get to know a brief outline of the new necron fluff?

The Necron lords were always individualistic, and self thinking...only things like warriors and scarab swarms and such, are souless unthinking automatons


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kronk wrote:No more phase out.

Awesome Models.

Anti-tank.

Transports other than a pricey monolyth.

Anyone bitching about the new Necron Codex can go get bent. I'm just not getting the hate.

Me either Kronk.......but people love to b tch about anything...

No phase out, I guess thats a good thing, but which models contribute to the %? phase out?

Warscyth Nerf. You are right this is a huge one. Because Pariah was the Crusnik of elite CC units.

so basically storm shield, dodge, and other fluffy invul saves.

LunaHound wrote:Warscyth Nerf. You are right this is a huge one. Because Pariah was the Crusnik of elite CC units.

Crusnik?

What are you saying?

LunaHound wrote:No phase out, I guess thats a good thing, but which models contribute to the %? phase out?

Warscythe Nerf. You are right this is a huge one. Because Pariah was the Crusnik of elite CC units.

so basically storm shield, dodge, and other fluffy invul saves.

It may surprise someone who never saw necrons before but the HQ, the Necron lord, could actually take a Warscythe (with VOD mind you.)

It was good on a Destroyer Lord as well. Ignoring Invul saves and 2d6 armor pen was pretty damn good.

Still, a S7 power weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

Monster Rain wrote:Still, a S7 power weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

Ya, that's going to be killer....even if it is "nerfed"