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I dont really get how people are saying warriors are weaker... I dunno I almost want to create a horde warrior army and have like 60 warriors with 6 ghost arks carting them around just for fun lol

Cryage wrote:I dont really get how people are saying warriors are weaker... I dunno I almost want to create a horde warrior army and have like 60 warriors with 6 ghost arks carting them around just for fun lol

That's what I was going to do

Cryage wrote:I dont really get how people are saying warriors are weaker... I dunno I almost want to create a horde warrior army and have like 60 warriors with 6 ghost arks carting them around just for fun lol

I'm still going to run a 40 warrior foot list with the new 'dex, at least till 2nd wave hits and I see all the options.

Just so you all know...new minimum size of a warrior squad is 5, and max is 20....

But I'm either...

A:Running a warrior horde list, running like 120 warriors...
B:6 warrior squads in Ghost arks...
C:Going all Destroyers and Immortals

I don't care about anything else in the 'dex haha

I have an important question.

What are the HQ choices now? Just Lord and Special Character versions there of? Cause IMO they really needed to put another HQ choice in.

Soladrin wrote:I have an important question.

What are the HQ choices now? Just Lord and Special Character versions there of? Cause IMO they really needed to put another HQ choice in.

Lord
Over Lord
Destroyer Lord
Cryptek

You want Nerf, see Tyranid FAQ.

About the warriors, I've heard it all now. So they made them 4+ save but 13 pts. My guardians aren't that good, my dire avengers aren't, DE warriors or alot of the other troop choices in other armies. My friend has played cron's since they came out and all I have heard the past few days is grip grip. So I started showing him the comparisons with my armies and he shut up quickly. It is a very nicely balanced book. I also told him to quit comparing it to the marines. He has come around and I told him to wait til he fields them. We are playing monday night so we will see what happens then.

Can you let me know how the necron play cause i am considering starting a necron army again.

The Necrons Traded some blows defiantly.

A 5+ RP that is immune to everything isnt bad ... a 4+ and a 5++ = 3+ with a chance of negating instant death. Sure we take more from heavy weapons but we are given tools to deal with it.

These changes may not all make sense now but in the rumored 6th Edition alot of things are going to change. Cover and FNP will go down to 5+, preferred enemies (that destroyers have) are supposedly to work on ranged weapons, ect.

So an army with a 5+ FNP that cant be denied will be awesome.

Monolith- They just made it more vulnerable b/c *gasp* we have more then 1 vehicle, all but 2 or 3 of which have 13/13/11 armor till 1st pen!
So we get a LR that can Teleport anything not a vehicle from any where through it, dedicated transports that can raise 1d3 warriors back, and some heavy weapon platforms.
I got mixed feelings here old rule monolith was awesome but more vehicles can be nice.

Wraiths still ignore terrain and now can deep strike with a 3++ save. And they can finally ignore armor on rends, someone else can do the math hammer but thats almost equivalent to Terminators with Storm Shields. (Lacking thunder hammers but they are str 6 at least ...)

In summary: I dont think we have anything to fear, they arent anything particularly broken like some SM armies. They have a new uniqueness to them and will require a little adaptability to play effectively. But they have come a long way from our previous edition, giving them more viable options.

I just played a game verses them and I can tell you they are not nerfed! They are a vast improvement over the old codex, much more effective on the battlefield.

Frankly it'd be fething absurd if the newcrons weren't better than the oldcrons, I never doubted that they would be, lol.

Don't Wraiths get bigger squads now? That was IMO their main weakness in the last codex, so that's a big improvement, especially when an extra wound is considered.

Mr. Self Destruct wrote:Monoliths, with the current army structure and still at 220~ pts would be OP, to be honest. I'm not surprised they got rid of melta immunity simply because for it to be characterful, it would have to be on EVERY VEHICLE.

Not really. Any more than every unit had to have the REAL warscythes to be characterful. Melta immunity could just as well have been a property that required more power to generate than some puny troop carrier could manage. And if 220 pts was undercosted (which I don't buy anyway), then raise the points to something like, say, a Land Raider's cost. Don't nerf it!!!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Monster Rain wrote:It was good on a Destroyer Lord as well. Ignoring Invul saves and 2d6 armor pen was pretty damn good.

Still, a S7 power weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

Again there's that word "still". "Lucky us, we still have something left! Yippee, we can salvage something!"

Please.


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Tyrs13 wrote:
So an army with a 5+ FNP that cant be denied will be awesome.

I find nothing "awesome" about failing two out of three rolls.

Tyrs13 wrote:
Monolith- They just made it more vulnerable b/c *gasp* we have more then 1 vehicle, all but 2 or 3 of which have 13/13/11 armor till 1st pen!
So we get a LR that can Teleport anything not a vehicle from any where through it, dedicated transports that can raise 1d3 warriors back, and some heavy weapon platforms.
I got mixed feelings here old rule monolith was awesome but more vehicles can be nice.

More vehicles are fine, but there was no need to take away what we had before, 6th edition rumors be 'd. IMO this is a chronic problem with GW: always taking away, as if that's a prereq for revising any codex. Add, don't take away! If too many new units would be "OP", then don't add so many new units!

Nerf? NERF? What are you talking about? The old Necrons were, by far, the easiest army to table!

That is, barring a slim few nasty builds played by a slimmer few nasty generals...

Even then.

The Monolith deserved to be cut down to size a bit. It was a relic whose rules were made for a different book. It's still got av 14 all around and getting into the melta sweet spot is dangerous.

Oh no's, my army didn't get more variety and get to keep its old special rules completely the same. I hate change! They should have kept phase out too! My plans are ruined! [/sarcasm]

BrainDeleted wrote:Nerf? NERF? What are you talking about? The old Necrons were, by far, the easiest army to table!

That is, barring a slim few nasty builds played by a slimmer few nasty generals...
[/sarcasm]

The most reliable way necrons could win before was to take full destroyer wings and just kite your opponent with superior maneuverability and 36" range shots... it was actually a VERY boring game of cat and mouse, and I wasn't a fan. I like the new direction the necrons are going

LordOfTheSloths wrote:Again there's that word "still". "Lucky us, we still have something left! Yippee, we can salvage something!"

Please.

I think you're getting a bit too worked up about this.

The army was going to change when the new codex came out. I'll cite every codex ever released as precedent.

To be fair, after getting my hands on my very own copy of the book, Destroyers did in fact pretty much get nerfed (jump infantry instead of jetbikes, -1S/-1Shot/-12" range in exchange for AP3 and 10pts off, not really worth it), but other than that, most of the changes to existing units are fantastic.

ernshmagl wrote:Can you let me know how the necron play cause i am considering starting a necron army again.

Will do. He is putting his Annilation Barge together now so it will be fielded on Monday as well as Imotek.

LordOfTheSloths wrote:

Mr. Self Destruct wrote:Monoliths, with the current army structure and still at 220~ pts would be OP, to be honest. I'm not surprised they got rid of melta immunity simply because for it to be characterful, it would have to be on EVERY VEHICLE.

Not really. Any more than every unit had to have the REAL warscythes to be characterful. Melta immunity could just as well have been a property that required more power to generate than some puny troop carrier could manage. And if 220 pts was undercosted (which I don't buy anyway), then raise the points to something like, say, a Land Raider's cost. Don't nerf it!!!

You had a vechicle that Eldar, Dark Eldar and to a lesser extent Orks could hardly kill and that was a PITA for everyone else. 220 points for the old Monolith was undercosted, unlike most of the other stuff in the old 'Dex.

Something tells me he didn't read the codex entry for the doom scythes.

bombboy1252 wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:Still, a S7 power weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

Ya, that's going to be killer....even if it is "nerfed"

I'd like to also point out that he gets preferred enemy too... (i think) Now you're not missing with half of your attacks. What use is a warscythe that ignores invulnerable saves if its only killing one model a turn?
The warscythe got worse against wyches, terminators etc but better against everything else

Has anyone else noticed that Necrons are better at killing daemons than grey knights? They hate deep strike and they've got a bunch of wargear that just removes models from the board without invul saves and without caring about eternal warrior. I'm not trying to troll here, I just thought it was funny.

As far as this codex being somehow a 'nerfed' version of a severely outdated codex, that's ridiculous... now I guess I am trolling. This codex is packed, it is freaking crammed with new and different. Destroyers 'nerfed', maybe, but you know what wasn't nerfed; the four thousand new ways to use your army. Some pre-existing units had their stats and point costs lowered, which actually makes them better, mainly because you don't have to rely on those units exclusively in order to try to squeeze out a win. There are more new units in this codex than there were units in the old codex, and if you brought your old 1500 point list to the table, you'd have enough points left over to field some of them.

As a Necron player i can not understand the NERF statement !!!!

1 All the stuff supposedly nerfing the dex was usless bar the destroyers because of Phase out ,
2 So many new toys with rules lots of people will be call OP
3 More choice


Yes individually things have been dulled down but come on a Melta immune tank with no phase out !!!!!

Nerf no way

I'm not quite ready to say that the Destroyers were nerfed quite yet.

Being able to move and then lay down that many low AP shots, particularly in conjunction with a lot of gubbinz that make your stuff twin-linked... I see potential there.

Vaktathi wrote:To be fair, after getting my hands on my very own copy of the book, Destroyers did in fact pretty much get nerfed (jump infantry instead of jetbikes, -1S/-1Shot/-12" range in exchange for AP3 and 10pts off, not really worth it), but other than that, most of the changes to existing units are fantastic.

The loss of strength isn't a big deal. The loss of 1 shot in exchange for the lower AP, that's a HUGE benefit dude. They just went from 15 shots that don't deny meq saves to 10 shots that DO deny their save. Also factor in the rumor that preferred enemy works in shooting in 6th edition and I hardly doubt you'll see them as being "nerfed" then.

Even still, if you don't see the advantage they got from going from AP4 to AP3 and assault instead of heavy...I don't know what to say.

LunaHound wrote:

Soladrin wrote:I have an important question.

What are the HQ choices now? Just Lord and Special Character versions there of? Cause IMO they really needed to put another HQ choice in.

Lord
Over Lord
Destroyer Lord
Cryptek

Lords and Crypteks aren't HQs actually.

They are more of an...accessory.




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comrade_nikolai wrote:

bombboy1252 wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:Still, a S7 power weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

Ya, that's going to be killer....even if it is "nerfed"

I'd like to also point out that he gets preferred enemy too... (i think) Now you're not missing with half of your attacks. What use is a warscythe that ignores invulnerable saves if its only killing one model a turn?
The warscythe got worse against wyches, terminators etc but better against everything else

Actually, since it's S7 you can now one shot eldar.

See that Succubus/Archon? SPLAT! Not anymore ^^

Yeah, the I2 sucks but other then that, I like the changes.

Lol no the old codex was not nerfed it was greatly improved on. Warriors are great the get two saves now a 4 up and then if that fails a 5 up. Monolith was taken down a few pegs but it is still nasty on the battlefield. Plus the monolith has better guns. Carbines are awasome scarabs are awasome crypteks are awasome the new lords are awasome adding some much needed punching power to your units plus a rez orb if your so inclined. I'm loving the new codex. I have been playing necrons for years and this gives me a new love for the army. Oh yea no more phase out too!

Are Necron Lords like Chaos Lieutenants or something now?

Durza wrote:Are Necron Lords like Chaos Lieutenants or something now?

They are closer to Wolf Guard.