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TheSovereign wrote:I've had good luck with it lately,

That's actually still the problem with Finecast.
"Luck" should not be a factor. Buying Finecast should not be a gamble.

Try the new game from GW , Finecast . Just like Russian Roulette , 1 in 6 a winner .

Lork Skystompa wrote:Try the new game from GW , Finecast . Just like Russian Roulette , 1 in 6 a winner .

But for most people buying Finecast has been like playing Russian Roulette with a semi-automatic pistol

ShumaGorath wrote:

Breotan wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:This implies that the molds coming down the line are worse than normal. Expect blisters to contain the wrong models.

I've already had boxes containing wrong parts. I have a Skaven Doomwheel that had two of the same wheel side (there are supposed to be two different ones) and packs of Mandrakes that each lost a guy in the warp somehow. The Seattle Bunker does an awesome job of fixing problems as quickly as possible though, so at least that's something.

I recently saw a tyranid tyrant guard blister with two sets of right legs on the same sprue. How the hell does that even happen?

It's a new biomorph for the next codex. The unit gets a hgher movement rate.

The Decapitator wrote:So Games Workshop have sent an email around to all of their stores notifying them that;

".....there has been a higher number of the new Citadel Finecast miniatures due to be released that have a bubble in a vital point or have cast thinner than they should have done."

Wait what the heck!? Games workshop know their next shipment has issues, yet they wont check them, recall them or do anything, so instead ship them to the stores just for the Customer to do it for them.
What?

Clever plan though. Dont pay for quality control, and get the customer to do it for you. *Sarcastic applause*

Total internet scaremongery,without a screenshot of the email it never happened.

"Scaremongering"? What part of this supposed communique is supposed to be scary, exactly? If the email said that some boxes might be contaminated with arsenic, then sure, that'd be a scaremongering rumor to pass around without corroboration, but this? This is owl-downy nonsense at worst.

Changing someones action by causing fear or worry is scaremongery,by claiming an email exists without proof about the quality of a release could change peoples mind on the purchases because they worry about the quality.

Well, GW doesn't worry about their quality pushing people away. I think a fake email would do much damage there.

I have bought alot of stuff of the years and you know what? I have never, ever asked to have a TV removed from the Box to prove it's ok, or a washing machine, or a mobile Phone, or a Games console.

Neither has a sales representative asked me to open what I have bought to as-wage the fears of the company that sold me the product has given me an inferior product.

Furthermore if a sales representative (working for the company in question) is openly telling me the product he is selling has issues. I would without fail, ask for a refund and hand the product back. Part of the tacit agreement is that I pay the vendor legitimate, legal tender and the Vendor must supply legitimate, legal and goods of an acceptable quality. In the UK consumer rights are pretty good on this issue and the Office of Fair Trading is brilliant at jumping on sharp practices and poor customer service. QUALITY CONTROL is key to any Company's product image it is counterproductive to their sales if it is of dubious quality or worse variable quality.

OP is literally jaw droppingly bad, imagine if this was an iPAD or iPhone?

There are far more satisfied finecast customers than unsatisfied,the sheep nature of the forums means however people are unfairly convinced the medium is terrible. Resin has its limitations regardless of the manufacture but GW have to be dragged over the coals for everything they do while other companies enjoy the keys to the forum city

and yes if there was serious concern about quality gw would have all shops check the stock, as the above poster pointed out in his post they wouldnt wait for the customer to do it at the till if they were aware of the issue prior,also the boxes have batch number (legally) so if there is a fault they can pull a batch .the opening post is nonsense

I disagree, if the company is releasing Quality/ Return Policy guidance to retailers then the amount of returns must be well beyond the acceptable norm that all manufacturers factor into their production runs.

You can dissagree all day long but that would be the process for any quality issue of this scale

mwnciboo wrote:I disagree, if the company is releasing Quality/ Return Policy guidance to retailers then the amount of returns must be well beyond the acceptable norm that all manufacturers factor into their production runs.

Don't feed the troll (or white knight), mwnciboo - take a look at his posting history.

How is pointing out that the opening post maybe untrue trolling? Open your minds people the number of anti fine cast posts on forums is stupid and this one takes the biscuit.if gw has prior knowledge of an issue they would identify the batch and pull it or have a store open it before it was sold,they would also say which product it is in the email

Dysartes wrote:

mwnciboo wrote:I disagree, if the company is releasing Quality/ Return Policy guidance to retailers then the amount of returns must be well beyond the acceptable norm that all manufacturers factor into their production runs.

Don't feed the troll (or white knight), mwnciboo - take a look at his posting history.

I was working on typing up some valid counter arguments, but I think I am going to heed your advice as well.

1) The Decapitator has been a member on this forum for some time. He has posted other rumours in this section before, as well as general discussion, and from my experience he has been a conscientious and sensible poster. A previous rumour, remarking that the Necrons had been removed from the display cabinets in WHW prior to the new codex being released, turned out to be correct.

2) You haven't been a member of this forum for a long time and therefore have no way of knowing whether the Decapitator (or any other forum member for that matter) is lying or not. Generally speaking, making a slur on someone's credibility (essentially coming in and firing from the hip, machine gun in both hands) generally won't endear you to many members on here.

3) The OP content is not exactly controversial. Mark Wells himself, the CEO of GW, commented that they were having some teething troubles early into the Finecast release. If the OP was going to lie, then why not make it something like 'GW staff member slapped me when I asked for refund' or 'Finecast killed my baby!' You know, something more dramatic?

I'm sorry that you feel there are too many anti-Finecast threads on this forum. Unfortunately, conscientious consumers often feel it is their right to complain, rather than just shrugging their shoulders and continuing to hand over their money for a below-standard product. Ultimately this will be for the benefit of every person who buys GW miniatures, if GW can get their QC sorted out, and by extension the kids who are buying miscast product and not replacing it because they don't know any better.

Whether you think they are all false or not, I ask you this: How many pictures of miscast GW miniatures used to appear, before the release of Finecast? I'm struggling to think of a single example. I think this comparison tells you everything you need to know about the validity of the OP.

hmmmm .....in regards to Swordwind99 someone's length of time on the Forum doesn't invalidate their opinion. I actually agree in many respects wtih Swordwind99 arguments, dissenters normally congregate and mutually back slap working themselves into a zealous fervour. They draw in the easily lead, (sheep) not unlike certain fundamentalist terrorist groups.

My disagreement is that a certain degree of error/returns and replacements is the acceptable norm in manufacturing. Companies do it all the time, they do not however send out revised Quality/ Return Policy guidance to retailers on a whim. If this was the case, all manufacturers would constantly and needlessly contact retailers everytime Joe Bloggs returned a single item. The fact GW has, IMHO indicates that the returns are beyond the normal acceptable level. Grabbing figures from thin air, i am guessing most people are happy with finecast, but what is most? 90%, 51%, 66% thats some fairly big numbers? 99% still gives 1 in a 100 unhappy. From ancedotal and a personal standpoint I have seen Finecast Necrons in Firestormgames and 5 models of the Necron Lord with the Resurrection Orb were appalling.

For the record, I believe Swordwind99 is not a troll. A discussion forum is for active discussion and debate, naming anyone that doesn't believe what you believe a Troll really means you probably don't understand the value of true debate.

I have in some encounters, conceeded defeated to articulate persons that have won me round to their way of thinking if their reasoning was sound / mine was not. It's about the personal confidence and self objectivity to actually say, well what I originally thought was wrong, strength of Character comes from this, not sticking to a losing point because you are to proud to say "Mea Culpa".

Lots of people have different opinions than me, and I don't consider them a Troll no matter how much I argue with them.

There is a certain tone of voice and attitude that earns somebody a Troll label.

Length of forum membership does not mean hes automatically right or that i am wrong,if your happy just to follow like sheep thats sad. Either way if tbe problem existed it eouldnt be handelled in the way described in opening post,it isnt the correct GW proceedure


Automatically Appended Next Post:

d-usa wrote:Lots of people have different opinions than me, and I don't consider them a Troll no matter how much I argue with them.

There is a certain tone of voice and attitude that earns somebody a Troll label.

stay in topic buddy,my preferance for bridges isnt the topic of discussion

Tone of Voice? On something you write?

I know what you mean! Reaching early for the insult button and then abusing someone for not agreeing is counter productive. Condescension and patronizing is a little annoying but not illegal, the truth of it is we are all very passionate about our hobby and that leads to hot-headiness.

mwnciboo wrote:Tone of Voice? On something you write?

I know what you mean! Reaching early for the insult button and then abusing someone for not agreeing is counter productive. Condescension and patronizing is a little annoying but not illegal, the truth of it is we are all very passionate about our hobby and that leads to hot-headiness.

But if two people are standing at opposite corners of the street spreading the same message, and one of them is calm and collected and the other is insulting people and rambling along, then there will be two very different oppinions about them.

As an example:

"Guys, this could be a rumor, we know that Finecast has had problems but we need to be reasonable"

vs.

"Sheeple! This is pure fearmongering and you finecast haters are all patting yourself on your GW hating backs!!!!"

Also, see post above yours

Agreed.

mwnciboo wrote:hmmmm .....in regards to Swordwind99 someone's length of time on the Forum doesn't invalidate their opinion. I actually agree in many respects wtih Swordwind99 arguments, dissenters normally congregate and mutually back slap working themselves into a zealous fervour. They draw in the easily lead, (sheep) not unlike certain fundamentalist terrorist groups.

No, of course it doesn't invalidate their opinion. But, it can affect the premise of their argument, in this case that The Decapitator is trying to be scurrilous with the OP to court popular opinion. Had Swordwind99 been a member for longer, and seen the Decapitator's previous posts, I don't think he would have made that comment.

I don't think Swordwind99 is a troll either. I understand the point he is trying to make - no doubt it is partly correct, people of similar opinion do tend to congregate for mutual back-slapping. That being said, there is no smoke without fire, and the large amount of evidence - not only on this forum, but from retailers refusing to sell FC (Wayland), and comments from around every part of the interweb, shows that it is not at all baseless. As is often the case, the 'truth' is probably somewhere between the two extremes.

Sadly we do get the occasional poster who has previously been held peacefully and lovingly by GW, only for a needle to be applied to edge of the bubble. Each new release was a moment of joy, the shop a shining light on the high-street, and each article in White Dwarf committed to memory (even Jervis' column). Then, they come to the dark and seedy under-belly of the hobby (here ), where terrible secrets are laid bare, and that bubble begins to burst. The instinctive result is to lash out "You're all lying!", and return to the loving and warm arms of GW (even though those arms have started to look a little more hairy, you can see a tattoo, and the hands look bruising), although Swordwind99 has made his argument it in a somewhat better manner than most.

And at least he hasn't disappeared after a temper tantrum and moderator warning like some other previous posters have.

The thing is, as much as I understand people's opinions, I quite clearly don't have an issue with GW, especially to result in 'Scaremongering'.

I quite clearly state that in my experience I've never had a problem with GW exchanging/refunding Finecast models that I've had a problem with.

I'm simply passing on information and asking people to be especially vigilant with anything they purchase this weekend. Nothing more, nothing less.

I thought about posting the original email, buy you know what, it's not worth it. If people want to listen then that's cool, if not then that's also cool! Just getting the relevant info out there, whether people take it on board is another thing entirely!

Relapse wrote:Does Spartan or Privateer have these kind of issues? I ask because I've seen some of their resins and they look really good.
I would imagine they must have some problems, just not to the degree GW has, since I've not seen any real complaint threads for them.

I have 4 armies + terrain pieces from Spartan and had a few pieces that were slightly miscast/damaged in delivery (6 parts in total). Contacted Spartan and they posted out the replacement parts without a issue.

I have no hesitation about buying Spartan stuff online

zombie wrote:

Relapse wrote:Does Spartan or Privateer have these kind of issues? I ask because I've seen some of their resins and they look really good.
I would imagine they must have some problems, just not to the degree GW has, since I've not seen any real complaint threads for them.

I have 4 armies + terrain pieces from Spartan and had a few pieces that were slightly miscast/damaged in delivery (6 parts in total). Contacted Spartan and they posted out the replacement parts without a issue.

I have no hesitation about buying Spartan stuff online

Never bought Spartan, but I purchased a metal box of Temple Flame Guard (PP) and it was short one model. I used their website to report it and within a week I had two replacement models.

Went to the GW at Rundle Mall, Adelaide, the staff insisted that finecast was a non issue hyped up by the internet and only two people total had either come in to get a replacement from the internet or needed a replacement on the spot since it came out. Apparently, Wayland Games refusing to stock Finecast (citation needed on that) is an "unreliable and biased source", purely because it's on the internet. I'm... kind of over this crap. I wonder if they'll admit this policy exists if I go in there next week?

Sorry if I will come across aggressive but I don't give a rats ass if GW admits or not its biggest failure and I also don't care if one, two or a million persons like finecast because this is my hobby and my money and if IMO and experience they produce overpriced miscasts I will simply not buy!

As for the trolling yeah kind of predictable and to be honest its sad t see the lengths people go to try to justify the unjustifiable...

swordwind99 wrote:Changing someones action by causing fear or worry is scaremongery,by claiming an email exists without proof about the quality of a release could change peoples mind on the purchases because they worry about the quality.

This is in no way "causing fear". Spreading news of a bomb on the Underground, that's "causing fear". This rumor, at its worst, only amounts to spreading misinformation that might affect a few people's hobby spending habits in the immediate future. Your words are willfully escalating the situation by claiming effects far in excess of what is in evidence.

"What we have here is a failure to communicate."