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He just gets math i dont he works for their research department

If your figure scale is 3", then that means your 'hunting rifle' is topping out at about 72 feet.

So wait ok mabey they dew need to be shorter i figured three inches was a guardsmen and a half tall. Plus since most of the maps are going to be in destroyed cities which would limit line of sight. One of the reasons i wanted to have multiple level buildings allowing for some unique oppurtunities. Do you have any suggestions

Lord General Cheese wrote:So wait ok mabey they dew need to be shorter i figured three inches was a guardsmen and a half tall. Plus since most of the maps are going to be in destroyed cities which would limit line of sight. One of the reasons i wanted to have multiple level buildings allowing for some unique oppurtunities. Do you have any suggestions

3 inches is probably closer to 3 Imperial Guardsmen, maybe 2.5 with bases.

The 'range issue' is something most modern/sci-fi/recent-ish historicals have to deal with. I vaguely remember an example from FoW where certain Glider troop models could not shoot from wingtip to wingtip of their own glider... 40k is bad at this as well, as many weapons have a range that would be well under 100 feet if we don't assume that ground scale is somehow different from mini scale.

Some games try to obscure this ("Range" being meant to represent the weapon's effective range) or just deal with it (Most weapons in Heavy Gear Blitz now have an effectively 'infinite' max range). You seem to prefer the latter, and have worked out the need to have terrain that cuts down on fire lanes. keep in mind, you'll need a lot of it... Which discourages players, as most players don't have a lot of terrain.

Ignore this space.

So 75mm then, around the size of a GI Joe figure.

If it were me creating a miniature wargame I would have it set in a post-apocalyptic world, with gangs ranging from 5-25 members. Each member can gain experience from each battle allowing them to gain levels. I would use hit points instead of wounds, allowing the to be raised by wearing armor. Weapons would have a damage rating to meaning that even lowly gang member have their worth. I would use d20 for dice roles and I would most likely do it 25mm 'Heroic' scale like GW.

Infact I might just do that.

Foster wrote:So 75mm then, around the size of a GI Joe figure.

Assuming (and it's a big assumption) that the OP is thinking this through clearly. He should be informed that a metal or resin 75mm figure costs around 20-50 dollars each or more. That puts the cost of a 10-15 person warband at between 200 and 500 dollars!

To the OP.
It' time to step back, and go read a bunch of rule sets. Then, either learn to use correct spelling, punctuation and grammar (or find a device with spell check) and write out your rules. Finally, bring them to us and find out what we think.
Otherwise you're just wasting everyone's time.

This thread is one sad horse that keeps smacking it's head into the cart.

Foster wrote:If it were me creating a miniature wargame I would have it set in a post-apocalyptic world, with gangs ranging from 5-25 members. Each member can gain experience from each battle allowing them to gain levels. I would use hit points instead of wounds, allowing the to be raised by wearing armor. Weapons would have a damage rating to meaning that even lowly gang member have their worth. I would use d20 for dice roles and I would most likely do it 25mm 'Heroic' scale like GW.

To be honest, I've kind of come to feel that 'post apocalyptic wargame setting' is the equivalent of everyone and their brother in the RPG world doing a 'tolkien-esque Fantasy setting' at some point.

Do something different! Infinity is more cyberpunk-ish, for example. It stands out.

Well obiously i havent looked into prices that much I had no idea how much armies would cost at that size. The reason i wanted thim so large is to allow more detail and customization the painter and modler speaking. Mabeye 25mm would be better and attrct more of a fan base. But what do you all think of the game mechanics and do you think i should try to intergrate vehicles.

Required Reading: Steve Cole's RUNNING A GAME PUBLISHING COMPANY

Thank you for link so far read first 3 chapters

Lord General Cheese wrote:Well obiously i havent looked into prices that much I had no idea how much armies would cost at that size. The reason i wanted thim so large is to allow more detail and customization the painter and modler speaking. Mabeye 25mm would be better and attrct more of a fan base. But what do you all think of the game mechanics and do you think i should try to intergrate vehicles.

I have seen quite a few companies out there that make 32mm heroic scale miniatures, which I think may be a "happy" compromise for you here.


Perhaps you could make a relatively simple chart for game mechanics...I'll use shooting as an example: If I have a character with a shotgun whose max range is 24" (with a 28mm scale model) but I am shooting at a target that is standing 7" away. Using a chart you could easily say 1-6 inches firing is an action carrying a difficulty of 0, so gain +2 to your roll, 7-12" away, and the difficulty is 1, so you would add 0 to your roll. 13-18" is difficulty 2, so subtract 1, etc. (on out to the maximum range) Now, lets say that your character with shotgun is a "militant" human, and ALL militants gain a bonus to any shooting action of +2 to their rolls.

If X is my shooting "skill"... and the target is 7" it'd be X+0+(militant modifier)2= whatever value the rules dictate is a hit on the target.


I personally feel that while it may slow some games down, it'd be a pretty damn unique system for shooting.. hell, you could have a second for purely melee actions (though not sure how that would work)

Yes melle wepons are a sore spot when it comes to charting and graphing. Pretty much i need a system for them because 2 of the factions are almost only melle, so thats a sore spot I feel I have a pretty good shooting mechanics but my melle seems to basic do you have any suggestions

Probably something more in line with DnD would work for melee here:

what I mean is Offensive stat vs. Defensive stat, if my roll plus the offensive stat is greater than the defensive stat value then the model takes damage... to simplify this could be representing a hit that bypasses or breaks through armor, and so no "saves" are taken.

Heavily armored, heavy hitting characters could suffer by having a slower attack.. put in 40k terms, if all your melee guys are armed with "powerfists" then their initiative is greatly reduced because whatever they hit will die in this game.

Thats a really good idea better then what i had in mind. Do you think i should try to incorperate in vehicles

curran12 wrote:

Second of all, you've given us a backstory and are asking for art. If you are wanting to make a minis game out of it, I think your priorities are a bit misaligned. What are the mechanics? What are the rules? A backstory is not going to sell a game on its own, art isn't going to do that either. You should really focus on building your rules and the mechanics of the game before you worry too much about the cool backstory. That stuff can come later along.

Actually, he needs the art and backstory first. Absolutely.

Otherwise, what will he sell?

One of the ways Warmachine started was because Matt Wilson is (surprise
surprise) an artist, and he created a strong visual feel for the Iron Kingdoms
that makes it what it is. The game itself helped carry the art beyond that point,
but artwork is what drove his company as an RPG product. In an interview he
said that the most expensive part about a gaming company is paying the
artists.

If you can create a strong visual feel for your game, I'd be more interested.

Rules, by themselves, aren't enough.

Actually, Malf is pretty much on the money with what the Dakka community wants. Art will drive sales. Look at Drop Zone Commander, no models available (yet) and no rules, yet there are like eight pages of people basically yelling "shut up and take my money."

Many of the people in this thread are suggesting he hammer down the rules because that will free him up to work more on art and background. At the moment, we all have an idea of art: "post-apoc earth with humans and mutants."

I would like an OLD game.

"New and Improved" isn't really all that it is cracked up to be.

Want an idea? Buy the rights to an old game, and breath life into it.

Stop jacking around with "I want to make a new game... thats been remade 1000 times before."

At the end of the day, miniatures games are miniatures games. The backstory and fluff is what the game is built on, the mechanics are the skull. the Meat is the factions, armies, what have you, and thier story is why we are playing.

Want a no bull idea for a game?

a skirmish level TWILIGHT:2000 game.

Would be great if added to the RPG suppliments, and give you depth of story with a squad of guys and a vehicle and let them roll.

the scenery is there.

Modern Military miniatures are there.

Story/ baseline info ... is there.

You can use modern setting table top cardstock cityscapes, rolling european hills, Middle eastern stuff, its all there.


Yes, you fight russians, and maruders, but if you could ever get that damn heavy weapons issue under wraps, Twilight:2000 is the one.


Not only that, but.... Your spelling doesn't show you serious of purpose in the task of games design.


there are a million games out there. You asking for meat when you have a Virginia Ham under your arm lacks common sense.

Just my two penn'orth:

Don't give up on your idea. Grab some minis from an existing game, find a buddy, scribble some rules down and try it out. Play, play and play some more. You'll get an idea for what works.

Most people have commented on spelling and grammar. You aren't alone in finding this a pain. I've read essays from top grade university students where they've made basic mistakes. It is, however, much easier for us to understand what you're saying if the grammar is correct.

With respect to your game, I think there are two points - fluff and mechanics. Clearly, there is no consensus on which is the most important. I'd have thought the latter was a no-brainer, but others have exactly the opposite view. Given that it's a matter of opinion to anyone that isn't an industry expert, we'll have to let it go.

The backstory you've provided is a good one, but it's been done before. You can probably create the same characters, but tell a different story. An isolated island previously used as a military instillation? A future society of massive disparity, where the poor fight and collect wealth to earn admission to the higher tiers? An alternative history without the Manhattan project, where WWII didn't end, and the whole planet descended into an ongoing war of attrition? Come up with something original, and plug your concepts into that.

For mechanics, the situation is similar. Move, shoot, fight, roll a dice to determine the outcome has been done many times, because it works. Could you imagine a different mechanic? If so, you might have something.

Hope this helps,

Ludo

Grot 6 wrote:I would like an OLD game.

"New and Improved" isn't really all that it is cracked up to be.

Want an idea? Buy the rights to an old game, and breath life into it.

Stop jacking around with "I want to make a new game... thats been remade 1000 times before."

At the end of the day, miniatures games are miniatures games. The backstory and fluff is what the game is built on, the mechanics are the skull. the Meat is the factions, armies, what have you, and thier story is why we are playing.

Want a no bull idea for a game?

a skirmish level TWILIGHT:2000 game.

Would be great if added to the RPG suppliments, and give you depth of story with a squad of guys and a vehicle and let them roll.

the scenery is there.

Modern Military miniatures are there.

Story/ baseline info ... is there.

You can use modern setting table top cardstock cityscapes, rolling european hills, Middle eastern stuff, its all there.


Yes, you fight russians, and maruders, but if you could ever get that damn heavy weapons issue under wraps, Twilight:2000 is the one.


Not only that, but.... Your spelling doesn't show you serious of purpose in the task of games design.


there are a million games out there. You asking for meat when you have a Virginia Ham under your arm lacks common sense.

Wow... I used to own that game. Wonder who owns the rights to it now? *GoogleTime*

I would sugest to try to get hold of the original warzone rules , that was a skirmish game and the rules were quite good (more tactical than 40k, squad activation and such) and then they wrecked it in the version 2 edition.

I like the idea of having integrated permanent magnets to allow for customization. That would actually be pretty badass for a mech-based game - perhaps with a colored ring around the magnet to indicate what sort of "bay" it can be installed in. Yellow ring means it can go in any bay, green means ballistic only, etc etc...

The problem with this idea is I'm pretty sure it's difficult to sell tiny pieces with magnets in them with on a commercial scale. Something about children eating them. I don't know how that is overcome.

Ouze wrote:I like the idea of having integrated permanent magnets to allow for customization. That would actually be pretty badass for a mech-based game - perhaps with a colored ring around the magnet to indicate what sort of "bay" it can be installed in. Yellow ring means it can go in any bay, green means ballistic only, etc etc...

The problem with this idea is I'm pretty sure it's difficult to sell tiny pieces with magnets in them with on a commercial scale. Something about children eating them. I don't know how that is overcome.

There was something similar to this at one point. A game called Ronin by Cel Entertainment. Company and game are both long defunct, but you could probably find some info if you were inclined to look.

~Eric

Dakka is the nicest online community I have ever, EVER seen.
This guy would have been flamed out of existence long ago on most other forums I have spent time on.
I want to applaud all of you for your patience, and positive response to this guy.
That said, I think he's probably got more fundamental challenges on his hands.
Things with which Dakka as a community of informed gamers might not be able to help.

OP, I'm suggesting you back off of the wargaming design dream for a while, and concentrate on a few important foundation goals.
First off, take several english classes. You can't do crap here in the english speaking world without a solid grasp of the language.
After that, spend some time playing the most successful wargames so that you understand the paradigm, language, and culture.
After that, spend some time asking yourself the serious question of, "Do I have anything interesting and innovative to bring to the table?"
Unless you are willing to take these relatively simple and straight forward steps, you are wasting your time, and the time of the nice people here who are trying to help you.

I love the a-holes in this thread. OP is asking for ideas, not investment money.

Sweet Jesus...

angel of ecstasy wrote:I love the a-holes in this thread. OP is asking for ideas, not investment money.

Sweet Jesus...

It's the way he's not responding to criticism of either his grammar or content that are why people are being "a-holes" in this here thread.

angel of ecstasy wrote:I love the a-holes in this thread. OP is asking for ideas, not investment money..

Maybe a few folks are being a bit harsher than absolutely necessary, but if you come in asking for help, and only offer vague ideas, an inability to communicate with punctuation and language, and a refusal to actually engage the criticism he recieved, you're not going to get a warm welcome.

Mathpat is right on, - if I may be permitted to paraphrase him- the OP needs to...

matphat wrote:.
-Take several english classes. You can't do crap here in the english speaking world without a solid grasp of the language.
-Spend some time playing the most successful wargames so that you understand the paradigm, language, and culture.
-spend some time asking yourself the serious question of, "Do I have anything interesting and innovative to bring to the table?"

It's ok to come to class raise your hand and ask a question, or even give a wrong answer. What matters if whether or not you then go home and do the necessary homework to get it right. The OP has mastered the art of raising hand and opening mouth, but doesn't seem to be much interested in what should follow.

angel of ecstasy wrote:I love the a-holes in this thread. OP is asking for ideas, not investment money.

Sweet Jesus...

If you think we're being too tough on the OP, you have no idea what tough is. This person is getting some of the nicest responses I've ever seen based on the way he has communicated his needs.

Regardless of how much offense you take, I have seen mostly helpful remarks, if not a bit blunt, mostly because the OP doesn't seem to be very invested.

Yeah Id agree with a lot said here. At the moment the backstory sounds almost exactly the same as fallout. The reason fallout has been so popular background wise is because it does what many other apocalpyse settings do, but have loads of twists, including robots in essentially the 1970's.
As well as that they went very in depth stuff.
Look on the wiki. Theres suprisingly a large amount of stuff about a cola company and how it had a freakin passion fruit famine. Anyone who bothers to go that in depth and put that much work into it deserves attention and popularity.

My impression (based on spelling, grammar, the setting of his "wargame", his attitude) is that OP is a young guy, who loves the concept of wargaming and thinks it would be cool to experiment with his own. I doubt he's a 30 year old with a concrete plan to invest "$80.000" in it, or take the idea further anytime soon.

Acting like many people do in this thread is like bullying a slowed child (and no, I am not saying OP is a slowed child). His ideas and plans are not going to harm any of you in any way.