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Send me the link privately then.

And I guess you have a point.

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Send me the link privately then.

And I guess you have a point.

What link? I have the book, and am posting information from it.

@Sasori

Thanks for backing me up there, I know what you're going through since I had a recent similar talk to him back at the Space Wolf hate thread. Sad as it is your evidence will likely be refuted as false or worse "irrelevant" by him. Unfortunately he is blinded by his own refusal to accept legitimate forms of information/proof from GW sources as well as arguments.

On a side note, I haven't been able to actually acquire IA12 myself so far, having only been able to glance through it from one of my friends at my FLGS. If you don't mind me asking, how did the Necrons manage to overwhelm all those worlds in such a short time frame? I never managed to read all the details in the book and I would assume they utilized some form of Cryptek invention/technomancy to help soften up a lot of the planets before they tore through their defenses. Also did they just cleanse the planet of life? Sorry if this is too much to ask for but from what you said earlier of the Necrons it really piqued my interest to see a FW viewpoint of the newer idea of Necrons.

I would argue Necrons are the biggest threat to non-imperials. They are militarily powerful, particularly in space, making them a perfect foil for Eldar and Tyranids. The fact they are indigestible to the nids too is also worth noting. They are also powerful foes on the ground, organized and relentless, making them a big foil to orks and Tau in most instances. They are a natural antithesis of Chaos that goes without saying.

For the imperials, numbers fall in to play (theoretically in fairness that would apply for orks too), in space they win on the ground give or take I would say. The important bit though, is that the Necrons in their new incarnation seem to be somewhat civilized and in certain circumstances, alliances seem possible. Tau and Imperials I think have a chance to co-exist with them relatively in the interim.

My totally subjective prediction would be that the Necrons would spend most of their time and energy on the nids and chaos, and the other races would let them, hoping to be able to tackle the winner of a long war of attrition on more manageable terms. If anything, I think the Necrons could be a balancing force in terms of Galactic power, blunting the biggest threats of nids and chaos while giving the imperials and tau a bit of breathing room.

60 worlds in 100 says is a frighteningly fast advance not even the SM legion of the great crusade could have pulled off.

On Chaos ,the biggest number of worlds I can recall them taking at once where the sabbit worlds and I do not think that was anywhere near 60. And it was a long term thing that did not happen over night.

Tech wise, no one beats the Necrones.

 Grimskul wrote:
@Sasori

Thanks for backing me up there, I know what you're going through since I had a recent similar talk to him back at the Space Wolf hate thread. Sad as it is your evidence will likely be refuted as false or worse "irrelevant" by him. Unfortunately he is blinded by his own refusal to accept legitimate forms of information/proof from GW sources as well as arguments.

On a side note, I haven't been able to actually acquire IA12 myself so far, having only been able to glance through it from one of my friends at my FLGS. If you don't mind me asking, how did the Necrons manage to overwhelm all those worlds in such a short time frame? I never managed to read all the details in the book and I would assume they utilized some form of Cryptek invention/technomancy to help soften up a lot of the planets before they tore through their defenses. Also did they just cleanse the planet of life? Sorry if this is too much to ask for but from what you said earlier of the Necrons it really piqued my interest to see a FW viewpoint of the newer idea of Necrons.

Hey, not a problem, I'll be glad to let you know.

As for how they conquered the first 60 planets, it was just brutal, all out lightning strikes, over scores of worlds at time. It wasn't a planet at time, but several scores. It was also plain extermination. No one was prepared for the Necrons assault, and it was implied that they had done their research ahead of time, It's just implied that their superior technology and lighting fast assaults simply overwhelmed that half of the sector.It also appears that they induced the planet that housed the Space Marine chapter, to erupt from the core, turning it into a molten wasteland. They also were able to drop a "Veil of Darkness" over half the sector, that functions similar to shadow of the warp, by disrupting communications, as well as seemingly "Swallowing" up anything passed into it. However, that may be up to interpretation if something was just destroyed by Necrons after it passed the Veil, or if the Veil itself was eliminating the ships.

For the imperials, numbers fall in to play (theoretically in fairness that would apply for orks too), in space they win on the ground give or take I would say. The important bit though, is that the Necrons in their new incarnation seem to be somewhat civilized and in certain circumstances, alliances seem possible. Tau and Imperials I think have a chance to co-exist with them relatively in the interim.

Hey Major,

According to this, the Imperial Armada that the Necrons fought, had several hundred escort vessels, over 60 rated cruisers and capital vessels, including seven primus-grade battleships, four battle barges, and an Apocalypse ship. This entire fleet was pretty much obliterated with ease, by a Necron fleet less than 1/4th of it's size. If anything, this seems to indicate to me that Necrons far outclass Imperials in space. This was also only a single dynasty's fleet.

 Sasori wrote:


Hey, not a problem, I'll be glad to let you know.

As for how they conquered the first 60 planets, it was just brutal, all out lightning strikes, over scores of worlds at time. It wasn't a planet at time, but several scores. It was also plain extermination. No one was prepared for the Necrons assault, and it was implied that they had done their research ahead of time, It's just implied that their superior technology and lighting fast assaults simply overwhelmed that half of the sector.It also appears that they induced the planet that housed the Space Marine chapter, to erupt from the core, turning it into a molten wasteland. They also were able to drop a "Veil of Darkness" over half the sector, that functions similar to shadow of the warp, by disrupting communications, as well as seemingly "Swallowing" up anything passed into it. However, that may be up to interpretation if something was just destroyed by Necrons after it passed the Veil, or if the Veil itself was eliminating the ships.

O.O Daaaaaaaaammmn! That is definitely one badass, appropriately cold and ruthless way to go about it. Really adds a nice sense of doom that isn't vague or "Wardified" because now not only are we given an actual number-based (practically flawless) victory but it shows the depth of their technological and military prowess. I really like their "sans fuss" method of simply blowing the SM monastery from the inside out; it gives a sense of a competent but incredibly hostile impending alien force that will outright wipe out opposition without the frills of half-baked long-winded Black Crusades and intercine Eldar/cultist plots or subversive Tau diplomacy. Thanks a bunch for the info! Looks like FW has really made a great addition to the new Necron fluff.

@Sasori, re-read, I said without qualification Necrons win in space, I agree with ya!

 MajorTom11 wrote:
@Sasori, re-read, I said without qualification Necrons win in space, I agree with ya!

Ohh, I apologize, I Mis-read that!

Well, at least It got me to type out all the stuff the Imperials brought!

 Grimskul wrote:

 Sasori wrote:


Hey, not a problem, I'll be glad to let you know.

As for how they conquered the first 60 planets, it was just brutal, all out lightning strikes, over scores of worlds at time. It wasn't a planet at time, but several scores. It was also plain extermination. No one was prepared for the Necrons assault, and it was implied that they had done their research ahead of time, It's just implied that their superior technology and lighting fast assaults simply overwhelmed that half of the sector.It also appears that they induced the planet that housed the Space Marine chapter, to erupt from the core, turning it into a molten wasteland. They also were able to drop a "Veil of Darkness" over half the sector, that functions similar to shadow of the warp, by disrupting communications, as well as seemingly "Swallowing" up anything passed into it. However, that may be up to interpretation if something was just destroyed by Necrons after it passed the Veil, or if the Veil itself was eliminating the ships.

O.O Daaaaaaaaammmn! That is definitely one badass, appropriately cold and ruthless way to go about it. Really adds a nice sense of doom that isn't vague or "Wardified" because now not only are we given an actual number-based (practically flawless) victory but it shows the depth of their technological and military prowess. I really like their "sans fuss" method of simply blowing the SM monastery from the inside out; it gives a sense of a competent but incredibly hostile impending alien force that will outright wipe out opposition without the frills of half-baked long-winded Black Crusades and intercine Eldar/cultist plots or subversive Tau diplomacy. Thanks a bunch for the info! Looks like FW has really made a great addition to the new Necron fluff.

Yeah, hearing all this fluff that sounds like it's actually competent and a nice dose of Oldcrony goodness really making it hard on whether to get a Sentry pylon first or the book.

Necrons dangerous? Why yes. Yes they are very dangerous! I'd personally put them in the top 3 in terms of their possible damage to the Imperium of Mankind (Nids, Chaos, Necrons). Whilst orks certainly have the numbers, they are far too fragmentation to really be able to pierce into the Imperium of Mankind. Chaos has subterfuge, deceit, the slow creeping sensation, and finally literally having single individuals that can rend reality and destroy planets, Nids have hive fleets constantly swarming in and evolve rapidly, and Necrons have the greatest technology in the galaxy. Each one represents a threat in their own way... (thank goodness two of them are so fractured!)

 Grimskul wrote:

 Sasori wrote:


Hey, not a problem, I'll be glad to let you know.

As for how they conquered the first 60 planets, it was just brutal, all out lightning strikes, over scores of worlds at time. It wasn't a planet at time, but several scores. It was also plain extermination. No one was prepared for the Necrons assault, and it was implied that they had done their research ahead of time, It's just implied that their superior technology and lighting fast assaults simply overwhelmed that half of the sector.It also appears that they induced the planet that housed the Space Marine chapter, to erupt from the core, turning it into a molten wasteland. They also were able to drop a "Veil of Darkness" over half the sector, that functions similar to shadow of the warp, by disrupting communications, as well as seemingly "Swallowing" up anything passed into it. However, that may be up to interpretation if something was just destroyed by Necrons after it passed the Veil, or if the Veil itself was eliminating the ships.

O.O Daaaaaaaaammmn! That is definitely one badass, appropriately cold and ruthless way to go about it. Really adds a nice sense of doom that isn't vague or "Wardified" because now not only are we given an actual number-based (practically flawless) victory but it shows the depth of their technological and military prowess. I really like their "sans fuss" method of simply blowing the SM monastery from the inside out; it gives a sense of a competent but incredibly hostile impending alien force that will outright wipe out opposition without the frills of half-baked long-winded Black Crusades and intercine Eldar/cultist plots or subversive Tau diplomacy. Thanks a bunch for the info! Looks like FW has really made a great addition to the new Necron fluff.

Yeah, the fluff is really top-notch.

A funny tidbit, is that the Sector governor, was having "Nightmares" about being summoned to a Court of the Necrons, and being forced to eat at a table, with flayed ones, and Necron Lords. One of the Inquisitors thought this was "Daemons" tainting his mind. It turns out though, that the Necrons were "Kidnapping" him (Out of the capital, without any sort of detection) and treating him as the leader of their opposition. Apparently it was so nightmarish, that his subconsciousness blocked it out, to appear as nightmares. They flat out told him, they were going to just destroy them.

Yeah, hearing all this fluff that sounds like it's actually competent and a nice dose of Oldcrony goodness really making it hard on whether to get a Sentry pylon first or the book.

I would go for the book, hands down.

Not bad, I had head mostly bad things surrounding the book itself, but this seems pretty cool!

 MajorTom11 wrote:
Not bad, I had head mostly bad things surrounding the book itself, but this seems pretty cool!

If you have any questions Tom, I'd be glad to answer them. I really feel the book is top notch, and it's the most well done of the IA books I have, IMO.

@Sasori

Haha! Nice! Humour AND grimdark? I feel sad that the codices that GW pumps out doesn't have this level of depth and work into them. Darn you and your storytelling! Now I gotta fish out some dough to get this work of 40K art!

 Sautekh_The_Silent_King wrote:
Everyone who plays 40K knows about Necrons. Who thinks they pose a threat in the 40K universe, and if not, why? I just want to know.

The emergence of the Necrons and the arrival of the Tyranids are the two primary reasons why the current time period of the meta plot is called the "time of ending." They, along with Chaos and the Tyranids, are the greatest threats to the Imperium.

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Send me the link privately then.

And I guess you have a point.

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/IMPERIAL_ARMOUR_VOLUME_TWELVE_THE_FALL_OF_ORPHEUS.html

Oh god, please not an other "my faction is better than yours" thread...

As to the OP's question, no, nothing can beat SM plot armor, the IoM ultimately has nothing to fear as long as they're around. everyone should know that by now.

In terms of an actual threat, the Necrons - if inclined to one day - could destroy the galaxy with a swipe of their hand through the celestial orrery. They have the ability to destroy everything in one go if they felt like it.

To say they aren't a threat implies you don't know much about their lore . . .

edit - I bet the next massive Tyranid invasion that gets close to Terra/severely threatens the galaxy gets stopped by the Necrons detonating key star systems using the orrery. It's only a matter of time before GW employs the orrery, especially with Ward writing super stories about characters who knock bears out with one punch and run twenty marathons but aren't even tired then eat 4 buffets and asks for more etc etc.

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
the Necrons - if inclined to one day - could destroy the galaxy with a swipe of their hand through the celestial orrery. They have the ability to destroy everything in one go if they felt like it.

Yeah they could the passage about it implied that it would damage them as well. Suicide isn't what they want, and neither is exterminating all living things (for most of them, anyway). While it is possible, there are too many reasons for them not to do so to actually act on it. One could also point out that we don't actually know how it works - it is possible that given time a way to counter its effects may be discovered.

edit - I bet the next massive Tyranid invasion that gets close to Terra/severely threatens the galaxy gets stopped by the Necrons detonating key star systems using the orrery. It's only a matter of time before GW employs the orrery,

I disagree with this. I suspect that the Orrery won't get used, and besides that, it's never said how quickly the stars actually go supernova, merely that they will millenia before their time. Certainly it would be difficult to use it as a weapon against mobile targets. It almost certainly wouldn't be necessary anyway. The Imperium could just start detonating Warp drives again, which is apparently the single best weapon against enormous fleets. One wonders why it isn't done more often.

 Sasori wrote:

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Ehm 60 worlds conquered is a footnote (seriously). And individually few except a Space Marine can take out a Necron. I will give you that. I don't what this fanaticism is coming from. I'm a fairly laid-back dude and suddenly I'm assaulted on all fronts by lovers of the Crons who for uncertain reasons wanna over-power them.

You keep changing it. Let me spell it out for you. Show me a faction that has conqured 60 fortified worlds, including a a fortress world of a Space Marine chapter, in less than 100 days. That is NOT a footnote.

You're not listing to reason to facts, and have not backed up any of your claims at all. We are simply asking for you to back up your claims, which you have not. We are not overpowering the, we have sources for everything we have posted, it's all been fact.

Here is an example that seems to be forgotten...Chaos. How many Eldar worlds fell to Slaanesh in an instant and how many other Eldar/Humans died galaxy wide when Slaanesh was born? By THAT definition, Chaos is worse.

However I do NOT think Chaos is worse, and the reason is that Chaos requires a status quo whereas Necrons and Tyranids do not.

But that doesn't make Necrons nor Tyranids the biggest threat either...because nobody really works with them anymore because of the threat they can pose with their ideas.

So to sum up, I feel there is no greater threat...there will ALWAYS be a status quo due to the lesser threats working out deals. The only way for this to NOT be so is if the Tyranids Hive Fleets are much larger than we currently see now and wipe out every living organism in space and then only have the Necrons to deal with...I don't think the Necrons would win that battle...but I admit it would be a good fight.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Quick addition.

I must admit I am a little frustrated that IA12 was written in such a way as to make the Necrons look godly but IA11 was done in such a way that the Eldar have no advantage except in taking small victories when the lose.

Most of the writing in that book was good, however the description of how the Eldar tech doesn't work against seasoned Imperial war machines was just rubbish.

They have a set of Christmas lights that can exterminate the suns of entire galaxies, Id say that's fairly dangerous. hell if a lord fell on it he could accidentally supernova a whole sector....

Accidental intergalactic genocide?

Was there a group of fanboys more rabid than SW ones? Apparently Necrons.

MarsNZ wrote:
Was there a group of fanboys more rabid than SW ones? Apparently Necrons.

It's not necessarily fanboying, it's more reiterating and emphasizing the legitimate amount of threat that they as a faction bring. Especially in the context of recent additional fluff and the capabilities, it would be ignorant not to realize the amount of damage they can bring upon the 40K universe considering how badly jacked up the universe was after the Necrons "won" the War in Heaven. Tyranids and Chaos are still up there when it comes to high level threats to the universe as a whole, it's just that in the case of a topic thread like this there's a lot of evidence to suggest that Necrons are incredibly dangerous in their own way. If anything it seems like the fanboys are really the ones who deny that they are dangerous and think that despite the amount of proof brought to the table that they still are a low-level tier threat despite everything to the contrary.

I just think it's rather funny that people get so worked up that their favourite faction's handwavium is being questioned. Necrons have a device that can destroy star systems at will, why bother making ships and going to sleep for millions of years? Ever since I got that free WD Necron back in 98? 99? (I forget) I've thought the race and especially the surrounding fluff was stupid.

MarsNZ wrote:
I just think it's rather funny that people get so worked up that their favourite faction's handwavium is being questioned. Necrons have a device that can destroy star systems at will, why bother making ships and going to sleep for millions of years? Ever since I got that free WD Necron back in 98? 99? (I forget) I've thought the race and especially the surrounding fluff was stupid.

They are by far for one of the most poorly conceived factions out there IMHO. They're the Mary Sues of the Xenos at this moment.

We used to rule the galaxy, just like the Eldar, only better.
We have really advanced tech, just like Eldar, only better.
We're really numerous, just like the Orks, only better.
We have really smart and powerful commanders, just like the Ultra Marines, only better.
We have really powerful Gods, just like Chaos, only better.
Only we don't serve them, they serve us.
Our space ships are really fast and devastating, just like the Eldar's/Space Wolfs', only better.
We have lots of honor, just like the Space Wolfs, only better.
We're really scary and cruel, just like the Dark Eldar, only better.
We're a threat to the galaxy, just like the Tyranids, only better.
We have Blackstone Fortresses, just like Chaos/Eldar, only better.
We could very easily beat all of you but we just don't wanna ATM.
Did I miss any?

They really sound like something an 8 year old would cook up for his own fanfic, they have no flaws and out perform everyone at everything. Buy hey, if some people like that kind of gak, good for them. Just don't expect me to take their fluff any more serious than LCB.

 Popenfresh wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
I just think it's rather funny that people get so worked up that their favourite faction's handwavium is being questioned. Necrons have a device that can destroy star systems at will, why bother making ships and going to sleep for millions of years? Ever since I got that free WD Necron back in 98? 99? (I forget) I've thought the race and especially the surrounding fluff was stupid.

They are by far for one of the most poorly conceived factions out there IMHO. They're the Mary Sues of the Xenos at this moment.

We used to rule the galaxy, just like the Eldar, only better.
We have really advanced tech, just like Eldar, only better.
We're really numerous, just like the Orks, only better.
We have really smart and powerful commanders, just like the Ultra Marines, only better.
We have really powerful Gods, just like Chaos, only better.
Only we don't serve them, they serve us.
Our space ships are really fast and devastating, just like the Eldar's/Space Wolfs', only better.
We have lots of honor, just like the Space Wolfs, only better.
We're really scary and cruel, just like the Dark Eldar, only better.
We're a threat to the galaxy, just like the Tyranids, only better.
We have Blackstone Fortresses, just like Chaos/Eldar, only better.
We could very easily beat all of you but we just don't wanna ATM.
Did I miss any?

They really sound like something an 8 year old would cook up for his own fanfic, they have no flaws and out perform everyone at everything. Buy hey, if some people like that kind of gak, good for them. Just don't expect me to take their fluff any more serious than LCB.

hahaha, this made me laugh, they are by far the most uninteresting army/faction for this very reason. well said!

 Popenfresh wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
I just think it's rather funny that people get so worked up that their favourite faction's handwavium is being questioned. Necrons have a device that can destroy star systems at will, why bother making ships and going to sleep for millions of years? Ever since I got that free WD Necron back in 98? 99? (I forget) I've thought the race and especially the surrounding fluff was stupid.

They are by far for one of the most poorly conceived factions out there IMHO. They're the Mary Sues of the Xenos at this moment.

We used to rule the galaxy, just like the Eldar, only better.
We have really advanced tech, just like Eldar, only better.
We're really numerous, just like the Orks, only better.
We have really smart and powerful commanders, just like the Ultra Marines, only better.
We have really powerful Gods, just like Chaos, only better.
Only we don't serve them, they serve us.
Our space ships are really fast and devastating, just like the Eldar's/Space Wolfs', only better.
We have lots of honor, just like the Space Wolfs, only better.
We're really scary and cruel, just like the Dark Eldar, only better.
We're a threat to the galaxy, just like the Tyranids, only better.
We have Blackstone Fortresses, just like Chaos/Eldar, only better.
We could very easily beat all of you but we just don't wanna ATM.
Did I miss any?

They really sound like something an 8 year old would cook up for his own fanfic, they have no flaws and out perform everyone at everything. Buy hey, if some people like that kind of gak, good for them. Just don't expect me to take their fluff any more serious than LCB.

Never saw it that way. That is very accurate actually. Poor fluff indeed.

 Sautekh_The_Silent_King wrote:
Everyone who plays 40K knows about Necrons. Who thinks they pose a threat in the 40K universe, and if not, why? I just want to know.

No, the Necrons aren't really dangerous.

The Necrons are a race of highly misunderstood people, who were assaulted by a race much larger and more powerful than themselves, and the experience messed them up quite badly. All they want to do is rebuild their home, and be friends with everyone. They want to help make all races immortal and turn themselves into hyper-intelligent immortal fluffy animals.

They would have achieved this if it were not for the evil humans bullying them until they have no choice but to defend themselves with the power of friendship and love.


/endsarcasm

Oh, god.... I couldn't write much more of that bs.... It was actually giving me chest pains just imagining it...

I shall apologize with something more satisfying:

The ground trembled as the undying horde marched towards the human gunline, taking fire that should have destroyed even the mightiest of armies. The Necrons marched forward, repairing all damage they sustained, whilst tearing apart humans and vehicles alike with their unstoppable gauss weaponry.

That's better...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Popenfresh wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
I just think it's rather funny that people get so worked up that their favourite faction's handwavium is being questioned. Necrons have a device that can destroy star systems at will, why bother making ships and going to sleep for millions of years? Ever since I got that free WD Necron back in 98? 99? (I forget) I've thought the race and especially the surrounding fluff was stupid.

They are by far for one of the most poorly conceived factions out there IMHO. They're the Mary Sues of the Xenos at this moment.

We used to rule the galaxy, just like the Eldar, only better.
We have really advanced tech, just like Eldar, only better.
We're really numerous, just like the Orks, only better.
We have really smart and powerful commanders, just like the Ultra Marines, only better.
We have really powerful Gods, just like Chaos, only better.
Only we don't serve them, they serve us.
Our space ships are really fast and devastating, just like the Eldar's/Space Wolfs', only better.
We have lots of honor, just like the Space Wolfs, only better.
We're really scary and cruel, just like the Dark Eldar, only better.
We're a threat to the galaxy, just like the Tyranids, only better.
We have Blackstone Fortresses, just like Chaos/Eldar, only better.
We could very easily beat all of you but we just don't wanna ATM.
Did I miss any?

They really sound like something an 8 year old would cook up for his own fanfic, they have no flaws and out perform everyone at everything. Buy hey, if some people like that kind of gak, good for them. Just don't expect me to take their fluff any more serious than LCB.

I liked it when they were just a horde of soul-sucking killing machines who hate all life...

If you don't like the faction, that's fine, but please create a more suitable topic for it. This thread is for if the Necrons are Dangerous or not, not weather you like they are poorly conceived or not.