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 thedarkavenger wrote:
Due to laziness, I'm not going to multiquote.

A) Most monsters never see the light of day? I'll tell that to Frosthearts, Chimerae, Daemon Princes, Mortarchs, Nagash, The Glottkin, The Maggoth Lords and Karl Franz Ascendant. (Here's a hint, 3 of those have any form of ward )

B) It's not like that. It's like saying Pit of Shades should do D6 s6 hits if you pass the initiative check. Because then, the spells would do the EXACT SAME THING.

C) If you think warlocks are a combat unit, then you should stop playing. They're only ever put into combat as either A) A bus with a front rank of 1+ save characters with lances, or B) A chaff block to save a unit that is worth more points.

D) You are aware that only one of those will be stopped, right? That is how the chalice works. You will only ever be able to stop one spell, short of the Chaos Dwarf player rolling a twelve or eleven dice phase. And even then, it's iffy.

The fact that that 5 out of 8 of the monsters you listed are end times, and 4 of which haven't even been around long enough to draw any conclsusions really demonstrates the opposite of your point. I.E. That only 3 out of how many monsters across the armybooks actually see that much play, is not many.

The fact that you keep ignoring the points brought up about Flames is also pretty telling.

Wow this blew up since the last time I checked it. I don't plan on min maxing so that can be ruled out of the discussion. I like the look of the Infernal Guard with hand weapon and shield, and I plan on using them as some hard hitting infantry. Hobgoblins are going to utilized as a giant shield wall. And I plan on using a few magma cannons and a skullcracker.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Wow this blew up since the last time I checked it. I don't plan on min maxing so that can be ruled out of the discussion. I like the look of the Infernal Guard with hand weapon and shield, and I plan on using them as some hard hitting infantry. Hobgoblins are going to utilized as a giant shield wall. And I plan on using a few magma cannons and a skullcracker.

Sounds good honestly, though Infernal Guard aren't so much hard hitting with base hand and shield. S4 is nice but they are more gradual grinding.

Yeah true. But they are pretty tough, thats more what im going for. Plus I love the models

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Yeah true. But they are pretty tough, thats more what im going for. Plus I love the models

You could follow it up with a bit of Ironsworn for extra damage, Ensorcelled weapons will help them kill a bit more, along with being WS5.

Ironsworn are a little too expensive for what they do plus they are special so don't fill out your core. I'd take infernal guard with HW/S and give em the razor standard for -1 save for your opponent.

A few things that got skipped.


Flames of Azgorth is INFINITE range and it's characteristic test is at -2 and ALL of it's wounds are multiple wounds.

It. Is. Better.Than.Pit.Of.Shades.

Chalice of Blood and Darkness is regularly played as thus.

"I cast my spell with my last 3 dice..AND IMMEDIATELY ROLL THE CHALICE BECAUSE IT SAYS AT ANY POINT IN THE PHASE AND YOU LOSE YOUR DISPEL DICE !!1!!11"

Ash Storm, while conceded as ridiculous, is nothing but lockdown.

Flames of Azgorth is INFINITE range and it's characteristic test is at -2 and ALL of it's wounds are multiple wounds.

It. Is. Better.Than.Pit.Of.Shades.

LoS range, Characteristic Test is one model in the center, and yes a S6 hit and then a D6 Wounding if it strikes. Thanks for reiterating something that's been known since the beginning of the conversation.

It is not, considering Pit of Shades is a forced I test or death for everyone the circle passes over, also is something wrong with your period key?

Chalice of Blood and Darkness is regularly played as thus.

"I cast my spell with my last 3 dice..AND IMMEDIATELY ROLL THE CHALICE BECAUSE IT SAYS AT ANY POINT IN THE PHASE AND YOU LOSE YOUR DISPEL DICE !!1!!11"

It is rather hard to take you seriously when you type like that but yes they could do that, I mean if they are relying entirely on Dispel Dice it's likely they weren't planning very well against magic to begin with, it is a very useful arcane wargear.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

Flames of Azgorth is INFINITE range and it's characteristic test is at -2 and ALL of it's wounds are multiple wounds.

It. Is. Better.Than.Pit.Of.Shades.

LoS range, Characteristic Test is one model in the center, and yes a S6 hit and then a D6 Wounding if it strikes. Thanks for reiterating something that's been known since the beginning of the conversation.

It is not, considering Pit of Shades is a forced I test or death for everyone the circle passes over, also is something wrong with your period key?

Other than Phoenix Guard, I'd say that 90% of units are going to be more scared of a STR 6 hit. It gives no armor and most units don't have a ward save. The large version also still only scatters 1d6, instead of 2 like Pit.

Take any infantry without a ward save - most are 1 wound, I 3 or 4, and T3 or 4.

STR 6 wounds on 2's and allows no save.

Pit of Shades deviates more and still allows most models a 50% chance to survive.

 Thunderfrog wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

Flames of Azgorth is INFINITE range and it's characteristic test is at -2 and ALL of it's wounds are multiple wounds.

It. Is. Better.Than.Pit.Of.Shades.

LoS range, Characteristic Test is one model in the center, and yes a S6 hit and then a D6 Wounding if it strikes. Thanks for reiterating something that's been known since the beginning of the conversation.

It is not, considering Pit of Shades is a forced I test or death for everyone the circle passes over, also is something wrong with your period key?

Other than Phoenix Guard, I'd say that 90% of units are going to be more scared of a STR 6 hit. It gives no armor and most units don't have a ward save. The large version also still only scatters 1d6, instead of 2 like Pit.

Take any infantry without a ward save - most are 1 wound, I 3 or 4, and T3 or 4.

STR 6 wounds on 2's and allows no save.

Pit of Shades deviates more and still allows most models a 50% chance to survive.

It also becomes a 25+ cast, while an expanded PoS is 17+. The expanded Pit of Shades is still less expensive then Flames Base Cost.

-3 Armor isn't exactly "No Armor", only the Characteristic test is without save, many elite units and knights aren't exactly fearful, not to mention if they are with Flame immunity or those with special ward saves against fire they get their ward save boosted against it.

Also I play OK, telling me 90% fear a S6 D6 hit when your common wound is 3 and I 2 isn't exactly helpful, not to mention it still doesn't allow any saves of any kind, so Ward Saves can't protect you either while flames will allow for Saves means that Pit of Shades is the far superior option because dying instantly will mean your saves matter for nothing.

Man that spell is harsh!

You play Ogres. You are an obvious exception to the match that affects the VAST majority of every other army

Hint: They aren't made of monstrous infantry like yours is, so one STR 6 hit that wounds on a 2+ is MORE deadly to them than pit is to you, because very few units have a 3+ armor save compared to the number with 4+ and 5+, which are negated. And 2d6 scatter on PoS sucks.


Maths on a direct hit:

For the 3"
Centred on the middle guy on 20mm bases, 21 are hit.

At T3, or T4 for that matter at I3, only 4 will survive on average.

Half will survive shades.

For your Ogres, I think the template maxes out at 9 ogres.

Flames would wound on 2's, averaging 2 failed wounds, leaving 7d6 wounds, which averages 23 wounds and about 7 dead ogres, +1 under the hole.

(Most ogre characters use Crown of Command, Fencer Blades, and Glittering Scales, right?)

Hitting them with shades, they save on an I test of two, which should kill an average of 5.4 ogres.

There are subtle differences, in that LoA can make the ogres flammable. Shadow can drop their last I. It still works out the same.

Shades is 24 inches. Flames is LoS, which on a hill, could be infinite, or the choice targets could try and hide.

It might cost more, but whether you are casting big flames or big pit of shades, you are likely tossing 6 dice anyways.

 Thunderfrog wrote:
You play Ogres. You are an obvious exception to the match that affects the VAST majority of every other army

Hint: They aren't made of monstrous infantry like yours is, so one STR 6 hit that wounds on a 2+ is MORE deadly to them than pit is to you, because very few units have a 3+ armor save compared to the number with 4+ and 5+, which are negated. And 2d6 scatter on PoS sucks.


Maths on a direct hit:

For the 3"
Centred on the middle guy on 20mm bases, 21 are hit.

At T3, or T4 for that matter at I3, only 4 will survive on average.

Half will survive shades.

For your Ogres, I think the template maxes out at 9 ogres.

Flames would wound on 2's, averaging 2 failed wounds, leaving 7d6 wounds, which averages 23 wounds and about 7 dead ogres, +1 under the hole.

(Most ogre characters use Crown of Command, Fencer Blades, and Glittering Scales, right?)

Hitting them with shades, they save on an I test of two, which should kill an average of 5.4 ogres.

There are subtle differences, in that LoA can make the ogres flammable. Shadow can drop their last I. It still works out the same.

Shades is 24 inches. Flames is LoS, which on a hill, could be infinite, or the choice targets could try and hide.

It might cost more, but whether you are casting big flames or big pit of shades, you are likely tossing 6 dice anyways.

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 Thunderfrog wrote:
You play Ogres. You are an obvious exception to the match that affects the VAST majority of every other army

Hint: They aren't made of monstrous infantry like yours is, so one STR 6 hit that wounds on a 2+ is MORE deadly to them than pit is to you, because very few units have a 3+ armor save compared to the number with 4+ and 5+, which are negated. And 2d6 scatter on PoS sucks.


Maths on a direct hit:

For the 3"
Centred on the middle guy on 20mm bases, 21 are hit.

At T3, or T4 for that matter at I3, only 4 will survive on average.

Half will survive shades.

For your Ogres, I think the template maxes out at 9 ogres.

Flames would wound on 2's, averaging 2 failed wounds, leaving 7d6 wounds, which averages 23 wounds and about 7 dead ogres, +1 under the hole.

(Most ogre characters use Crown of Command, Fencer Blades, and Glittering Scales, right?)

Hitting them with shades, they save on an I test of two, which should kill an average of 5.4 ogres.

There are subtle differences, in that LoA can make the ogres flammable. Shadow can drop their last I. It still works out the same.

Shades is 24 inches. Flames is LoS, which on a hill, could be infinite, or the choice targets could try and hide.

It might cost more, but whether you are casting big flames or big pit of shades, you are likely tossing 6 dice anyways.

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

You complain about a lack of balance of chaos dwarfs in this thread yet plot to build broken armies from the end Times:Khaine list in another. The harsh truth is you're either a troll or a hypocrite!

 Ugly Green Trog wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 Thunderfrog wrote:
You play Ogres. You are an obvious exception to the match that affects the VAST majority of every other army

Hint: They aren't made of monstrous infantry like yours is, so one STR 6 hit that wounds on a 2+ is MORE deadly to them than pit is to you, because very few units have a 3+ armor save compared to the number with 4+ and 5+, which are negated. And 2d6 scatter on PoS sucks.


Maths on a direct hit:

For the 3"
Centred on the middle guy on 20mm bases, 21 are hit.

At T3, or T4 for that matter at I3, only 4 will survive on average.

Half will survive shades.

For your Ogres, I think the template maxes out at 9 ogres.

Flames would wound on 2's, averaging 2 failed wounds, leaving 7d6 wounds, which averages 23 wounds and about 7 dead ogres, +1 under the hole.

(Most ogre characters use Crown of Command, Fencer Blades, and Glittering Scales, right?)

Hitting them with shades, they save on an I test of two, which should kill an average of 5.4 ogres.

There are subtle differences, in that LoA can make the ogres flammable. Shadow can drop their last I. It still works out the same.

Shades is 24 inches. Flames is LoS, which on a hill, could be infinite, or the choice targets could try and hide.

It might cost more, but whether you are casting big flames or big pit of shades, you are likely tossing 6 dice anyways.

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

You complain about a lack of balance of chaos dwarfs in this thread yet plot to build broken armies from the end Times:Khaine list in another. The harsh truth is you're either a troll or a hypocrite!

I am neither. I was merely stating that by combining the three elf books, you can write a list that is almost as boring to play as Legions of Azorgh.

 Thunderfrog wrote:
You play Ogres. You are an obvious exception to the match that affects the VAST majority of every other army

Hint: They aren't made of monstrous infantry like yours is, so one STR 6 hit that wounds on a 2+ is MORE deadly to them than pit is to you, because very few units have a 3+ armor save compared to the number with 4+ and 5+, which are negated. And 2d6 scatter on PoS sucks.


Maths on a direct hit:

For the 3"
Centred on the middle guy on 20mm bases, 21 are hit.

At T3, or T4 for that matter at I3, only 4 will survive on average.

Half will survive shades.

For your Ogres, I think the template maxes out at 9 ogres.

Flames would wound on 2's, averaging 2 failed wounds, leaving 7d6 wounds, which averages 23 wounds and about 7 dead ogres, +1 under the hole.

(Most ogre characters use Crown of Command, Fencer Blades, and Glittering Scales, right?)

Hitting them with shades, they save on an I test of two, which should kill an average of 5.4 ogres.

There are subtle differences, in that LoA can make the ogres flammable. Shadow can drop their last I. It still works out the same.

Shades is 24 inches. Flames is LoS, which on a hill, could be infinite, or the choice targets could try and hide.

It might cost more, but whether you are casting big flames or big pit of shades, you are likely tossing 6 dice anyways.

The problem with averaging it like that is that since it's per assigned wound and excess wounds don't pass over on Multiple Wounds, typically it's harder to math out how many specifically will die as they have a 5+ chance to survive with one to two wounds left per ogre.

And yes that's a typical build, though it differs more on meta and depending on what build you prefer, but wow that's actually quite enlightening I must admit, though it ruins my day to see those with Ward Saves sucked into the Pit rather then hit by the Flames, typically my Lord and Such

Though I actually thank you for presenting actual data behind what your saying, I actually didn't have the proper math down for Legion, though Pit has always been one thing that's far more common to see, I suppose Pit would be far better then Flames at killing elite units compared to Legion who would have to deal with higher saves and ward.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

Considering you have yet to actually refute an argument..Or put forth any evidence at all beyond "They are OP because they have this this and thiss!" You are just so adorable.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

Considering you have yet to actually refute an argument..Or put forth any evidence at all beyond "They are OP because they have this this and thiss!" You are just so adorable.

Chaos Dwarfs are a boring gunline army list that are full of bent core, special, rare and character choices. Please provide evidence to the contrary so I can disprove it.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

Considering you have yet to actually refute an argument..Or put forth any evidence at all beyond "They are OP because they have this this and thiss!" You are just so adorable.

Chaos Dwarfs are a boring gunline army list that are full of bent core, special, rare and character choices. Please provide evidence to the contrary so I can disprove it.

You are the one who are saying they are OP beyond measure, start providing actual evidence to the contrary as you are the one saying they are.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 Thunderfrog wrote:
You play Ogres. You are an obvious exception to the match that affects the VAST majority of every other army

Hint: They aren't made of monstrous infantry like yours is, so one STR 6 hit that wounds on a 2+ is MORE deadly to them than pit is to you, because very few units have a 3+ armor save compared to the number with 4+ and 5+, which are negated. And 2d6 scatter on PoS sucks.


Maths on a direct hit:

For the 3"
Centred on the middle guy on 20mm bases, 21 are hit.

At T3, or T4 for that matter at I3, only 4 will survive on average.

Half will survive shades.

For your Ogres, I think the template maxes out at 9 ogres.

Flames would wound on 2's, averaging 2 failed wounds, leaving 7d6 wounds, which averages 23 wounds and about 7 dead ogres, +1 under the hole.

(Most ogre characters use Crown of Command, Fencer Blades, and Glittering Scales, right?)

Hitting them with shades, they save on an I test of two, which should kill an average of 5.4 ogres.

There are subtle differences, in that LoA can make the ogres flammable. Shadow can drop their last I. It still works out the same.

Shades is 24 inches. Flames is LoS, which on a hill, could be infinite, or the choice targets could try and hide.

It might cost more, but whether you are casting big flames or big pit of shades, you are likely tossing 6 dice anyways.

The problem with averaging it like that is that since it's per assigned wound and excess wounds don't pass over on Multiple Wounds, typically it's harder to math out how many specifically will die as they have a 5+ chance to survive with one to two wounds left per ogre.

And yes that's a typical build, though it differs more on meta and depending on what build you prefer, but wow that's actually quite enlightening I must admit, though it ruins my day to see those with Ward Saves sucked into the Pit rather then hit by the Flames, typically my Lord and Such

Though I actually thank you for presenting actual data behind what your saying, I actually didn't have the proper math down for Legion, though Pit has always been one thing that's far more common to see, I suppose Pit would be far better then Flames at killing elite units compared to Legion who would have to deal with higher saves and ward.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

Considering you have yet to actually refute an argument..Or put forth any evidence at all beyond "They are sad pare OP because they have this this and thiss!" You are just so adorable.

The math really comes to a few conclusions.

Multiwound models with I2 are scared of pit of shades, but unless they are T5 with a 6+ ward or T6 or T5 with a 2+/3+ armor, Azgorth is far more deadly.

Infantry models always suffer more wounds from Azgorth unless they are I 1 / have a 2+ armor / have a 5+ ward / are T6. (on average)

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

Give it up. He will just stick his fingers in his ears and yell that the book is perfectly balanced and that all other armies are terrible for not having similar things.

The harsh truth of it is that Chaos Dwarfs are about as balanced as KFA and Nagash. In that they nullify most armies and builds.

Considering you have yet to actually refute an argument..Or put forth any evidence at all beyond "They are OP because they have this this and thiss!" You are just so adorable.

Chaos Dwarfs are a boring gunline army list that are full of bent core, special, rare and character choices. Please provide evidence to the contrary so I can disprove it.

You are the one who are saying they are OP beyond measure, start providing actual evidence to the contrary as you are the one saying they are.

Evidence is as follows.

A spell that provides multiple methods of killing models worth 700+ VPs. This is an undeniable fact. As much as you say, "It's not bent because pit of shades exists." You are wrong. Toughness test or die is bad enough, to then even have the potential to doone S6 hit makes it OP.

The items. The fact that you can use the chalice between castings to deny your opponent the ability to counteract your magic phase. You'll probably reply with "But it drains your power dice too!" Which is of no consequence. By this point, you've either got enough dice do do what you want, or you can force that one major spell through, or you can force them to burn their scroll in the early game.

Core dwarfs with fireglaives and a pistol. Oh. These 4+ save dwarfs are S5 and can shoot you at 18" with S5 guns. And we always stand and shoot at close range for our guns. You'll probably reply with "Pit of shades is a thing." But, the fact that Ash storm exists means that you can effectively lock down a mage.

Cheap war machines. The fact that the war machines cost like no points in conjunction to the lore and items, means that you can keep them safe from anything.

K'daii Destroyer. I don't even need to go into this one.




So now I leave it to you. Please provide concrete evidence as to why chaos dwarfs are A) Balanced. B) Legit without bringing pit of shades into this.

Core dwarfs with fireglaives and a pistol. Oh. These 4+ save dwarfs are S5 and can shoot you at 18" with S5 guns. And we always stand and shoot at close range for our guns. You'll probably reply with "Pit of shades is a thing." But, the fact that Ash storm exists means that you can effectively lock down a mage.

18" S4 Armour piercing, Can get a pistol on the deathmask (Making him exorbitantly expensive) while making your core cost quite too much to be effective, oh and you're giving the Fireglaive the "Hailshot" modifier from the Hailshot Blunderbuss, which still requires 10+ models shooting at once.

Also 4+ Armour with S5 is OP at about the cost of the Ironsworn Really? It's too expensive to mass just for having a single shot before the enemy closes in while having a weaker greatweapon. They are worse then Chaos Warriors for the same cost.

A spell that provides multiple methods of killing models worth 700+ VPs. This is an undeniable fact. As much as you say, "It's not bent because pit of shades exists." You are wrong. Toughness test or die is bad enough, to then even have the potential to doone S6 hit makes it OP.

Yeah we've gone over this plenty enough by now, it's a strong spell but there's plenty of spells ingame that are just as powerful.

Cheap war machines. The fact that the war machines cost like no points in conjunction to the lore and items, means that you can keep them safe from anything.

More expensive then Dwarves and Empire, and not as spammable as Gunline Orcs, still it's their best feature.

K'daii Destroyer. I don't even need to go into this one.

Because we've pointed out it's not an "IWIN" button and you have no arguments.

The items. The fact that you can use the chalice between castings to deny your opponent the ability to counteract your magic phase. You'll probably reply with "But it drains your power dice too!" Which is of no consequence. By this point, you've either got enough dice do do what you want, or you can force that one major spell through, or you can force them to burn their scroll in the early game.

Yeah it's a strong item, probably should've been erratated to be used not right after a casting, though at the same time you seem to act as if it's the end all be all.

There, did it once without bringing pit of shades, maybe you could do a favor and not bring up Flames then.

Though they do need an update to make them a bit less gunline, open up their options for mid-field combat and such.

Thunderfrog

Pit of shades is a significantly better spell. I don’t understand how it can be made clearer.
Pit of shades costs a lot less to cast than FoA. This is a huge factor. The Enhanced version costs less than the casting cost of the unenhanced version of FoA. This means you can get a much more destructive version off, your can cast the smaller version with plenty of dice for the other spells.
Flames is really good for killing infantry, which is something armies have in abundance. Pit of shades is spell that can consistently remove much more expensive multi-wound models, for a cheaper casting cost. As a Tomb King players, I would much rather see flames any day of the week than Pit.
Of course, pit doesn’t allow saves of any kind, compared to flames which does. Flames also needs to wound as well.
This points to shades being a better spell, which objectively it is.

ThedarkAvenger,
Considering you have the reputation of sticking your fingers in your ears about issues, which is what you are doing now, is pretty ironic.
At this point, you’ve shown not to be objective multiple times in this thread about the army, including a slew posts that were deleted earlier in the thread. Zebio has put forth a lot of evidence to the contrary, while you have consistently gotten rules wrong about the LoA, or just ignored posts when it was convenient for you.

I feel that chaos dwarves have mix of over costed and under cost items in their list. If you look at things individually, yes you can point out things that are bent, but there are also a number of things you can sit there and scratch your head about.

vyslav wrote:
I feel that chaos dwarves have mix of over costed and under cost items in their list. If you look at things individually, yes you can point out things that are bent, but there are also a number of things you can sit there and scratch your head about.

Pretty sure that's most armies in a nutshell, you'll never see a Khaine's Ring of Fury but you'll be pressed to find a HE army that doesn't run a Banner of the WOrld Dragon.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

vyslav wrote:
I feel that chaos dwarves have mix of over costed and under cost items in their list. If you look at things individually, yes you can point out things that are bent, but there are also a number of things you can sit there and scratch your head about.

Pretty sure that's most armies in a nutshell, you'll never see a Khaine's Ring of Fury but you'll be pressed to find a HE army that doesn't run a Banner of the WOrld Dragon.

Odd. I *like* Khaines Ring of Fury.

It's a one dice flier that does decent damage and gives my units +1 ward if it isn't stopped.

Reading this thread I'm just like

Yes, I have been waiting all day for an excuse to use that meme.