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And I have yet to see anything that could possibly beat "the unlimited Independent characters of the imperium allied together."

Points cost was not given as a limiting factor. =p

I would say it often depends on what your facing. Some cc units are overkill against different targets while others are just far better priced for different sets of targets.

Take for example...
1. AP of the weapon being used. If the unit your assaulting is armor value 2, ll those points you paid for power swords is wasted because the target still gets their 2+ armor save. Youd be just as well off taking a squad of something with the same stats swinging rifle butts.
2. Initiative. You might have an initiative 5 squad that is perfect for attacking a unit that an initiative of 4 because it just gives that edge to get first swing. However, if your assaulting a unit of initiative 3 guardsment, you paid for an initiative where a point of it is wasted.
3. Armaments. An assault unit armed with rapid fire weapons means you cant fire them as you go in. Likewise, if they are armed with assault weapons like a flamer, they are golden. Then take it a step further.... A unit armed with flamer weapons are better at assaulting hordeswhile one armed with meltas are better for assaulting tanks.

Overall, there are too many strategic and tactical variations to tack a prie on any one without breaking it down into catagories.

Grotesques or Taloi in a Corpsethief Claw are pretty sick, especially when buffed by an Eldar psyker.

I'd create a poll, but there is no genuine way to create a balanced poll. I definitely should have been more specific (I was looking at a single unit with weapon upgrades, not 1300 points of orks or "every character ever in a single unit"). Oh well, I did get some useful feedback. My main reason was to potentially add a powerful melee heavy ally (I might add some wolves, I'll need to look at their stats and points costs first).

Although it is definitely fun seeing what people can suggest, and considering what would beat it. I'd genuinely like to see 25 deathwing knights take on 90 orks or something along those lines. While I can think of reasons I'd win (precision strike to kill off the klaws, higher initiative, higher WS, S6 AP4, having a 3++ against the claws) I can equally see plenty of opportunity for the orks to absolutely wreck me.

I'll definitely need to look up the rules on MSS now too, I've only played necrons at 500 or less, I was definitely expecting to see more chaos stuff (which I'm not familiar with) besides a great unclean one. Are they not very impressive compared to other melee-focused units?

 kingbobbito wrote:
I'd create a poll, but there is no genuine way to create a balanced poll. I definitely should have been more specific (I was looking at a single unit with weapon upgrades, not 1300 points of orks or "every character ever in a single unit"). Oh well, I did get some useful feedback. My main reason was to potentially add a powerful melee heavy ally (I might add some wolves, I'll need to look at their stats and points costs first).

Although it is definitely fun seeing what people can suggest, and considering what would beat it. I'd genuinely like to see 25 deathwing knights take on 90 orks or something along those lines. While I can think of reasons I'd win (precision strike to kill off the klaws, higher initiative, higher WS, S6 AP4, having a 3++ against the claws) I can equally see plenty of opportunity for the orks to absolutely wreck me.

I'll definitely need to look up the rules on MSS now too, I've only played necrons at 500 or less, I was definitely expecting to see more chaos stuff (which I'm not familiar with) besides a great unclean one. Are they not very impressive compared to other melee-focused units?

Exactly why I felt a bit odd for mentioning the green tide. It's a legit unit and all, but still, at that points cost it makes sense few things could stand against it.

If you're looking for some choppy allies, few things can beat TWC. They have a great statline for their points cost, they're mobile and upgrades will allow them to take on the opponent's entire army.

 Mumblez wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:
I'd create a poll, but there is no genuine way to create a balanced poll. I definitely should have been more specific (I was looking at a single unit with weapon upgrades, not 1300 points of orks or "every character ever in a single unit"). Oh well, I did get some useful feedback. My main reason was to potentially add a powerful melee heavy ally (I might add some wolves, I'll need to look at their stats and points costs first).

Although it is definitely fun seeing what people can suggest, and considering what would beat it. I'd genuinely like to see 25 deathwing knights take on 90 orks or something along those lines. While I can think of reasons I'd win (precision strike to kill off the klaws, higher initiative, higher WS, S6 AP4, having a 3++ against the claws) I can equally see plenty of opportunity for the orks to absolutely wreck me.

I'll definitely need to look up the rules on MSS now too, I've only played necrons at 500 or less, I was definitely expecting to see more chaos stuff (which I'm not familiar with) besides a great unclean one. Are they not very impressive compared to other melee-focused units?

Exactly why I felt a bit odd for mentioning the green tide. It's a legit unit and all, but still, at that points cost it makes sense few things could stand against it.

If you're looking for some choppy allies, few things can beat TWC. They have a great statline for their points cost, they're mobile and upgrades will allow them to take on the opponent's entire army.

I agree that TWC are great, though they have one big check and that is carnifexes. A brood of 3 carnifexes, with upgrades that made them str. 10 will really ruin your day.

oz of the north wrote:
I agree that TWC are great, though they have one big check and that is carnifexes. A brood of 3 carnifexes, with upgrades that made them str. 10 will really ruin your day.

Only if enough of them survive. With 5 S5 Rending attacks each, plus the cheese the Wolf Lord can have, I'm not sure you'd have enough carnifexes left for a decent counter-attack. Especially since it takes more than 6 attacks to kill a single Thunderwolf.

Also, you'll have a lot of trouble catching said thunderwolves - since they can move twice as fast as the carnifexes, and so basically pick and choose their battles.

If we're narrowing it down to only a single unit with maybe just one character attached...

Then Seekers are still the correct answer.

Though they may be dethroned by that Henchman/Inquisitor abomination mentioned earlier.

It's very curious that TWC keep getting mention in here, though.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Flipped through the thread, and I've yet to see anything posted in here that will beat a 20-man Seeker squad with attached locus of beguilement Herald in close-combat.

On mathematical averages, the unit will crush every suggestion made in this thread, thus far, unless I've missed something.

Even when not looking at pure hitting power, the unit moves an average of 23'' per turn, meaning it has a better chance of actually reaching combat than the super-majority of units in the game.

Are you talking about Horus Heresy units? In that case I'd nominate Jetbike White Scar spam. It's like normal White Scar bike spam, only better in every way and harder hitting with a guy who'll win every challenge, ever.

Seekers of Slaanesh.

Fast attack calvalry in the daemon codex.

I actually have no idea what the manly Horus Heresy units do, sans the Primarchs.

 The Wise Dane wrote:
Ork Shootas. Because it is fething hilarious to see 30 or so green bodies crush a squad of Guardsmen by sheer numbers.

Purifiers are good for anything non-Termi, too.

Shootas?....why Shootas? Why wouldn't you Slugga/Choppa? Get that extra CC attack!

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Seekers of Slaanesh.

Fast attack calvalry in the daemon codex.

I actually have no idea what the manly Horus Heresy units do, sans the Primarchs.

A five man command squad with jetbikes is fething scary when done right. Toughness five on jetbikes, they all can have power weapons and shields, charnabal sabres, etc, and they have 2+ armor saves from artificer armor. The jetbikes themselves all have heavy bolters tacked on, and I think the Command Squad can get a plasma cannon or multi-melta on one bike. Meanwhile the Praetor leading the squad can take a paragon blade, various shields or an iron halo, mastercraft any single weapon of choice, and gets to chose two rites of war (like warlord traits, only quality choices the lot of them).

Melevolence wrote:

 The Wise Dane wrote:
Ork Shootas. Because it is fething hilarious to see 30 or so green bodies crush a squad of Guardsmen by sheer numbers.

Purifiers are good for anything non-Termi, too.

Shootas?....why Shootas? Why wouldn't you Slugga/Choppa? Get that extra CC attack!

Because Sluggas are supposed to be good ass-whoopas, but most people don't think that of Shootas, so when you choose to charge with them, the result is absolutely hilarious

... I'm not taking this terribly seriously.