Flying Frog Productions: Forbidden Fortress (Shadows of Brimstone Standalone)

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**Nostromodamus**

Says right on the KS page that they're compatible.

**NewTruthNeomaxim**

Slight aside, and apologies as I know this thread has foot traffic. Has anyone tried ordering from FFG's webstore lately? I did two days ago without issue, but now at check-out Paypal keeps insisting that they're converting my currency from Brazillian Real(sp) to USD???

Called my CC company, and checked with Paypal, and no shady hacks or issues on my end.

**Forar**

I've ordered from them a couple of times (once for a poster, once for some card packs) and never had any weirdness on my end like that.

**455_PWR**

I've ordered a lot around the Halloween sale (resin limited gunslinger piece, minis, etc). Only thing I noticed was it took a few more days than normal to ship... perfectly acceptable as I'm sure they had higher sales with the sale.

I've never had issues ordering from ffg.

**Aeneades**

Belly of the beast feels a little short on enemy types at the moment (6 x Acidic Tentacles, 3x Skin Crawlers and 6 x Flesh Mites) so hopefully there will be another enemy type, mini boss or boss to give it a little more character.

A few new additions since I last posted the stretch goal list -

**B0B MaRlEy**

I've got no funds to get in on this, but I'll be hunting for that male sumo figure at the very least, it's basically an accurate depiction of one of my RPG characters

**Bossk_Hogg**

B0B MaRlEy wrote:
I've got no funds to get in on this, but I'll be hunting for that male sumo figure at the very least, it's basically an accurate depiction of one of my RPG characters

That figure is going to be pretty pricey, given that its an exclusive and it doesnt look like there's an option to add on extras. Plus it's a year and a half at least away. Out of curiosity, what makes it a must have? Bushido makes several great ones and you could add a sword easily if needed.

**Motograter**

Lot of complaints around facebook on this. First KS not being finished yet they are doing another. Price has been very talked about and some backers planning on backing out.

**Nostromodamus**

Motograter wrote:
Lot of complaints around facebook on this. First KS not being finished yet they are doing another. Price has been very talked about and some backers planning on backing out.

First KS is coming to a close with everything remaining currently in production in china. FFP need to work on their next project rather than just sitting around idle. So many people fail to understand this for some reason.

Price is subjective, but I think it currently stands as good value and is getting better all the time.

And some backers threatening to leave? Oh noes! That never happens on kickstarter...

**Forar**

Yeah, if people leave, they leave. That's their prerogative.

From what the Frogs have said, KS1 is at production. With a good chunk of December a writeoff for the holidays, what's the harm is slotting a campaign in now? Before fulfillment takes up a bunch of time/resources getting the oft lamented Wave 2 actually out to people.

Sure, the Sumo and Shogun levels aren't the 'omgwtfbbq' savings of the first campaign, but we knew that'd be the case. FFP have stated in a number of places that the Outlaw and Mine Cart tiers were underpriced, it would've been delusional to expect them to actively repeat a bad business decision.

Is it less than MSRP? Yes. Less than Retail? Yes. Do backers get things they can't easily get elsewhere (limited edition figures, card packs and such items that are often not found at retail)? Yes.

And with the initial surge of backers, we're already at a point where a good amount has been unlocked, and I'm sure there'll be more to come in the weeks ahead.

So... got on a bit of a rant there, but having seen some of those conversations pop up on the KS Comments, people are entitled to their opinions, but I think some of their opinions betray biases or expectations that aren't realistic. References to expecting equal or better 'deals' or 'value' to other campaigns while ignoring a lot of nuance and history present here.

Plus they're not charging for shipping in advance this time (and that's a good call to make), so we'd likely be well over 700k by now if they had been. But that kind of artificial inflation (not to mention Kickstarter taking a cut of that money) wouldn't have been wise.

**Grot 6**

Considering that each and every one of these streach goals will be met, THIS is a great deal. You just fire and forget, the project will do the rest. I can say as well from the first one that they were hit pretty hard by the deal that they gave out on the first project. Forar is spot on with his assessment as well.

QFT

Problem the vocals have is the sense of entitlement that comes with spending money on a project. Personally... I don't give the peanut gallery much credence, they get pretty savage, and are more then their fair share of just background noise.

**Mutter**

I'm in for Sumo, but seen as almost all of the SG now being unlocked are for Shogun only, I think I'm gonna drop out. The value for Sumo is just not really there, compared to similar big KS, and I'm not prepared to drop 300 bucks on the sweet spot ...

Will still follow this with interest.

**endtransmission**

The stretch goals now go up to 800k, which is our first new Otherworld! This Otherworld is just boards, cards and rules/missions at this point so I would imagine some of the other goals around it that are marked as not available as an add-on will be part of this world

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Aeneades wrote:
Belly of the beast feels a little short on enemy types at the moment (6 x Acidic Tentacles, 3x Skin Crawlers and 6 x Flesh Mites) so hopefully there will be another enemy type, mini boss or boss to give it a little more character.

There are also acid blobs as an enemy type, which are currently cardboard tokens in the box. This was spotted in the comments section because there is 1 more enemy stat card than miniature type in FoFo. Still not brilliant for an otherworld, but we do have 4 types here. It kind of makes sense that everything in here is stuff that could/would live inside a big monster; but it could do with a big boss of some sort

**Alpharius**

Forar wrote:Yeah, if people leave, they leave. That's their prerogative.

From what the Frogs have said, KS1 is at production. With a good chunk of December a writeoff for the holidays, what's the harm is slotting a campaign in now? Before fulfillment takes up a bunch of time/resources getting the oft lamented Wave 2 actually out to people.

Sure, the Sumo and Shogun levels aren't the 'omgwtfbbq' savings of the first campaign, but we knew that'd be the case. FFP have stated in a number of places that the Outlaw and Mine Cart tiers were underpriced, it would've been delusional to expect them to actively repeat a bad business decision.

Is it less than MSRP? Yes. Less than Retail? Yes. Do backers get things they can't easily get elsewhere (limited edition figures, card packs and such items that are often not found at retail)? Yes.

And with the initial surge of backers, we're already at a point where a good amount has been unlocked, and I'm sure there'll be more to come in the weeks ahead.

So... got on a bit of a rant there, but having seen some of those conversations pop up on the KS Comments, people are entitled to their opinions, but I think some of their opinions betray biases or expectations that aren't realistic. References to expecting equal or better 'deals' or 'value' to other campaigns while ignoring a lot of nuance and history present here.

Plus they're not charging for shipping in advance this time (and that's a good call to make), so we'd likely be well over 700k by now if they had been. But that kind of artificial inflation (not to mention Kickstarter taking a cut of that money) wouldn't have been wise.

Agreed!

They certainly have said often enough that the first campaign had a lot of...let's call them...miscalculations...in it!

Grot 6 wrote:Considering that each and every one of these streach goals will be met, THIS is a great deal. You just fire and forget, the project will do the rest. I can say as well from the first one that they were hit pretty hard by the deal that they gave out on the first project. Forar is spot on with his assessment as well.

Yes, FFP and Forar have indeed said that many times.

Grot 6 wrote:
Problem the vocals have is the sense of entitlement that comes with spending money on a project. Personally... I don't give the peanut gallery much credence, they get pretty savage, and are more then their fair share of just background noise.

Agreed and...

http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/thundersqueaks/irony_meter.gif

**Aeneades**

endtransmission wrote:
There are also acid blobs as an enemy type, which are currently cardboard tokens in the box. This was spotted in the comments section because there is 1 more enemy stat card than miniature type in FoFo. Still not brilliant for an otherworld, but we do have 4 types here. It kind of makes sense that everything in here is stuff that could/would live inside a big monster; but it could do with a big boss of some sort

I had seen the blobs mentioned on the main page but just presumed they were mentioning a future stretch goal early but I tracked down a comment from FFP and it sounds like they are happy to have them representanted as tokens. Not convinced that they wont pop up somewhere along the lines.

I like the look of the new Otherworld, hopefully we will see at least one more before the end of the campaign. Sounds like no Hell Train during this campaign as it would delay the entire project but a new town expansion is a possibility if funding gets high enough.

In the comments they posted a quick summary of the Forest of the Dead Rules -

Forest of the Dead The Forest of the Dead is a shadowy realm that lies between worlds, where the dead roam freely amongst the ancient and decayed trees. One of the main World features of the Forest of the Dead is that all the Enemies there automatically gain the Keyword Undead and Fear(1). This combines with the fact that in addition to the normal spectres and monsters that reside there, several of the OtherWorld Threat cards in the Forest have you draw a World card and a Threat from that World, giving you the possibility of running into Undead versions of any Enemies that are out there, as they roam the haunted, supernatural Forest of the Dead! You may run into a patrol of Undead Trederran Legionnaires, zombie Night Terrors, decayed Oni, or rusty and shambling Custodians from the Targa Plateau. The possibilities can be endless, drawn from across your entire Shadows of Brimstone collection to terrify and torment your Heroes!

So, judging by the themes, descriptions and lots of guess work I would say the Otherworld enemy list currently looks like -

Belly of the beast:
6 x Acidic Tentacles
3x Skin Crawlers (Large enemies)
6 x Flesh Mites
? x Acid Blobs (tokens not miniatures)

Forest of the Dead:
1 x Onmorake Carrion Phoenix (XL enemy) *
6 x Scourge Dead
3 x Goryu (Large enemies)
1 x Undead Daimyo (Mini Boss)*
3 x Spectral Horde (Large enemies)

* These could be an enemy for the regular world instead as seems to fit the criteria for both.

**ced1106**

New social media goal!

You know BGG'ers are trapped in the 17th century and won't do this, so make up for them by Sharing! :

https://www.facebook.com/FFPgames/posts/10153938416661994

**highlord tamburlaine**

Love the Kosugi clan reference. Grew up with their dad's movies as a kid.

They need to have a sword artifact that is possessed by the soul of an ancient ninja, that only females are allowed to wield that then puts them under its control on bad rolls for holding back the darkness, but otherwise turns them into ultimate bad asses.

Trying to figure out what happened to the total between this morning and today. Did the ADD crowd already lose interest or something?

**ced1106**

Well, I read that one of the pledgers was a troll who pledged 1K.

I think the problem the campaign is having is that the Samurai pledge is "all in", which is good for the hardcore SoB players. However, it's bad if there aren't enough pledgers during the campaign to sustain momentum and reach those SG's -- which looks like the case.

I don't think the campaign is attractive to casual Sumo backers who are also looking at Deep Madness, Mythic Battles: Pantheon, and Kingdom Death.

**Grot 6**

He only did that to gak up the project. He is the typical TFG that has brought himself over from the other KS project. The exact person that was alluded to earlier. He will pull out and throw the project back a bit. Ninja add-on is a bag of chips. I'm scrounging up my beer can money and going to get in on this by next week or two, if I can get away with it.

**Vain**

In reference to the person who is trying to futz the numbers...What a tool.

**Siygess**

I'm sure this KS has another $150k in it over the next month but I agree with ced1106 - if you are only looking to drop around $100 plus shipping, Pantheon is looking like a much stronger (standalone) prospect with stretch goals that actually apply to you. All things being equal, if you can only afford one of the two, I think you would really have to be invested in SoB (probably through ownership of one or both of the previous core boxes) to go for Sumo.

**Mutter**

ced1106 wrote:

I don't think the campaign is attractive to casual Sumo backers who are also looking at Deep Madness, Mythic Battles: Pantheon, and Kingdom Death.

This! That's exactly the position I'm in, that's why I dropped my pledge ...

**Alpharius**

SHOGUN looks great for me - and I think this one will probably push up against $1M eventually, if not tick a bit over.

At least, I certainly hope it does!

**Nostromodamus**

I had to drop out

It really sucks, but at least I'll have SoB wave 2 soon.

**NewTruthNeomaxim**

I'm super late to SoB as you guys know, but even after a few days, I know we're in love. The wife and I threw maybe eight hours a day/evening at it, each of the last three days.

Saying that, I wish this KS would run like gangbusters and go into the 2m+ mark. I'm in for $295 which, at $1million, a solid deal, but I know it would be exciting to have this one really run into "amazing deal" territory.

Either way, I have an easy time investing in games with a healthy future, and I literally have 20+ expansions to expect at retail before this KS fulfills, which in turn means a game they're obviously planning to support for at least another couple years after that... and that is an awesome success.

**Alpharius**

Update time!

Update #6

Nov 9 2016

Kosugi Master and Clan Ninjas Deluxe Enemy Pack Unlocked! New Add Ons! Beautiful New Painted Minis!

Hello Fortress Fans!

We have some exciting things to share. Progress is being made on all fronts - miniatures are being sculpted, figures painted, artifact illustrations, map tiles, etc. We are busy bees, but we wanted to do a quick update to show off some stuff.

Kosugi Master and Clan Ninjas Deluxe Enemy Pack Unlocked!

We had a fantastic response to our recent Social Media Stretch Goal. No sooner did we post the update then you guys sprang into action, sharing the post on Facebook with all of your friends and family! We got 250 shares and unlocked the Stretch Goal in just a couple of hours! Way to go! Keep sharing info and pictures on social media and we can be sure that everyone knows about the game. After our last Kickstarter ended, we got a flood of email and messages saying "I missed the Kickstarter! Is it too late?!?" I guarantee this will happen again after this campaign wraps at the end of the month. I just wish all of those gamers could get the message now during the KS, so that they can join the group!
New Add Ons

Backers have been very vocal about asking for Add Ons for the project and we listened! The number one request that we get in email and messages has been for Custom Dice. Not surprising since they were the hottest add-on in the last Kickstarter. Well, we not only created new Forbidden Fortress Dice designs, but we've included all of the original Shadows of Brimstone Custom Dice as well, to give backers a chance to get the cool dice from the first Kickstarter!

We've also added the Deluxe Dark Stone for those who would like to trick out their game!

Beautiful New Painted Minis

Our Studio Painter, Aaron Lovejoy, has been hard at work painting up the minis (3D Printed Prototypes) and you may have already seen the heroes. But, he has just completed the Acidic Tentacles and the XL-Sized Epic Boss, The Living Statue!

Happy Gaming!
Scott and Jason

It is always good to see the inevitable 'dice add-on' show up as, apparently, a lot of people want them (drive up that total baby!) and now that they're here people can now stop asking for them!

**highlord tamburlaine**

This campaign has been quite frustrating to watch this past week though. No real movement despite FFP trying to inject a bit of excitement into things with the dice and ninjas.

The dice add ons I don't get, but I know people really do go crazy over dice.

My Cthulhu Wars dice ended up paying for my base game for example. I'd ordered a few of the KS sets to pass around the table, and they ended up selling for way more than I thought they ever would have/ should have.

**Myrthe**

Yeah, watch out for the "Deluxe Dark Stone" optional buy. I went for that in the first campaign and it turned out to be translucent purple aquarium "rocks". And, while not smooth, they certainly weren't the shards depicted in the sketch.

I'm really torn on this campaign. I went full Mine Cart (and then some) in the first one and I STILL don't have it all. Moreso, we haven't played it all. FoFo's expected delivery is 18 months away !! But they aren't known for making deadlines. Additionally, I hate they way they botched the minis in the first campaign. And the resins aren't much better, IMO. I don't appreciate unannounced diversions from what was expected.

That being said, I LOVE the game !!! I might just ride the campaign out and see where it goes. If I remain on the fence I might just wait for retail release.

**Alpharius**

I am also shocked at the stall we're in right now...

Hopefully there aren't too many zero or negative days, and this one can get to climbing again soon.

**Bossk_Hogg**

Its largely stalled because the Sumo level just isnt all that exciting a deal when weighed against other kickstarters. You currently get the main box, the exclusive sumo pair, 4 alt gender heroes, 4 card expansions, a large model and a unit expansion.

Going by current SoB pricing available, the main box will be $$65 on mini market or a similar site, the 4 alt heroes are $8 each on Flying Frog's main site ($32, possibly cheaper when released formally), the Ninja Clan compares to the Scafford Gang ($26 on mini market), and the spider lady will probably shake out around $20 on mini market. The cards retail for $10 each, but to me thats stupid expensive for 15 cards... and they sell them 3 for 2 on the website. So $30 assuming you value them at that. Current value of the pledge is about $175+ the exclusive Sumo if you buy stuff online, so we'll say $195. But you have to also pay shipping on this and can probably get free shipping elsewhere, so that reduces the value by another $10-$20 for US residents.

At which point I'm looking at a $75 savings for paying 2 years out, because let's face it, delivery won't be on time, particularly that close to Chinese New Year. It's easy to see why it hasnt picked up steam. Mythic Battles: Pantheon and Deep Madness offer more bang for my buck. And Black Friday is just around the corner, and I know there's going to be crap I want then, so that's even less incentive to pay now for a moderate savings years later.

I really enjoy my SoB stuff, but this is feeling more like a pass until retail for me, as I cant afford to go Shogun and they arent interested in letting you upgrade later.