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 Jambles wrote:
Stikkbomb Chukkas upgrade for Ork vehicles.

Confers stikkbombs to a unit that charges the turn it disembarks.
Ain't no infantry in the codex that don't have stikkbombs...

Except Meganobz (that have power klaws and thus have no use for them)
And Wierdboys

Jbz` wrote:

 Jambles wrote:
Stikkbomb Chukkas upgrade for Ork vehicles.

Confers stikkbombs to a unit that charges the turn it disembarks.
Ain't no infantry in the codex that don't have stikkbombs...

Except Meganobz (that have power klaws and thus have no use for them)
And Wierdboys

Don't forget grots, in case you want to waste the points sticking them in a trukk.

Speaking of which, red paint job. It gives us +1'' movement when flatting out. Not really worth the 5 points.

That bonus move is a old through back to 2nd edition. Where painting your vehicles red allowed them to 1" faster. No charge.

It was also the only rule that actually required you to paint your models a certain way. Although as TVTropes put it, if you managed to convince your opponent that your non-red vehicle really was red, it'd be a feat worthy of an Ork.

Jbz` wrote:

 Jambles wrote:
Stikkbomb Chukkas upgrade for Ork vehicles.

Confers stikkbombs to a unit that charges the turn it disembarks.
Ain't no infantry in the codex that don't have stikkbombs...

Except Meganobz (that have power klaws and thus have no use for them)
And Wierdboys

Check again! Meganobz have stikkbomz too, believe it or not! It's crazy.

Vitali Advenil wrote:

Don't forget grots, in case you want to waste the points sticking them in a trukk.

Okay fair enough, I missed one - to be fair though, the RUNTHERD does still have stikkbomz

Painboyz also don't have stikkbombz.

So I guess the only use for that is on the off chance you want to give your painboy or weirdboy their own personal limo.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:

Don't forget grots, in case you want to waste the points sticking them in a trukk.

I've once won a tourney with grots charging a ravenwing deathstar out of a trukk. Well, technically they just ate overwatch but this overwatch would have killed 3 meganobz and grots wouldn't be able to reach dark angels without a trukk.

Wrecker and Amphibious.

Strafing Run is one of the rules that make Vultures so good.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:

Arson Fire wrote:
Many tyranid monstrous creatures coming with an AP6 close combat weapon is kinda amusing. Particularly on those that are unable to replace it, or take a second one.

Adding to this, the Bloodcrusher's 6+ armor save.

6+ ARMOR SAVE. The thing has the freaking Daemonic Rule. Why the hell does this exist? And it doesn't even matter for Grav anyways since I think the default is 6 anyhow.

The 40k daemons had their stats copied from the WHFB 8ed Daemon book. Their bloodcrushers had 6+ armor so the 40k ones get 6+ armor

 Jaxler wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:

Arson Fire wrote:
Many tyranid monstrous creatures coming with an AP6 close combat weapon is kinda amusing. Particularly on those that are unable to replace it, or take a second one.

Adding to this, the Bloodcrusher's 6+ armor save.

6+ ARMOR SAVE. The thing has the freaking Daemonic Rule. Why the hell does this exist? And it doesn't even matter for Grav anyways since I think the default is 6 anyhow.

Probably as a place holder or something. Every unit I think has a save. It's probably there in case you find some rule that modifies saves in some way. If it had no save it'd be impossible or need some FAQ if it got something like a +1 to armor save reroll if armor saves.

Also it sorta kinda helps against dangerous terrain I guess.

There are models without saves. Chaos Spawn for example don't have an actual armor save ( sv -) instead relying on toughness and wounds to protect them. I think there's something somewhere in the rules where if a model with no save has it's save buffed, such as +1 to armor save, it goes from armor save - to 6+ giving it an actual armor save (and +2 would make a sv - become 5+). I'm not really sure why daemons have armor saves worse than the invul granted by daemon.

It's kinda funny how Chaos Spawn are huge and yet for the purpose of Grav weapons are feather light.

Edit: Forgot to list my useless rules: Soul Blaze and Fear. Soul Blaze just doesn't seem to be worth keeping track of unless its to know something is immune to it and there's just too much stuff that makes fear useless.

A specific pointless example from 6th was Relentless on Maugan Ra since he has an assault weapon. I never could understand that one.

Although it's not pointless I do have a problem with Slow and Purposeful. It seems like a watered down version of Relentless. Personally I think from the description you would be better at overwatch (bs 2 or some such) rather than not being able to use it at all. The other parts like no running and such fit. It almost seems like it should be called "Slow and Aloof". With increased overwatch skill it would be a nice alternative to Relentless.

SaP has its pros and cons compared to Relentless.

I'm gonna say Fear, Acute Senses, Vector Dancer and Strafing Run. These rules are practically useless and superfluous to boot.

I would also like to suggest the "Assault Weapon" type.

Now assault weapons as a rule isn't useless, in fact it's very useful. The issue I have is that the "Assault Weapon" type is basically the default type of weapons, with the others basically being restrictions on top of the "basic" assault weapon. Whenever I play introductory games with people, this often gets some confusion as they think that because it's a listed special rule, it should have more rules than the basic "has no penalties when shooting and you can still assault".

 Roknar wrote:
It's not so much soul blaze that is an issue, but that you pay for it. And it's pretty much never ever worth it, so nobody takes the stuff that has it. At the very least it would have to stack.

I'd say precision strikes/shots is the most useless rule in the game. I can't even think of unit that has the rule....assasins?

Uhhhh no, that rule is absolute gold on my Death jesters. use it to snipe out special weapons from squads all the time.

If we're talking the most useless as in basically never gets used, I'm going to have to rank it:

1) Concussive. This rule almost never happens because the most common weapons that have it are hugely strong and/or, hilariously, Unwieldy. And most models only have 1 wound to take anyway... The number of times I've seen Concussive ever apply I can count on the fingers of one hand, and I'm a highly unsuccessful pirate so they're both hooks.

2) Fear. Only when playing vs Eldar, Orks, or Dark Eldar, and even then it rarely comes up.

3) Soul Blaze. So much bookkeeping, so little effect...

4) Crusader. Does something - just not anything terribly impactful.

5) Precision Strikes. This one is only, ONLY this low on the list because one time my solitaire charged a conscript blob, managed to insert himself such that he was base to base with the commissar, even though he refused the challenge I precision striked him, he rolled 1 on his look out sir, and the solitaire killed him and swept the other 47 members of the blob. So this one, I've only ever seen happen once. But god was it a glorious one time...

Leadership & Morale. 40k would be a better game without it at all.

The Heldrake Terror Packs 'Merciless Pursuit' is pretty much never getting used. You get d6 vector strikes over units falling back, pinned, or gone to ground, which are usually effects that happened after, or are removed before the Movement Phase.

Accute Senses.
When using Outflank accute senses allows you to re-roll the dice determining what board edge the unit enters the board from.

Not sure about other Armies but all Space Wolves have Accute Senses, so it actually sounds pretty cool, until you consider how useless/random Outflank is for the Wolves. Due to the "No assault out of Reserves" rule melee units pop out of the board edge then stop and stare at the enemy. Outflank works best for armies, units and models that have low mobility and high RoF. Easiest way of getting it for Space Wolves is Harold Deathwolf, a mobile melee monster.
Getting Outflank on Obj Sec Grey Hunters means a one in six chance or keeping Harold connected to them in Reserves.

the_scotsman wrote:

 Roknar wrote:
It's not so much soul blaze that is an issue, but that you pay for it. And it's pretty much never ever worth it, so nobody takes the stuff that has it. At the very least it would have to stack.

I'd say precision strikes/shots is the most useless rule in the game. I can't even think of unit that has the rule....assasins?

Uhhhh no, that rule is absolute gold on my Death jesters. use it to snipe out special weapons from squads all the time.

If we're talking the most useless as in basically never gets used, I'm going to have to rank it:

1) Concussive. This rule almost never happens because the most common weapons that have it are hugely strong and/or, hilariously, Unwieldy. And most models only have 1 wound to take anyway... The number of times I've seen Concussive ever apply I can count on the fingers of one hand, and I'm a highly unsuccessful pirate so they're both hooks.

2) Fear. Only when playing vs Eldar, Orks, or Dark Eldar, and even then it rarely comes up.

3) Soul Blaze. So much bookkeeping, so little effect...

4) Crusader. Does something - just not anything terribly impactful.

5) Precision Strikes. This one is only, ONLY this low on the list because one time my solitaire charged a conscript blob, managed to insert himself such that he was base to base with the commissar, even though he refused the challenge I precision striked him, he rolled 1 on his look out sir, and the solitaire killed him and swept the other 47 members of the blob. So this one, I've only ever seen happen once. But god was it a glorious one time...

Point 5 made me laugh

Cybork Armor. If you really want a FNP roll why not take a Dok? Why would they remove the only invulnerability besides a mek shield!?

I've got a big issue with mob rule. I always end up making several dice rolls and end up falling back anyway.

the_scotsman wrote:

 Roknar wrote:
It's not so much soul blaze that is an issue, but that you pay for it. And it's pretty much never ever worth it, so nobody takes the stuff that has it. At the very least it would have to stack.

I'd say precision strikes/shots is the most useless rule in the game. I can't even think of unit that has the rule....assasins?

Uhhhh no, that rule is absolute gold on my Death jesters. use it to snipe out special weapons from squads all the time.

If we're talking the most useless as in basically never gets used, I'm going to have to rank it:

1) Concussive. This rule almost never happens because the most common weapons that have it are hugely strong and/or, hilariously, Unwieldy. And most models only have 1 wound to take anyway... The number of times I've seen Concussive ever apply I can count on the fingers of one hand, and I'm a highly unsuccessful pirate so they're both hooks.

2) Fear. Only when playing vs Eldar, Orks, or Dark Eldar, and even then it rarely comes up.

3) Soul Blaze. So much bookkeeping, so little effect...

4) Crusader. Does something - just not anything terribly impactful.

5) Precision Strikes. This one is only, ONLY this low on the list because one time my solitaire charged a conscript blob, managed to insert himself such that he was base to base with the commissar, even though he refused the challenge I precision striked him, he rolled 1 on his look out sir, and the solitaire killed him and swept the other 47 members of the blob. So this one, I've only ever seen happen once. But god was it a glorious one time...

I'd imagine precision strikes actually can be useful but similar to the way precision shots is. Haemonculus covens can get it in a formation i think and i think it could be ok but you'd need plenty of decent attacks to make it worth anything. I think it might be ok in theory if you fight a mixed unit with different gear. I mean let's say you're fighting dudes with storm shields and some that don't have it. You get to pick who gets hit sometimes which could be helpful. I'm not sure if it is useful considering the weapons that have it but it has potential if given to the right weapons or units unlike many rules that just suck because of the rule themselves.

I actually find your point on concussive to be funnier with the pirate hooks.

I actually had fear matter vs my dark eldar. I failed a Ld 10 check vs a stormsurge with my archon group. I cried a little on the inside and complained heavily on the outside. Lesson learned? If you get fearless as a warlord trait for your archon spam. TAKE IT! Also take raiders with the grisly trophies for leadership re-rolls just in case. They probably won't live but once their passengers are outside people tend not to focus on killing them anymore. Funny thing is my archon posse still murdered that stormsurge in the game to everyone's surprise. 4x archon bro force with huskblades and shadow fields ftw! On the subject i'd just like to make a point of how unlucky my blaster and blast pistol shots with my archon were when i only used one (haven't used it on archon posse yet). I've failed to wound like 90% of the time i swear whether from missed shots or far more likely rolling a one to wound. Keep in mind it's normally a 2 to wound (str 8 ap 2 lance) and like BS 7 and i've missed hits at least once or twice. Seriously sometimes luck just likes to screw with you.

Can't even remember what crusader does. That probably is a big hint how much it comes up.

Soul blaze does next to nothing and i only get it if i have mandrakes which are an ok-ish to bad unit (at least theoretically) in an army that needs its good units most of the time. Shame mandrakes can't be taken as troops or have a couple points dropped. Their FOC has them compete with incubi, grotesques and trueborn and you'd never take mandrakes given those other choices. Going unbound they might actually be ok but dark eldar get nothing from being bound anyway.

I think dark eldar only have a couple concussive units and it tends to not matter as we're usually striking first (except for the fact we don't have combat grenades on most of our melee units thanks to idiots in the rules department). I know reavers can take an upgrade for it but it is massively inferior to cluster caltrops and i've never seen someone prefer one anywhere.

Agreed on precision shots though. You gotta realize you don't tend to kill characters with precision shots but rather special weapons or an imperial guard's vox caster model (the hq voxes) or banner bearer ;P.

It's subjective, but Sniper in Kill Teams.
They even listed it as a 'skill' to give to models.
It lets you pick which model to target, in a unit of one model.

 Skinnereal wrote:
It's subjective, but Sniper in Kill Teams.
They even listed it as a 'skill' to give to models.
It lets you pick which model to target, in a unit of one model.

Doesn't it also give rending?

 koooaei wrote:

 Skinnereal wrote:
It's subjective, but Sniper in Kill Teams.
They even listed it as a 'skill' to give to models.
It lets you pick which model to target, in a unit of one model.

Doesn't it also give rending?

Probably. Good point.
As I was using Eldar with shuriken weapons, that wouldn't help me, so I must have skipped past that bit.

Crusader almost never gets used if not just forgotten because it's basically useless. Oh I have to run? That extra die will definitely help my shooty army or my melee guys that can't charge afterwards, and rarely do we actually get to use sweeping advance. Speaking of that, with the current ways to just ignore leadership checks sweeping advance just becomes pointless.

 Jaxler wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:

Arson Fire wrote:
Many tyranid monstrous creatures coming with an AP6 close combat weapon is kinda amusing. Particularly on those that are unable to replace it, or take a second one.

Adding to this, the Bloodcrusher's 6+ armor save.

6+ ARMOR SAVE. The thing has the freaking Daemonic Rule. Why the hell does this exist? And it doesn't even matter for Grav anyways since I think the default is 6 anyhow.

Probably as a place holder or something. Every unit I think has a save. It's probably there in case you find some rule that modifies saves in some way. If it had no save it'd be impossible or need some FAQ if it got something like a +1 to armor save reroll if armor saves.

Also it sorta kinda helps against dangerous terrain I guess.

Standard demon princes dont have a save unless you equip them with armour - on its stat list it just has a - where armour save is ...

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Cybork Armor. If you really want a FNP roll why not take a Dok? Why would they remove the only invulnerability besides a mek shield!?

Orks' latest codex was somewhat phoned in, IMO... Not the only or worst low-effort codex by a long shot, but still one of the most egregious.
I definitely don't think the change to Cybork body was a good one, so I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one that thinks so. If nothing else, it should stack with the Painboy's FNP bonus, gosh darnit!

How many people remember characters of the same initiative as non-characters must pile in first?

When is the last time you have used Glorious Intervention?

Youn wrote:
How many people remember characters of the same initiative as non-characters must pile in first?

When is the last time you have used Glorious Intervention?

I used Glorious Intervention last week!
I had a 2w Librarian in a Command Squad that only had one other character - A 1w apothecary. The Librarian was far more valuable, but twice as durable, so I put him in the challenge. Lo and behold, he took 1w - Since he was no longer any more durable, I swapped in the Apothecary to tank shots.

Oh wow, I had completely forgotten about glorious intervention. As in literally forgotten XD