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3d printing custom models in 40K is OK?
Print me up Scotty!
Not now, not ever - GW originals, all night, all day!

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Made in us
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord





In My Lab

 Blackie wrote:
 Aenar wrote:
 Blackie wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:
 Blackie wrote:

Absolutely. And a 2000 points 3D printed army is typically far more expensive than an original GW one if it's bought from someone else or if the player had to pay for the printer as well.

If that was even close to true we wouldn't be discussing this.

No? How much would a 3D printed 2000 points army cost? All things considered, including the actual cost of the printer and time spent on learning how to design, print and clean the models.

3D printing is a long term investment, if you want thousands of points of stuff then it's a cheaper solution than buying the original stuff. Now everyone wants that, and not everyone has the patience or skills to make their own models.

And 3D printed stuff that is on the market is not really cheaper than GW stuff.

Even by considering all the related costs, it depends on the army.
Probably 2000 points of Custodes (excluding expensive FW units) would be cheaper with official models.
2000 points of AdMech, GSC, Guard, ...? It depends.

A cheap resin 3D printer (Anycubic Photon) costs $140 (USD), plus resin ($50-60 for two liters of resin, but again it depends on the faction), isopropyl alcohol to clean prints ($30), random paper towels and similar stuff ($20?).
You can also add a wash&cure machine to properly prepare the prints for painting ($100), or do it yourself with a couple of buckets full of alcohol and then leaving the models under the sun.
Total: $250-350 to get a printer and print a full 2000 points army.
You could get a 4K printer, a mono printer, a larger printer, ... and spend a little bit more. But the cheapest one I've seen, the one I own, is capable of printing incredible details.

This would be the cost for the first army. The second one would cost obviously less.

As for the time investment in learning how to use it, it's not rocket science. It involves a lot of trial & error to get to know your particular printer and to dial in the correct print settings. But it can be easily done over a couple of weeks.


What about time spent on learning how to design the models? Something can be found for free on the internet, granted, but typically files must be paid. And designing own models takes really a lot of time to master.
How many unique models do you need for a 2k army?

Assuming the $250-350 figure is accurate on actual costs, that leaves you with about $250-350 to pay for files and STILL be cheaper than a GW army.

Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
   
Made in ie
Ruthless Rafkin





 Blackie wrote:
 Aenar wrote:
 Blackie wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:
 Blackie wrote:

Absolutely. And a 2000 points 3D printed army is typically far more expensive than an original GW one if it's bought from someone else or if the player had to pay for the printer as well.

If that was even close to true we wouldn't be discussing this.

No? How much would a 3D printed 2000 points army cost? All things considered, including the actual cost of the printer and time spent on learning how to design, print and clean the models.

3D printing is a long term investment, if you want thousands of points of stuff then it's a cheaper solution than buying the original stuff. Now everyone wants that, and not everyone has the patience or skills to make their own models.

And 3D printed stuff that is on the market is not really cheaper than GW stuff.

Even by considering all the related costs, it depends on the army.
Probably 2000 points of Custodes (excluding expensive FW units) would be cheaper with official models.
2000 points of AdMech, GSC, Guard, ...? It depends.

A cheap resin 3D printer (Anycubic Photon) costs $140 (USD), plus resin ($50-60 for two liters of resin, but again it depends on the faction), isopropyl alcohol to clean prints ($30), random paper towels and similar stuff ($20?).
You can also add a wash&cure machine to properly prepare the prints for painting ($100), or do it yourself with a couple of buckets full of alcohol and then leaving the models under the sun.
Total: $250-350 to get a printer and print a full 2000 points army.
You could get a 4K printer, a mono printer, a larger printer, ... and spend a little bit more. But the cheapest one I've seen, the one I own, is capable of printing incredible details.

This would be the cost for the first army. The second one would cost obviously less.

As for the time investment in learning how to use it, it's not rocket science. It involves a lot of trial & error to get to know your particular printer and to dial in the correct print settings. But it can be easily done over a couple of weeks.


What about time spent on learning how to design the models? Something can be found for free on the internet, granted, but typically files must be paid. And designing own models takes really a lot of time to master.


Still cheaper to pay for an STL than a GW kit.


 
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






Racerguy180 wrote:
If the technology for home SLA printing at the resolutions available now, you had shown a teenage me this I would've been all over it. I already had exposure to industrial 3d SLA but it required some finishing up machining and not quite ready for primetime. That was on a $400k machine in 1993. The mere fact that for less than $500 today you can get a printer that blows stuff out of the water is unbelievable.
Give it 5yrs with all in one printers(SLA, FDM, sintering) and you could basically have the beginnings of a STC(minus the abominable intelligence...)

This misses the point entirely.
How many of you had access to £400 when you were a kid/teen? Because the average purchase for my group was once a month, less if it was something big, and almost always relied on birthdays/Christmas/other big events to get anything more than one box of models. Hell even now as an adult spending that much money on a single product has to have serious justification. I spent about 4 months waiting and worrying before I nabbed a PC that was actually good because it was a lot of money. My average monthly hobby budget, in a good month, is £100.
It doesn't matter if the technology is great because when it comes down to it I'm not waiting a month before I can even begin to start printing models, let alone using them in games. A SC/Starter Box can easily be built in a week and at that point, you're good to play games.
   
Made in us
Terminator with Assault Cannon




San Jose, CA

I'm pretty sure what I paid for my squats would've been close enuff to make it a viable choice.

Mowing lawns was an easy way to make $$$ & that would've been about 2.5mo of saving to achieve.
If you as a teenager would not have been able to be patient to wait, how in the hell would you have the patience to build/paint them?
   
Made in ie
Ruthless Rafkin





 Gert wrote:
Racerguy180 wrote:
If the technology for home SLA printing at the resolutions available now, you had shown a teenage me this I would've been all over it. I already had exposure to industrial 3d SLA but it required some finishing up machining and not quite ready for primetime. That was on a $400k machine in 1993. The mere fact that for less than $500 today you can get a printer that blows stuff out of the water is unbelievable.
Give it 5yrs with all in one printers(SLA, FDM, sintering) and you could basically have the beginnings of a STC(minus the abominable intelligence...)

This misses the point entirely.
How many of you had access to £400 when you were a kid/teen? Because the average purchase for my group was once a month, less if it was something big, and almost always relied on birthdays/Christmas/other big events to get anything more than one box of models. Hell even now as an adult spending that much money on a single product has to have serious justification. I spent about 4 months waiting and worrying before I nabbed a PC that was actually good because it was a lot of money. My average monthly hobby budget, in a good month, is £100.
It doesn't matter if the technology is great because when it comes down to it I'm not waiting a month before I can even begin to start printing models, let alone using them in games. A SC/Starter Box can easily be built in a week and at that point, you're good to play games.


We live in a world where kids regularly get the latest iPad or iPhone for their Christmas/birthday. They cost WAY more than the cost of an entry level 3D printer

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 19:23:31



 
   
Made in gb
Rampaging Khorne Dreadnought




 Sim-Life wrote:
 Gert wrote:
Racerguy180 wrote:
If the technology for home SLA printing at the resolutions available now, you had shown a teenage me this I would've been all over it. I already had exposure to industrial 3d SLA but it required some finishing up machining and not quite ready for primetime. That was on a $400k machine in 1993. The mere fact that for less than $500 today you can get a printer that blows stuff out of the water is unbelievable.
Give it 5yrs with all in one printers(SLA, FDM, sintering) and you could basically have the beginnings of a STC(minus the abominable intelligence...)

This misses the point entirely.
How many of you had access to £400 when you were a kid/teen? Because the average purchase for my group was once a month, less if it was something big, and almost always relied on birthdays/Christmas/other big events to get anything more than one box of models. Hell even now as an adult spending that much money on a single product has to have serious justification. I spent about 4 months waiting and worrying before I nabbed a PC that was actually good because it was a lot of money. My average monthly hobby budget, in a good month, is £100.
It doesn't matter if the technology is great because when it comes down to it I'm not waiting a month before I can even begin to start printing models, let alone using them in games. A SC/Starter Box can easily be built in a week and at that point, you're good to play games.


We live in a world where kids regularly get the latest iPad or iPhone for their Christmas/birthday. They cost WAY more than the cost of an entry level 3D printer


I'd wager most 13 year old still won't be getting bought a £200+ delicate piece of machinery with a bucket of toxic resin for christmas.
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






Racerguy180 wrote:
I'm pretty sure what I paid for my squats would've been close enuff to make it a viable choice.

Mowing lawns was an easy way to make $$$ & that would've been about 2.5mo of saving to achieve.
If you as a teenager would not have been able to be patient to wait, how in the hell would you have the patience to build/paint them?

Because it doesn't take a month to assemble miniatures.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Sim-Life wrote:
We live in a world where kids regularly get the latest iPad or iPhone for their Christmas/birthday. They cost WAY more than the cost of an entry level 3D printer

And they don't take a month to learn how to use + time after that before it starts becoming worth the purchase.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 19:27:11


 
   
Made in ie
Ruthless Rafkin





Dudeface wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:
 Gert wrote:
Racerguy180 wrote:
If the technology for home SLA printing at the resolutions available now, you had shown a teenage me this I would've been all over it. I already had exposure to industrial 3d SLA but it required some finishing up machining and not quite ready for primetime. That was on a $400k machine in 1993. The mere fact that for less than $500 today you can get a printer that blows stuff out of the water is unbelievable.
Give it 5yrs with all in one printers(SLA, FDM, sintering) and you could basically have the beginnings of a STC(minus the abominable intelligence...)

This misses the point entirely.
How many of you had access to £400 when you were a kid/teen? Because the average purchase for my group was once a month, less if it was something big, and almost always relied on birthdays/Christmas/other big events to get anything more than one box of models. Hell even now as an adult spending that much money on a single product has to have serious justification. I spent about 4 months waiting and worrying before I nabbed a PC that was actually good because it was a lot of money. My average monthly hobby budget, in a good month, is £100.
It doesn't matter if the technology is great because when it comes down to it I'm not waiting a month before I can even begin to start printing models, let alone using them in games. A SC/Starter Box can easily be built in a week and at that point, you're good to play games.


We live in a world where kids regularly get the latest iPad or iPhone for their Christmas/birthday. They cost WAY more than the cost of an entry level 3D printer


I'd wager most 13 year old still won't be getting bought a £200+ delicate piece of machinery with a bucket of toxic resin for christmas.


If parents are stupid enough to buy them internet machines, they're stupid enough to buy them buckets of poison for them to make models.


 
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






 Sim-Life wrote:

If parents are stupid enough to buy them internet machines, they're stupid enough to buy them buckets of poison for them to make models.

You do know parental locks are a thing right? That there are different versions of services for kids? That a phone is not in any way comparable to a chemical substance?
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







Arguably, the phone is more dangerous.

2021 Plog - Here we go again... - my fifth attempt at a Dakka PLOG

My [url=https://pileofpotential.com/dysartes]Pile of Potential[/url - updates ongoing...

Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.


 Kanluwen wrote:
This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.

Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army... 
   
Made in gb
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard







You don’t agitate for a printer for yourself. You convince your parent(s) that it’ll be an amazing hobby device that they can use as well! Then Just get them to make stuff for you.

Teenagers don’t tend to exist in isolation.

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block




 Flinty wrote:
You don’t agitate for a printer for yourself. You convince your parent(s) that it’ll be an amazing hobby device that they can use as well! Then Just get them to make stuff for you.

Teenagers don’t tend to exist in isolation.


Most parents probably think that painting toy soldiers is just a craze that they would get bored of and move on, so sinking a large amount of money on a device to print them and do little else would be a waste of money. Plus any teenager would most likely go for a games console than a 3D printer if they wanted a large gift.
   
Made in ie
Ruthless Rafkin





Templarted wrote:
 Flinty wrote:
You don’t agitate for a printer for yourself. You convince your parent(s) that it’ll be an amazing hobby device that they can use as well! Then Just get them to make stuff for you.

Teenagers don’t tend to exist in isolation.


Most parents probably think that painting toy soldiers is just a craze that they would get bored of and move on, so sinking a large amount of money on a device to print them and do little else would be a waste of money. Plus any teenager would most likely go for a games console than a 3D printer if they wanted a large gift.


You know people have more than one birthday and Christmas happens EVERY year, right? And as has been stated, Warhammer costs just as much and printer LESS than a console.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gert wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:

If parents are stupid enough to buy them internet machines, they're stupid enough to buy them buckets of poison for them to make models.

You do know parental locks are a thing right? That there are different versions of services for kids? That a phone is not in any way comparable to a chemical substance?


You are a very naive person if you think every parent regulates their child's internet usage. Especially if you don't think teenagers can't work out how to look at stuff they shouldn't be.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/26 19:58:47



 
   
Made in es
[DCM]
Secret Inquisitorial Eldar Xenexecutor






your mind

 Gert wrote:
 jeff white wrote:
Roughly 5 to 1 in favor of 3d printing.
After seeing the reception here, I know where my hobby dollars are going when and if we ever get a stable home again.

I thought you were just wondering in general not making an actual decision. Ask your locals, you'll get a much more accurate reaction.
Forums tend to be polarised and are a poor representation of real-world communities, which is interesting because so far this thread hasn't been so bad with regards to insults and vendettas.

I wanted to hear from others first, as I understand that biases are prejudice and should be informed before action… guess I have made enough mistakes to learn this lesson, and at more than 5 to 1 in favor of 3D printing, well… yeah. I am comfortable moving on. GW is too expensive and many of their designs lately are too far from home, for me. I don’t even like restartes armor, and hate the so called orruk look. The new swamp stuff is cool, and their new multi layering for depth using plastic can offer a fantastic sense of depth, but it seems that Indy artists with their new print files can provide similar qualities, and months from now who knows where we will be. So, yeah, I don’t like the new hammer CCG style gameplay on kitchen tables, don’t like the kid friendly reskin of the not so grim darkness… not into Warhammer plus eubscription services, and have exactly zero members of any local scene so… yeah. I can feel the wind blowing and will be filling my sales pun intended by moving in that direction …

   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block




 Sim-Life wrote:
Templarted wrote:
 Flinty wrote:
You don’t agitate for a printer for yourself. You convince your parent(s) that it’ll be an amazing hobby device that they can use as well! Then Just get them to make stuff for you.

Teenagers don’t tend to exist in isolation.


Most parents probably think that painting toy soldiers is just a craze that they would get bored of and move on, so sinking a large amount of money on a device to print them and do little else would be a waste of money. Plus any teenager would most likely go for a games console than a 3D printer if they wanted a large gift.


You know people have more than one birthday and Christmas happens EVERY year, right? And as has been stated, Warhammer costs just as much and printer LESS than a console.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gert wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:

If parents are stupid enough to buy them internet machines, they're stupid enough to buy them buckets of poison for them to make models.

You do know parental locks are a thing right? That there are different versions of services for kids? That a phone is not in any way comparable to a chemical substance?


You are a very naive person if you think every parent regulates their child's internet usage. Especially if you don't think teenagers can't work out how to look at stuff they shouldn't be.


A 3d printer still costs less than virtually any Warhammer set, and it’s still a big purchase along with all the consumables to use it. It’s a huge start up cost for something with very little use. Most parents would be apprehensive about spending that amount of money on something with little use and will most likely be forgotten about within a year.
   
Made in es
[DCM]
Secret Inquisitorial Eldar Xenexecutor






your mind

 Gert wrote:
A 3d printer is a relatively complex piece of equipment, you try selling the 40k hobby to a bunch of kids/teens off the back of buying a 3d printer, and very few are going to pick you up on it.
It's all well and good to say learning 3d printing only takes a few weeks but it's hardly the same as buying models. To get good quality stuff you have to be good at 3d printing/get a good printer and if you beans it, you're left with nothing. On the other side, a beginner who buys their models isn't expected to be a "Golden Demon" standard painter. The learning curve with painting is a hell of a lot simpler IMO than 3d printing, especially with things like Contrast. Of course, that's even if you care about painting in the first place. The only thing you actually need to do with bought models is build them.
It's not a case of instant gratification, it's more "why should I spend £300 on a printer, wait a month before I actually know how to use it, then print models".
Anyway, that's just my opinion on the whole "3d printing will kill GW" thing.

I exalted this post because it is true. My answer would be because I can. I imagine that, as this tech becomes more common, many people will answer the same. GW will kill itself by forcing YouTube videos off the site if they use non gw models to play gw games during batreps. That is when the community will mutiny straight up. The grim dark is ours, always was. GW will learn that lesson too quickly if that is their chosen road.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Templarted wrote:
I don’t see it as being good for the local scene, near me it was completely dead until a FLGS opened up so I don’t want to 3D print whole armies and drive them out of business. That being said I do use 3D printed parts and bases on models and don’t really have a problem playing against them. I don’t see 3D printing really taking off for a few years, it’s still a high start up cost and a lot of hours to get it right. When software becomes more user friendly(I’m aware it might seem it to you but not to others with limited time) it will be a lot more common place, GW and most other model manufacturers will just produce vehicles and scenery.

If I had a flgs to frequent I would be buying ice creams and snacks and candybars and comics and kits here and there, maybe the occasional box set and preorder as I had been doing with the local gw shop when we lived near enough to get there… hope to have the chance again, and that the owners would be smart enough to build a lifestyle into the shop, not depending on boxset sales to pay the rent. Just saying…


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Ketara wrote:
Spoiler:
 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Dysartes wrote:
 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
I'm surprised that the mods aren't challenging/shutting down the endorsement of outright carbon copying.

They don't do it when people talk about pirating the rules, so why would they when it comes to the models?
Again, I just seem to recall when Dakka's mods operated on a rather strict "no recasting" policy, and such topics were rather quickly halted. I wonder if this is perhaps a change in policy on their end.


Arguments in favour of direct copies of GW sculpts have been against the rules, are against the rules, and will likely always be against the rules. Dakka has never endorsed illegal direct duplications of artistic sculpts. Note that saying 'Yeah, I'd play someone with a recast army', or 'I don't care about recasts' are merely personal expressions and consequently not the same thing as 'We should all be recasting models! Look at my huge army of recasts, you should do it too!' or 'You can buy recasts at Location X!' The latter is banned here, the former is not.

When it comes to someone printing out a Makers Cult Feudal Guard army however, that's basically the same as someone modifying some WW2 Germans to carry lasguns, or buying some plastics from Mantic to play with. Those are independent sculpts, and no matter how derivative of GW IP generally an independent sculpt may be, it's not a duplicate or a recast and not treated the same. Mods have better things to do then try and figure out if a model is 2% over the acceptable line of similarity to qualify as an IP infringement.

In other words, saying 'Yeah, I think we should all be playing 5th edition 40K with printed out proxies that can resemble GW units' is A-OK - as it neither promotes nor endorses illegal sculpt duplication.

Not to mention the fact that fictional universes with wide fan support take on a life of their own independent of the company, and are hardly tied to its continued existence. IX Age is very much a thing now traditional Warhammer is gone, and when Bloodbowl got dropped altogether, fans and smaller companies sprang up to support it.
If everyone gets bored of GW prices and rules, and the resulting exodus to 3D print resulted in the demise of GW; it would simply continue in other formats.

Thank you for this.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Dudeface wrote:
Poll is top narrow in scope imo.

No to 3d printing
3d printing conversion parts
3d printing occasional models
3d printing units/armies from alternatives
OK with 3d printed gw knockoffs

Yeah, I tried to keep things simple and let the comments fill in the grey area…


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Dysartes wrote:
Arguably, the phone is more dangerous.

So true… omg so true. Studies prove it. Resin chems are safe and educational by comparison.

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2021/09/26 20:27:30


   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





Interesting thread. A few things from my POV:

I wouldn't hate working with resin models any less if I printed them myself, so I'd need a plastic printer. Period.

I've looked at 3rd party models before and I've purchased a few. It always seems like a good idea, but when I put them on the table as part of a mixed army, the lack of consistency- minor variations in scale and aesthetic, just smash the unity right out of the army, and I rarely end up fielding my third party minis.

Now I'm a dude who can't draw and doesn't know squat about CAD. So I'm getting all my files from the internet; the first thing this means is additional cost. But more importantly, if I can't find a single source for ALL of my models, I'm likely to have the same problem I do when I try third party models.

Do Wagames Exclusive Repentia, Raging Heroes Davidians, GW Metal Repentia and GW plastic repentia look good individually? Sure. Ever seen them side by side in the same army? Not so much.

   
Made in gb
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard







There are vendors selling whole army sets that do address this issue.

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

The poll lacks a "I don't care" option for those that are in the middle.

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in au
Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon





Okay, but what about scratch builds? Do we consider it different because more effort was placed in it's production?

As an example, I made 2 ork FW Killtanks from a sizable amount of plasticard and bitz. Would there be any real difference between someone who created a 3D model and printed that?

Personally I think most of the issue comes from how much effort someone is putting into it
   
Made in ie
Ruthless Rafkin





Templarted wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:
Templarted wrote:
 Flinty wrote:
You don’t agitate for a printer for yourself. You convince your parent(s) that it’ll be an amazing hobby device that they can use as well! Then Just get them to make stuff for you.

Teenagers don’t tend to exist in isolation.


Most parents probably think that painting toy soldiers is just a craze that they would get bored of and move on, so sinking a large amount of money on a device to print them and do little else would be a waste of money. Plus any teenager would most likely go for a games console than a 3D printer if they wanted a large gift.


You know people have more than one birthday and Christmas happens EVERY year, right? And as has been stated, Warhammer costs just as much and printer LESS than a console.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gert wrote:
 Sim-Life wrote:

If parents are stupid enough to buy them internet machines, they're stupid enough to buy them buckets of poison for them to make models.

You do know parental locks are a thing right? That there are different versions of services for kids? That a phone is not in any way comparable to a chemical substance?


You are a very naive person if you think every parent regulates their child's internet usage. Especially if you don't think teenagers can't work out how to look at stuff they shouldn't be.


A 3d printer still costs less than virtually any Warhammer set, and it’s still a big purchase along with all the consumables to use it. It’s a huge start up cost for something with very little use. Most parents would be apprehensive about spending that amount of money on something with little use and will most likely be forgotten about within a year.


You could literally say the same about Warhammer itself.


 
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.

People in this thread said that learning to use one would take a month. Something that's easy to learn doesn't take a month. They also said it takes a lot of trial and error. Again to me, if someone is saying this new thing is going to take a lot of trial and error even after learning how to do said thing which takes a month to learn, then it's not easy.
Do you have a personal issue with me or something btw because it felt a bit unnecessary for you to be rude just there.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Beaverton OR

Just thought I'd chip in to say that at this point I have gotten at least one army's worth of 3d printed figs from etsy sellers and others (small apartment, so I can't get my own printer... yet...)

And while none of them are full armies of ONLY 3d printed figs (I also sprinkle in GW and 3rd party models,) I've spent a tiny fraction of what it costs to put together an entire GW army... and have 3 full armies at this point with lots of options.

Like it or not: 3d printing is the wave of the future.
   
Made in ie
Ruthless Rafkin





 Gert wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.

People in this thread said that learning to use one would take a month. Something that's easy to learn doesn't take a month. They also said it takes a lot of trial and error. Again to me, if someone is saying this new thing is going to take a lot of trial and error even after learning how to do said thing which takes a month to learn, then it's not easy.
Do you have a personal issue with me or something btw because it felt a bit unnecessary for you to be rude just there.


A kid I know of about 18 who got into Warhammer last year bought a 3D printer and started knocking up a Warlord titan within a few weeks of starting the hobby. He's not the most academic person and to this day he doesn't know how to play the game properly or make a legal army list despite multiple peoples efforts so it can't be that hard to learn how to print stuff.


 
   
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 Gert wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.

People in this thread said that learning to use one would take a month. Something that's easy to learn doesn't take a month. They also said it takes a lot of trial and error. Again to me, if someone is saying this new thing is going to take a lot of trial and error even after learning how to do said thing which takes a month to learn, then it's not easy.
Do you have a personal issue with me or something btw because it felt a bit unnecessary for you to be rude just there.


It’s incredibly easy to get decent results with modern printers. What takes a bit of practice is dialling the settings to be super crisp and to reduce likelihood of print failures. This is analogous to the learning you need to do to be able to trim, assemble, glue and remove mould lines from modern plastics. And the benefit of printing is that if you mess something up, it’s a matter of a few hours print time to get a new better one, rather than needing to fork out a fortune for a new box set

As an example, this was the second thing I ever printed using my resin printer and default settings and knowing nothing really about anything



It’s not perfect, and the underside is a terrible mess of support contact areas, but I think it stands up quite well against commercially available stuff, especially with my standard of painting.



This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/27 00:07:43


Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

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 Gert wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.

People in this thread said that learning to use one would take a month. Something that's easy to learn doesn't take a month. They also said it takes a lot of trial and error. Again to me, if someone is saying this new thing is going to take a lot of trial and error even after learning how to do said thing which takes a month to learn, then it's not easy.


To a large extent, the time period it takes to 'learn' to use a printer is naturally due to the time spent manufacturing or printing. For me to make a light buggy like vehicle on default settings, you're looking at a 5-6 hour print time. So essentially, you usually set it up for the day in the morning, then come back in the evening. Then you spend an evening watching some videos to tweak the settings. Then the weekend is over, so you wait until next weekend, when you set another print in motion. Etcetc.

By the time you're a month in, you've optimised your settings, gained the confidence to just walk away and leave it (I spent my first print turning and trying to check it every ten minutes out of paranoia) and just plug and play. You leave your resin in overnight because you've learned that's okay so long as the temperature is good - rather than washing everything and relevelling the bed in between each print. And so on.

If you could get all the testing and experience done without having to wait for the actual prints, you could do it in an afternoon or two. But having to stop and wait each time is what stretches out the experimental and learning phase.


 
   
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Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 Gert wrote:
People in this thread said that learning to use one would take a month. Something that's easy to learn doesn't take a month. They also said it takes a lot of trial and error. Again to me, if someone is saying this new thing is going to take a lot of trial and error even after learning how to do said thing which takes a month to learn, then it's not easy.
I have a number of friends with 3D printers. One took quite a few prints to get it right. One made a mistake on his first print and hasn't made a mistake since. He even has two printers now. I don't know how to work one, but I figure anyone who's going to buy one isn't doing so casually and will actually put effort into the use of said machine both before and after purchasing it.

My point is that "it's difficult to learn!" isn't really an argument against such things, just an attempt to shut down the idea of having one. Speaking of which...

 Gert wrote:
Do you have a personal issue with me or something btw because it felt a bit unnecessary for you to be rude just there.
I have no personal issue with you, but what I haven't noticed over several recent threads in this sub-forum is that you tend to be the "Nope. Can't do that.", "Nope. I don't think that would ever work." or "Nope. Too hard. We shouldn't even try!" guy. So I come into this thread and, to my utter shock, here you are, poo-poo'ing the idea of 3D printing. I especially liked the "toxic resin" angle. That was a hoot!

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
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Tallarook, Victoria, Australia

 Gert wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.

People in this thread said that learning to use one would take a month. Something that's easy to learn doesn't take a month. They also said it takes a lot of trial and error. Again to me, if someone is saying this new thing is going to take a lot of trial and error even after learning how to do said thing which takes a month to learn, then it's not easy.
Do you have a personal issue with me or something btw because it felt a bit unnecessary for you to be rude just there.


You seem to think kids are not intelligent nor determined enough to learn 3d printing.....let alone anything that requires effort. .....nice assumption

Typical dakkadakka reaction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmXRQeJLhtw 
   
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Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Yeah. Kids learn dinosaur names that their parents can't even begin to pronounce. Kids will learn what they put their minds towards.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The poll lacks a "I don't care" option for those that are in the middle.

Although the thread has been fun for Gert's assertions that 3D printers are really tough to use. Go back 25 years and replace "3D printer" with "this newfangled Interweb thing!" or even further back and "kids and their televisions!" and it sounds just as funny.


in fairness before internet browsers where a thing the internet wasn't the easiest to use

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
 
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