Games Workshop-Last Chance to Buy/Range Rotation news and rumors

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**Kid_Kyoto**

How good is Dungeons and Lasers as a substitute for the old Cities o Death terrain?

**NinthMusketeer**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
NinthMusketeer wrote:
I have some nostalgia for those old pieces, but in all honesty I just like the new stuff better. However I can understand the perspective of people who are unhappy with this development even though I do not share it personally.
The Sector Mechanicus stuff that's going away are hardly an 'old pieces'.

Fair point, though at 5 years it isn't new either.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Geifer wrote:
NinthMusketeer wrote:
I have some nostalgia for those old pieces, but in all honesty I just like the new stuff better. However I can understand the perspective of people who are unhappy with this development even though I do not share it personally.

There is something to be said for the design and styling of newer kits. I wish GW was just willing to compromise a little and make some things modular instead of heavily investing in making unique pieces that can only be assembled one way. Like yeah, the recent dragon skeleton should be the latter. It makes sense. There's nothing wrong with having some unique pieces in your terrain range. But couldn't we have Sigmar buildings (preferably with both ruined and intact parts) as a core to the urban terrain range and create something like the floating fountain to come with its own stairs and both the fountain and the stairs being scaled so they can be fit neatly into the building range?

I think GW could get a lot more out of these kits if they were willing to commit to it. It even fits with the usual no model, no rules and monopose arguments. Make it build a single thing, and sell that thing only once. Make it modular or kitbashable with other kits, and you can sell multiples of the same thing.

Completely agree. I will say a lot of the 40k terrain is really good about this, and even the new stuff is much more modular than it initially appears. It is just strange how they haven't applied that to AoS beyond the Dreadhold terrain (which was phased out even faster than the sector mechanicus).

**H.B.M.C.**

NinthMusketeer wrote:
I will say a lot of the 40k terrain is really good about this, and even the new stuff is much more modular than it initially appears.

Take it from me, who spent a good chunk of Sunday building Nachmund terrain: No it's not.

**tauist**

Sector Mechanicus terrain aint all going OOP.. When the next KillTeam box launces, the Nachmund terrain kit will be released alongside it.

That however will not contain the full range, so get what you need now or end up paying scalper prices later.

**Togusa**

Man this sucks, I had plans for the trenches and I just cannot buy them at the moment. So I guess I'll have to try and find a replacement when the time comes.

What's with them discontinuing terrain all the time? Some of those kits currently up on the chopping block are less than two years old!

**NinthMusketeer**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
NinthMusketeer wrote:
I will say a lot of the 40k terrain is really good about this, and even the new stuff is much more modular than it initially appears.
Take it from me, who spent a good chunk of Sunday building Nachmund terrain: No it's not.

I suppose it is a rather subjective definition, so I can't really disagree.

**H.B.M.C.**

It goes together one way and one way only. There's nothing subjective about that.

**Rihgu**

Strange, as I follow the designer of many of those kits on twitter and he's always giving tips and tricks about cool modularity features he incorporated into it.

**H.B.M.C.**

Rihgu wrote:
Strange, as I follow the designer of many of those kits on twitter and he's always giving tips and tricks about cool modularity features he incorporated into it.

We're talking about the newest stuff. Not the Sector Mechanicus/Zone Mortalis stuff.

**MajorWesJanson**

It would be nice if they expanded the fronteris range even further- a second floor option and a garage would be nice. Maybe a small watch tower that slots into the barricade wall.

**H.B.M.C.**

I'd love for them to do that. Right now you can put the dish into the slot on the landing pad, or put a hab building onto the landing pad, and that's it.

**GMSchofield**

Some of the Nachmund terrain pieces are reused Sector Mechanicus sprues that are designed to combine with other kits. ie: the vertical pieces are the same height as mechanicus walkways / sector Imperialis building floors / Zone Mortalis columns and can be used as supports, the pipes match up with the vents on ruined building walls, weird pipey bits can attach to ruins as chimneys, etc.

The Nachmund box really doesn't show this to it's full potential at all. The modularity isn't there in isolation, it's in how the different kits can be combined (and it's almost completely missing in the newer Battlezone Vertigus stuff!)

For a real world example look at the Sacristan Forgeshrine, which uses a couple of pieces from Nachmund combined with some walkways to make a larger structure.

**Orlanth**

GW has most of its terrain manufactured in China, do as single production run and then retire the mold. These production runs are large, but when they end they end.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
How good is Dungeons and Lasers as a substitute for the old Cities o Death terrain?

Use Rampart instead.

Get it here:
https://gamefound.com/projects/archon-studio/rampart-third-edition

Kickstarter page:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/archonstudio/rampart

In short, very good, particularly the cathedral. Though you need to do your own platforms and roofing, the platform systems included do not work properly except as isolated elements, and some look sub par.

The factory has an arc deco rather than gothic look to it, and the windows and doorways are plain weird. Archon are now doing a concrete wall moderns ruin as a fourth set which looks very promising.

Dungeons and Lasers itself could be used, but is better used for its intended purpose: dungeons, whether industrial or medieval fantasy.

**H.B.M.C.**

GMSchofield wrote:
Some of the Nachmund terrain pieces are reused Sector Mechanicus sprues...

No they're not.

You're thinking of the KT box.

**GMSchofield**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
GMSchofield wrote:
Some of the Nachmund terrain pieces are reused Sector Mechanicus sprues...
No they're not.

You're thinking of the KT box.

That explains it then. I never even considered that GW might have two boxes out with different contents but both called Nachmund. Those buildings don't look modular at all.

**Rihgu**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
GMSchofield wrote:
Some of the Nachmund terrain pieces are reused Sector Mechanicus sprues...
No they're not.

You're thinking of the KT box.

Ah, this is where I went wrong. I looked at their latest releases for terrain kits, saw Kill Team and that it was Sector Mechanicus stuff.

**tauist**

There's KillTeam: Nachmund, a box of assorted Sectore Mechanicus scenery, which will be getting a Killzone: Nachmund box in Q2. Not to be confused with Warzone Nachmund, the new GW terrain kit with the Fronteris hab and the fences etc.

One of them has modular terrain, the other has "some further assembly required" hackably modular terrain

**NinthMusketeer**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
It goes together one way and one way only. There's nothing subjective about that.

A single Lego piece isn't modular either.

**H.B.M.C.**

NinthMusketeer wrote:
A single Lego piece isn't modular either.

What a bizarre (and not even slightly correct) comparison.

They're not modular. Period. I really don't know why you're trying to argue this at all.

This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.

**chaos0xomega**

Orlanth wrote:
GW has most of its terrain manufactured in China, do as single production run and then retire the mold. These production runs are large, but when they end they end.

I don't know how accurate that is. Many of these kits have gone in and out of stock multiple times over the years, which suggests that they have had additional production runs to maintain availability.

**Dysartes**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.

Do both of those fit in the top of the "landing pad", HBMC, or just the radar dish?

**tauist**

The Bastion only went together one way as well.. Yet that didn't stop creative people from creating variations of things based on it. I'm quite confident a razor saw to the new hab bits and to the fences could yield interesting mashup potential, the vox tower base included.

**Matt.Kingsley**

tauist wrote:
The Bastion only went together one way as well.. Yet that didn't stop creative people from creating variations of things based on it. I'm quite confident a razor saw to the new hab bits and to the fences could yield interesting mashup potential, the vox tower base included.

the Imperial Bastion was designed so that you could easily combine multiple kits together to make larger structures. They even come with the parts to connect floor panels of multiple kits together.

**NinthMusketeer**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
NinthMusketeer wrote:
A single Lego piece isn't modular either.
What a bizarre (and not even slightly correct) comparison.

They're not modular. Period. I really don't know why you're trying to argue this at all.

This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.

*shrug* it's your loss, I don't want to argue about it.

**Myrthe**

Designed modularity is different from kit convertability.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Orlanth wrote:
GW has most of its terrain manufactured in China, do as single production run and then retire the mold. These production runs are large, but when they end they end.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
How good is Dungeons and Lasers as a substitute for the old Cities o Death terrain?

Use Rampart instead.

Get it here:
https://gamefound.com/projects/archon-studio/rampart-third-edition

Kickstarter page:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/archonstudio/rampart

In short, very good, particularly the cathedral. Though you need to do your own platforms and roofing, the platform systems included do not work properly except as isolated elements, and some look sub par.

The factory has an arc deco rather than gothic look to it, and the windows and doorways are plain weird. Archon are now doing a concrete wall moderns ruin as a fourth set which looks very promising.

Dungeons and Lasers itself could be used, but is better used for its intended purpose: dungeons, whether industrial or medieval fantasy.

To add to the above, the scale is thrown off because the doors are short. YMMV but it drove me up the wall ! I covered the smaller, molded closed ones with skulls to read as a relief panel and not a door.
Oh, and Archon never produced the actual door for the larger openings (as they showed in the Kickstarter).

**H.B.M.C.**

NinthMusketeer wrote:
*shrug* it's your loss, I don't want to argue about it.

What am I losing? What you're arguing literally makes no sense. You're saying the sky is green.

You said the newer kits are "much more modular than it initially appears", but they aren't. They're not modular at all. The two newest kits that GW has released - one for AoS and one for 40k - are some of the least modular terrain kits GW has ever produced. They literally go together one way. And this is a common theme among most recent GW terrain releases as well. They're just not doing what they did when Sector Mechanicus/Imperialis/Mortalis anymore.

So really, what are you trying to say?

tauist wrote:
The Bastion only went together one way as well.. Yet that didn't stop creative people from creating variations of things based on it. I'm quite confident a razor saw to the new hab bits and to the fences could yield interesting mashup potential, the vox tower base included.

Firstly, as mentioned above, that's not even slightly true. The Bastion kit contained additional pieces allowing you to combine multiple kits together to create larger pieces. Moreover, it was designed with the same dimensions as the Cities of Death terrain, for further compatibility.

Secondly, cutting up and converting something isn't the same as "being modular". How do you not get that?

**Theophony**

I'm done with GW pricing, but I could see this piece
This goes together only one way.
used as a mobile terrain piece in ash wastes as a hunt for Red October style Scenario. It looks like the command tower off the top of a submarine to me and it could move around the board randomly (cause GW) with gangs trying to board it and take over.

**MorglumNecksnapper**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
NinthMusketeer wrote:
A single Lego piece isn't modular either.
What a bizarre (and not even slightly correct) comparison.

They're not modular. Period. I really don't know why you're trying to argue this at all.

This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.
This goes together only one way.

Depends on the level of modularity you want to see. The tower and dish fitting into the building is a form of modular build, as is the hab block fitting onto the building. But modularity in the way you can build them would have been nice.

The hab block I do find more modular, as it also builds well together with the Kill zone: Sector Fronteris for some awesome ruined building possibilities. It's even compatible with the Ryza-Pattern ruins terrain, so way more options than you might think.

Missed chance is making several floors possible, in that way it is not modular, but with some cutting I do see ways to make that possible.

**H.B.M.C.**

The tower doesn't fit. And that's not modularity. Putting a tree on a hill doesn't make the hill modular. Or the tree.

**MorglumNecksnapper**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
The tower doesn't fit. And that's not modularity. Putting a tree on a hill doesn't make the hill modular. Or the tree.

If we agree that modularity is various components that can fit together to build a new working system, then slotting the dish into the building is modular building.

I totally agree if someone doesn't find it very modular, but stating that's it's not modular at all is false. Like I stated, the kits are even compatible with earlier released kits, even with the Ryza ruins.

The parts are made to work together with at least three different kits, you can't call that not modular.