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Made in us
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Georgia

Both these stratagems show thinking in the right direction. This is clearly a superior version of the current Dakka Dakka Dakka, and gives grots a purpose other than slot fillers.

Maybe, if we all pray to Gork and Mork, these might be stratagems in the actual codex.

"The undead ogre believes the sack of pies is your parrot, and proceeds to eat them. The pies explode, and so does his head. The way is clear." - Me, DMing what was supposed to be a serious Pathfinder campaign.

6000 - Death Skulls, Painted
2000 - Admech/Skitarii, Painted 
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






 An Actual Englishman wrote:
The grot stratagem would be completely useless in 40k. You resolve the attack against the grot and after the grot has died you take the shots as normal.

So the 2CP stratagem protects a single model for what, 1 or 2 shots before the grot dies and you're back to taking shots as normal? Meh.

Perhaps if the 40k equivalent gave meant we could use a squad of grots to protect another squad, then we'd be talking but even then we kinda have that already with Ammo Runts/Grot Oilers etc


You obviously would be redirecting the shooting of an entire unit onto a unit of gretchin instead of a single one, which is pretty much the same as "pick a unit that can't shoot this turn". Unless my memory fails me, the vast majority of units don't have ammo runts or grot oilers.

7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks do not think that purple makes them harder to see. They do think that camouflage does however, without knowing why.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. 
   
Made in us
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Georgia

 Jidmah wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
The grot stratagem would be completely useless in 40k. You resolve the attack against the grot and after the grot has died you take the shots as normal.

So the 2CP stratagem protects a single model for what, 1 or 2 shots before the grot dies and you're back to taking shots as normal? Meh.

Perhaps if the 40k equivalent gave meant we could use a squad of grots to protect another squad, then we'd be talking but even then we kinda have that already with Ammo Runts/Grot Oilers etc


You obviously would be redirecting the shooting of an entire unit onto a unit of gretchin instead of a single one, which is pretty much the same as "pick a unit that can't shoot this turn". Unless my memory fails me, the vast majority of units don't have ammo runts or grot oilers.


Which is why this stratagem costs 2cp. Even a min squad of grots is a huge speedbump to chew through. If positioned well, one squad of grots could cover multiple other squads. I like this because it is interactive on two levels. For one, we have to decide which squad to use this stratagem on, and it also makes the opponent try to predict which squad we'd want to protect the most, and which guns to use on which squad. This is exactly the kind of stratagem we need.

Granted, we can't rely on this one stratagem for durability- we still need a drastic bumping up in that department.

"The undead ogre believes the sack of pies is your parrot, and proceeds to eat them. The pies explode, and so does his head. The way is clear." - Me, DMing what was supposed to be a serious Pathfinder campaign.

6000 - Death Skulls, Painted
2000 - Admech/Skitarii, Painted 
   
Made in gb
Fully-charged Electropriest






Here's hoping these stratagems make it into the codex in a good format. Dakka Dakka Dakka should always have been a unit gets to shoot again and 2 CP for that is reasonable presuming our points costs get significantly reduced. As things stand at the moment I would begrudge paying 2 CP because our shooting is so awful. Flash Gitz at a reasonable cost with that stratagem and their innate Flashiest Gitz (or something similar) ability could be fun with Badrukk for the re-rolls. The same goes for Dakkjets, which would still fill a similar role but would still be better at it.

Grot shield stratagem would be excellent, they've already got good utility as road blocks and speed bumps and this would increase their utility many times over. Battalion with Nobz squads with ammo runts filled out with even more cannon fodder Grots for Troops would be interesting. A Battlewagon with Meganobz filling the remaining capacity with Grots. The list goes on, that stratagem would make a single unit of something dangerous much more survivable. Obviously it will pair well with Greentide also, which I can easily see continuing to be our post-codex go-to list.

As for these stratagems in Kill Team, which I'm very much looking forward to, I think they will still be useful for keeping key players in our Kill Teams alive and dishing out damage but without a codex we're still coming out of the starting blocks so much later than our opponents that I don't think we'll have much of an impact. Excluding, of course, a Kill Team mini-Greentide which will no doubt work to some degree.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/09 21:27:00


 
   
Made in gb
Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






 Jidmah wrote:
Unless my memory fails me, the vast majority of units don't have ammo runts or grot oilers.


No, but generally speaking our characters and other important units you'd want to protect do.
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






Even that isn't true. Nobz, Flash Gits and Badruk are the only models with access to ammo runts. Big Meks and Meks are the only ones with grot oilers and the regular pain boyz is the only model that can have a grot orderly. That isn't even half our characters and you surely have other important units besides foot nobz and flash gits.

7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks do not think that purple makes them harder to see. They do think that camouflage does however, without knowing why.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. 
   
Made in gb
Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).
   
Made in nl
Regular Dakkanaut




Reading through fb comment section from the warhammer page, it looks like there is something coming from the grots. And maybe some plastic kommandos, as gw wants kill team to be played with plastic kits... interesting stuff imo
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob




Crescent City Fl..

I like that stratagem and would use it if we get something like that. I'd be happy to take both stratagems. Please let my flash gits shoot three times a turn. (depending on the wording possibly 4 times a turn.)

The grots one would be good for protecting back field units like lootas for a turn but might hurt me to use if I need those grots to score an objective. The will also likely cost me another few command points to keep them from taking Morale if they aren't all killed and can be of future use in the next turn or two. Still, it would be cool. I'd protect them with a KFF and pain boy if the opportunity presented itself.

Sigh, Yet another doomed attempt by man to bridge the gap between the material and spiritual worlds 
   
Made in us
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Georgia

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).


I think it's fantastic. There are so many terrifying shooty weapons that 30 garbage wounds can completely negate. Hell, that can absolutely save the life of key characters, expensive squads, what have you. It's a great stratagem that can be used very defensively.

"The undead ogre believes the sack of pies is your parrot, and proceeds to eat them. The pies explode, and so does his head. The way is clear." - Me, DMing what was supposed to be a serious Pathfinder campaign.

6000 - Death Skulls, Painted
2000 - Admech/Skitarii, Painted 
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob




Crescent City Fl..

 Vitali Advenil wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).


I think it's fantastic. There are so many terrifying shooty weapons that 30 garbage wounds can completely negate. Hell, that can absolutely save the life of key characters, expensive squads, what have you. It's a great stratagem that can be used very defensively.

Why would a character need saving? lol. Snipers probably... Gitz.

Sigh, Yet another doomed attempt by man to bridge the gap between the material and spiritual worlds 
   
Made in us
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Georgia

 warhead01 wrote:
 Vitali Advenil wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).


I think it's fantastic. There are so many terrifying shooty weapons that 30 garbage wounds can completely negate. Hell, that can absolutely save the life of key characters, expensive squads, what have you. It's a great stratagem that can be used very defensively.

Why would a character need saving? lol. Snipers probably... Gitz.


Snipers, deep strikers, or just situations where you character is exposed. In my experience, grots are usually ignored for greater threats, so I can absolutely see grots being left alone for a character to be near. And hell, if this stratagem makes people more focused on shooting my grots beforehand, go right ahead! Not only that, but it drastically increases the durability of units by giving them 10-30 ablative wounds. Stick a squad of lootas in the backfield on an objective with a bunch of grots, bam, they're no longer the fragile squad they once were.

"The undead ogre believes the sack of pies is your parrot, and proceeds to eat them. The pies explode, and so does his head. The way is clear." - Me, DMing what was supposed to be a serious Pathfinder campaign.

6000 - Death Skulls, Painted
2000 - Admech/Skitarii, Painted 
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





 Vitali Advenil wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).


I think it's fantastic. There are so many terrifying shooty weapons that 30 garbage wounds can completely negate. Hell, that can absolutely save the life of key characters, expensive squads, what have you. It's a great stratagem that can be used very defensively.
It depends on how it is worded. If the effect only lasts for one attack, then not so much. But if it lasts an entire shooting phase, then Yes Please! Especially if you use the other model's toughness.

I wouldn't mind a 38 wound Gazzy...jes sayin.
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





 JimOnMars wrote:
 Vitali Advenil wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).


I think it's fantastic. There are so many terrifying shooty weapons that 30 garbage wounds can completely negate. Hell, that can absolutely save the life of key characters, expensive squads, what have you. It's a great stratagem that can be used very defensively.
It depends on how it is worded. If the effect only lasts for one attack, then not so much. But if it lasts an entire shooting phase, then Yes Please! Especially if you use the other model's toughness.

I wouldn't mind a 38 wound Gazzy...jes sayin.


If we could do it with a Stompa to make it 70 wounds it might be worth its points...


But probably not

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
You never know when that leman russ will punch you back

 
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






 An Actual Englishman wrote:
I'm not going to do this with you Jidmah. Perhaps the other half of those characters a)don't provide protective buffs and b)aren't going to exist in the codex because they don't have a model?

Either way, I see very few opportunities where I'd want to spend 2 CP to give one unit the protection of 30 grots (at the start of the enemy shooting phase and lasting only till the end of that phase).


Or you could just admit that your statement was hyperbe. I think I can both save us the trouble of listing all characters without gretchin that won't be going away with the codex no matter what happens and I think you would have to agree that they vastly outnumber the ones with gretchin at their side. The only character that is not OOP and still has additional gretchin are Badrukk, MA big mek and the mini-mek. On the other side is every named character, the warboss and the weird boy.

If you can't see the benefit of adding 30 wounds to a unit of lootaz, flash gits, nobz, burna boyz or tank bustas, I don't know what to say.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/10 06:09:06


7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks do not think that purple makes them harder to see. They do think that camouflage does however, without knowing why.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. 
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine




I think the stratagem could add an interesting aspect to ork tactics as we'd essentially get shield drones in hordes at the cost of CP

At the same time, I hate it. I always end up feeling awful for the grots and this just seems mean :(
   
Made in gb
Assassin with Black Lotus Poison





Bristol

Should really just be a rule that grots have, like in previous editions, rather than a stratagem.

The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.

Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
 
   
Made in gb
Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






 Jidmah wrote:
Or you could just admit that your statement was hyperbe. I think I can both save us the trouble of listing all characters without gretchin that won't be going away with the codex no matter what happens and I think you would have to agree that they vastly outnumber the ones with gretchin at their side. The only character that is not OOP and still has additional gretchin are Badrukk, MA big mek and the mini-mek. On the other side is every named character, the warboss and the weird boy.

If you can't see the benefit of adding 30 wounds to a unit of lootaz, flash gits, nobz, burna boyz or tank bustas, I don't know what to say.

I don't need to admit anything. I said (if you bothered to read my post in it's entirety) "GENERALLY SPEAKING" which doesn't mean this is the rule for each and every character.

You forgot Painboy, I'm sure he's not OOP? There's also Big Mek with SAG and standard Big Mek.

Which named characters are competitive apart from Ghazzy again?

Ghazzy and other warbosses in my experience aren't too worried about snipers with their toughness. They have character protection (currently) so they have 30 - 90 ablative wounds anyway.

Flash Gits have Ammo Runts (that don't cost CP).

Nobz have Ammo Runts (that don't cost CP).

Why are you taking Burna Boyz?

Lootas generally sit in cover on an objective with KFF Mek proection who sits healing KMKs.

Foot slogging Tank Bustas I can see value for this stratagem. Of course I think the value of a Tank Bustas in a Trukk is far greater than foot slogging because you can actually get to your intended targets.
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






 An Actual Englishman wrote:
You forgot Painboy, I'm sure he's not OOP?

The pain boy with grot orderly is OOP. The new one does not have a separate grot orderly.

There's also Big Mek with SAG and standard Big Mek.

Standard big mek is OOP, but you're right about the SAG one.

Which named characters are competitive apart from Ghazzy again?

1) Moving goal posts. If you want to go by competitive characters, Warbosses, Weird boys and Waaagh! banners are in most ork lists and don't have gretchin, SAGs and mini-mek are not cometitive. So "in general" boils down to just KFF meks and painboyz, with KFF meks being OOP.
2) Zardsnark, Snikrot, Zagstrukk and Mad Dok Grotznik have all seen tournament play.

Ghazzy and other warbosses in my experience aren't too worried about snipers with their toughness. They have character protection (currently) so they have 30 - 90 ablative wounds anyway.

You are picking apart your own argument. Your argument was that the stratagem is useless because characters in general have gretchin as protection. Which is wrong for every character that is not Badrukk, a mek or a pain boy.
So, yes, I agree that your original argument isn't a really good one, since you will rarely need to protect characters from shooting.

Flash Gits have Ammo Runts (that don't cost CP).

Nobz have Ammo Runts (that don't cost CP).

If your opponent sets his or her mind to it, they will plow through those ammo runts. A knight with twin avenger gatling cannons can kill an entire unit of 10 nobz/flash gits and 10 ammo runts, but will not be able to kill a whole lot more than 30 gretchin.
A unit of gretchin will take an average of 54 shots from BS3 models to kill, no mater how awesome your weapon is. At 3 points per wound nothing will ever be point-efficient at killing them. You are basically making one unit immune to shooting for a turn, at the cost of 2CP and a gretchin unit-assuming your opponent actually bothers to shoot them instead of another target.

Why are you taking Burna Boyz?

We had this before, right? You claiming that you cannot ever assume that any unit gets better despite discussing a stratagem that can only exist in the new codex.
You are really being negative for no reason here. When we have this stratagem burnas might be worth fielding, and then a screen of gretchin would be very good at protecting them, foot slogging or after being disembarked from their respective transports. For example, a battlewagon could hold 10 burnas and 10 gretchin, allowing the gretchin to take the heat after the enemy has fallen back from combat.

Lootas generally sit in cover on an objective with KFF Mek proection who sits healing KMKs.

If anything, lootaz sit on top of some terrain feature to have a good LoS so they can utilize their 48" without ever needing to move. A unit of gretchin is almost the same cost as a KFF mek, has objective secured and provides CP by filling battalions.
I'd also like to point out that you just claimed a 5+/5++ save to be equivalent to 30 ablative wounds.

Foot slogging Tank Bustas I can see value for this stratagem. Of course I think the value of a Tank Bustas in a Trukk is far greater than foot slogging because you can actually get to your intended targets.

Tank bustas in a trukk can still be killed in a single turn of shooting with no problems whatsoever. Killing 30 gretchin takes a whole lot of dedicated firepower and might leave your opponent with too little firepower to gun down your tank bustas after he has wasted a ton of shots on 3 point models.

The ability to redirect shooting from an expensive unit onto a very cheap unit is invaluable and solves the problem of all ork specialists requiring a transport or dying turn 1. I'm baffled that you don't understand that as an otherwise very knowledgeable ork player.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/07/10 13:08:41


7 Ork facts people always get wrong:
Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other.
A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot.
Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests.
Orks do not think that purple makes them harder to see. They do think that camouflage does however, without knowing why.
Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor.
Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers.
Orks do not have the power of believe. 
   
Made in us
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Indianapolis, IN

Strategies on how to deal with knights with orks and go!

Armies:
The Iron Waagh: 10,000+ 8th Edition Tournament Record: 4-7-1
Salamanders: 5,000 8th Edition Tournament Record: 4-2
Ultramarines: 4,000
Armored Battle Company (DKoK): 4000
Elysians: 500
Khorne Daemons: 2500
 
   
Made in ca
Nasty Nob






 Glitcha wrote:
Strategies on how to deal with knights with orks and go!


gotta wait unfortunately

ERJAK wrote:


The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.

 
   
Made in us
Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





Sit on objectives for 5 turns :/ Theyll have a hard time clearing 200 boyz

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
You never know when that leman russ will punch you back

 
   
Made in us
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Indianapolis, IN

 Billagio wrote:
Sit on objectives for 5 turns :/ Theyll have a hard time clearing 200 boyz


You say this but i watched a game over the weekend at a local ITC event and saw a knight army table a 200 ork army list in 4 turns.

Armies:
The Iron Waagh: 10,000+ 8th Edition Tournament Record: 4-7-1
Salamanders: 5,000 8th Edition Tournament Record: 4-2
Ultramarines: 4,000
Armored Battle Company (DKoK): 4000
Elysians: 500
Khorne Daemons: 2500
 
   
Made in gb
Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






 Jidmah wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Ghazzy and other warbosses in my experience aren't too worried about snipers with their toughness. They have character protection (currently) so they have 30 - 90 ablative wounds anyway.

You are picking apart your own argument. Your argument was that the stratagem is useless because characters in general have gretchin as protection. Which is wrong for every character that is not Badrukk, a mek or a pain boy.
So, yes, I agree that your original argument isn't a really good one, since you will rarely need to protect characters from shooting.


That wasn't really my argument though was it? You should know this, since I responded to you with it;

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
Unless my memory fails me, the vast majority of units don't have ammo runts or grot oilers.


No, but generally speaking our characters and other important units you'd want to protect do.


See the bold and underlined bit? That should help with your confusion. I'm not talking about units that don't need protection because they are so cheap, or characters that don't need protection from Snipers because they are so tough. I'm on about our squishy ass Painboy and Meks with KFF, y'know, the prime targets for snipers? The Big Mek can be built out of the Meganobz kit by the way, it's written on the box and the current painboy clearly has a grot orderly on his model.

 Jidmah wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Flash Gits have Ammo Runts (that don't cost CP).

Nobz have Ammo Runts (that don't cost CP).

If your opponent sets his or her mind to it, they will plow through those ammo runts. A knight with twin avenger gatling cannons can kill an entire unit of 10 nobz/flash gits and 10 ammo runts, but will not be able to kill a whole lot more than 30 gretchin.
A unit of gretchin will take an average of 54 shots from BS3 models to kill, no mater how awesome your weapon is. At 3 points per wound nothing will ever be point-efficient at killing them. You are basically making one unit immune to shooting for a turn, at the cost of 2CP and a gretchin unit-assuming your opponent actually bothers to shoot them instead of another target.


So 2 CP a turn and 3 x 30 = 90 pts for making a single unit semi immune to fine (until the grots die, which isn't exactly going to take long). I could think of better stratagems.

 Jidmah wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Why are you taking Burna Boyz?

We had this before, right? You claiming that you cannot ever assume that any unit gets better despite discussing a stratagem that can only exist in the new codex.
You are really being negative for no reason here. When we have this stratagem burnas might be worth fielding, and then a screen of gretchin would be very good at protecting them, foot slogging or after being disembarked from their respective transports. For example, a battlewagon could hold 10 burnas and 10 gretchin, allowing the gretchin to take the heat after the enemy has fallen back from combat.

Burna Boyz are point for point worse at shooting than Shoota Boyz. They're awful. This stratagem wouldn't change that. Their problem isn't just their squishyness, it's their lack of damage output. I liked your pun with "take the heat" though. Well played.

 Jidmah wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Lootas generally sit in cover on an objective with KFF Mek proection who sits healing KMKs.

If anything, lootaz sit on top of some terrain feature to have a good LoS so they can utilize their 48" without ever needing to move. A unit of gretchin is almost the same cost as a KFF mek, has objective secured and provides CP by filling battalions.
I'd also like to point out that you just claimed a 5+/5++ save to be equivalent to 30 ablative wounds.

That's not what I claimed at all. You're acting as if CP is utterly worthless. You're also seemingly forgetting that you can only use the same stratagem once per phase. So if your Lootas are shielded by Grots, something else ISN'T.

Also dude, if you're up on a terrain piece overseeing the battlefield, it's gonna be highly unlikely you're within 2" of a Grot unit right...??

 Jidmah wrote:
 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Foot slogging Tank Bustas I can see value for this stratagem. Of course I think the value of a Tank Bustas in a Trukk is far greater than foot slogging because you can actually get to your intended targets.

Tank bustas in a trukk can still be killed in a single turn of shooting with no problems whatsoever. Killing 30 gretchin takes a whole lot of dedicated firepower and might leave your opponent with too little firepower to gun down your tank bustas after he has wasted a ton of shots on 3 point models.

The ability to redirect shooting from an expensive unit onto a very cheap unit is invaluable and solves the problem of all ork specialists requiring a transport or dying turn 1. I'm baffled that you don't understand that as an otherwise very knowledgeable ork player.


Nawww, you knock me down just to build me back up huh? Honestly I don't think it helps all that much. We tend to spam our specialists so the enemy player will just target those that aren't protected by the stratagem. I also play Evil Sunz, a transport is kinda built into my blood. Weirdboyz have already hurt them, I don't want them to become more redundant. Tank Bustas only have 18" range, on foot they're too slow and too easy to outmaneuver with that 5" move. Lootas as we've both said are normally perched in a building so won't be in range of the grots. Flash Gits have ammo runts as I've mentioned but you've sold me on the stratagem for them. Nobz I tend to run cheap and melee focused anyway.

I don't know, this is all speculation anyway so there's no point getting upset over it. I wouldn't be too amazed if this were a stratagem but perhaps I'm not seeing something. I guess we're all assuming it'd only affect infantry right? If you could do it on ANY unit, then I'd be listening.
   
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Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine




Well, as the englishman aove me stated, burna boyz are pretty awful. That being said, they might get improved quite a bit in the codex (hopefully, since the models are cool IMO and I bet they're only collecting dust on ork players shelves around the world right now)

As of right now they're 14 points each and that's just crazy expensive. The most obvious fix is upping d3 shots to d6.. I'm not sure I feel they'd be worth it even with d6 shots each considering how easy they die though so I'd say a small point drop is needed in addition to that. Maybe 11-12 points?

Point being, that grot stratagem might be useful if the burnas (as an example) get their damage buffed. Good damage output but squishy units could benefit from some grot bodyguards
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut




Is there anything in the kill team ork box that’s worth spending $60 for if I have the crane and enough burna/lootas?
   
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Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






gungo wrote:
Is there anything in the kill team ork box that’s worth spending $60 for if I have the crane and enough burna/lootas?

Hell naw.
   
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Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine





Burnas at 14 points is ridiculous. You could probably get a space marine with a flamer for that price.

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
You never know when that leman russ will punch you back

 
   
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Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Georgia

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
gungo wrote:
Is there anything in the kill team ork box that’s worth spending $60 for if I have the crane and enough burna/lootas?

Hell naw.


The ork kill team box set is laughably bad. Unless of course they have some awesome new rules for killteam we're not aware of, I guess.

"The undead ogre believes the sack of pies is your parrot, and proceeds to eat them. The pies explode, and so does his head. The way is clear." - Me, DMing what was supposed to be a serious Pathfinder campaign.

6000 - Death Skulls, Painted
2000 - Admech/Skitarii, Painted 
   
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Fresh-Faced New User




This is probably spinning off topic and into speculation, but what if gretchin were to receive a built-in aura that worked like the kill team stratagem, only more limited to balance what would make the rest of our army basically invincible? Something similar to savior protocols
   
 
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