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gungo wrote:

Finish up the leaks :p
confirm the specialist nob takes away kulturs

I think that’s the only questions left.

As I've repeatedly said, this is already confirmed. I've seen the text and it's already been leaked.

It only takes away that units kultur and does not affect the rest of the detachment.

According to Art of War, Specialist Mobz replace Kultur and each different specialist mob is limited to 1 per detachment.

So only one trukk boyz unit per detachment. Unfortunately, it is unclear whether that's "one of each specialist mob per detachment" or 'one specialist mob total per detahcment"

 the_scotsman wrote:

gungo wrote:
Considering the kustom jobs are per model and you are limited to 1 unique kustom job unless you take the Mek workshop… I’m not sure if the Mek workshop will be almost mandatory for buggy/dread lists.. you might as well make the most use of it…

Imho worst clan is bloodaxe (depending on snikrot rules), followed closely by freebooter… while the freebooter +1 to hit looks nice it’s completely redundant and doesnt stack, the relic is blah, the shoot twice strat is nice and the warlord trait is blah…

Man, I completely cannot disagree more on Freebootas.

A +1 to hit bonus is only redundant possibly in close combat, if you bring a non-deffkilla warboss (deffkilla AFAIK has no +1 to hit aura unlike other warboss types) and is much more rarely redundant for shooting, where the real money is with Freebootas. Just start out your shooting with whatever Specialist Mobz units you've got in your army to get a kill, and then +1 to hit across the board.

And the obsec shuffling stratagem and relic? Meh? Obsec is how you win the game! Warlord trait is definitely garbage though. Luckily, you can always just take Competitive Edg-iiiiiii mean Brutal But Kunnin'!

A relic on vehicle only that you can’t protect with a 6in deny only secure bubble is going to die before it’s able to do anything.. it’s far down on the list of useful relics and I doubt anyone takes it unless you can play some character shenanigans with the hunter rig. The obj secured strat for non troops is going to be situationally useful if you get a non troop and need to challenge a spot with an infantry unit vs a objected secured unit that you outnumber. It does only cost 1cp so that is nice.. there a several +1 to hit auras that work on shooting, off the top of my head, grot gunners, tankbustas, all snaggas get +1 to hit vehicles and monsters, buzzgrob, zodgrod runts, and the flashgitz own gitfinder. We will see seems redundant to me but I guess it depends on list.. .

which is what i originally thought subkultures worked to begin with, and how even the old ones felt like they should have done.
Making it the entire detachment was stupid, so many units you HAD to bring were now kultureless. (And adding it on top of the kulture would be kinda silly)

I'm glad they did that this time around. And i hope that 1 per detachment is 1 of that subkulture, not one subkulture period per detachment, otherwise a LOT of them wont ever get used due to the usual "why would i use X when Y is superior in every way for the same cost?"

 TedNugent wrote:

gungo wrote:

Finish up the leaks :p
confirm the specialist nob takes away kulturs

I think that’s the only questions left.

As I've repeatedly said, this is already confirmed. I've seen the text and it's already been leaked.

It only takes away that units kultur and does not affect the rest of the detachment.

If you are talking about the app screenshot Ive seen the same leak and it’s not clear.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 the_scotsman wrote:
According to Art of War, Specialist Mobz replace Kultur and each different specialist mob is limited to 1 per detachment.

So only one trukk boyz unit per detachment. Unfortunately, it is unclear whether that's "one of each specialist mob per detachment" or 'one specialist mob total per detahcment"

They are just reading the app leaks. I was hoping for them to talk about the actual codex. You can see exactly what they are reading here. https://m.imgur.com/a/YC4UNqS

 the_scotsman wrote:
According to Art of War, Specialist Mobz replace Kultur and each different specialist mob is limited to 1 per detachment.

So only one trukk boyz unit per detachment. Unfortunately, it is unclear whether that's "one of each specialist mob per detachment" or 'one specialist mob total per detahcment"

.
I just looked at the text again, where are you seeing limit of 1 per detachment?

I'm not seeing that under the detachment abilities scree grabs I have not am I seeing them under clan rules or the specialist mobs rules themselves.

gungo wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:

gungo wrote:

Finish up the leaks :p
confirm the specialist nob takes away kulturs

I think that’s the only questions left.

As I've repeatedly said, this is already confirmed. I've seen the text and it's already been leaked.

It only takes away that units kultur and does not affect the rest of the detachment.

If you are talking about the app screenshot Ive seen the same leak and it’s not clear.

That isn't everything, I have another screen grab. Will post in a half hour when I get on lunch.

It's just a compilation, there's been stuff trickling through the past day. Namely the ork detachment rules.

gungo wrote:
Imho worst clan is bloodaxe (depending on snikrot rules), followed closely by freebooter… while the freebooter +1 to hit looks nice it’s mostly redundant for alot of your army, the relic is blah, the freebooter strat is blah and the warlord trait is blah… thier best strat is flashgitz shoot twice and it’s not freebooter detachment locked.

I think Freebooters will be really strong for shooting armies - if you can wipe out a small unit and then double-shoot your Flash Gitz at BS 3+ you can do a lot of damage. Or use the gitz to wipe out a unit and give the +1 to hit to all your vehicles, for example. Kans hitting on 3's and deff dreads, wagons, etc hitting on 4's is a really solid boost. Plus their "take your obsec away" relic is potentially game-winning on its own if you put it on a character you don't mind camping around an objective. Honestly I think Freebooters win over Bad Moons for a shooty list.

Blood axes are potentially really good too, definitely not in raw power or damage output but if you want to play the objective game and pull tricks their redeploy shenanigans can take people by surprise.

gungo wrote:

 the_scotsman wrote:

gungo wrote:
Considering the kustom jobs are per model and you are limited to 1 unique kustom job unless you take the Mek workshop… I’m not sure if the Mek workshop will be almost mandatory for buggy/dread lists.. you might as well make the most use of it…

Imho worst clan is bloodaxe (depending on snikrot rules), followed closely by freebooter… while the freebooter +1 to hit looks nice it’s completely redundant and doesnt stack, the relic is blah, the shoot twice strat is nice and the warlord trait is blah…

Man, I completely cannot disagree more on Freebootas.

A +1 to hit bonus is only redundant possibly in close combat, if you bring a non-deffkilla warboss (deffkilla AFAIK has no +1 to hit aura unlike other warboss types) and is much more rarely redundant for shooting, where the real money is with Freebootas. Just start out your shooting with whatever Specialist Mobz units you've got in your army to get a kill, and then +1 to hit across the board.

And the obsec shuffling stratagem and relic? Meh? Obsec is how you win the game! Warlord trait is definitely garbage though. Luckily, you can always just take Competitive Edg-iiiiiii mean Brutal But Kunnin'!

A relic on vehicle only that you can’t protect with a 6in deny only secure bubble is going to die before it’s able to do anything.. it’s far down on the list of useful relics and I doubt anyone takes it unless you can play some character shenanigans with the hunter rig. The obj secured strat for non troops is going to be situationally useful if you get a non troop and need to challenge a spot with an infantry unit vs a objected secured unit that you outnumber. It does only cost 1cp so that is nice.. there a several +1 to hit auras that work on shooting, off the top of my head, grot gunners, tankbustas, all snaggas get +1 to hit vehicles and monsters, buzzgrob, zodgrod runts, and the Waagh banner according to leaks. We will see seems redundant to me but I guess it depends on list.. if the waaagh banner is +1 to all hits you can replace the freebooters kultur with a single character.

Badskull Banner is not vehicle only, it MAY be taken on a vehicle - like, say, a Deffkilla Wartrike, which moves ridiculously fast and has character protection. It denies obsec from any enemy unit within 6" and then you've got a 1cp strat to make any unit obsec.

This relic and this strat is literally "Any objective on the board that you can physically get to with any unit is yours, period, for a total of one cp". Any unit of Kommandos, any unit of Stormboyz, and then you advance 20" with your character-protected deffkilla wartrike to turn off any unit of your opponent.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 TedNugent wrote:

 the_scotsman wrote:
According to Art of War, Specialist Mobz replace Kultur and each different specialist mob is limited to 1 per detachment.

So only one trukk boyz unit per detachment. Unfortunately, it is unclear whether that's "one of each specialist mob per detachment" or 'one specialist mob total per detahcment"

.
I just looked at the text again, where are you seeing limit of 1 per detachment?

I'm not seeing that under the detachment abilities scree grabs I have not am I seeing them under clan rules or the specialist mobs rules themselves.

gungo wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:

gungo wrote:

Finish up the leaks :p
confirm the specialist nob takes away kulturs

I think that’s the only questions left.

As I've repeatedly said, this is already confirmed. I've seen the text and it's already been leaked.

It only takes away that units kultur and does not affect the rest of the detachment.

If you are talking about the app screenshot Ive seen the same leak and it’s not clear.

That isn't everything, I have another screen grab. Will post in a half hour when I get on lunch.

It's just a compilation, there's been stuff trickling through the past day. Namely the ork detachment rules.

Like I said in the post - literally just what some guys on a stream said. If you have a screenshot to the contrary I will delete happily. If specialist mobs are not limited and Gretchins do not get Kultur...what is the reason why I wouldnt just make all gretchins Orrible Gits?

Brad said he’s a playtester (even though he won’t confirm stuff not in the app leaks) so I’m assuming since he explained the subkulter he’s using the correct meaning of it.

Another great thing about freebooters (aside from « all over the table » instead of 24h is we now have no LOs needed rukkatrukks, so wiping out that small squad that is used for whatever by your opponent, hiding behind a wall, cowering in fear, is NOW POSSIBLE.

I am not saying this is the best clan, even with the obsec shenanigans, but I agree with The Scotsman here. The issue is that get the loot is infantry only, so no deffkilla wartrike getting obsec, just denying obsec. Still great stuff though. Especially when you have stormboyz which are so good now.

oh hey - imgur post has been updated again with a few more sneaky units added.

-Confirmed that the waagh banner nob is still an 'all-orks units' +1 to hit in melee aura. that sucks.

-Weirdboy now knows 2 powers by default + smite and if within 6" of 20 non-gretchin ork models, he gets to cast 2 instead of cast 1.

-Runtherd squig hound is now 'ignore all mods to attrition tests for gretchins within 3". so basically, probably works out about the same as the old 'd3 dead grots' thing. Whip is now hilariously useless - "+1" move for grot infantry within 3" lol.

-Kaptin Badrukk looks basically identical, still a reroll 1 to hit aura. Interestingly, we know that the 'flashiest git' aura is still conveyed out of the new fortification thing. Pirate Fortress Synergy? Probably not but still cute.





Automatically Appended Next Post:
The on-foot beastboss as well.

Hilariously, the beastboss' best use case appears to be 'so ya like the Dead Shiny Shoota" - he's got a targeter squig that explicitly calls out that it gives a +1 to hit to his shoota or any relic that replaces a shoota.

so...this is concerning...

Da Ded Shiny Shoota and Gobshot Blunderbuss mention "Model with a kustom shoota only" (latter badmoonz only)

....wtf has a kustom shoota? Generic boss is forced to have a kombi rokkit now, new bosses dont have one, big meks dont have one.
It used to say "kombi weapon swaps out the shoota profile" but it doesnt have that clause now.

 the_scotsman wrote:


Like I said in the post - literally just what some guys on a stream said. If you have a screenshot to the contrary I will delete happily. If specialist mobs are not limited and Gretchins do not get Kultur...what is the reason why I wouldnt just make all gretchins Orrible Gits?

E.g. relevant section "<Clan> units from Orks Detachments gain access to the following clan rules, provided every model in that Detachment that is drawn from a clan (with the exception of Specialist Ladz) is from the same clan."

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so...this is concerning...

Da Ded Shiny Shoota and Gobshot Blunderbuss mention "Model with a kustom shoota only" (latter badmoonz only)

....wtf has a kustom shoota? Generic boss is forced to have a kombi rokkit now, new bosses dont have one, big meks dont have one.
It used to say "kombi weapon swaps out the shoota profile" but it doesnt have that clause now.

I'm not sure, honestly. Im guessing it's going to be FAQed to a regular shoota so that the beast boss can take it.

Side note, I adore that a weapon called the 'gobshot blunderbuss' cannot be taken to replace a weapon called a 'boomstick'. It's like poetry, it rhymes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 TedNugent wrote:

 the_scotsman wrote:


Like I said in the post - literally just what some guys on a stream said. If you have a screenshot to the contrary I will delete happily. If specialist mobs are not limited and Gretchins do not get Kultur...what is the reason why I wouldnt just make all gretchins Orrible Gits?

E.g. relevant section "<Clan> units from Orks Detachments gain access to the following clan rules, provided every model in that Detachment that is drawn from a clan (with the exception of Specialist Ladz) is from the same clan."

This is missing the section of how you designate a unit as a Specialist mob, which i suspect is most likely where any restriction would live. This does indeed establish the fact that specialist mobs abilities supplant clan kulturs. I am unconvinced that GW would give us something as nice as 'completely unlimited specialist mobs'.

apparently the Banner Nob has a kustom shoota, but that is the ONLY character-using kustom shoota i see.
So 2 of our relics cannot be used by HQs atm. Cool, and both are actually pretty good. Awesome. Gj gw....wth lol

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so...this is concerning...

Da Ded Shiny Shoota and Gobshot Blunderbuss mention "Model with a kustom shoota only" (latter badmoonz only)

....wtf has a kustom shoota? Generic boss is forced to have a kombi rokkit now, new bosses dont have one, big meks dont have one.
It used to say "kombi weapon swaps out the shoota profile" but it doesnt have that clause now.

Waaagh banner has one but he’s pretty redundant and still cost 70pts

If we lose WAAAGH! by taking two different klan detachments that majorly sucks. Didn't know Necrons worked that way but doesn't fill me with hope.

gungo wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so...this is concerning...

Da Ded Shiny Shoota and Gobshot Blunderbuss mention "Model with a kustom shoota only" (latter badmoonz only)

....wtf has a kustom shoota? Generic boss is forced to have a kombi rokkit now, new bosses dont have one, big meks dont have one.
It used to say "kombi weapon swaps out the shoota profile" but it doesnt have that clause now.

Waaagh banner has one but he’s pretty redundant and still cost 70pts

Interestingly he's not redundant if you're using Ghazzy, since Ghazzy is a rr aura rather than a +1.

May not be worth it still, but worth noting anyway.

 Dendarien wrote:
If we lose WAAAGH! by taking two different klan detachments that majorly sucks. Didn't know Necrons worked that way but doesn't fill me with hope.

It's also super unfluffy given that real WAAAGH!'s are pretty much always multi-klan in nature. Ghazzy's schtick besides being big is having the acumen to effectively use the klanz in tandem with one another.

 the_scotsman wrote:

This is missing the section of how you designate a unit as a Specialist mob, which i suspect is most likely where any restriction would live. This does indeed establish the fact that specialist mobs abilities supplant clan kulturs. I am unconvinced that GW would give us something as nice as 'completely unlimited specialist mobs'.

Selected unit gains the Trukk Boyz keyword and the following ability:



I haven't seen anything thus far, but admittedly it's hard to comb the page when I don't have it in front of me just a compilation of screen grabs. It doesn't say anything on the Specialist Mobs section about a limit, e.g. 0-1 etc. Based on the leaks so far, there's not a limit on the number of these you can have.

What's interesting is that means you can take a Goff detachment but have Flyboyz for your aircraft, since they get no benefit from the Goffs clan ability. Or Big Krumpaz MANz in your Bad Moons. Etc.

Kinda funny the flashgitz using a gitfinder won’t stack with thier own kultur.

gungo wrote:
Kinda funny the flashgitz using a gitfinder won’t stack with thier own kultur.

I mean, unless you want to move with them. But yea the amount of +1 to hit is absurd...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
oh - the boomdakka snazzwagon is ordinarily Dakka 10/14.

So the souped up speshul bumps it up to 12/16. And S5 AP-2 D2 now. HOLY MOLY thats so good. perma -1 to hit with ramshackle and a bs4+ big shoota, all for 90pts. That's so spicy.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
apparently the Banner Nob has a kustom shoota, but that is the ONLY character-using kustom shoota i see.
So 2 of our relics cannot be used by HQs atm. Cool, and both are actually pretty good. Awesome. Gj gw....wth lol

alot of those app leaks arn't finished, there are alot of ap 0 choppas etc.

i am reserving judgment when it comes to points cost and weapon loadouts........wouldn't be the first time the app is wrong or different from the book

not wrong there. I remember my friend talking about some eldar model having S20 for some reason in the app lol

...maybe the sheer amount of +1 to hit available is an attempt to address the common complaint that orks firepower is halved by just a weeny little -1 to hit rule/strat. if you can get +1 to hit six ways to sunday you can overcome basically any minus to hit gak.

Its still irritating just how much it all stacks up.

-Beast Snaggas rule
-Warboss rule
-Tankbustas
-Many many weapons (wing missiles, gitfinda, anything with Grot Gunner, etcetcetc)
-freebootas kultur
-Waaagh banner

soooooooo much +1 to hit....

 Vineheart01 wrote:
so...this is concerning...

Da Ded Shiny Shoota and Gobshot Blunderbuss mention "Model with a kustom shoota only" (latter badmoonz only)

....wtf has a kustom shoota? Generic boss is forced to have a kombi rokkit now, new bosses dont have one, big meks dont have one.
It used to say "kombi weapon swaps out the shoota profile" but it doesnt have that clause now.

IIRC the section of the WB profile not shown has a Kustom Shoota option for 0p. Granted, you're already paying for the Kombi Rokkit, so take that as you will.

Unfortunately I messed up when I tried to save that screengrab, so you'll have to take my word for it. But I recall having seen it and being fairly disgusted.

Rukkatrukk has a different weapons profile. All fires out of LOS —— first interesting weapons for years firing out of LOS…

if thats true then thats a tleast a bit better.
I'd rather have Da Gobshot or DedShiny than a kombirokkit anyway.

 the_scotsman wrote:
...maybe the sheer amount of +1 to hit available is an attempt to address the common complaint that orks firepower is halved by just a weeny little -1 to hit rule/strat. if you can get +1 to hit six ways to sunday you can overcome basically any minus to hit gak.

Its still irritating just how much it all stacks up.

-Beast Snaggas rule
-Warboss rule
-Tankbustas
-Many many weapons (wing missiles, gitfinda, anything with Grot Gunner, etcetcetc)
-freebootas kultur
-Waaagh banner

soooooooo much +1 to hit....

It feels like they wanted to not include reroll auras but just didn't know what else to do.

 the_scotsman wrote:
...maybe the sheer amount of +1 to hit available is an attempt to address the common complaint that orks firepower is halved by just a weeny little -1 to hit rule/strat. if you can get +1 to hit six ways to sunday you can overcome basically any minus to hit gak.

Its still irritating just how much it all stacks up.

-Beast Snaggas rule
-Warboss rule
-Tankbustas
-Many many weapons (wing missiles, gitfinda, anything with Grot Gunner, etcetcetc)
-freebootas kultur
-Waaagh banner

soooooooo much +1 to hit....

Maybe worth noting there are a couple of sources of "extra hit on a 6", which is mathematically equivalent to +1 to hit but stacks with it. The multiple redundancy should make getting PKs hitting on 2+ and otherwise overcoming hit penalties pretty doable.

Incidentally, if you combine +1 to hit to get a mob up to WS 2+ with Goff stratagem for exploding 5's and 6's, you will statistically get 17% more hits than you had attacks.